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Ggozzo

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Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« on: April 08, 2015, 12:24:33 AM »

BTS keeps falling and I wanted to cover some of my position but it says I have to buy bitUSD to cover. Try to buy bitUSD and i dont have sufficient funds. So is there a way around this or do I have to wait the 30 days out and get auto filled upon expiration?

Sure hope there is some way to get out. Losing BTS everyday!

Side note: why does my account dashboard not display how much I am short?


Offline liondani

Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2015, 01:30:07 AM »
BTS keeps falling and I wanted to cover some of my position but it says I have to buy bitUSD to cover. Try to buy bitUSD and i dont have sufficient funds. So is there a way around this or do I have to wait the 30 days out and get auto filled upon expiration?

Sure hope there is some way to get out. Losing BTS everyday!

Side note: why does my account dashboard not display how much I am short?

We are adding an operation that will allow you to cover a short position using the collateral at any time.  We are doing this by giving the user the ability to set the "call price" to anything higher than the "minimum call price".   This feature makes it trivial to bypass the 5% fee by slightly increasing your call price, so this makes the 5% fee impossible to enforce.

In reality the 5% fee merely served to create a variable amount of additional collateral depending upon the risk tolerance of each individual shorter.  Considering we are raising the min collateral requirement from 1.5 to 2x the added benefit of the 5% fee is insignificant.  The fear of a short squeeze and being forced to buy at up to 10% above the feed if there are not enough orders at the feed means there is still plenty of incentive to avoid forced buying.

If you set your call price at or above the price feed then your order will be matched against any and all bids up to 10% above the feed.   So be careful or you might just walk the book. 

Overall this will simplify the explanation of BitShares and shorts and remove uncertainty over how shorts and fees will be calculated.

@bytemaster

If I am right on current versions it is still not possible....
Will this future be implemented soon?

@skyscraperfarms
After expiration day if you not have covered yet you will loose up to 10% further (with current version, If I am not missing anything)
« Last Edit: April 08, 2015, 01:34:30 AM by liondani »
  https://bitshares.OPENLEDGER.info/?r=GREECE  | You are in Control | BUY | SELL | SHORT | SWAP | LOAN | TRADE |  

Offline Troglodactyl

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Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2015, 01:33:43 AM »
I realize it's a bit late now, but for any other readers, this is much easier to manage if you break up your shorts into small orders.  That way you can roll it all over gradually with a lot less extra BTS.

Is it all a single order coming due at once?

Offline liondani

Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2015, 01:37:11 AM »
I realize it's a bit late now, but for any other readers, this is much easier to manage if you break up your shorts into small orders.  That way you can roll it all over gradually with a lot less extra BTS.

Is it all a single order coming due at once?

using the remaining collateral to cover shorts would be the best solution(?)
any update on this?
  https://bitshares.OPENLEDGER.info/?r=GREECE  | You are in Control | BUY | SELL | SHORT | SWAP | LOAN | TRADE |  

Ggozzo

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Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2015, 02:04:20 AM »
I realize it's a bit late now, but for any other readers, this is much easier to manage if you break up your shorts into small orders.  That way you can roll it all over gradually with a lot less extra BTS.

Is it all a single order coming due at once?

It was 3 separate order. Two small, one bigger.

They all come due within a day of the first one.

This is the worst thing I have come across in BitShares. How could this be? It seem it would be common sense to be able to cover, especially since the blockchain controls the collateral.

Ggozzo

  • Guest
Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2015, 02:08:53 AM »
I realize it's a bit late now, but for any other readers, this is much easier to manage if you break up your shorts into small orders.  That way you can roll it all over gradually with a lot less extra BTS.

Is it all a single order coming due at once?

using the remaining collateral to cover shorts would be the best solution(?)
any update on this?

I actually don't want to do anything now. This is pretty lame and I will just wait it out and update if the market turns around or if I get screwed or if this problem is corrected. 


Offline liondani

Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2015, 02:14:47 AM »
It seem it would be common sense to be able to cover, especially since the blockchain controls the collateral.

THIS ^

I hope they implement the future to cover our shorts using the remaining collateral soon enough! Traders expect this by default...
  https://bitshares.OPENLEDGER.info/?r=GREECE  | You are in Control | BUY | SELL | SHORT | SWAP | LOAN | TRADE |  

Ggozzo

  • Guest
Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2015, 02:20:36 AM »
It actually is annoying me thinking about this. I assumed that I could exit regardless of the amount of BTS or bitUSD held in my account * as long as my collateral can cover any loss.

Having shorted stocks before, I'm actually credited the amount of money for the shares I shorted. I can then use that money to buy back the shares in order to close the position out. I don't ever have to go to the bank and transfer more money in to buy them back. But I also can't use that money to buy other stocks if it puts me over a required margin amount.

Why can't I be in control of the BTS from the sale of the bitUSD? I know it will mess up the 3x collateral claims, but I think 2x collateral is plenty. If not, you need to implement a manual cover that will execute at limit orders and not be shuffled to the back of the book.

zerosum

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Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2015, 02:23:09 AM »
I realize it's a bit late now, but for any other readers, this is much easier to manage if you break up your shorts into small orders.  That way you can roll it all over gradually with a lot less extra BTS.

Is it all a single order coming due at once?

It was 3 separate order. Two small, one bigger.

They all come due within a day of the first one.

This is the worst thing I have come across in BitShares. How could this be? It seem it would be common sense to be able to cover, especially since the blockchain controls the collateral.

I do not know if you started this as a general concern thread or do you need a solution for just now.

1. Generally - This was done because BM feels the more collateral the safer system... at all costs. My total disagreement with that notion is well documented. At least he is softening his stands as was quoted above on this 'soft collateral' issue....

2. Practical - The way to do it (assuming you do not want to put new money in BTS) is to:
 Borrow BTS from a friend; buy bitUSD, cover your shorts and return the loaned BTS from the collateral you will get back.
This works only if you have not lost too much and there are enough bitUSD for sell...Right now you will have to pay quite a premium for any bitUSD you want to buy, though.

Hope this helps....

Online yellowecho

Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2015, 03:04:33 AM »
It seem it would be common sense to be able to cover, especially since the blockchain controls the collateral.

THIS ^

I hope they implement the future to cover our shorts using the remaining collateral soon enough! Traders expect this by default...

Truth.
696c6f766562726f776e696573

Offline lastagile

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Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2015, 11:56:34 AM »
anyone knows when the 0.9will release?I have some asset can not found. Now I need to cover the short with that money.


从我的 iPhone 发送,使用 Tapatalk

Online yellowecho

Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2015, 02:53:51 PM »
anyone knows when the 0.9will release?I have some asset can not found. Now I need to cover the short with that money.

Have you tried importing your wallet into 0.8?  I had no issues receiving shares from NOTES.
696c6f766562726f776e696573

Offline abit

Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2015, 03:44:57 AM »
anyone knows when the 0.9will release?I have some asset can not found. Now I need to cover the short with that money.

Have you tried importing your wallet into 0.8?  I had no issues receiving shares from NOTES.
The problem is that 0.8 has an issue while recovering/regenerating active key.
BTS account: abit
BTS committee member: abit
BTS witness: in.abit

Offline abit

Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2015, 03:55:57 AM »
anyone knows when the 0.9will release?I have some asset can not found. Now I need to cover the short with that money.

If you're brave enough, you could try the patch in this issue https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares/issues/1413 and make a work build yourself.  ;)
BTS account: abit
BTS committee member: abit
BTS witness: in.abit

Offline xeroc

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Re: Used all my BTS to short bitUSD......
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2015, 06:25:51 AM »
The problem is that 0.8 has an issue while recovering/regenerating active key.
Do you know details .. could you tell us more?
Give BitShares a try! Use the http://testnet.bitshares.eu provided by http://bitshares.eu powered by ChainSquad GmbH

 

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