BTSCX - UIAs backed by real cryptocurrency, decentralized fund storage

[donkeypong]

I'm also interested, but add me to the list of those who don't fully understand how it would work.

[tonyk]

Okay, it's been a week now. Nobody else interested in a good decentralized exchange here? 

I think this is something that is potentially of great interest here.  But I'm not sure it's clear enough to everyone exactly what you've proposed or what the ramifications might be in terms of the mechanics of trading on the Bitshares platform.  I tried to ask some questions in the chat during last week's mumble session to start shedding some light, but apparently you didn't see that. 

In any event, as you know, Bitshares already has decentralized exchange.  So are you just talking about a decentralized wallet component that would allow actual coins to be stored and traded on the existing exchange as opposed to needing to create pegged assets for each coin that would be traded?  That sounds very interesting.  But if I'm getting it wrong, please explain. 

Can you also explain some other details.  Are you proposing to create a version of this specifically FOR the Bitshares platform?  Or is this something which, once developed, would work with any decentralized exchange?

Finally, can you offer a rough estimate as to a) how long this would take to develop, and b) what the cost would be?  Thanks.

Yes  for those questions.

Put the same in another way, after those coins hit your 'decentralize wallet(s)' what happens next? Do you issue some IOUs of you exchange representing each coin or pegged asset or combination of both?
 This part is not quite clear from what you have posted so far.
Thanks.

[tbone]

Okay, it's been a week now. Nobody else interested in a good decentralized exchange here? 

I think this is something that is potentially of great interest here.  But I'm not sure it's clear enough to everyone exactly what you've proposed or what the ramifications might be in terms of the mechanics of trading on the Bitshares platform.  I tried to ask some questions in the chat during last week's mumble session to start shedding some light, but apparently you didn't see that. 

In any event, as you know, Bitshares already has decentralized exchange.  So are you just talking about a decentralized wallet component that would allow actual coins to be stored and traded on the existing exchange as opposed to needing to create pegged assets for each coin that would be traded?  That sounds very interesting.  But if I'm getting it wrong, please explain. 

Can you also explain some other details.  Are you proposing to create a version of this specifically FOR the Bitshares platform?  Or is this something which, once developed, would work with any decentralized exchange?

Finally, can you offer a rough estimate as to a) how long this would take to develop, and b) what the cost would be?  Thanks.

[seraphim]

Please don't be offended by a seeming lack of interest. There are just an awful lot of things going on between now and Oct. 13th and probably for a while after that.

For instance, did you attend the Lottoshares webinar this morning? (The integration of that project with BitShares seems to be further along than yours, and so more pressing to devote time to at the moment).

Are you current on the status of all the projects listed here? https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16447.0.html

It's hard to keep up with it all 

Definitely not offended here, just honestly wondering if the idea may not be worth attempting a crowdfunding campaign.

[onceuponatime]

Okay, it's been a week now. Nobody else interested in a good decentralized exchange here? 

Please don't be offended by a seeming lack of interest. There are just an awful lot of things going on between now and Oct. 13th and probably for a while after that.

For instance, did you attend the Lottoshares webinar this morning? (The integration of that project with BitShares seems to be further along than yours, and so more pressing to devote time to at the moment).

Are you current on the status of all the projects listed here? https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16447.0.html

It's hard to keep up with it all 

[seraphim]

Okay, it's been a week now. Nobody else interested in a good decentralized exchange here? 

[seraphim]

The current HZxchange is more of a proof-of-concept. The signing nodes are distributed, but if one goes down another 3rd signer has to be found in the community, and the setup requires some manual work.
HZxGO is something I started with to integrate the voting and signer part, as well as more improvements to the current state into an easy-to-use client for everyone. GO stands for golang here, as that's the programming language used for the client.

fav calling it ubernet made me smile, it kind of takes the trading aspect of BitcoinDark's supernet (instantdex), but fully decentralizes the multisig storage and completely integrates into the bts ecosystem.

[tbone]

I'm a fan of HZ and I really like the idea of this.  I'm surprised it hasn't generated more interest here.  On the other hand, I'm a bit unclear about a couple of things, and perhaps others are too.  For starters, what are the differences between HZxchange, HZxGO and BTSxGO?  Thanks in advance.

[fav]

  what Ander wrote.

An ubernet based on bitshares would be amazing!

[seraphim]

Please be a bit more specific with those questions, did you understand the basic principle of hzxchange?

In addition to what that is doing already, we would use the ipo asset to control the settings like coinlistings, fees, x-of-y-multisig, keyholders, tolerance for outtimes of signers, keyholders percentage and asset holders percentage on fees, etc. by votes.
The signers would work like witnesses in BTS. They'd keep the consensus, and kick out those breaking the rules. The full client will be used to apply as a signer, and trade all available coins directly from the wallets (using rpc).

[Ander]

Welcome!

HZ is horizon correct?  Its an interesting coin.  (I wish we could get it into the Bitshares exchange network)

I am very interested in this idea. Trading of other cryptocoins on the BTS network is very promising, it allows people to avoid centralized exchanges and not get hacked, while being able to hold their value in whatever form they want, whether it is BTS, or ETH, or Doge, or HZ.  Its like creating our own Supernet.

As you have figured out already, BTS 2.0 lets you do this, and I am glad to see this being realized in the crypto community.


Any project that uses BTS as its back end supports Bitshares by generating transaction fees for BTS, and thus should have the support of the Bitshares community imo.


Do you have any more details of how this would work?

Thanks!

[seraphim]

BitShares CryptoeXchange (working name)

BTSCX will provide a gateway for cryptocurrencies to a decentralized storage, backing assets tradable on the BTS network.

For a coin to be added there need to be at least three individuals, so called signers, who hold keys to multisig addresses to store coins and assets. Two of those keys are required for a transaction to get accepted in the blockchain. The signers watch each other and react to suspicious behaviour by locking out the malicious signer, and if possible replacing him.
A multisig address can be created with a variable number of signers and required signatures, so it can be raised per-coin when more individuals applied for signing and get voted in. The number of signers should be in some way proportional to the total deposited value for (obvious) security reasons.

When a coin is added (enough signers available + successful community vote), an asset representing that coin is issued by the signers (also multisig protected), which will be given out in return for deposited coins. The deposits are immediately sent to the multisig storage address.
Returning the asset to the issuer triggers a withdrawal of the respective amount of coins.

The gateway can sustain itself through fees taken from deposits and withdrawals.

The client will support adding new coins and applying as a signer for an added coin as well as voting, trading and community functions.
Like Graphene, the UI will be standalone and can work with remote BTSCX, BTS and coin nodes.
By connecting it to a local coin wallet it will support trading directly out of or into that wallet.

A control asset will be issued, which gives the community the possibility to vote on every variable that may be set, per coin.
Those variables are (list not necessarily complete):
- coins to add
- x-of-y multisig
- offline/dropout tolerance
- fees
- distribution of fees between asset holders and signers


80% of this asset will be given to the community, 20% will stay with me to be distributed amongst the people helping to create the gateway.

The team consists of 3 persons so far (2 coders, 1 designer). As a rough estimation it'll require about 6 months and at least 30k USD to develop a working product. This would only cover a very basic version though. Adding more features like a trollbox or margin trading will boost that up quite a bit, and if we want to include marketing and further development, even 300k USD could be spent.

I will create 6 worker proposals, amounting to 60k BTS/day each, running for three months. With this setup and current prices having all 6 voted in for 1 month, or 2 for three months, secures the minimum funding.  Donations of BTC, BTS and BitUSD will be accepted when the initial 30k USD target is met through those workers.
At the end of January 2016 the value in USD for everything that came in will be calculated, and 80% of the control asset will be given out proportionally, sharedropping the worker income.

[seraphim]

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// UPDATE                                                                                                  //
// the idea failed to light a spark in the community                            //
// as there doesn't seem to be a way to finance it, it's cancelled     //
//                                                                                                                 //
// worker proposal discussion:                                                              //
// https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19351.0.html              //
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


Hello BTS community

If you're not interested in me and why I'm here, at least take the time to read the next post, that's the upcoming announcement work-in-progress

Some may remember me from the very early days of PTS mining, or my time as CSO at MMC.
Others could know me under the alias pharesim as a founding member of HZ and creator of HZxchange.

The prototype of HZxchange is working, but it has a flaw (apart from not having enough volume): The storage is distributed, so there's still a trust issue towards the multisig key holders of the storage wallets.
I have a solution for that, but it requires a lot of coding, and probably other talents like designers and marketers. In short: money.

I started working on HZxGO, which was planned to be a completely decentralized solution, but realized that it's far too much work to make that a quality product, without me and probably a few others going full time on it. That's not possible in the HZ universe, but in BTS it is! When 2.0 comes out all the necessary functions will be available, and when we have a working BTSxGO, it can easily be ported to HZxGO. That's looks like a win-win-win-win-situation to me.

So what do you guys think? Would you like to see that happen?


ANN for HZxchange with further info+links:
https://cryptocointalk.com/topic/38646-ann-hzxchange-decentralized-bitcoin-altcoin-and-asset-trading/