Author Topic: Hard Questions for Bytemaster  (Read 32864 times)

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Offline bytemaster

Fmv is little more than a couple full pay delegate slots over 2 years. 

Noise.

Fmv is the cornerstone of my marketing strategy.   
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline gamey

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I think they'll end up having to be even more measured with both Sharedrops and the markets they target. Even a few $ is really eating into NXTTY imo.. https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=10589.0

Wow, NXTTY is getting destroyed.  That giveaway just looks like a complete failure now.

We should definitely avoid giving away BTS, and instead should give bitUSD as rewards in any upcoming promotions!  After all, did paypal give away paypal stock in its viral growth promotion?  No, they gave USD.

Yeah the PayPal case study is very misleading because PayPal blew through a huge pile of money short term and it was a huge drain and burden that took a while to generate positive returns. Applied to Crypto and having give-aways directly eat into the share price is very different and pretty much every sharedrop case study has shown that it's not an effective network technique in this space.

I'm not against them, they just have to be very specific and targeted. Start small & evaluate. Even $10 can be expensive.

An example is, if it was possible to give $10 BitUSD to existing customers of Bitcoin exchanges in Argentina who have reasonable balances, then that might be something worth attempting. As Argentina could be huge for BitUSD and getting it into the hands of people that already understand crypto and can communicate it to family and friends would be ideal. (I would prefer to recruit potential marketers like that. People or businesses that have the ability or platform to advertise and promote BitAssets to a much wider audience if they like it.) Generally though I think you get more bang for your buck with advertising and publicity than give-aways in this space.

I think the culture of the internet has changed signficantly since whenever PayPal did that.  You have those fatwallet type sites.  When I was a kid on the internet, I'm sure the IQ level was easily 15 points higher in general. (Which far predated paypal) Now every scrub ass kid is on the internet in some capacity.  I'm not sure giveaways would target the right demographic at this point unless they are specifically targeted.
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Offline NewMine

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Bytemaster, I would appreciate public answers to all of these questions. Sorry to do this to you, but when lots of money is involved, asking hard questions is the right thing to do. You’ve always championed transparency as far as I can remember, which is part of the reason I have invested so much and am ready to invest even more once these are addressed:


1) What value is Follow My Vote supposed to be contributing? When will we see deliverables? Will you make them pay for / work on BTS stuff, considering you gave them a huge monetary gift (30m BTS which is half a million dollars) and apparently a core developer as well (nathanhourt on github, a top contributor for github.com/bitshares/bitshares until recently)?

2) I understand Brian and his team have a performance-based incentive of some kind, can you give us exact numbers? Is it another 30m like for Adam?

3) What will you do if a different marketing team can prove that a marketing success is due to their contributions and not Brian's?

4) Yes, I said *prove* - you know marketing is an objective science, right? How do you measure marketing success? How does Brian? Have you ever used the word "metric" in your marketing discussions?

5) Would you support a hard fork to freeze FMV’s funds if a majority of shareholders approved it? When will we have the proposal feature so that we can vote on it?   ~~Poll question~~: Should we freeze FMV’s half-million-dollar sharedrop until they deliver something with non-0 positive value?

6) Bonus question: What is your hypothesis about why Ethereum, which is younger than BTS, is literally 10 times more well-known by most freely-accessible internet marketing metrics? "I don't know" is an acceptable and honorable answer.


Thanks for your time and sorry again for bringing up this uncomfortable topic. You still have my support 100%, because I don't blame you for the failures alluded to above.

P.S.  If you want to do something, but internal politics prevent you, all it takes is the proposal feature with a properly-worded proposal for your shareholders to get it and vote how you want. Don’t be a slave to contrived social pressure and stop letting your friends plunder your investors’ funds.


To everyone else: I think Brian Page and Adam Ernest (among others, but these guys have fat BTS stake now) are both leeches who are sucking value out of Dan, taking advantage of his inability to make value judgements about some aspects of business (marketing and business dev). It is the job of BTS holders to prevent corruption, incompetence, or whatever is really going on. Demand a proposal / polling feature.

These are my concerns with FMV and some are speculative and others are just facts and hurdles that I see as complications with the entire process:

1. FMV has a direct geographical relation to the Bitshares origins. Since no one on the team had any political experience (the Ernest listed as a "political Scientist" has zero experience in politics through listed references or an advanced google search, and frankly saying he is active in politics means what? He votes?), I am suspect that there is some non-familial nepotism i.e. Adam Ernest is friends with someone in Bitshares.

2. It is quite clear that FMV is just an idea and outside developers are being brought in to actually build the tangibles. This again bothers me that the community is giving huge wealth to the supposed idea grabber and not the people truly inventing it. The money will trickle down I am sure, but there is an unnecessary middle man and frankly, the idea was birthed well before Adam Ernest was involved within this community.

3.CAVO is not anything to be hyped up about. They are an advocacy group in its infancy and it's debatable whether they have any influence over anything at this point or ever will. It is a group of a few county registrars and entrepreneurs (who are most likely promoting their idea for open source voting structures).

As a recent law was passed here in California, any county registrar has the ability to test and try new voting systems. There is no need to pay into a group if you have a platform established. You could go to any county, ask to demonstrate and then try out and they will get funding and you can then prove your system works.

4. Implementing a new voting system isn't as easy as you would think. You need it to conform to Federal and State election codes,Accesability requirements (HAVA), and counting standards. For California (as is where CAVO applies), Once a particular voting system meets these requirements and is certified by the EAC, the Ca Secratary of State has to approve the system. This is not the end all. Then the county registrars get to pick and choose which system they want their county to use. Currently, there are 7 voting systems approved by the Sec. Of State. used in 58 counties in Ca.

5. FMV has no representation in CAlifornia, the state they are trying break ground in. They have a self appointed "Political Scientist" who lives in San Diego with no real political experience.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2014, 06:07:39 am by NewMine »

Offline Mysto

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An example is, if it was possible to give $10 BitUSD to existing customers of Bitcoin exchanges in Argentina who have reasonable balances, then that might be something worth attempting. As Argentina could be huge for BitUSD and getting it into the hands of people that already understand crypto and can communicate it to family and friends would be ideal. (I would prefer to recruit potential marketers like that. People or businesses that have the ability or platform to advertise and promote BitAssets to a much wider audience if they like it.)

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Offline Mysto

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I am using a 800$ laptop, i5 CPU, 500G SSD HD, Windows7. It usually takes about 3 minutes to open the wallet, and 30 seconds to open the market. Better than yours, but still far from satisfying.

BTW, the above description is the common case. If I don't open my wallet over 3 days, it sometimes takes over 10 minutes to open the wallet, and no connection. I have to restart many times to resolve the no connection issue.

However, my point is that, although the current windows wallet is not good enough, the linux wallet is quite stable, and the security and functionality of system can be guaranteed. For enterprise-level application, usually linux version wallet is used. So I don't understand why the wallet stability affects the marketing...

I don't open my wallet everyday that's probably why it takes so long to launch. I have a FX-8350, 32 GB of memory, and a 480 GB SSD, running on windows.

It effects marketing because we are not exclusively marketing to linux users. If we put out a marketing campaign some windows users are bound to see it, download the wallet and have a bad taste left in their mouth. Even if you are talking about marketing it to merchants it's still a bad idea. Merchants are not going to want to implement something that works flawlessly for them (if they are using linux) while the customers who are using windows don't have a similar experience.

Unless you are talking about something completely different, in that case please do elaborate.

Offline Empirical1.1

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I think they'll end up having to be even more measured with both Sharedrops and the markets they target. Even a few $ is really eating into NXTTY imo.. https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=10589.0

Wow, NXTTY is getting destroyed.  That giveaway just looks like a complete failure now.

We should definitely avoid giving away BTS, and instead should give bitUSD as rewards in any upcoming promotions!  After all, did paypal give away paypal stock in its viral growth promotion?  No, they gave USD.

Yeah the PayPal case study is very misleading because PayPal blew through a huge pile of money short term and it was a huge drain and burden that took a while to generate positive returns. Applied to Crypto and having give-aways directly eat into the share price is very different and pretty much every sharedrop case study has shown that it's not an effective network technique in this space.

I'm not against them, they just have to be very specific and targeted. Start small & evaluate. Even $10 can be expensive.

An example is, if it was possible to give $10 BitUSD to existing customers of Bitcoin exchanges in Argentina who have reasonable balances, then that might be something worth attempting. As Argentina could be huge for BitUSD and getting it into the hands of people that already understand crypto and can communicate it to family and friends would be ideal. (I would prefer to recruit potential marketers like that. People or businesses that have the ability or platform to advertise and promote BitAssets to a much wider audience if they like it.) Generally though I think you get more bang for your buck with advertising and publicity than give-aways in this space.


« Last Edit: December 01, 2014, 05:30:59 pm by Empirical1.1 »

Offline roadscape

Wow, NXTTY is getting destroyed.  That giveaway just looks like a complete failure now.

We should definitely avoid giving away BTS, and instead should give bitUSD as rewards in any upcoming promotions!  After all, did paypal give away paypal stock in its viral growth promotion?  No, they gave USD.

From what I saw, NXTTY quietly increased their supply by 500% in the run-up to their app launch. Seems shady.
http://cryptofresh.com  |  witness: roadscape

Offline Ander

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I think they'll end up having to be even more measured with both Sharedrops and the markets they target. Even a few $ is really eating into NXTTY imo.. https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=10589.0

Wow, NXTTY is getting destroyed.  That giveaway just looks like a complete failure now.

We should definitely avoid giving away BTS, and instead should give bitUSD as rewards in any upcoming promotions!  After all, did paypal give away paypal stock in its viral growth promotion?  No, they gave USD.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline CalabiYau

WIN7/64, i7, 8GB, SSD,   Wallet v. 0.4.24 

Setup was tricky, the specific folders in ./bitshares had to be deleted but:

Runs stable since weeks on 8 connections now, no more issues so far, opens quick and voting is no more scary - balance shows up after seconds  :)   

Offline islandking

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The Linux wallet seems to be running quickly. I have not tried the windows or mac wallet though.
I've been working on a new electronic cash system that's fully peer-to-peer, with no trusted third party. - Satoshi

Offline Crossover

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The current wallet is functional, works reasonably well on Mac but is terrible on windows.
very very slow.

Offline fluxer555

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ssd hard drive

Perhaps this is what is making your experience much better than most Windows users? Try running the client with the data directory on an external hard drive.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2014, 04:00:14 pm by fluxer555 »

Offline Gentso1

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I run win7 64 bit
first gen core I7
12gig ram
ssd hard drive
internet is slow here(I live in the country) @ 15mb/s

The wallet takes ,wait let me time it 6secs to get to the log on screen and another 6 secs from the time I hit enter until I am in the client. Last block was synced 17 hours ago, 2 network connections showing, took 1 min to snyc.I can't remember the last time my client crashed. It should be noted I don't short but I do buy/sell and vote on a regular basis. I have made backups and done complete restores with little problem once I understood how to do it.

My electrum wallet takes 25 secs to load and about 5 to snyc for comparison.

Maybe my view is a little off because my Bitshares experience has been pretty positive. 
If you make a bad first impression then it will cost 3x as much to get an opportunity to make a second impression.   

The current wallet is functional, works reasonably well on Mac but is terrible on windows.

You seem very firm for some time to not start marketing until the wallet is up to your standards BUT many of us in the community have spoken up and said lets talk about this, do our voices just fall on deaf ears? Is their a way to get you to change your mind or consider a change or should we just sit quietly and wait?
« Last Edit: December 01, 2014, 03:26:57 pm by Gentso1 »

merockstar

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This thread is jumping the gun.

The story has consistently, for as long as I can remember there being a marketing director, been "chill out peeps, the wallet isn't even shiny yet, brian is working on top secret plans in the background."

A few months back there was all manner of hints pertaining to what he had up his sleeve. Without being open, they still managed to keep those of us who made the effort to research vaguely aware of what has been going on.

Patience.

Offline santaclause102

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If you make a bad first impression then it will cost 3x as much to get an opportunity to make a second impression.   

The current wallet is functional, works reasonably well on Mac but is terrible on windows.
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