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Offline Bitcoinfan

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Bitshares dividend
« on: January 04, 2014, 04:54:16 AM »

How large can dividends be?  And would it be hard codes -- bitcoin has been known for low transaction fees.  .0001.  If bitshares transaction fees are that low, then the dividend rate would be indifferent. 


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Offline Bitcoinfan

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Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2014, 05:05:13 AM »
Therefore having a dividend rate of 3x 20x 50x 100x wouldn't really matter because it is so small


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Offline ripplexiaoshan

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Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2014, 06:14:34 AM »
The dividends are not only from transaction fees, but also from the loan interest for short position during trade, and many other fees, like accrount inactive fee. That could account for a big part of dividends. Maybe you can follow this post to learn more:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=1306.15
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Offline bytemaster

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2014, 06:24:41 AM »
The dividends are not only from transaction fees, but also from the loan interest for short position during trade, and many other fees, like accrount inactive fee. That could account for a big part of dividends. Maybe you can follow this post to learn more:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=1306.15

Exchanges will have much higher transaction volume that BTC which will bid up the fixed space in the block chain.  Bitcoin level transaction fees are not expected here because we intentionally limit block-chain size to keep it decentralized and it is this limited space that is the scarce resource.
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Offline Bitcoinfan

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Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2014, 06:26:56 PM »
Very interesting.  Limiting the blockchain and the number of transations into one creates a supply and demand market.  However, arguably then there will always be a need for bitcoin for commerce transactions because of its lower costs. 

I guess Bitshares are in it to complement bitcoin, rather than supplant it?  No bitcoin killer here...

Offline bytemaster

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2014, 06:28:35 PM »
Very interesting.  Limiting the blockchain and the number of transations into one creates a supply and demand market.  However, arguably then there will always be a need for bitcoin for commerce transactions because of its lower costs. 

I guess Bitshares are in it to complement bitcoin, rather than supplant it?  No bitcoin killer here...

No it just means BitShares will have parallel chains and remain decentralized, where as bitcoin will become very centralized. 
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Offline Bitcoinfan

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Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2014, 06:37:22 PM »
Trying to get a deeper understanding of this:

Does this mean sending 100 BITUSD to a friend or ecommerce store will be fairly cheap, because it is in a parallel blockchain?  But to sell/ buy/ short it on the Bitshares Exchange would require a higher fee-- due to a fixed space in the block chain?

Offline bytemaster

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2014, 06:41:42 PM »
Trying to get a deeper understanding of this:

Does this mean sending 100 BITUSD to a friend or ecommerce store will be fairly cheap, because it is in a parallel blockchain?  But to sell/ buy/ short it on the Bitshares Exchange would require a higher fee-- due to a fixed space in the block chain?

BitUSD is not a separate block-chain.  But there many be multiple chains with BitUSD and buy/sell/short kind of like having multiple banks.   When fees become too high on the first chain, an alt-chain will startup to give competition.  It will have a smaller network, but lower fees. 

I do not expect fees to be very high compared to the current banking system.   Lots of opportunity for the market to adapt to bring fees down.
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Offline MrJeans

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Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2014, 11:51:13 AM »
Trying to get a deeper understanding of this:

Does this mean sending 100 BITUSD to a friend or ecommerce store will be fairly cheap, because it is in a parallel blockchain?  But to sell/ buy/ short it on the Bitshares Exchange would require a higher fee-- due to a fixed space in the block chain?

BitUSD is not a separate block-chain.  But there many be multiple chains with BitUSD and buy/sell/short kind of like having multiple banks.   When fees become too high on the first chain, an alt-chain will startup to give competition.  It will have a smaller network, but lower fees. 

I do not expect fees to be very high compared to the current banking system.   Lots of opportunity for the market to adapt to bring fees down.
This is rather confusing, someone please elaborate.
So there will be multiple chains upon which people will be able to short and buy bitUSD? Can bitUSD be traded between chains? I've defiantly hit an understanding block here  :-\
Or perhaps is there a thread or part of the bitshares white paper I can read to help

Offline bytemaster

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2014, 04:51:42 PM »
Think of it this way:  If bitcoin were to limit block sizes to 1 MB every 10 minutes then transaction fees would start to rise once demand for transactions hit that limit.   Eventually they would rise to the point that many people will only use Bitcoin for savings or large purchases where they need massive liquidity and they will adopt an Altcoin that has not yet hit the block limit for performing checking transactions. 

Every BitShares chain that launches can support up to 16 assets (perhaps more) and if there are 2 BitShares chains then there will be two versions of BitUSD... each will track BitUSD independently and you could trade them via cross-chain-trading or via a centralized exchange.
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Offline MrJeans

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Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2014, 07:40:09 PM »
Think of it this way:  If bitcoin were to limit block sizes to 1 MB every 10 minutes then transaction fees would start to rise once demand for transactions hit that limit.   Eventually they would rise to the point that many people will only use Bitcoin for savings or large purchases where they need massive liquidity and they will adopt an Altcoin that has not yet hit the block limit for performing checking transactions. 

Every BitShares chain that launches can support up to 16 assets (perhaps more) and if there are 2 BitShares chains then there will be two versions of BitUSD... each will track BitUSD independently and you could trade them via cross-chain-trading or via a centralized exchange.
Ok that makes sense now.

I see the potential need for multiple chains having the same asset. But wouldnt it be easier to limit the number of assets per chain to say 3 and increase the block size so that the number of different 'versions' of each asset are limited to just one.

Offline toast

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2014, 08:18:31 PM »
But wouldnt it be easier to limit the number of assets per chain to say 3 and increase the block size so that the number of different 'versions' of each asset are limited to just one.

"3 is too many, we would eventually need separate chains due to traffic. Wouldn't it be easier to limit the number of assets per chain to say 2 and increase the block size so that the number of different 'versions' of each asset are limited to just one?"

;)
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Offline bytemaster

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2014, 08:35:07 PM »
But wouldnt it be easier to limit the number of assets per chain to say 3 and increase the block size so that the number of different 'versions' of each asset are limited to just one.

"3 is too many, we would eventually need separate chains due to traffic. Wouldn't it be easier to limit the number of assets per chain to say 2 and increase the block size so that the number of different 'versions' of each asset are limited to just one?"

;)

There is value in being able to trade USD vs GLD on one chain. 
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Offline toast

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2014, 08:42:57 PM »
I was making a joke
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Offline bytemaster

Re: Bitshares dividend
« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2014, 10:08:39 PM »
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

 

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