Author Topic: Is it like you don't care about PTS?  (Read 11877 times)

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Offline mich431

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Offline luckybit

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lol, desperation.
this emotional thread so transparent to understand, i think its not about Invictus or Bts project only, its about current cryptoindustry in whole, many analysts alarmists think that in near 2-6 months S&P500 going to collapse very deeply. I mean it would be as bad as  in 2008. That prediction is influence negatively sentiment to BTC/USD rate.
BTC rate/sentiment affect whole cryptos, because altcoins are derivatives of bitcoins.
I think that in near term (1-12 months) prices to all cryptocurrencies awaits down trend, even with superb marketing like in nxt proj.
So...its good year for investments
imho my 2 cents ;)

how should a stock market crash effect crypto currencies in a negative way??
idk, its tendency, it was like that in 2008 USD index skyrocketed in to air

lol if this happens and u have 1 BTC u can buy like 3 houses :)
but beware the gold holders ..they will try to crack your head open with their heavy gold bars to find your brain wallet  :D
it depends on market situation, nobody know how people will react during stock market decline, thats all i know.

But we know why and when it will decline allowing proper investment into the cryptocurrencies and financial instruments to actually profit from it. The stock market decline will mean money will move. It does not guarantee it will move to Bitcoin but if the right financial instruments are built in time it could move at least some money into our ecosystem and that could actually be billions of dollars.


hmm... for some reason this bottom line does not feel fine when reading...
a) giving examples for "amzing things" would really increase trust
b) if i were you i wouldnt bet my entire life and future on a startup of any kind... i know that this line is probably not said all that seriously, but theres probably still a bit of truth in it
c) your bet as a developer and the one on the receiving side of the fundings is definately a different one than on the investment side giving away money
The truth is when you work for possibly the most disruptive technology company in the world, yes you're putting everything on the line and that attitude is a good attitude to have because it's the true state of things. Bitshares is about replacing the stock market as we know it, decentralizing it. and is even more ambitious than that with DACs producing an entirely new economic ecology. There will be books written about these developments in the future and if it fails those books will not be written in a good light.

I think anyone who is a public face of these projects will also be the people taking the most risk. We should give them respect because someone had to take the risk in order to innovate.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2014, 01:44:59 pm by luckybit »
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Offline luckybit

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Just so you know

1. There is no public ledger over how funds are being spent. I saw Brian gets 100 pts a week for working with Invictus? Last I checked no start-up founder gets  close to 10k a month in salary unless he's running a bloated company thats headed to a crash

PTS are not dollars. Solid point but dollars are stable while PTS could crash at any moment. Also many artists and marketing directors do get paid in stock. People being paid in PTS are similar to people being paid in stock, not dollars.

So you're wrong. It's actually normal to offer stock options or to pay in stock as well as dollars. How do you think the people working for companies like Google, Microsoft, Apple, Facebook all became so rich? They were paid in $ along with stock.

People paid in PTS are more like people who get paid in stock. In my opinion this is fair. As far as whether or not they are amateurs, that will be revealed by the quality of their work. At the end of the day PTS have to recirculate back into the community and over time the amateurs gain skill and become experts.

You're right, they do need to hire more full time programmers. But you're wrong in saying that PTS should be valued in $ as if the $ value cannot be crashed. It's stock which means at any moment you could get 100PTS of worthlessness or 100PTS worth $100,000. We just don't know but that is one of the reasons why it's exciting for people to work for start ups. Working for a start up which goes on to become successful can make you rich.

As a miner and investor you're taking a risk, but so are the people who invest their time on these bounties. As long as people are willing to take a risk for the project, they should be able to receive the rewards.

« Last Edit: January 17, 2014, 01:48:53 pm by luckybit »
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Offline td services

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I invested 4 days with my entire team (I run a start-up too) , setting up 1000's of servers (close to 4000 for those wondering) and burned around 40000 dollars (not to mention time wasted doing this while I could focus on my start-up instead),  and mined a seizable amount of coins. Sure I could dump my coins in mid December when coin prices were at a high. But no! I believed in what you guys were doing and stuck around as any reasonable investor would. I looked forward to keyhotee and bitshares and spoke about it to people. As a matter of fact I have also been working on partnerships with different networks for acquiring massive mining hardware, servers and was looking forward to investing another 100,000 in mining operations.

This is exactly what Protoshares was trying to avoid by having an algorithm which favored standalone computers with CPU mining based on memory capacity for decentralization, with a much more gradual creation of PTS. While it succeeded in discouraging ASICs and GPUs, it failed by allowing massive cloud mining on server farms and botnets. The money wasted on cloud mining would have been much better spent on development. I really hope someone comes up with an algorithm which cripples cloud mining along with the ASICs and GPUs.

I considered exchanging PTS for AGS, but have decided the lock-in of AGS is not worth the loss of optionality and liquidity of PTS at current AGS prices, but AGS makes a lot of sense to correct the problem with Protoshares, which have become a liability with little benefit to the project.

Offline mich431

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Bottom line is that what you see on the forum is the tip of the iceberg of amazing things going on.   We are betting our entire life and future on these things so I can assure you we care very much about PTS, AGS, BitShares, Keyhotee, etc.

hmm... for some reason this bottom line does not feel fine when reading...
a) giving examples for "amzing things" would really increase trust
b) if i were you i wouldnt bet my entire life and future on a startup of any kind... i know that this line is probably not said all that seriously, but theres probably still a bit of truth in it
c) your bet as a developer and the one on the receiving side of the fundings is definately a different one than on the investment side giving away money

overall i think the expectations are too high... since there does not seem to be anything similar in concept that also gives hope to people getting rich&richer... when expectations are that high its always a problem to meet them...
also investing early is always a bet on success - the earlier you invest, the higher the risk is to fail (obvious example is Bitcoin itself - investing now is alot less profiatable than months ago)
so when people realise their fear of a failure is too high it just means they invested more than they should have

in the end its pretty much more of an "as is" situation and you can take it or leave it now or later
sure you can suggest and try to help and whatnot, but i dont think the influence of most people here is really that big
(which can be both, good and bad)

just my thoughts when reading this thread....

sumantso

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Carefull not everybody appreciates that :)

As for the rest I thing the bytemaster answer should cover every concerned raised.

thank. you.

Oh don't worry, its not all hugs and kisses now. I am still angry that PTS got a very raw deal wrt AGS IMO.

Offline oco101

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Priority :
1.Keyhotee
2.Website
3.Bitshares
4. Marketing

We have adopted parallel and independent development tracts so Keyhotee will be developed at whatever pace Dan Notestein and team can manage.
Website is being working on in Parallel and Super3 is providing full time effort competing for the bounty. 
BitShares is being worked on in Parallel by ME 75% of the time and daily updates are being posted with a goal toward MVP.
Marketing is being worked on in Parallel by Brian full time and based upon what I have seen him produce internally you will be impressed.
Recruitment and partnership development is being managed by others.
Bounties will soon be managed by a new hire who will take on the roll of system integrator.

I have given each individual autonomy so that I do not become the bottleneck.  Until 12 days ago we couldn't even consider hiring anyone more, but with this boost in funding things will really start moving.    We are allocating a budget of 10% AGS funding to marketing as this is the industry average and Brian is actively working many angles to make most effective use of that.

Most of our marketing push has been held back by website update delays, but those delays will not last much longer. 

Bottom line is that what you see on the forum is the tip of the iceberg of amazing things going on.   We are betting our entire life and future on these things so I can assure you we care very much about PTS, AGS, BitShares, Keyhotee, etc.

Cheers

I like how you engage in the forums. If some of the other team members did so too that would be a fun update for us.
Carefull not everybody appreciates that :)

As for the rest I thing the bytemaster answer should cover every concerned raised.

thank. you.

Offline Geneko

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I guess this is the tread I have been looking for.

Here is my post on similar issues but from different angle: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=2306.msg28341#msg28341

sumantso

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Priority :
1.Keyhotee
2.Website
3.Bitshares
4. Marketing

We have adopted parallel and independent development tracts so Keyhotee will be developed at whatever pace Dan Notestein and team can manage.
Website is being working on in Parallel and Super3 is providing full time effort competing for the bounty. 
BitShares is being worked on in Parallel by ME 75% of the time and daily updates are being posted with a goal toward MVP.
Marketing is being worked on in Parallel by Brian full time and based upon what I have seen him produce internally you will be impressed.
Recruitment and partnership development is being managed by others.
Bounties will soon be managed by a new hire who will take on the roll of system integrator.

I have given each individual autonomy so that I do not become the bottleneck.  Until 12 days ago we couldn't even consider hiring anyone more, but with this boost in funding things will really start moving.    We are allocating a budget of 10% AGS funding to marketing as this is the industry average and Brian is actively working many angles to make most effective use of that.

Most of our marketing push has been held back by website update delays, but those delays will not last much longer. 

Bottom line is that what you see on the forum is the tip of the iceberg of amazing things going on.   We are betting our entire life and future on these things so I can assure you we care very much about PTS, AGS, BitShares, Keyhotee, etc.

Cheers

I like how you engage in the forums. If some of the other team members did so too that would be a fun update for us.

Offline bytemaster

Priority :
1.Keyhotee
2.Website
3.Bitshares
4. Marketing

We have adopted parallel and independent development tracts so Keyhotee will be developed at whatever pace Dan Notestein and team can manage.
Website is being working on in Parallel and Super3 is providing full time effort competing for the bounty. 
BitShares is being worked on in Parallel by ME 75% of the time and daily updates are being posted with a goal toward MVP.
Marketing is being worked on in Parallel by Brian full time and based upon what I have seen him produce internally you will be impressed.
Recruitment and partnership development is being managed by others.
Bounties will soon be managed by a new hire who will take on the roll of system integrator.

I have given each individual autonomy so that I do not become the bottleneck.  Until 12 days ago we couldn't even consider hiring anyone more, but with this boost in funding things will really start moving.    We are allocating a budget of 10% AGS funding to marketing as this is the industry average and Brian is actively working many angles to make most effective use of that.

Most of our marketing push has been held back by website update delays, but those delays will not last much longer. 

Bottom line is that what you see on the forum is the tip of the iceberg of amazing things going on.   We are betting our entire life and future on these things so I can assure you we care very much about PTS, AGS, BitShares, Keyhotee, etc. 

For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline bitcoinba

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So let see :

-3I it is a 2 month old company,and  in those two months they manage to crowdfound  more than a million dollar and they will have more then 2  millions by the end of the third month . For that matter how's your start-up compare ? Or any start-up  in this short time frame?
-they have a full team working on Keyhotee around the clock and they delivered the first alpha version. Read the last newsletter, they explained why the delay for keyhotee, in fact they  addressee all your concerns that you raise here.
-finding new good developers, as you should know, is not easy, finding new developers familiar with cryptoworld is even harder. Bounties it is a way to find those rare developers and to attract that talent make those bounty worthwhile I remember when they announce that they have a team working around the clock for keyhotee, some complained that this is not the right approach and bounty should be the way to do it etc. Well, I guess they have them both now. But I guess this is not good enough either ....

You make some good points tough  :

-I agree some of the bounties they are more efficient done by hiring professionals like for the website. In my opinion the website should be one of the top priorities right know, and should have been done by know.
-Marketing until now not the best thing !!( but I have fate on Brian  )
-"How about you leave the forum to your great batch of moderators and go ahead with things that actually require your attention?" I thing although bytemaster presence is essential on the forum,  I think now there are enough people that could moderate and answer most parts. He already started doing that.
-Most of you concerns are addressed in the forum, but not everybody has the time to look this is very true and this must be improved. The newsletter is not enough, some kind of global news once a week will clarify things for everybody. 

Yeah sure there are things that should and must be improved but let's be objective here. Blaming it the easiest thing to do.

+1


Offline cass

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So let see :

-3I it is a 2 month old company,and  in those two months they manage to crowdfound  more than a million dollar and they will have more then 2  millions by the end of the third month . For that matter how's your start-up compare ? Or any start-up  in this short time frame?
-they have a full team working on Keyhotee around the clock and they delivered the first alpha version. Read the last newsletter, they explained why the delay for keyhotee, in fact they  addressee all your concerns that you raise here.
-finding new good developers, as you should know, is not easy, finding new developers familiar with cryptoworld is even harder. Bounties it is a way to find those rare developers and to attract that talent make those bounty worthwhile I remember when they announce that they have a team working around the clock for keyhotee, some complained that this is not the right approach and bounty should be the way to do it etc. Well, I guess they have them both now. But I guess this is not good enough either ....

You make some good points tough  :

-I agree some of the bounties they are more efficient done by hiring professionals like for the website. In my opinion the website should be one of the top priorities right know, and should have been done by know.
-Marketing until now not the best thing !!( but I have fate on Brian  )
-"How about you leave the forum to your great batch of moderators and go ahead with things that actually require your attention?" I thing although bytemaster presence is essential on the forum,  I think now there are enough people that could moderate and answer most parts. He already started doing that.
-Most of you concerns are addressed in the forum, but not everybody has the time to look this is very true and this must be improved. The newsletter is not enough, some kind of global news once a week will clarify things for everybody. 

Yeah sure there are things that should and must be improved but let's be objective here. Blaming it the easiest thing to do.
To tell truth, im not sure that load marketing campaign is good for Bts project on this stage.
We would receive more funding, its good, but we already have enough investments flows, more important for now to develop exceptional product ,so that new people start to use Bts system from start.
Priority :
1.Keyhotee
2.Website
3.Bitshares
4. Marketing

All points you mentioned are in progress but iam thinking all those parts have same priority (high) but for different teams :)
█║▌║║█  - - -  The quieter you become, the more you are able to hear  - - -  █║▌║║█

Offline oco101

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So let see :

-3I it is a 2 month old company,and  in those two months they manage to crowdfound  more than a million dollar and they will have more then 2  millions by the end of the third month . For that matter how's your start-up compare ? Or any start-up  in this short time frame?
-they have a full team working on Keyhotee around the clock and they delivered the first alpha version. Read the last newsletter, they explained why the delay for keyhotee, in fact they  addressee all your concerns that you raise here.
-finding new good developers, as you should know, is not easy, finding new developers familiar with cryptoworld is even harder. Bounties it is a way to find those rare developers and to attract that talent make those bounty worthwhile I remember when they announce that they have a team working around the clock for keyhotee, some complained that this is not the right approach and bounty should be the way to do it etc. Well, I guess they have them both now. But I guess this is not good enough either ....

You make some good points tough  :

-I agree some of the bounties they are more efficient done by hiring professionals like for the website. In my opinion the website should be one of the top priorities right know, and should have been done by know.
-Marketing until now not the best thing !!( but I have fate on Brian  )
-"How about you leave the forum to your great batch of moderators and go ahead with things that actually require your attention?" I thing although bytemaster presence is essential on the forum,  I think now there are enough people that could moderate and answer most parts. He already started doing that.
-Most of you concerns are addressed in the forum, but not everybody has the time to look this is very true and this must be improved. The newsletter is not enough, some kind of global news once a week will clarify things for everybody. 

Yeah sure there are things that should and must be improved but let's be objective here. Blaming it the easiest thing to do.
To tell truth, im not sure that load marketing campaign is good for Bts project on this stage.
We would receive more funding, its good, but we already have enough investments flows, more important for now to develop exceptional product ,so that new people start to use Bts system from start.
Priority :
1.Keyhotee
2.Website
3.Bitshares
4. Marketing

Offline hasher

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So let see :

-3I it is a 2 month old company,and  in those two months they manage to crowdfound  more than a million dollar and they will have more then 2  millions by the end of the third month . For that matter how's your start-up compare ? Or any start-up  in this short time frame?
-they have a full team working on Keyhotee around the clock and they delivered the first alpha version. Read the last newsletter, they explained why the delay for keyhotee, in fact they  addressee all your concerns that you raise here.
-finding new good developers, as you should know, is not easy, finding new developers familiar with cryptoworld is even harder. Bounties it is a way to find those rare developers and to attract that talent make those bounty worthwhile I remember when they announce that they have a team working around the clock for keyhotee, some complained that this is not the right approach and bounty should be the way to do it etc. Well, I guess they have them both now. But I guess this is not good enough either ....

You make some good points tough  :

-I agree some of the bounties they are more efficient done by hiring professionals like for the website. In my opinion the website should be one of the top priorities right know, and should have been done by know.
-Marketing until now not the best thing !!( but I have fate on Brian  )
-"How about you leave the forum to your great batch of moderators and go ahead with things that actually require your attention?" I thing although bytemaster presence is essential on the forum,  I think now there are enough people that could moderate and answer most parts. He already started doing that.
-Most of you concerns are addressed in the forum, but not everybody has the time to look this is very true and this must be improved. The newsletter is not enough, some kind of global news once a week will clarify things for everybody. 

Yeah sure there are things that should and must be improved but let's be objective here. Blaming it the easiest thing to do.
To tell truth, im not sure that load marketing campaign is good for Bts project on this stage.
We would receive more funding, its good, but we already have enough investments flows, more important for now to develop exceptional product ,so that new people start to use Bts system from start.

Offline hasher

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lol, desperation.
this emotional thread so transparent to understand, i think its not about Invictus or Bts project only, its about current cryptoindustry in whole, many analysts alarmists think that in near 2-6 months S&P500 going to collapse very deeply. I mean it would be as bad as  in 2008. That prediction is influence negatively sentiment to BTC/USD rate.
BTC rate/sentiment affect whole cryptos, because altcoins are derivatives of bitcoins.
I think that in near term (1-12 months) prices to all cryptocurrencies awaits down trend, even with superb marketing like in nxt proj.
So...its good year for investments
imho my 2 cents ;)

how should a stock market crash effect crypto currencies in a negative way??
idk, its tendency, it was like that in 2008 USD index skyrocketed in to air

lol if this happens and u have 1 BTC u can buy like 3 houses :)
but beware the gold holders ..they will try to crack your head open with their heavy gold bars to find your brain wallet  :D
it depends on market situation, nobody know how people will react during stock market decline, thats all i know.