Number of Witnesses

[Samupaha]

Topic was discussed in this hangout: https://beyondbitcoin.org/beyond-bitcoin-bitshares-dev-hangout-bytemaster-october-13th-upgrade/

[roadscape]

I've come to realise that the number of witnesses is irrelevant from the POV of decentralisation.

What matters is controlling stake. Right now, one account could vote out/in a majority of its own witnesses without any other intervention; essentially controlling the entire network.

+5% +5% +5% +5%

Gotta get the vote out.
85% of stake is not voting.

[xeroc]

because witnesses have to pay for servers and so on. more witnesses = less money for them.

Almost .. All witnesses are paid a fixed amount of BTS.
More witnesses means more costs for the DAC.

I don't think it works like that, each witness gets the same pay per block -- so more witnesses doesn't effect DAC expenses but reduces witness daily pay since each witness gets fewer blocks.

+5%

Dang .. you are so right .. block interval is constant and bts pays per block ..

[fav]

because witnesses have to pay for servers and so on. more witnesses = less money for them.

Almost .. All witnesses are paid a fixed amount of BTS.
More witnesses means more costs for the DAC.

I don't think it works like that, each witness gets the same pay per block -- so more witnesses doesn't effect DAC expenses but reduces witness daily pay since each witness gets fewer blocks.

+5%

[maqifrnswa]

because witnesses have to pay for servers and so on. more witnesses = less money for them.

Almost .. All witnesses are paid a fixed amount of BTS.
More witnesses means more costs for the DAC.

I don't think it works like that, each witness gets the same pay per block -- so more witnesses doesn't effect DAC expenses but reduces witness daily pay since each witness gets fewer blocks.

[xeroc]

because witnesses have to pay for servers and so on. more witnesses = less money for them.

Almost .. All witnesses are paid a fixed amount of BTS.
More witnesses means more costs for the DAC.

bytemaster recommended 17 witnesses in total by the way.

Not sure it was meant as a "recommendation". I think it was meant as the lowest
number that makes sense to provoke a discussion

edit: also, coordination is key and gets very hard the more witnesses run

Witnesses don't need to coordinate at all. Committee members need to.

[monsterer]

I've come to realise that the number of witnesses is irrelevant from the POV of decentralisation.

What matters is controlling stake. Right now, one account could vote out/in a majority of its own witnesses without any other intervention; essentially controlling the entire network.

[fav]

17 does not seem like a robust network, does it?
Will this stay like that?
I am sure a few people on the waiting list have dedicated servers running Bitshares as a witness and still waiting while dedicating resources and time to it.
There are not many candidates, 42 does not seem like a lot,  and so limiting it even further does not seem like the right strategy for a strong and healthy network.
Comments or thoughts welcome.

there are some threads about this topic, I'd recommend you to search this forum via google, should be easily discovered.

bitshares is strong and healthy even with less than 17 witnesses.

[asimov]

17 does not seem like a robust network, does it?
Will this stay like that?
I am sure a few people on the waiting list have dedicated servers running Bitshares as a witness and still waiting while dedicating resources and time to it.
There are not many candidates, 42 does not seem like a lot,  and so limiting it even further does not seem like the right strategy for a strong and healthy network.
Comments or thoughts welcome.

[fav]

because witnesses have to pay for servers and so on. more witnesses = less money for them.

bytemaster recommended 17 witnesses in total by the way.

edit: also, coordination is key and gets very hard the more witnesses run

[asimov]

There are currently 27 witnesses (as reported by http://cryptofresh.com/witnesses ) and only 42 candidates wishing to be a witness.
Why not approve them all to strengthen the network and let people wishing to collaborate do so?
42 witnesses does not seem like a lot, does it? A larger number will actually be desirable for a healthy network.