Author Topic: The video calls bitcoin a company  (Read 3725 times)

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merockstar

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I agree, it is a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by everyone in a voluntary, free market manner.

normally I'd respond to this by asking rhetorically what you're proposing.

but shit dude, you might actually be able to solve this problem.

I actually have it all worked up, thought through, and designed.   BTS X is just the first step on my path toward implementing it.

Early thoughts on the subject:  https://the-iland.net

checking my understanding:

let's say somebody wanted to be a cocaine dealer. that's something that not everybody would consider immoral, but most people would. that means they would join a minority group of people whose arbiters are okay with that, and if the cocaine dealer tried to sell to somebody whose group disallows cocaine use and that buyer wasn't willing to cross over and switch to cocaine-group's arbiters, then a crime has been committed and each group's arbiters would have to work together to figure out an appropriate punishment, if they get caught?

Offline luckybit

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Quote
governments do produce added consume value in the form of conflict resolution initiation.

I respectfully disagree. The conflicts would have been there with or without the government, their role is to attempt to mitigate the negative consequences of those conflicts.

I am saying that the government is the source of more conflicts and violations of property rights than any private conflicts the government pretends to intermediate.

ie:  in the case of a single conflict where person A steals something from person B... government will attempt to resolve that conflict by introducing a conflict between itself and every other member of society to collect taxes at gun point to pay for the legal system and jails.   Governments kill more people than private criminals by several orders of magnitude.   

So on a net: governments create more conflict than they resolve.

That is how it is now but there really never has been a time in history when there wasn't governments. Families were governments back before we had states and there were conflicts within and between families too.

It's just that today governments in the form we are accustomed to tend to have the best weapons. If we are talking about Mexico or of places in Africa then a lot of people in those countries would prefer a stronger centralized government to the cartels and warlords. It really depends on what the alternative is at the time and in our case because our government has wiped out most of the gangs, organized criminals, terrorists and those who would create "scary" alternative forms of government that we can make the statement that for everything else our government is inefficient.

I'll agree with you that for a lot of things our government is inefficient. War and law enforcement are two areas where our government is among the most efficient in the world though. For a majority of Americans the paternal authoritarian mindset is war and law enforcement are services which protect their commercial interests or physical security. Most people don't want to learn to shoot a gun, go to war themselves, protect the borders, or fight crime, so they pay the government to handle "nuisances" on their behalf. 

I'm not saying I agree with that mindset but that is the mindset that most people seem to have.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2014, 07:07:42 am by luckybit »
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merockstar

  • Guest
I agree, it is a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by everyone in a voluntary, free market manner.

normally I'd respond to this by asking rhetorically what you're proposing.

but shit dude, you might actually be able to solve this problem.

I actually have it all worked up, thought through, and designed.   BTS X is just the first step on my path toward implementing it.

no shit? haven't read the link yet. going now

maybe you should be doing this anonymously... (i've thoroughly derailed this thread. that's my special talent, derailing threads)

Offline bytemaster

I agree, it is a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by everyone in a voluntary, free market manner.

normally I'd respond to this by asking rhetorically what you're proposing.

but shit dude, you might actually be able to solve this problem.

I actually have it all worked up, thought through, and designed.   BTS X is just the first step on my path toward implementing it.

Early thoughts on the subject:  https://the-iland.net
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline bytemaster

I agree, it is a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by everyone in a voluntary, free market manner.

normally I'd respond to this by asking rhetorically what you're proposing.

but shit dude, you might actually be able to solve this problem.

I actually have it all worked up, thought through, and designed.   BTS X is just the first step on my path toward implementing it.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

merockstar

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I agree, it is a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by everyone in a voluntary, free market manner.

normally I'd respond to this by asking rhetorically what you're proposing.

but shit dude, you might actually be able to solve this problem.

edit: rereading that, it was way too asskissish for my tastes. but goddamn, the respect I have for this guy. kinda feel uncomfortable even engaging in friendly debate.

I'm going to bow out of this thread.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2014, 03:07:28 am by merockstar »

Offline bytemaster

Quote
governments do produce added consume value in the form of conflict resolution initiation.

I respectfully disagree. The conflicts would have been there with or without the government, their role is to attempt to mitigate the negative consequences of those conflicts.

Governments kill more people than private criminals by several orders of magnitude.   

If we lived in anarchy would private individuals still kill less people than governments currently do?

I want to clarify. I'm not saying that I approve of the way current governments handle their responsibility. But it's a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by somebody.

I agree, it is a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by everyone in a voluntary, free market manner.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline fuzzy

DAC stands for decentralized autonomous company.  It's a company because it IS for profit. Profit is the incentive that makes us different from all other 2.0 technologies out there.  If something doesn't produce a profit (ie: value) then it can't thrive and grow.  The only thing that can grow without prodcing added value is government.  So are we a technical "company"? No, but that's the closest metaphor we have to describe a DAC, and thus BitShares.

I'm being pedantic, but I would argue that governments do produce added value in the form of conflict resolution.

but they also destroy value through the process of conflict creation...and the value they create through conflict resolution is not value that is based in competition in a market of ideas.  governments are pure force and monopoly of control for whatever place they touch.  that is my opinion...
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merockstar

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Quote
governments do produce added consume value in the form of conflict resolution initiation.

I respectfully disagree. The conflicts would have been there with or without the government, their role is to attempt to mitigate the negative consequences of those conflicts.

Governments kill more people than private criminals by several orders of magnitude.   

If we lived in anarchy would private individuals still kill less people than governments currently do?

I want to clarify. I'm not saying that I approve of the way current governments handle their responsibility. But it's a responsibility that needs to be shouldered by somebody.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2014, 09:08:28 pm by merockstar »

Offline bytemaster

Quote
governments do produce added consume value in the form of conflict resolution initiation.

I respectfully disagree. The conflicts would have been there with or without the government, their role is to attempt to mitigate the negative consequences of those conflicts.

I am saying that the government is the source of more conflicts and violations of property rights than any private conflicts the government pretends to intermediate.

ie:  in the case of a single conflict where person A steals something from person B... government will attempt to resolve that conflict by introducing a conflict between itself and every other member of society to collect taxes at gun point to pay for the legal system and jails.   Governments kill more people than private criminals by several orders of magnitude.   

So on a net: governments create more conflict than they resolve.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

merockstar

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Quote
governments do produce added consume value in the form of conflict resolution initiation.

I respectfully disagree. The conflicts would have been there with or without the government, their role is to attempt to mitigate the negative consequences of those conflicts.

Offline myhometalk

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The first time i heard someone called bitcoin as company was from bm's papers and his online video.
Besides as a company, to be a delagate of bts,you will get pay by doing the transaction and can donate your delegate income to charity
« Last Edit: July 22, 2014, 08:45:55 pm by myhometalk »

Offline bytemaster

Quote
governments do produce added consume value in the form of conflict resolution initiation.
For the latest updates checkout my blog: http://bytemaster.bitshares.org
Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

bitbro

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The more I think about the metaphor, the more I think distributed is sometimes better than decentralized... I still like decentralized tho


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Offline toast

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DAC stands for decentralized autonomous company.  It's a company because it IS for profit. Profit is the incentive that makes us different from all other 2.0 technologies out there.  If something doesn't produce a profit (ie: value) then it can't thrive and grow.  The only thing that can grow without prodcing added value is government.  So are we a technical "company"? No, but that's the closest metaphor we have to describe a DAC, and thus BitShares.

I think he meant that "The video calls bitcoin a company" - Bitcoin is not traditionally viewed as a DAC and so it can turn off newcomers who 'know we are wrong' if we don't take the time to emphasize that it is a metaphor they should consider
« Last Edit: July 22, 2014, 07:30:01 pm by toast »
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