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Offline speedy

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Cross chain trading
« on: February 13, 2014, 01:48:58 AM »

Given that we definitely are going to have multiple Bitshares chains, can someone confirm whether cross chain atomic trading will definitely be supported by each chain and the client? As I understand it, it requires a number of steps to setup a contract for cross-chaining with someone else, so this would require some work to support. See here: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Atomic_cross-chain_trading#Solution_using_revealing_secrets_of_contract

And are we agreed that this is how users will manage multiple chains - a BitUSD asset will exist in each one, and users can swap their BitUSD 1:1 to get into another chain that they are interested in?

Also, I am assuming that some kind of meeting place (such as a website) will be required to find other users who want to do a swap. Is anyone working on that?

Offline bytemaster

Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2014, 01:55:19 AM »
Given that we definitely are going to have multiple Bitshares chains, can someone confirm whether cross chain atomic trading will definitely be supported by each chain and the client? As I understand it, it requires a number of steps to setup a contract for cross-chaining with someone else, so this would require some work to support. See here: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Atomic_cross-chain_trading#Solution_using_revealing_secrets_of_contract

And are we agreed that this is how users will manage multiple chains - a BitUSD asset will exist in each one, and users can swap their BitUSD 1:1 to get into another chain that they are interested in?

Also, I am assuming that some kind of meeting place (such as a website) will be required to find other users who want to do a swap. Is anyone working on that?

I have the transactions defined in include/bts/blockchain/outputs.hpp and have assigned tasks in JIRA to have it implemented.


Yes, a BitGLD asset will exist in each one... as the USD's long-term value is questionable I think the blockchain should use a different BitAsset as the fundamental unit.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline toast

Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2014, 02:19:29 AM »
So does each chain have a different core asset? Are any of these assets expected to be pegged 1:1?
Are the BTS inside BTS X going to be devalued by the BTS on other chains? Or will all core assets have their own floating exchange rates?
Do not use this post as information for making any important decisions. The only agreements I ever make are informal and non-binding. Take the same precautions as when dealing with a compromised account, scammer, sockpuppet, etc.

Offline speedy

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Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2014, 02:21:43 AM »
Thanks for the reply - yes BitGold is better choice +5% Dan thinks of everything.

But how easy will it be to do a trade with someone in practice? Will I be able to post my receive address here on the forums along with how much of the other BitGold I want, the other user then signs a transaction in his chain with that info and replies back with the transaction id, I then sign that id on my chain and transmit. Is that more or less how it could work?

Offline bytemaster

Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2014, 02:21:59 AM »
So does each chain have a different core asset? Are any of these assets expected to be pegged 1:1?
Are the BTS inside BTS X going to be devalued by the BTS on other chains? Or will all core assets have their own floating exchange rates?

All chains have their own shares... to facilitate cross-chain trading it would be nice if there was no need to worry about price-discovery and fluctuation.  Thus if two chains each had BitGLD then you can trade without having to consider price even though BitGLD on each chain is backed by a different shares.

For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline speedy

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Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2014, 02:23:49 AM »
So does each chain have a different core asset? Are any of these assets expected to be pegged 1:1?
Are the BTS inside BTS X going to be devalued by the BTS on other chains? Or will all core assets have their own floating exchange rates?

Dan is saying that every chain will only have BitGold as a common/core asset, and they will naturally peg 1:1 between each chain because everyone will trade them according to the price of Gold relative to each chain's collateral.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2014, 02:26:53 AM by trader »

Offline bytemaster

Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2014, 02:24:06 AM »
Thanks for the reply - yes BitGold is better choice +5% Dan thinks of everything.

But how easy will it be to do a trade with someone in practice? Will I be able to post my receive address here on the forums along with how much of the other BitGold I want, the other user then signs a transaction in his chain with that info and replies back with the transaction id, I then sign that id on my chain and transmit. Is that more or less how it could work?

As we progress it will be as simple as emailing someone a proposal and having them click accept.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline toast

Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2014, 02:26:36 AM »
So does each chain have a different core asset? Are any of these assets expected to be pegged 1:1?
Are the BTS inside BTS X going to be devalued by the BTS on other chains? Or will all core assets have their own floating exchange rates?

All chains have their own shares... to facilitate cross-chain trading it would be nice if there was no need to worry about price-discovery and fluctuation.  Thus if two chains each had BitGLD then you can trade without having to consider price even though BitGLD on each chain is backed by a different shares.

Right, so BitGLD will be somewhat fungible across chains by virtue of having the name "GLD".
Do you expect the name "BTS" to mean "bitshare" and thus be traded 1:1, or do you expect people to account for the fact that they are shares of different chains? Especially if the new chain is just like BTS X but with other assets.
Do not use this post as information for making any important decisions. The only agreements I ever make are informal and non-binding. Take the same precautions as when dealing with a compromised account, scammer, sockpuppet, etc.

Offline bytemaster

Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2014, 02:29:57 AM »
So does each chain have a different core asset? Are any of these assets expected to be pegged 1:1?
Are the BTS inside BTS X going to be devalued by the BTS on other chains? Or will all core assets have their own floating exchange rates?

All chains have their own shares... to facilitate cross-chain trading it would be nice if there was no need to worry about price-discovery and fluctuation.  Thus if two chains each had BitGLD then you can trade without having to consider price even though BitGLD on each chain is backed by a different shares.

Right, so BitGLD will be somewhat fungible across chains by virtue of having the name "GLD".
Do you expect the name "BTS" to mean "bitshare" and thus be traded 1:1, or do you expect people to account for the fact that they are shares of different chains? Especially if the new chain is just like BTS X but with other assets.

BTS is only used generically... we will need a unique 3 letter name for each chain.  TSH for BitShares XT.  I would prefer not to use BTS for any actual products so that it can be used in conversation generically when we are referring to shares in a chain. 
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline toast

Re: Cross chain trading
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2014, 02:31:26 AM »
Agree very much, that was my concern during the BitShares name promotion.

BTS := shorthand for "bitshares" the brand of cryptoequity
BSX := BitShares X core asset
Do not use this post as information for making any important decisions. The only agreements I ever make are informal and non-binding. Take the same precautions as when dealing with a compromised account, scammer, sockpuppet, etc.

 

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