The real difference between AGS and PTS

[sumantso]

But there is no reason that PTS should fall except if BTS fall because it is the only way to buy into other I3 DACs if AGS are not tradable...

Nope, other I3 DACs will have a minimum of 10% allotted to PTS. There will still be other ways to get into them.

[weiry]

Would it make sense for I3 to merge AGS and PTS after donation period is over?

As I said in the other thread, in future, I3 MAY list the AGS in cryptostocks or something similar and make them tradeable; awarding shares to the accounts in that 'exchange'.

Delulo - I know you are not too in favour of AGS due to they being unsellable. But look at it this way - do you believe the PTS shares in the future DACs will make it so expensive that you are willing to write off the extra BTSX earned now through AGS? Remember, in future, the DACs will allot upto 80% through other means, so its not as if PTS is the only way to gain them. In fact, it may even turn out that PTS price goes down while BTSX price goes up after BTSX release.

The point is that there is no easy answer - its all wildly speculative. Hence, IMO its best to spread out among both.

True. Its definitely a balance! And above I actually put forward arguments pro AGS...

But there is no reason that PTS should fall except if BTS fall because it is the only way to buy into other I3 DACs if AGS are not tradable...

You're pretty much equally bought into all I3 DACs with PTS and AGS.

The difference is you can't currently "buy out" of I3 DACs with AGS.

My limited understanding is PTS and AGS will have an equal stake in ALL Invictus DACs. AGS are a one time event to help fund the initial development of the platforms that will be the foundation of all I3's offerings in the DACspace. However you can cash out your PTS for reinvestment in anything you can trade BTC for, AGS will at least initially only offer you a stake in I3 and any DACs that are derived from their code.

[santaclause102]

Would it make sense for I3 to merge AGS and PTS after donation period is over?

As I said in the other thread, in future, I3 MAY list the AGS in cryptostocks or something similar and make them tradeable; awarding shares to the accounts in that 'exchange'.

Delulo - I know you are not too in favour of AGS due to they being unsellable. But look at it this way - do you believe the PTS shares in the future DACs will make it so expensive that you are willing to write off the extra BTSX earned now through AGS? Remember, in future, the DACs will allot upto 80% through other means, so its not as if PTS is the only way to gain them. In fact, it may even turn out that PTS price goes down while BTSX price goes up after BTSX release.

The point is that there is no easy answer - its all wildly speculative. Hence, IMO its best to spread out among both.

True. Its definitely a balance! And above I actually put forward arguments pro AGS...

But there is no reason that PTS should fall except if BTS fall because it is the only way to buy into other I3 DACs if AGS are not tradable...

[bytemaster]

They would honor AGS if they wanted to use our source code as the foundation of their company


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[weiry]

... and tbh I secretly think people in the future (not invictus) would honor PTS but not AGS.

Why?

Well...

People will be able to buy PTS later. Whereas AGS to my understanding can only be acquired during the AGS funding period. Furthermore the AGS funding is controlled by III.

If I were developing a DAC I could acquire PTS and only honor PTS in the launch of my DAC, viewing AGS as dilution of my new DAC holdings.

Is this actually the case? I don't know.

I would imagine that having both AGS & PTS holders would strengthen my DAC's ecosystem by increasing the number of shareholders. Simultaneously I imagine that most AGS holders also hold PTS, so perhaps my equity in the DAC would be diluted without really increasing the number of people who have a stake in the DAC.

I agree with your last paragraph.
But if you develope a DAC in 1 year PTS will be quite expensive and you can only get a fraction of all PTS for a reasonable price. That would not be very effective to increase your profits. Would be more effective to reserve 1% of all tokens of your DAC for yourself... and give the rest to PTS/AGS holders. If you leave out AGS you risk dispute.

Would it make sense for I3 to merge AGS and PTS after donation period is over? 

I believe I3 is building their Social Contract license to effectively merge AGS & PTS.

I think in the end pretty much anyone using I3 code is going to honor both. Your 1% (or whatever percentages the Social Contract allows) idea does allow you to mitigate interest dilution while honoring AGS & PTS.

I personally only hold PTS at the moment. I'll be investing in AGS with BTC over the next few weeks though. I was thinking about increasing my PTS holdings but currently AGS seems like the better value. I figure either way I'm investing in Invictus and I'd rather have a greater share in their future.

[sumantso]

Would it make sense for I3 to merge AGS and PTS after donation period is over?

As I said in the other thread, in future, I3 MAY list the AGS in cryptostocks or something similar and make them tradeable; awarding shares to the accounts in that 'exchange'.

Delulo - I know you are not too in favour of AGS due to they being unsellable. But look at it this way - do you believe the PTS shares in the future DACs will make it so expensive that you are willing to write off the extra BTSX earned now through AGS? Remember, in future, the DACs will allot upto 80% through other means, so its not as if PTS is the only way to gain them. In fact, it may even turn out that PTS price goes down while BTSX price goes up after BTSX release.

The point is that there is no easy answer - its all wildly speculative. Hence, IMO its best to spread out among both.

[santaclause102]

... and tbh I secretly think people in the future (not invictus) would honor PTS but not AGS.

Why?

Well...

People will be able to buy PTS later. Whereas AGS to my understanding can only be acquired during the AGS funding period. Furthermore the AGS funding is controlled by III.

If I were developing a DAC I could acquire PTS and only honor PTS in the launch of my DAC, viewing AGS as dilution of my new DAC holdings.

Is this actually the case? I don't know.

I would imagine that having both AGS & PTS holders would strengthen my DAC's ecosystem by increasing the number of shareholders. Simultaneously I imagine that most AGS holders also hold PTS, so perhaps my equity in the DAC would be diluted without really increasing the number of people who have a stake in the DAC.

I agree with your last paragraph.
But if you develope a DAC in 1 year PTS will be quite expensive and you can only get a fraction of all PTS for a reasonable price. That would not be very effective to increase your profits. Would be more effective to reserve 1% of all tokens of your DAC for yourself... and give the rest to PTS/AGS holders. If you leave out AGS you risk dispute.

Would it make sense for I3 to merge AGS and PTS after donation period is over? 

[sumantso]

... and tbh I secretly think people in the future (not invictus) would honor PTS but not AGS.

Why?

Coz PTS is a mined coin while AGS is a donation. Its a matter of perception. In anycase, I believe if 3rd party uses I3 copyrighted code they will have to honour AGS too.

My ratio for PTS:AGS is 2:1. My target was to go 1:1 and I planned to start donating in PTS (or rather BTC earned from selling PTS) when my BTC ran out. But with PTS getting hammered (and I still blame I3 for it - makes me feel better), there is not much to be gained diluting PTS for AGS right now.

If Bytemaster delivers BTSX within 2 months, each AGS will give more than 2 BTSX - thats a great deal.

Btw, if you are thinking of starting donating for AGS, scroll down and have a look at my investment strategy https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=2321.0

[weiry]

... and tbh I secretly think people in the future (not invictus) would honor PTS but not AGS.

Why?

Well...

People will be able to buy PTS later. Whereas AGS to my understanding can only be acquired during the AGS funding period. Furthermore the AGS funding is controlled by III.

If I were developing a DAC I could acquire PTS and only honor PTS in the launch of my DAC, viewing AGS as dilution of my new DAC holdings.

Is this actually the case? I don't know.

I would imagine that having both AGS & PTS holders would strengthen my DAC's ecosystem by increasing the number of shareholders. Simultaneously I imagine that most AGS holders also hold PTS, so perhaps my equity in the DAC would be diluted without really increasing the number of people who have a stake in the DAC.

[santaclause102]

... and tbh I secretly think people in the future (not invictus) would honor PTS but not AGS.

Why?

[toast]

That aside, I am still unsure whether I should donate BTC or buy more PTS. What do you guys think, is there a ratio of PTS/AGS that you strive for, or do you essentially prefer one over the other?

AGS for more bitshares/$, PTS for resale value and tbh I secretly think people in the future (not invictus) would honor PTS but not AGS.

Also, are AGS useable after the introduction of BTS, in the same way I would still be able to use my ProtoShares or are they 'gone' after this process and merely represent the amount of individual donations for BTS?

I3 will honor AGS in all of their DACs

[FelixO]

Whats the 5:1?

Bitshares to Protoshares

How?

2 million BTSX will be distributed among 1.2-1.3m PTS; making almost 1.3 BTSX/PTS.
2 million BTSX will be distributed among 0.6-2m AGS; making anything between 3-1 BTSX/AGS.

Personally I am optimistic we will get at least 2+ BTSX/AGS. If not, I will round up the fellow AGS donors, grab some pitchforks and gasoline, and head over to Bytemaster's castle.

Yes I keep reading references towards a 5:1 distribution but your explanation seems to contain more reasonable numbers. It's quite hard to find such essential informations. There really should be a place where all important informations like this are gathered in an easily accessible and understandable way, without having to spend hours digging through countless forum posts. (with the abundance of intellect in this crowd this is admittedly fun though  )

That aside, I am still unsure whether I should donate BTC or buy more PTS. What do you guys think, is there a ratio of PTS/AGS that you strive for, or do you essentially prefer one over the other?
Also, are AGS useable after the introduction of BTS, in the same way I would still be able to use my ProtoShares or are they 'gone' after this process and merely represent the amount of individual donations for BTS?

[santaclause102]

As a PTS holder I am seriously peeved at the raw deal I3 gave us.

Can you explain?  I thought PTS was more valuable now because rather than receiving 10% of the DAC the PTS shares now receive 50%.. is that inaccurate?

AGS kind of ended up pegging PTS value. People are now selling PTS for AGS.

That just makes sense to a certain extend though. Because holding PTS gives you BTS plus you can keep your PTS.... Think that was an exception today because someone put in a lot at once which is about half of the PTS donated...

[yellowecho]

As a PTS holder I am seriously peeved at the raw deal I3 gave us.

Can you explain?  I thought PTS was more valuable now because rather than receiving 10% of the DAC the PTS shares now receive 50%.. is that inaccurate?

AGS kind of ended up pegging PTS value. People are now selling PTS for AGS.

That doesn't explain how I3 gave us a "raw deal" though.  PTS gets 5x more BTS than originally promised now so even if the nominal value falls you're still ahead in terms of BTS.  And if you're upset about that, why don't you just liquidate your PTS for AGS like everyone else? 

[sumantso]

As a PTS holder I am seriously peeved at the raw deal I3 gave us.

Can you explain?  I thought PTS was more valuable now because rather than receiving 10% of the DAC the PTS shares now receive 50%.. is that inaccurate?

AGS kind of ended up pegging PTS value. People are now selling PTS for AGS.

[yellowecho]

As a PTS holder I am seriously peeved at the raw deal I3 gave us.

Can you explain?  I thought PTS was more valuable now because rather than receiving 10% of the DAC the PTS shares now receive 50%.. is that inaccurate?

[sumantso]

Looks like the market is tending towards parity in PTS and AGS value. As a PTS holder I am seriously peeved at the raw deal I3 gave us.

[maqifrnswa]

S

But at the current rate most PTS will be frozen in the AGS account in a couple of months.. meaning the opportunity to to bid using PTS will be far greater in the future.  So the value of PTS will increase while the price may decrease...
Am I wrong on this?   

pts aren't frozen in the ags account, they are used to fund development.

[sumantso]

Whats the 5:1?

Bitshares to Protoshares

How?

2 million BTSX will be distributed among 1.2-1.3m PTS; making almost 1.3 BTSX/PTS.
2 million BTSX will be distributed among 0.6-2m AGS; making anything between 3-1 BTSX/AGS.

Personally I am optimistic we will get at least 2+ BTSX/AGS. If not, I will round up the fellow AGS donors, grab some pitchforks and gasoline, and head over to Bytemaster's castle.

[bytemaster]

4 million bts. 2 mill pts. 2 mill ags


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[yellowecho]

Whats the 5:1?

Bitshares to Protoshares

[sumantso]

Whats the 5:1?

[yellowecho]

Perhaps I haven't done enough research but it seems that PTS is a better deal right now.  Rather than getting a 1:1 like before, now PTS is getting 5:1 (BTS/PTS) while still maintaining a position in future DACs while AGS gets ~5:1 with no position.  Sure, you can roll the dice bidding for a few more BTS by investing in AGS... but at the current rate most PTS will be frozen in the AGS account in a couple of months.. meaning the opportunity to to bid using PTS will be far greater in the future.  So the value of PTS will increase while the price may decrease...
Am I wrong on this?   

[sumantso]

Do you mean 1:1 with respect to your profits from AGS vs. PTS?

No, I meant the absolute number I hold. I currently have more PTS than AGS.

AGS is like nitro. You burn up the BTC to get a boost in BitsharesX.

[sumantso]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

I guess you can synthetically make your own AGS, if you had extra money you can temporarily part with.  If you get X more AGS per PTS donated, just buy extra PTS to make up for the difference.  As soon as Bitshares X is launched, sell the extra PTS you purchased.  Now you have the same amount of Bitshares and you still maintain your liquid asset.  The cost will be the potential loss on the extra purchased shares.  It's also possible it could work out in your favor.  A successful launch of Bitshares will probably cause a significant rise in the price of PTS.  Is there something I'm missing here?

That would just work under the assumption that pts and Bitshares will DEFENITELY rise and that Bitshares will defenitely work. Under this assumption you can spend all your money on PTS/AGS and win. The question is is whether the added 1.5 times bitshares you get are worth giving up PTS...

Thats why you should spread it. I haven't diluted my PTS, but bought AGS with BTC.

The whole premise of our being here is hoping that BitsharesX, the flagship DAC, is going to have a high value. If BitsharesX fails it will drown confidence leading to a crash in PTS prices anyways.

For per unit BTC spent, you may end up getting 2-3 times BitsharesX by going through AGS.

[santaclause102]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

You will get a portion in all future I3 or I3 supported DACs through AGS. As far as I3 is concerned, AGS and PTS are on the same footing.

...you are not contradicting what I said above

I read closely and yes, you are right.

So it all boils down to how big BitsharesX is going to become. If you believe that its gonna be huge it makes sense to maximize the earned amount. I am some 2:1 in PTS/AGS and will probably end up as 1:1.

Do you mean 1:1 with respect to your profits from AGS vs. PTS?

[santaclause102]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

I guess you can synthetically make your own AGS, if you had extra money you can temporarily part with.  If you get X more AGS per PTS donated, just buy extra PTS to make up for the difference.  As soon as Bitshares X is launched, sell the extra PTS you purchased.  Now you have the same amount of Bitshares and you still maintain your liquid asset.  The cost will be the potential loss on the extra purchased shares.  It's also possible it could work out in your favor.  A successful launch of Bitshares will probably cause a significant rise in the price of PTS.  Is there something I'm missing here?

That would just work under the assumption that pts and Bitshares will DEFENITELY rise and that Bitshares will defenitely work. Under this assumption you can spend all your money on PTS/AGS and win. The question is is whether the added 1.5 times bitshares you get are worth giving up PTS...

[JakeThePanda]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

I guess you can synthetically make your own AGS, if you had extra money you can temporarily part with.  If you get X more AGS per PTS donated, just buy extra PTS to make up for the difference.  As soon as Bitshares X is launched, sell the extra PTS you purchased.  Now you have the same amount of Bitshares and you still maintain your liquid asset.  The cost will be the potential loss on the extra purchased shares.  It's also possible it could work out in your favor.  A successful launch of Bitshares will probably cause a significant rise in the price of PTS.  Is there something I'm missing here?

[sumantso]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

You will get a portion in all future I3 or I3 supported DACs through AGS. As far as I3 is concerned, AGS and PTS are on the same footing.

...you are not contradicting what I said above

I read closely and yes, you are right.

So it all boils down to how big BitsharesX is going to become. If you believe that its gonna be huge it makes sense to maximize the earned amount. I am some 2:1 in PTS/AGS and will probably end up as 1:1.

[santaclause102]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

You will get a portion in all future I3 or I3 supported DACs through AGS. As far as I3 is concerned, AGS and PTS are on the same footing.

...you are not contradicting what I said above

[sumantso]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

You will get a portion in all future I3 or I3 supported DACs through AGS. As far as I3 is concerned, AGS and PTS are on the same footing.

[santaclause102]

Agree with regard to invictus and bytemaster! Good distribution is key to success in DACs and this is only possible if the team focuses on the long term and not the quick bug which in the end is way more profitable anyway (exponential growth...).

Edit:
And with respect to AGS/PTS value something has to be considered that has not been mentioned yet that much. With PTS you are holding a tradable asset that can rise in value in itself which is not the case for AGS. Maybe (what do you think?) bitshares has more potential to grow in price compared to PTS but by buying AGS one is giving up an asset with value in itself. With PTS you have both Bitshares and PTS. With AGS you only have Bitshares after the release... The only way people can get in with future invictus DACS is by PTS which will make it rise lots....
What do you think?

[jae208]

Here is how you prove we have excellent team... we have raised more money from crowd funding than all of our competition combined

Well it is all about perception and people perceive you as someone who really is working towards something revolutionary and liberating.
We perceive your team as a group of people who aren't just motivated by profit and that is what makes the difference.

[bytemaster]

Memory coin has already demonstrated the concept and you will not have to wait long for bitshares x.   Also there are already two similar bounties in play.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sumantso]

Here is how you prove we have excellent team... we have raised more money from crowd funding than all of our competition combined

Thats great to hear. Do you have some ballpark figures?

Already 48 BTCs donated today, and it has been rising steadily over the past few days after the mini slump. I would like to believe all my posting here had some effect (though I am sure the website and the upcoming conference along with the pre alpha software had the effect).

EDIT: Since you have a lot of funding and award a lot of bounties (I get jealous everytime I visit that thread), can you set a bounty/payment for some simple alt-coin with minimal functions? It will serve as a nice demonstrator of how AGS and PTS holders get rewarded. I mean its one thing to know we will get stakes when BitsharesX is released, but actually getting stuff would be very interesting (even though it may not be very useful in the long run) and will demonstrate that BitsharesX is only one of the many things we will be getting.

[bytemaster]

Here is how you prove we have excellent team... we have raised more money from crowd funding than all of our competition combined

[sumantso]

google translate spits out this:

Most of my pts donate ags, not directed at bts, feel I3 need help through the status quo, which I hope to ags reasonable position to, if not pts high value, how to prove that I3 excellent team? ?

Many people are reluctant to vote because there are misappropriating ags mean, did not believe the market how ags, so people donate ags confidence I3 can understand it?

Does he mean he/others is not sure how to donate AGS or what it means and if donating to I3 is any good?

So I guess it was good that we managed to get low priced AGS till now 

[codinat]

很多人不愿意投ags是因为有圈钱的意思，没产品上市怎么相信ags，所以捐ags的人的信心I3能体会到吗?

[codinat]

我pts大部分捐ags,并不是冲着bts，觉得I3需要帮助度过现状，希望官方给于ags合理位置，如果价值没pts高，那如何证明I3团队优秀？？

[sumantso]

Will AGS eventually be traded on one of the exchanges?

No; at least thats what I3 says. The current value of AGS as well as PTS is dependent on that. I3 can't suddenly change the structure after 3-4 weeks of donations done.

[JakeThePanda]

Will AGS eventually be traded on one of the exchanges?

[sumantso]

Is he saying PTS makes more sense than AGS?

IMO, you should get both. AGS gives you more BitsharesX, while PTS is liquid and will give similar number of shares in future DACs.

The question, of course, is how much you expect the BitsharesX would be valued. If you think that they will be worth a lot, it makes sense to maximize the number you can get.

[codinat]

Thamks!Talos

[Talos]

我相信参与ags的没有傻子，出现这个结果一定是有原因的。
有没有这个可能呢？有人想借助ags捐赠数据打压pts价格，趁机低价吸货。
如果真是这样，我的策略是握紧手中的pts，直接拿手上的btc投ags。等pts相对btc价格上来后，再拿pts投。
没有btc的同志们就惨了
大家都是这样想的，我觉得现在是投btc.pts 都吃亏，因为btc 是硬货币，pts 一直在跌，bts可能跳票，ags 又不能交易，风险真的很大，持pts 稳妥。

^ Me Lost in (Google) Translation!

"I believe that the participation ags no fool, this result must occur for a reason.
There is no this possible? Some people like to use the data to suppress pts ags donation rates, cheap Xihuo opportunity.
If so, my strategy is clenched hands pts, good btc direct investment ags on. After a relatively btc prices and other pts up, shouting pts vote.
No btc comrades miserable
We all think so, I think it is cast btc.pts all suffer because btc hard currency, pts been dropped, bts may bounce, ags and not trading, risk is really great, holding pts secure. "

[codinat]

我相信参与ags的没有傻子，出现这个结果一定是有原因的。
有没有这个可能呢？有人想借助ags捐赠数据打压pts价格，趁机低价吸货。
如果真是这样，我的策略是握紧手中的pts，直接拿手上的btc投ags。等pts相对btc价格上来后，再拿pts投。
没有btc的同志们就惨了
大家都是这样想的，我觉得现在是投btc.pts 都吃亏，因为btc 是硬货币，pts 一直在跌，bts可能跳票，ags 又不能交易，风险真的很大，持pts 稳妥。

[slacking]

Yes, suppose two DAC's come out that do the same thing and one honors PTS holders and one doesn't....which do you think will be more popular?

[kokojie]

Thanks!
Did you mean that

is a much more profitable way into BitsharesX. However, for future DAC

with respect to future non invictus DACS ? And why?

I meant I3 DACs or I3 affiliated (who use I3 copyrighted code). But as I said in the next post if you see the number of DACs gained per unit BTC, AGS still remains more profitable.

Non I3 DACs apparently should honour only PTS, but I see no compelling argument for them to do so.

It can be a form of advertisement, offer a small bonus to PTS holders, and get them on board. Kinda like all the forum giveaways, except there's no need for someone to manually give away small amounts of coins, it's become automatic if you hold PTS.

[sumantso]

Thanks!
Did you mean that

is a much more profitable way into BitsharesX. However, for future DAC

with respect to future non invictus DACS ? And why?

I meant I3 DACs or I3 affiliated (who use I3 copyrighted code). But as I said in the next post if you see the number of DACs gained per unit BTC, AGS still remains more profitable.

Non I3 DACs apparently should honour only PTS, but I see no compelling argument for them to do so.

[santaclause102]

Thanks!
Did you mean that

is a much more profitable way into BitsharesX. However, for future DAC

with respect to future non invictus DACS ? And why?

[5chdn]

where is the place where you can see how many ags you get for 1pts/btc again?
And right now how many

http://agsexplorer.com/

[sumantso]

Both AGS and PTS will give you BitsharesX (at 50/50) and all future I3 or I3 copyrighted DACs (at least 10/10). Bytemaster has said the next DACs after BitsharesX may also award 50/50.

If BitsharesX is released within May, 1 AGS will give you more BitsharesX than 1 PTS. Its likely it will be released much earlier, in which case AGS is a much more profitable way into BitsharesX. However, for future DACs, PTS is likely to be more profitable. Then, theres also the fact that PTS is liquid.

Bytemaster thinks that some alpha version will be available in early February. Once that happens, I guess the AGS donations will shoot up (it has been dropping over the past few days).

why should PTS be more profitable for future dacs?
PTS will shoot up equally in feb then though
where is the place where you can see how many ags you get for 1pts/btc again?
And right now how many

1> After 150 days (roughly), the AGS distributed will catch up with PTS. Then, it will overtake, so there will be more AGS than PTS (and it will stay that way untill all PTS are mined). Since AGS are cheaper than PTS, I guess you can say that AGS will remain more profitable/unit BTC spent.

2> It will, but early release means you get more BitsharesX per AGS than PTS. Currently, since you are getting more than 1 AGS/ 1 PTS anyways, its much more profitable. Assuming it releases in another 3 months (I am hoping it will be earlier), then you will get 2 BitsharesX/AGS but only some 1.33 BitsharesX/PTS.

3> http://www1.agsexplorer.com/  For some reason the AGS price has dropped even wrt PTS, so I guess it is the best time to get a few. Till date, on an average, AGS has been 1.8 AGS/PTS.

[santaclause102]

Both AGS and PTS will give you BitsharesX (at 50/50) and all future I3 or I3 copyrighted DACs (at least 10/10). Bytemaster has said the next DACs after BitsharesX may also award 50/50.

If BitsharesX is released within May, 1 AGS will give you more BitsharesX than 1 PTS. Its likely it will be released much earlier, in which case AGS is a much more profitable way into BitsharesX. However, for future DACs, PTS is likely to be more profitable. Then, theres also the fact that PTS is liquid.

Bytemaster thinks that some alpha version will be available in early February. Once that happens, I guess the AGS donations will shoot up (it has been dropping over the past few days).

why should PTS be more profitable for future dacs?
PTS will shoot up equally in feb then though
where is the place where you can see how many ags you get for 1pts/btc again?
And right now how many

[sumantso]

Both AGS and PTS will give you BitsharesX (at 50/50) and all future I3 or I3 copyrighted DACs (at least 10/10). Bytemaster has said the next DACs after BitsharesX may also award 50/50.

If BitsharesX is released within May, 1 AGS will give you more BitsharesX than 1 PTS. Its likely it will be released much earlier, in which case AGS is a much more profitable way into BitsharesX. However, for future DACs, PTS is likely to be more profitable. Then, theres also the fact that PTS is liquid.

Bytemaster thinks that some alpha version will be available in early February. Once that happens, I guess the AGS donations will shoot up (it has been dropping over the past few days).

[Talos]

What I wasn't sure about exactly was all the derived assets:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=1696.0
What is the exact difference with PTS and AGS holders in relation to the blockchains for BitsharesX?