Author Topic: Marketing Director, Brian Page, leaving Bitshares  (Read 19536 times)

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Offline testz

Doesnt it feel to anyone else like we are lying when we tell people bitcoin is decentralized?
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I guess the real test or question would be is: if someone put 10% of BTC's cap into a mining operation, would they be able to attain as much network control as someone who buys 10% stake of BTS shares? Or would it be more.

Easily, make a Bitcoin mining pool which pay 5-10% bonus, and you get 51% in few weeks and it's will cost you much less than $341,675,405 (10% of BTC cap)

Offline NewMine

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Doesnt it feel to anyone else like we are lying when we tell people bitcoin is decentralized?

Bitcoin is decentralized. It's security/block production is just not evenly distributed amongst all users. Nothing will ever be completely distributed unless you live in a communist utopia with no elite ruling class. Bitshares is decentralized too.  It has the potential to be more distributed than the current state of bitcoin thus making it more decentralized than Bitcoin. However, BitShares decentralization is calculated by share wealth and share wealth vote participation. If 100% of shares voted, the landscape of delegates would be very much the same because of a few elite/major share holders. These share holders/voters are no different than the large mining pools and mining operations for Bitcoin.

Then again, if you draw a large enough circle around something, it will always be centralized.


I almost agree with this.  I certainly love the "large enough circle" quotable quote.

The difference with BitShares is that it is at least possible for small stakeholders to unite to completely eliminate the influence of large stakeholders.  In a more realistic situation, only delegates most agreed upon by BOTH the small holders AND big holders would likely reach the Top 101.  If the small holders don't vote, oh well, they just agreed with the large holders.  This is still, by definition, a generally acceptable outcome.

This is not possible with the other schemes you mentioned.  There, the big guy's influence is absolute.

Yeah, I kind of based it off the quote from Fight Club, "On a long enough time line, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero.” Although, it is a concept that I am sure others have eluded to if not outright stated it.

I agree that small holders can unite, but at a greater effort and time.

I do think mining pools are subjected to the collective consensus of the little guys.

I guess the real test or question would be is: if someone put 10% of BTC's cap into a mining operation, would they be able to attain as much network control as someone who buys 10% stake of BTS shares? Or would it be more.

Offline Stan

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Doesnt it feel to anyone else like we are lying when we tell people bitcoin is decentralized?

Bitcoin is decentralized. It's security/block production is just not evenly distributed amongst all users. Nothing will ever be completely distributed unless you live in a communist utopia with no elite ruling class. Bitshares is decentralized too.  It has the potential to be more distributed than the current state of bitcoin thus making it more decentralized than Bitcoin. However, BitShares decentralization is calculated by share wealth and share wealth vote participation. If 100% of shares voted, the landscape of delegates would be very much the same because of a few elite/major share holders. These share holders/voters are no different than the large mining pools and mining operations for Bitcoin.

Then again, if you draw a large enough circle around something, it will always be centralized.


I almost agree with this.  I certainly love the "large enough circle" quotable quote.

The difference with BitShares is that it is at least possible for small stakeholders to unite to completely eliminate the influence of large stakeholders.  In a more realistic situation, only delegates most agreed upon by BOTH the small holders AND big holders would likely reach the Top 101.  If the small holders don't vote, oh well, they just agreed with the large holders.  This is still, by definition, a generally acceptable outcome.

This is not possible with the other schemes you mentioned.  There, the big guy's influence is absolute.
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Offline NewMine

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Should Have, Could Have, Would Have

Worst time for an ad. Until we have an easy to use wallet, that traffic isn't a huge benefit.  Missed opportunities, we're moving forward and hope you join us.

There's the spirit! Name recognition and brand recognition mean nothing. I mean, there is no way you could or should possibly know what a Ford Mustang is unless you go actually drive it and it's physically in your reach. Right?

BitShares, coming soon..... You ever hear of something coming soon?

Offline NewMine

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Doesnt it feel to anyone else like we are lying when we tell people bitcoin is decentralized?

Bitcoin is decentralized. It's security/block production is just not evenly distributed amongst all users. Nothing will ever be completely distributed unless you live in a communist utopia with no elite ruling class. Bitshares is decentralized too.  It has the potential to be more distributed than the current state of bitcoin thus making it more decentralized than Bitcoin. However, BitShares decentralization is calculated by share wealth and share wealth vote participation. If 100% of shares voted, the landscape of delegates would be very much the same because of a few elite/major share holders. These share holders/voters are no different than the large mining pools and mining operations for Bitcoin.

Then again, if you draw a large enough circle around something, it will always be centralized.

Offline fuzzy

Doesnt it feel to anyone else like we are lying when we tell people bitcoin is decentralized?
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Offline hpenvy2

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Instead of throwing out numbers of your high hopes and frankly unrealistic short term goals, layout the plans on how you intend to achieve those goals.

You do realize you could have taken out a full page ad in the LA times or a half page ad in the Wall St. Journal for most likely less than you paid the former Marketing Director.

Would've been a great time for an ad...Too bad.  >:(
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Article link: http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-revolutionary-power-of-digital-currency-1422035061

Should Have, Could Have, Would Have

Worst time for an ad. Until we have an easy to use wallet, that traffic isn't a huge benefit.  Missed opportunities, we're moving forward and hope you join us.

Offline NewMine

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Instead of throwing out numbers of your high hopes and frankly unrealistic short term goals, layout the plans on how you intend to achieve those goals.

You do realize you could have taken out a full page ad in the LA times or a half page ad in the Wall St. Journal for most likely less than you paid the former Marketing Director.

Would've been a great time for an ad...Too bad.  >:(
}


Article link: http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-revolutionary-power-of-digital-currency-1422035061
« Last Edit: January 25, 2015, 08:57:22 am by NewMine »

Offline jae208

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stop complaining -- and start helping ....

I am helping to bring you guys back to reality. Complaining about complaining isn't helping.

Gimme some of that AGS funds, and I will do more in a week than the Marketing Director did the entire time he served.  I can get you ads, sit downs with politicians, blurbs in local newscasts, intros to lobbyists from the top consulting firms. You name it.

While you guys sit around and high five each other and pat each other's backs because you are on the payroll doesn't take away from the fact that outside of the Bitshares code/product, little to no advance in adoption and community sentiment has been made. And by community, I mean cryptocommunity.

This is the second time in two days a paid I3 or Bitshares (I can't even tell which one pays the bills) person has told the community to do something for nothing.

I am sorry, but we donated to AGS, we didn't collect the AGS donations.

We don't have access to those funds.

I have seen no attempt to put the community to work using those funds outside of working on the code.

Give the community an opportunity to produce and you would have better results than that of the doge community.

 +5%

In hindsight, I think that the rise in Bitshares price a few days ago had more to do with the crypto community and people seeing BitsharesX rise quickly on coinmarketcap than wealthy friends recently made. In essence the best marketing we have is being on the top 4 for coinmarketcap, for now.
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Offline Riverhead

I don't disagree but btsx is on the dac Bitshares X. Bitshares itself is a toolkit, framework, platform, whatever you want to call it. That's what I was (not clearly) referring to.
I agree about the level playing field.

Offline fuzzy

BTSX needs momentum; market cap is how the avalanche will start.

BTC is what is today not because of social media presence, trendy ads, political lobbying or clever P2P marketing.

BTC is what it is because there are a few very powerful and connected hands pulling the strings.

We need a few whales, not a bunch of minnows.

I3/Brian are doing this right.
Once I better understood what BitShares was trying to do it made sense that this isn't a tool looking for adoption by the masses. It's a tool for businesses and those that work/play in the ForEx and equities markets.

The DACs built with the toolkit will need to appeal to the masses if that's their market (music vs vote).

I see the marketing of this more like the marketing we see for DuPont, 3M, or Java. It's more about making people aware of the framework than trying to sell it to them so that when a DAC says it's built with BitShares people aren't hearing it for the first time.

With that in mind I too feel I3 is doing this right.


Thats funny because I look at the platform as a great equalizer. A place where minnow and whale can compete with no edge. We could make a wallstreet where home user and billionaire all enjoy the same advantages of the software and ecosystem. Why only market from one group to one demographic? What possible advantages are there to making  your average joe feel like we aren't interested in his business because he is a few zero's shy.

Millionaire's are both made and borne(born into money vs self made) lets just give them a level field to play on and let the pieces fall where they may.


+5% +5% +5%
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Offline Gentso1

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BTSX needs momentum; market cap is how the avalanche will start.

BTC is what is today not because of social media presence, trendy ads, political lobbying or clever P2P marketing.

BTC is what it is because there are a few very powerful and connected hands pulling the strings.

We need a few whales, not a bunch of minnows.

I3/Brian are doing this right.
Once I better understood what BitShares was trying to do it made sense that this isn't a tool looking for adoption by the masses. It's a tool for businesses and those that work/play in the ForEx and equities markets.

The DACs built with the toolkit will need to appeal to the masses if that's their market (music vs vote).

I see the marketing of this more like the marketing we see for DuPont, 3M, or Java. It's more about making people aware of the framework than trying to sell it to them so that when a DAC says it's built with BitShares people aren't hearing it for the first time.

With that in mind I too feel I3 is doing this right.

Thats funny because I look at the platform as a great equalizer. A place where minnow and whale can compete with no edge. We could make a wallstreet where home user and billionaire all enjoy the same advantages of the software and ecosystem. Why only market from one group to one demographic? What possible advantages are there to making  your average joe feel like we aren't interested in his business because he is a few zero's shy.

Millionaire's are both made and borne(born into money vs self made) lets just give them a level field to play on and let the pieces fall where they may.

Offline fuzzy

When I hear people complaining about monopolies it reminds me of the South Park episode about Walmart. :)

I prefer the savings account one...though the walmart episode is beautiful too. Cant beat south park man. Been a long time since I had the time to watch it though :/
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Offline bitmeat

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When I hear people complaining about monopolies it reminds me of the South Park episode about Walmart. :)

Offline fuzzy


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winklevoss_twins#Bitcoin

the same guys whonfought over intellectual property rights for facebook...that should give some clue as to how freedom loving they are and in what direction they want to help evolve the bitcoin ecosystem.

Based on a movie full of inaccuracies everybody saw. Come on now! You can't deny there was a conflict of interest. Facebook settled with them, which to me looks like an admission of guilt.

No not because of that...but because it just seems too coincidental that these guys get in on such foundational technologies again and again. 

Of course,  I tend toward the supposition that exising power stuctures tend to create groups of insiders who have sworn to protect the interests of their monopolies and have access to far more resources than the normal joes... some call this conspiracy.  I call a logical consequence of the old money paradigm and human nature. :/
« Last Edit: August 14, 2014, 01:48:52 am by fuznuts »
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