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Offline infovortice2013

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pts price crash
« on: November 08, 2014, 08:52:24 PM »

pts is not been more usefull ??
New Keyoteeid: 5rUhuLCDWUA2FStkKVRTWYEqY1mZhwpfVdRmYEvMRFRD1bqYAL
new08/21 id 5Sjf3LMuYPSeNnjLYXmAoHj5Z6TPCmwmfXD6XwDmg27dwfQ

Offline Stan

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2014, 10:50:58 PM »
I think it will still be useful for all the reasons it has always been useful.
It represents one of the best targets for developers who want to reach a set of DAC savvy supporters!

(And those who still own it will be the most loyal of the loyal.)

Put yourself in any developer's shoes...  :)
« Last Edit: November 08, 2014, 11:07:53 PM by Stan »
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Offline donkeypong

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2014, 02:59:23 AM »
I'm surprised PTS hung on as long as it did. I guess it took some time for everyone to move it from wallets to exchanges.

RIP, PTS. You've served your purpose well.

Offline freebit

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2014, 03:57:43 AM »
If I was a developer,i will give 10% shares to PTS holder,10% shares to AGS, and ?% to BTS.
 

Offline Stan

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2014, 04:06:39 AM »
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract of any kind.   These are merely my opinions which I reserve the right to change at any time.

Offline toobox

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2014, 12:03:33 PM »
Hi and i will start with "What's going on?"

i have some questions, hope someone can answer them, because i lost complete the overview here.
I was very busy with other tasks, therefore i was not able to do the key import for bitshares dns,
now i am reading, that bitshares dns not even exits anymore.. and also that Protoshares is almost
done or is done... i mean all that happened in the last 4-5 weeks?????
Great.
my questions:
I. "So PTS is nearly useless now?"
II. "DNS snapshot was on 5th november, i missed to transfer my keys to the dns-wallet, so for dns my PTS keys are now useless? and i lost my share for the dns->"new bitshares" conversion now?
III. "Is there already a "Vote" wallet?
IV. "How can i see all private keys which exits in the wallet.dat, because i'm missing one btc-donation for AngelShares, which i can't verify in the blockexplorer"
V. "is there an overview of what exactly is going on in the bitshare ecosphere..?"

thank you in advance


Offline kalash1337

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2014, 12:10:33 PM »
is not... my friend says this... but i dont know 100%

Offline biophil

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2014, 05:19:22 PM »
Hi and i will start with "What's going on?"

i have some questions, hope someone can answer them, because i lost complete the overview here.
I was very busy with other tasks, therefore i was not able to do the key import for bitshares dns,
now i am reading, that bitshares dns not even exits anymore.. and also that Protoshares is almost
done or is done... i mean all that happened in the last 4-5 weeks?????
Great.
my questions:
I. "So PTS is nearly useless now?"

Hi toobox, I know things look awful, but don't worry - it's not quite the shambles it appears.

The simple answer is that No, PTS is not useless. However, it's not quite clear what PTS is: there is a team of people trying reboot a DPOS version of PTS, but they haven't decided whether they're going to use a snapshot of PTS from November 5th or whether they're going to use a future snapshot. So maybe the PTS on exchanges is future PTS, maybe it's not. You probably shouldn't buy or sell PTS right now without doing some due diligence. (for my part, I sold all my PTS immediately after Nov 5.)

EDIT: See below for a comment by user "pc," who is one of those involved in plotting a course for the future of PTS. He says most likely PTS will be snapshotted in the future and the DPOS upgrade will not use the November 5 snapshot.

II. "DNS snapshot was on 5th november, i missed to transfer my keys to the dns-wallet, so for dns my PTS keys are now useless? and i lost my share for the dns->"new bitshares" conversion now?

No, you're fine. Your PTS keys were already in the DNS genesis block, so they got snapshotted. When you import your PTS keys to the new BTS, you'll have BTS that came directly from PTS via the Nov 5 snapshot, you'll have BTS that came from VOTE via PTS via the Nov 5 snapshot, and you'll have shares from DNS via PTS via the Nov 5 snapshot.

The trick is that if you held PTS during a snapshot, you get shares in a chain whether you claim them or not. All your shares are safe, don't worry.

Quote
III. "Is there already a "Vote" wallet?

No.

Quote
IV. "How can i see all private keys which exits in the wallet.dat, because i'm missing one btc-donation for AngelShares, which i can't verify in the blockexplorer"

Um, I'm not quite sure what you're asking. In the BTC wallet debug console, there are a number of commands that let you see what addresses are in there; I think listaddressgroupings is one. But your best bet is probably to go into the BTC debug console and type "help" and start messing around.


Quote
V. "is there an overview of what exactly is going on in the bitshare ecosphere..?"

I'd look here: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=10844.0

Most likely, that's going to be a decent overview.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2014, 09:32:15 PM by biophil »

Offline pc

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2014, 08:19:35 PM »
The simple answer is that No, PTS is not useless. However, it's not quite clear what PTS is: there is a team of people trying reboot a DPOS version of PTS, but they haven't decided whether they're going to use a snapshot of PTS from November 5th or whether they're going to use a future snapshot.

Although I'm not quite authoritative wrt the snapshot question, I'm *very* certain that we're going to use a future snapshot.

The plan, in general, is to upgrade the existing PTS to a DPOS chain. That means that all transactions in the old chain must be honoured, up to a yet-to-be-announced point in the future. Using the Nov-5 snapshot simply doesn't make any sense.
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Offline biophil

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2014, 09:30:08 PM »
The simple answer is that No, PTS is not useless. However, it's not quite clear what PTS is: there is a team of people trying reboot a DPOS version of PTS, but they haven't decided whether they're going to use a snapshot of PTS from November 5th or whether they're going to use a future snapshot.

Although I'm not quite authoritative wrt the snapshot question, I'm *very* certain that we're going to use a future snapshot.

The plan, in general, is to upgrade the existing PTS to a DPOS chain. That means that all transactions in the old chain must be honoured, up to a yet-to-be-announced point in the future. Using the Nov-5 snapshot simply doesn't make any sense.

Thanks pc, I'm very glad to hear you say this. I'm updating my post accordingly. I agree that the Nov5 snapshot doesn't make sense; especially since PTS is still trading and the PoW chain (against all odds) is still operating.

Offline donkeypong

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2014, 10:38:35 PM »
Whoever's buying PTS is doing so on pure speculation. It has no inherent value because there aren't any DACs on the horizon. Furthermore, it's risky because its miners and exchanges may not stick with it.

Offline toobox

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Re: pts price crash
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2014, 11:21:06 AM »
@biophil thanks for answering, i see a little bit clearer now :)


Offline Riverhead

Re: pts price crash
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2014, 03:10:35 PM »

The plan, in general, is to upgrade the existing PTS to a DPOS chain. That means that all transactions in the old chain must be honoured, up to a yet-to-be-announced point in the future. Using the Nov-5 snapshot simply doesn't make any sense.

 +5%

It would just be giving back PTS to those that sold after the snapshot so that they could sell it again.

Offline hadrian

Re: pts price crash
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2014, 11:04:15 PM »

The plan, in general, is to upgrade the existing PTS to a DPOS chain. That means that all transactions in the old chain must be honoured, up to a yet-to-be-announced point in the future. Using the Nov-5 snapshot simply doesn't make any sense.

 +5%

It would just be giving back PTS to those that sold after the snapshot so that they could sell it again.

Can't existing POW PTS be sent by users to a 'proof-of-burn' address in order to receive new DPOS PTS?

If a burn address were used it would be a way to increase the value of the new DPOS PTS:
  • It removes potential competition - what if someone else decided to 'revive' the old POW PTS in a slightly different way? It's harder for them if a load of it's been burned already.
  • DPOS PTS hodlers have demonstrated some kind of commitment to it by burning the old PTS.
  • DPOS PTS hodlers have also had to invest in it (in a way) by having to think about it and make a conscious decision.

The above points make it a bit more viable and therefore more valuable.

Other advantages of proof-of-burn:
  • Because action is required to claim DPOS PTS, it means that all hodlers are currently active. That is to say, it could clear out 'lost', inactive or exchange-owned PTS
  • Erm...

If it were to be done from a snapshot we would then have the old POW PTS remaining. This could go on ad infinitum. Dumping, keeping, buying, other devs reviving the old, old PTS with a different feature...101 different versions of PTS. I'm sure some people would say this is fine - let there be competition. I think it'd be too messy.

Wouldn't proof-of-burn bring more clarity and finality to the situation?

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Offline bytemaster

Re: pts price crash
« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2014, 11:22:30 PM »

The plan, in general, is to upgrade the existing PTS to a DPOS chain. That means that all transactions in the old chain must be honoured, up to a yet-to-be-announced point in the future. Using the Nov-5 snapshot simply doesn't make any sense.

 +5%

It would just be giving back PTS to those that sold after the snapshot so that they could sell it again.

Can't existing POW PTS be sent by users to a 'proof-of-burn' address in order to receive new DPOS PTS?

If a burn address were used it would be a way to increase the value of the new DPOS PTS:
  • It removes potential competition - what if someone else decided to 'revive' the old POW PTS in a slightly different way? It's harder for them if a load of it's been burned already.
  • DPOS PTS hodlers have demonstrated some kind of commitment to it by burning the old PTS.
  • DPOS PTS hodlers have also had to invest in it (in a way) by having to think about it and make a conscious decision.

The above points make it a bit more viable and therefore more valuable.

Other advantages of proof-of-burn:
  • Because action is required to claim DPOS PTS, it means that all hodlers are currently active. That is to say, it could clear out 'lost', inactive or exchange-owned PTS
  • Erm...

If it were to be done from a snapshot we would then have the old POW PTS remaining. This could go on ad infinitum. Dumping, keeping, buying, other devs reviving the old, old PTS with a different feature...101 different versions of PTS. I'm sure some people would say this is fine - let there be competition. I think it'd be too messy.

Wouldn't proof-of-burn bring more clarity and finality to the situation?

I think proof-of-burn is the only way to upgrade PTS and make sure the old version of PTS dies.   When you snapshot in the future it could be hybrid between old / new PTS in a ratio proportional to the BURN.   

If you opt for this approach you could have 2 different burn addresses: 1 for a User Issued Asset on BTS and 1 for a custom chain with is own delegates.

Let PTS holders exit to both options.
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