Moonstone Fundraiser Help Thread

[xeroc]

I sent the MOONFUND I purchased with bitcoin from the newly-generated wallet to my main BitShares address. No problem with that, right?

Nop .. all right .. :)
My guess for the "buyback" is that they will probably set a buy order for MOONFUND in the decentralized exchange (maybe also offer via metaexchange or so) ..
this means, you can
+ send your MOONFUND tokens to however you want
+ split them into smaller pieces
+ store them in coldstorage
+ sell them on the DEX earlier of you find a buyer (for any asset)

[joereform]

I sent the MOONFUND I purchased with bitcoin from the newly-generated wallet to my main BitShares address. No problem with that, right?

[Shentist]

it seems bitsapphire is still reworking the moonstone.io website

if you want to donat, you can still submit direct on https://metaexchange.info/markets/MOONFUND/BTC

[jz831]

The price of BTS moved within that time period faster than our API call to our price feed. Metaexchange is showing the correct amount. The correct amount should be displayed within a few minutes on Moonstone.io. Both are just estimates as the final amount is calculated once the first Bitcoin confirmation happens after 10-15 minutes.

If you want to see your final balance faster, and if you already have a TITAN ID with the current wallet, you can use Metaexchange. After 10-15 minutes you'll get your MOONFUND tokens.

Please let us know whether there are any other issues you encounter!

When i submit the form on the crowdfunding page https://moonstone.io/, (after moving the mouse around, and entering the password) - the page now is outputting the following incorrect text:

You will receive approximately
0.00 Moonstone Tokens per Bitcoin

I realize what you say above probably explains the issue, I just wanted to raise it to you so you're aware of it, as this will likely deter investors.

[bitsapphire]

I want to donate from the moonstone.io  but it tell me I will get 50200 moonfund for one bitcoin.
But If I buy from metaxchange, the moonfund price is 0.00001704, that is about 58000 moonfund per bitcoin.

Some body can tell me why? I dare not donate for now.

The price of BTS moved within that time period faster than our API call to our price feed. Metaexchange is showing the correct amount. The correct amount should be displayed within a few minutes on Moonstone.io. Both are just estimates as the final amount is calculated once the first Bitcoin confirmation happens after 10-15 minutes.

If you want to see your final balance faster, and if you already have a TITAN ID with the current wallet, you can use Metaexchange. After 10-15 minutes you'll get your MOONFUND tokens.

Please let us know whether there are any other issues you encounter!

[xiahui135]

I want to donate from the moonstone.io  but it tell me I will get 50200 moonfund for one bitcoin.
But If I buy from metaxchange, the moonfund price is 0.00001704, that is about 58000 moonfund per bitcoin.

Some body can tell me why? I dare not donate for now.

[bitsapphire]

What happens when you reach your goal?  Will you still refund the donations made after $150k with 15% yield?  What if you had 500k dumped on your site.  Is there anything preventing you from meeting the target of 15% yield for 500K in donations?

If we get 500k dumped then that will be the least of our worries :). We would be able to integrate Bitcoin much faster, create a decentralized bridging service, and decentralize the server setup into an oracle setup. Not to mention that we could start with the modularization of the system for future plugins too. If anything like that happens we'll figure out an even better way to compensate everybody!

Assuming though we simply pass the 130k goal, based on our calculation and the current BTS exchange rate up to 300k USD worth of MOONFUNDS should be no problem with 5 delegates.

Does that address your concerns?

Yeah thats great.  Btw what's your story?  How did you find out about bitshares?  And why bitshares?  Any other projects you guys worked on before you came here?

Here's  a great video interview Max did https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sDU-ooXq-E

This should answer all your questions.

[vlight]

Congrats on selling BTS down to its lowest price ever to fund moonstone.

Its going to be so great when moonstone gives us a 20% rise when it comes out, after driving the price down 50% for the funding.  Yep, so awesome.

haha, we wanted a moon instead we got a moonstone to the face.

[bitsapphire]

"Moonstone is a crypto wallet that allows transfers and trades among BitShares, BitAssets, User-Issued Assets (UIA), and other tokens."

This description is very difficult for non-BitShares people who might find this page. How about,

"Moonstone is a free crypto wallet that allows transfers and trades among Bitcoin, BitAssets (like bitUSD and bitGOLD), User-Issued Assets (UIA), and other tokens."

Thanks CLains! Just updated the sentence accordingly. New website will be up in 2-3 days based on community feedback so far. Any other ideas or comments?

[CLains]

"Moonstone is a crypto wallet that allows transfers and trades among BitShares, BitAssets, User-Issued Assets (UIA), and other tokens."

This description is very difficult for non-BitShares people who might find this page. How about,

"Moonstone is a free crypto wallet that allows transfers and trades among Bitcoin, BitAssets (like bitUSD and bitGOLD), User-Issued Assets (UIA), and other tokens."

[bitsapphire]

Can you spell out more clearly why moontokens are valuable?

Each MOONFUND token will be bought back from the market with BTS in the future via delegate pay. For every donation you will receive 15% more MOONFUND tokens than you would BTS on a current exchange. This means that as long as the Moonstone wallet becomes sufficiently popular over the next 5-30 months you can make a return on your donation.

I'm concerned about the numbers. Let's say you put a 30 month cutoff on the delegate pay. This means each 100% delegate can only generate 3,905,560 BTS during this 30 month period. You already have 1,350,349 MOONFUND liability with only 5% funded. If we assume the price of BTS remains the same over the next 30 days, then raising $130,000 requires generating a total of (1.15 * 130,000 / 0.005399) = 27,690,313 MOONFUND tokens (assuming the crowdfunding is successful). In order to generate enough BTS to buyback the MOONFUND at a 1-to-1 rate, you would need 27,690,313/3,905,560 = 7.09 100% paid delegates (so round that up to 8 delegates). The problem will be even worse if the price of BTS continues to drop over the next 30 days.

The problem is you are offering 15% return on BTS. If BTS price is expected to shoot up in the next year or so like we all expect it will, you will be overpaying a lot! It was a much more realistic deal when the return was on the dollar amount donated.

Edit: I don't think you should change the deal now that the fundraiser has started. But you should just be clear about exactly how many delegates you plan to include in the opt-out selection for the Moonstone wallet and what your maximum cut off time is before you take the delegates down (or at least stop using their pay to buy back MOONFUND tokens). That way people can properly assess the risk of not getting paid back (or what percentage they will be paid back).

Furthermore, you should not do a continuous buyback since you cannot know if you will be able to fulfill the entire buyback at a 1-to-1 rate prior to the cut off time. In this case, the people who are fastest to sell their MOONFUND tokens will profit at the expense of the slower movers. To be fair, you should instead regularly distribute dividends to MOONFUND holders.

If the price of BTS continues to fall relative to BTC over the next month then yes the 30 month limit is too short.

Our number one approach is to not cap the buyback period at all.

We are currently redesigning the fundraiser page to reflect visually better what got done so far.

[fav]

What if we want to do multiple donations? Would you just send some more BTC at a later time to the same BTC address you generated when you first created the wallet?

Is there any way to check and see whether our donation was received and our wallet credited?

That flow should work - metaexchange deposit addresses are reusable and the moonstone team is using our API to generate the addresses on their fundraiser page. bitsapphire should be able to confirm :)

was about to ask the same. is this confirmed @bitsapphire ?

[fuzzy]

Thats why future fund-raisers should get advises from the community before they start...
just my 2 MOONSTONES  ;)

Nehh... why bother?

"We will receive the delegates pay and buy back the IOU" was as detail explanation as we got from bitsapphire....and this was enough for at least 2 months of min 2-3 daily posts that applauded them and virtually promised that the project will bring  the price of BTS to the... moon (appropriately). Why break the good mojo with some details and logic? nehh.

[edit]
PS
And yes this was my only question (alongside with several critiques) when the funding with delegates/buying back the IOU was initially announced... And I have not seen yet any model that makes this working smoothly (it is a rare case but I am not in owe with arhag's proposals neither)

People don't show up to ask tough questions: tough questions will not be asked.

[NewMine]

Congrats on selling BTS down to its lowest price ever to fund moonstone.

Its going to be so great when moonstone gives us a 20% rise when it comes out, after driving the price down 50% for the funding.  Yep, so awesome.

Hey now.

It just a crypto bear market. Right?   ;)

[zerosum]

Thats why future fund-raisers should get advises from the community before they start...
just my 2 MOONSTONES  ;)

Nehh... why bother?

"We will receive the delegates pay and buy back the IOU" was as detail explanation as we got from bitsapphire....and this was enough for at least 2 months of min 2-3 daily posts that applauded them and virtually promised that the project will bring  the price of BTS to the... moon (appropriately). Why break the good mojo with some details and logic? nehh.

[edit]
PS
And yes this was my only question (alongside with several critiques) when the funding with delegates/buying back the IOU was initially announced... And I have not seen yet any model that makes this working smoothly (it is a rare case but I am not in owe with arhag's proposals neither)