Ripple fined

[davidpbrown]

This bit is very interesting:

Pursuant to the agreement, Ripple Labs will also undertake certain enhancements to the Ripple Protocol to appropriately monitor all future transactions.

Could regulators put pressure on Bytemaster & co to change the BitShares protocol? Of course the answer to that would be "the community has the source code and wouldnt accept those changes" (I would fork them out immediately).

Is the main difference that Ripple was selling the XRP themselves, so its not really centralized whereas BitShares isnt really owned/sold by any one group?

It helps to consider different classes of activity.
Done right, I would expect to see the following.. and it seems the UK perhaps is gearing up for this.
Ripple is clearly Class 2 below and no surprise from the fine, I would expect strict KYC and AML will be enforced on them.. quite right too.
BitShares atm is Class 3 and perhaps BTS could be considered Class 1.


Class 1: Money
# Would expect: No regulation or Government intervention needed here.

Class 2: Money transport
# Would expect: KYC and other consumer protection and the usual requirements for money transfer services, might be appropriate.

Class 3: Tokens with value pegged to match other assets
# Would expect: No regulation or Government intervention needed here.

Class 4: Tokens that are explicitly linked to real world assets
# Would expect: Government could help establish licensing and making the law clear and responsive in ways that help evidence and enforce the explicit link between digital token and asset.

Class 5: Zero value applications, such as private key signing.
# Would expect: No action at this time.


and then also, I've suggested before:
Class 2 and Class 4, could benefit from having a certain level of Government regulation and consumer protection. While digital currencies or tokens can represent value, it is only those explicitly linked to real world assets and wealth that need Government regulation and consumer protection. Blockchain technology, for all its acting in place of third party authority, cannot bridge the gap from the internet into the real world.

Class 1 and Class 3, needs no regulation by Government and would suffer from that. The exchange of those classes between people, might need to be acknowledged and understood by courts and in legislation. To be clear, the values within these digital currencies and pegged assets, are a private concern and it would be inappropriate and unnecessary for Government to interfere with those interests.

[blahblah7up]

BitShares - we're not a decentralized exchange, but a ___(1000BTS bounty)_________

decentralized unit transducer  :D

decentralized market mirror   ;D

[blahblah7up]

BitShares - we're not a decentralized exchange, but a ___(1000BTS bounty)_________

decentralized unit transducer  :D

[kenCode]

Well, technically there is no 'exchange' going on, since all the assets are on the same chain...
edit: depends on what their definition of virtual currency is

Their definitions of 'exchange' or 'virtual currency' are (and will be) whatever they say it is. They will open end it, or just demonize you and create your "guilt", at all costs. The government is a cat in a corner right now, it will do whatever it has to, to save itself. Vicious.

This is one reason why I am not so excited about any direct fiat onramps to us. We can utilize centralized exchanges FOR NOW to get fiat into our platform. Once the system collapses (this year will be VERY ugly for all fiat markets), centralized exchanges and fiat won't even be desired anymore.

There's TONS of ways to get bitcoin right now and more than enough ways to get that bitcoin into BitShares. You guys know as well as I do, it's not that hard.

Once in crypto, always in crypto. Avoid the f*ckers. Render the fiat'ers obsolete, don't try to onramp with them as a kneejerk to our currently low cap and price.

This is just my opinion. There's tons of other things we can be doing right now to onramp people.

[kenCode]

All that kissing up to the government just so they could get fined?

+5%

[monsterer]

This means virtual currency exchanges need to have AML.  I am not sure how this is going to impact bitshares's internal 'exchange'.  Perhaps bitshares needs to move away from the word 'exchange' to stay clear from legal troubles.

Well, technically there is no 'exchange' going on, since all the assets are on the same chain...

edit: depends on what their definition of virtual currency is

[speedy]

This bit is very interesting:

Pursuant to the agreement, Ripple Labs will also undertake certain enhancements to the Ripple Protocol to appropriately monitor all future transactions.

Could regulators put pressure on Bytemaster & co to change the BitShares protocol? Of course the answer to that would be "the community has the source code and wouldnt accept those changes" (I would fork them out immediately).

Is the main difference that Ripple was selling the XRP themselves, so its not really centralized whereas BitShares isnt really owned/sold by any one group?

[cube]

http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/nr/pdf/20150505.pdf

"Virtual currency exchangers must bring products to market that comply with our anti-money
laundering laws," said FinCEN Director Jennifer Shasky Calvery.

This means virtual currency exchanges need to have AML.  I am not sure how this is going to impact bitshares's internal 'exchange'.  Perhaps bitshares needs to move away from the word 'exchange' to stay clear from legal troubles.

[monsterer]

Is this related to their IPO, or to their day to day operations?

[mike623317]

http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/nr/pdf/20150505.pdf

"Virtual currency exchangers must bring products to market that comply with our anti-money
laundering laws," said FinCEN Director Jennifer Shasky Calvery. "Innovation is laudable but
only as long as it does not unreasonably expose our financial system to tech-smart criminals
eager to abuse the latest and most complex products."

.. tech-smart criminals eager to abuse the latest and most complex products
..er
....goldmansacs, is that you?
.. that's it

[Pheonike]

Translation: We need to protect the "tech-smart criminals eager to abuse the latest and most complex products" inside the system because they are "too big to fail".

[jaran]

Bitcoin's model of anonymous, fully decentralized protocol signers is a huge advantage against this kind of regulatory action.

Can bitshares delegates be targeted by this kind of regulation?

[julian1]

Bitcoin's model of anonymous, fully decentralized protocol signers is a huge advantage against this kind of regulatory action.

[luckybit]

http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/nr/pdf/20150505.pdf

"Virtual currency exchangers must bring products to market that comply with our anti-money
laundering laws," said FinCEN Director Jennifer Shasky Calvery. "Innovation is laudable but
only as long as it does not unreasonably expose our financial system to tech-smart criminals
eager to abuse the latest and most complex products."

All that kissing up to the government just so they could get fined?

[Riverhead]

Translation: We aren't sure if the system allows us to collect all the tax revenue we're "due".