Author Topic: Long live the social consensus, long live PTS! (Stay tuned)  (Read 18494 times)

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Offline alphaBar

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The existence of PTS does not hurt BTS. PTS is a DAC-agnostic implementation of the core DPOS Toolkit. It does not compete with BTS on features (how could it?) and it is not intended to "generate revenue" in the manner that BTS does. PTS will differ from BTS in the following ways:

* non-inflationary
* no application-specific features
* a jumping off point for 3rd party developers (extensible core DPOS Toolkit)

The anti-diversity crowd who wants to kill PTS is missing the point entirely. Very soon, 3rd party implementations of DPOS will become as common as Bitcoin clones. BTS is a feature-rich DAC with tons of advanced functionality (Pegged-assets, user assets, exchange, Vote, DNS, etc). 3rd party developers who intend to create a competing Vote DAC or a competing exchange DAC will never sharedrop to BTS (although an agnostic PTS would be a great choice). PTS will provide a hedge to investors who care about the Bitshares ecosystem to ensure that this community is vested in the protocol that we helped to fund, rather than just a single application of that protocol. We all hope that BTS succeeds, but the fact is that competition will exist whether we want it to or not. Why not vest yourself in the protocol by owning an agnostic, open-source, and non-competitive sharedrop instrument (PTS) as well as the killer app (BTS)?

Offline Ander

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It annoys me that people are still trying to give more free things to PTS, when I feel that BTS has 'bought out' that value of PTS and that BTS should be sharedropped instead if 3rd party devs want to do things like this.

Of course, I cannot control what developers want to do.

Also, it isnt really that big of a deal to me, I would much rather just see all the confusion end, and for us to promote a clear and unified vision of Bitshares to the world, so that everyone can understand Bitshares again and get behind it again.

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Offline ticklebiscuit

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PTS  8)
Crazy thing...its almost like a honey badger.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2014, 11:55:09 pm by ticklebiscuit »

Offline Akado

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Personally, I don't agree with this. PTS are now part of BTS. This just seems to be done out of a whim, with hopes to perpetuate something whose fate is already decided. It's way more simple to use BTS than trying to "revive" PTS and use them for snapshots, you're just wasting potential resources. As I see, it something being done out of a whim. It seems egoistical to say the least.

On top of that, it will make this discussion continue. It's done, it's solved. Let it be.

Don't fix what doesn't need to be fixed.
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lzr1900

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DO NOT DO THIS!

1. PTS was given shares in BTS. If it still lives we all just lost value in BTS for no reason
2. To reach a wide audience, as many our saying, new projects can still sharedrop on BTS
3. If people want stake in a specific new DAC they can either get it through a sharedrop on BTS or by investing in whatever the earliest mechanism the devs allow (e.g., fundraiser, etherium-style, placeholder coin, etc.) It will still be effectively the same concept because everyone will have the investment opportunity at the same time. If the devs don't allow for "early adopters" it will be because they did not want to. If they want to allow an early adopter mechanism, they still can.
4. This will confuse everyone even further. Just let it go, keep the ecosystem simple. PLEASE. You are going to hurt BTS if you do this.

I hope people either support me on this or give a good reason why I'm wrong.

AlphaBar knows what he is doing, and he knows that this hurts BTS. My guess is that he wants to make money on buying cheap PTS and making people that were unhappy with the merger come back toward his new PTS.
This is clearly hurting the community, but who really believes he has some real developers able to maintain and upgrade PTS... this story will be over soon, we shall just ignore him.
+5%

Offline inarizushi

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DO NOT DO THIS!

1. PTS was given shares in BTS. If it still lives we all just lost value in BTS for no reason
2. To reach a wide audience, as many our saying, new projects can still sharedrop on BTS
3. If people want stake in a specific new DAC they can either get it through a sharedrop on BTS or by investing in whatever the earliest mechanism the devs allow (e.g., fundraiser, etherium-style, placeholder coin, etc.) It will still be effectively the same concept because everyone will have the investment opportunity at the same time. If the devs don't allow for "early adopters" it will be because they did not want to. If they want to allow an early adopter mechanism, they still can.
4. This will confuse everyone even further. Just let it go, keep the ecosystem simple. PLEASE. You are going to hurt BTS if you do this.

I hope people either support me on this or give a good reason why I'm wrong.

AlphaBar knows what he is doing, and he knows that this hurts BTS. My guess is that he wants to make money on buying cheap PTS and making people that were unhappy with the merger come back toward his new PTS.
This is clearly hurting the community, but who really believes he has some real developers able to maintain and upgrade PTS... this story will be over soon, we shall just ignore him.
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Offline donkeypong

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Alphabar, I really think you should do a poll and see what percentage of the community supports you doing this and using the name PTS.

Offline teenagecheese

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DO NOT DO THIS!

1. PTS was given shares in BTS. If it still lives we all just lost value in BTS for no reason
2. To reach a wide audience, as many our saying, new projects can still sharedrop on BTS
3. If people want stake in a specific new DAC they can either get it through a sharedrop on BTS or by investing in whatever the earliest mechanism the devs allow (e.g., fundraiser, etherium-style, placeholder coin, etc.) It will still be effectively the same concept because everyone will have the investment opportunity at the same time. If the devs don't allow for "early adopters" it will be because they did not want to. If they want to allow an early adopter mechanism, they still can.
4. This will confuse everyone even further. Just let it go, keep the ecosystem simple. PLEASE. You are going to hurt BTS if you do this.

I hope people either support me on this or give a good reason why I'm wrong.

Offline ticklebiscuit

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PTS will be the preferred sharedrop instrument of future 3rd party DACs.

Really? Last time I looked, PTS and AGS were co-equal in that respect. And now most everyone is in BTS, so a sharedrop might start there for an updated list of community members.

Which 3rd party DACs are upcoming? X, Music, DNS, Vote, Play: all snapshotted.

If there are talented developers working on PTS, why aren't you working on making the existing DACs a big success? Or working on new DACs?

Clones of dacs with better marketing or business models.  Maybe competitors  to bts.  Or maybe any of the dacs that are still ideas.

Offline donkeypong

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PTS will be the preferred sharedrop instrument of future 3rd party DACs.

Really? Last time I looked, PTS and AGS were co-equal in that respect. And now most everyone is in BTS, so a sharedrop might start there for an updated list of community members.

Which 3rd party DACs are upcoming? X, Music, DNS, Vote, Play: all snapshotted.

If there are talented developers working on PTS, why aren't you working on making the existing DACs a big success? Or working on new DACs?

Offline ticklebiscuit

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Why not using your time with something useful?
Maybe you could build a wallet only bts Client, iOS app, Promotion campaigns or anything related to BTS?
via Imgflip Meme Maker
PTS did its job very well. Don't keep it artificially alive like they do it with the zombiecoin MMC.
My Heart bleeds when I see you guys wasting (y)our time with this sh..

People who wants pts to die need to promise to never buy them again. People who dont should buy them. Fair.  3rd parties choose what they honor. Not us

Offline nomoreheroes7

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I personally think PTS just needs to die gracefully. PTSers received shares in BTSX and have now DOUBLE dipped into BTS in exchange for their death. On top of this, PTS even now can sell to buy MORE BTSX. I think PTSers are being selfish in wanting to continue receiving shares in 3rd party DACs -- they've already been more than made whole through all the BTS dropped to them. Also, why would BTS want to compete against another chain that it just gifted a huge amount of shares to? Why can't BTS be the target of 3rd party snapshots, as that's where the entire ecosystem's value is and has now flowed into? How can you say that a 3rd party sharedrop to AGS/PTS now is showing support for the hard work of I3 and the team, when they no longer have any affiliation to these tokens whatsoever? In addition, the whole point of the merger was to make things less confusing; continuing PTS just continues to dilute the brand and blur the overall message.

Disclaimer: This is just my opinion; feel free to try and persuade me otherwise. But it truly feels like PTSers want to have their cake and eat it too, and that just doesn't sit right with me.

Offline emski

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A note regarding our work on the transition of PTS to a standalone DPOS chain:

PTS is alive and well and so is the social consensus. PTS will be the preferred sharedrop instrument of future 3rd party DACs. We have yet to decide whether to use the Nov. 5th snapshot (since a future snapshot may not be possible if mining stops completely), but rest assured that we have a functional testnet, new website and marketing in the works, and an active group of dedicated developers and marketers.

Stay tuned for more information...

Snapshot is possible at any block. Even if mining completely stops there will still be one last block. And that should be the snapshot.

As you cant be sure the mining will stop then a new snapshot should be announced.
That snapshot should be used instead of Nov 5th to start the new PTS DPOS chain.

Offline inarizushi

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A note regarding our work on the transition of PTS to a standalone DPOS chain:

PTS is alive and well and so is the social consensus. PTS will be the preferred sharedrop instrument of future 3rd party DACs. We have yet to decide whether to use the Nov. 5th snapshot (since a future snapshot may not be possible if mining stops completely), but rest assured that we have a functional testnet, new website and marketing in the works, and an active group of dedicated developers and marketers.

Stay tuned for more information...

I hope we won't need to hear from you anymore here once you got your new website
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Offline ticklebiscuit

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Why can't we just do 3rd party drops to BTS? PTS is pretty much dead as no miners are mining it anymore. It would also be nice because you would give the new blood coming in a chance instead of locking it to a small group of people. By dropping shares into BTS you will get wider distribution so more users. I really do not see the point in giving away shares to a defunct system that is owned largely by early adopters.

*Not trying to be disrespectful to the "early adopters" but I think we are all early adopters, and I think that by just sticking to BTS for share drops it will do 2 things

1) Bigger userbase and testers for your new 3rd party DAC which means less hoarding by just a few individuals.
2) Eliminates the confusion to new users and will give the new "early adopters" a chance to get in on the action.

Just my personal opinion :)

U mean expand the number of shares for new snapshot on bts?