Author Topic: Will Bitcoin switch to DPOS or is POW really dead?  (Read 4111 times)

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Offline santaclause102

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BM talked about politics and big players with control over the direction Bitcoin goes here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBcJ5rsAGaI (min. 1:53:00).

BM, which Players did you have in mind here and what observations are your conclusions based on?

I think this is a topic of major importance for AGS/PTS holders!

Is there a Bitshares/Invictus roadmap here yet?
« Last Edit: August 17, 2014, 10:48:29 am by delulo »

Offline bobmaloney

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LO_real_L -Honor PTS/AGS?  +5%

;-)
"The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw."
- Jack Handey (SNL)

Offline tonyk

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The question is whether POS in some variation (let's assume DPOS) will make it with the Bitcoin holders as shareholders of the leading POS crypto currency or with Bitshares/NXT/whatever other POS system shareholders of the leading crypto currency.

I think their smartest move would be to adopt DPoS after Bitassets have made their mark.

The real interesting part will be what to do with that gap between 14M and 21M bitcoin?

Honor PTS/AGS?
Honor at ratio?
Charity donations?
Small country currency bootstraps?

Imagine all the Bitshares community sharedrop discussions on a Bitcoin-sized stage with Bitcoin-sized politics = FUN ;-)

LO_real_L -Honor PTS/AGS?  +5%
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline bobmaloney

The question is whether POS in some variation (let's assume DPOS) will make it with the Bitcoin holders as shareholders of the leading POS crypto currency or with Bitshares/NXT/whatever other POS system shareholders of the leading crypto currency.

I think their smartest move would be to adopt DPoS after Bitassets have made their mark.

The real interesting part will be what to do with that gap between 14M and 21M bitcoin?

Honor PTS/AGS?
Honor at ratio?
Charity donations?
Small country currency bootstraps?

Imagine all the Bitshares community sharedrop discussions on a Bitcoin-sized stage with Bitcoin-sized politics = FUN ;-)

« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 05:05:52 pm by bobmaloney »
"The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw."
- Jack Handey (SNL)

Offline santaclause102

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I think for quite a while, Bitcoin will still be "Bitcoin!!!!" - the worlds next currency!
All I know is that POW will not make it for long. I give Bitcoin (in its current POW form) something between a few month and a few years to live.

The question is whether POS in some variation (let's assume DPOS) will make it with the Bitcoin holders as shareholders of the leading POS crypto currency or with Bitshares/NXT/whatever other POS system shareholders of the leading crypto currency.

Offline tonyk

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The public discussion whether to change or not might take 2 month.

.....

Why so long? Technically it surely wouldn't take so long. Or do you assume that it would take so long technically because only Gavin is rally doing any work ;)

No, Mainly reaching the decision. I am joking about the 3 1/2 years though - they might gear up and do it in 1.5-2 years.

Most importantly tho it is a decision whether to be die as  POW or DPOS or xyOz coin in the next 5-7-10 years... (personal opinion only)
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 05:03:42 pm by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline bobmaloney

Bitcoin will have to change DPoS (or something very similar) when the community realizes that the merchant providers hold more power than the miners.

I think it will happen much sooner than most people think.


What do you think would happen if Bitpay, Coinbase, Circle, etc., threaten to take a hard fork Bitcoin?
I don't think it can happen that fast. I would guess if the the Bitcoin foundation is wiling to change to DPOS then it takes another 3 month to change. The public discussion whether to change or not might take 2 month. So half a year from when the Bitcoin foundation basically thinks it makes sense to switch.
Any more educated guesses?

What is the plan for Bitshares? Financing and running an own payment provider? Making Bitpay accept Bitshares / BitUSD before Bitcoin can switch? 

What would be advantages of Bitshares + DPOS vs. Bitcoin + DPOS?

I would consider 6 months fast, but 3.5 is much too long - that would kill Bitcoin, IMO.

I think for quite a while, Bitcoin will still be "Bitcoin!!!!" - the worlds next currency!

Bitshares will be everything else.

My view has been:

Bitcoin: Currency, Highest-profile Ledger
Bitshares: Business, Wall Street, Internet, etc.
Ethereum: Internet of things

Regarding Bitshares adoption at the merchant providers - wait until they try out DPoS for themselves - it answers the coffee shop conformation problem.
"The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw."
- Jack Handey (SNL)

Offline santaclause102

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Bitcoin will have to change DPoS (or something very similar) when the community realizes that the merchant providers hold more power than the miners.

I think it will happen much sooner than most people think.


What do you think would happen if Bitpay, Coinbase, Circle, etc., threaten to take a hard fork Bitcoin?
I don't think it can happen that fast. I would guess if the the Bitcoin foundation is wiling to change to DPOS then it takes another 3 month to change. The public discussion whether to change or not might take 2 month. So half a year from when the Bitcoin foundation basically thinks it makes sense to switch.
Any more educated guesses?

3 1/2 years min.
Why so long? Technically it surely wouldn't take so long. Or do you assume that it would take so long technically because only Gavin is rally doing any work ;)

Offline tonyk

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Bitcoin will have to change DPoS (or something very similar) when the community realizes that the merchant providers hold more power than the miners.

I think it will happen much sooner than most people think.


What do you think would happen if Bitpay, Coinbase, Circle, etc., threaten to take a hard fork Bitcoin?
I don't think it can happen that fast. I would guess if the the Bitcoin foundation is wiling to change to DPOS then it takes another 3 month to change. The public discussion whether to change or not might take 2 month. So half a year from when the Bitcoin foundation basically thinks it makes sense to switch.
Any more educated guesses?

3 1/2 years min.
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline santaclause102

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Bitcoin will have to change DPoS (or something very similar) when the community realizes that the merchant providers hold more power than the miners.

I think it will happen much sooner than most people think.


What do you think would happen if Bitpay, Coinbase, Circle, etc., threaten to take a hard fork Bitcoin?
I don't think it can happen that fast. I would guess if the the Bitcoin foundation is wiling to change to DPOS then it takes another 3 month to change. The public discussion whether to change or not might take 2 month. So half a year from when the Bitcoin foundation basically thinks it makes sense to switch.
Any more educated guesses?

What is the plan for Bitshares? Financing and running an own payment provider? Making Bitpay accept Bitshares / BitUSD before Bitcoin can switch? 

What would be advantages of Bitshares + DPOS vs. Bitcoin + DPOS?
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 04:39:10 pm by delulo »

Offline liondani

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Can you imagine a day when BitShares success forces POW based coins to adapt DPOS to stay competitive?
Do you think there may come a day when even Bitcoin itself dumps POW and goes DPOS?

Not all of them will. A lot of people have invested a lot of time and money into PoW. They are in pivotal positions on the chess board. They are going to milk PoW for all it has to offer and why shouldn't they? Not everyone cares about the best technology and many people are in it just to make the maximum profit from the ecosystem.

I would like to profit but I think if given a choice I would choose to profit from innovation rather than from political incumbency.


Offline tonyk

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Not all of them will. A lot of people have invested a lot of time and money into PoW. They are in pivotal positions on the chess board. They are going to milk PoW for all it has to offer and why shouldn't they? Not everyone cares about the best technology and many people are in it just to make the maximum profit from the ecosystem.

I would like to profit but I think if given a choice I would choose to profit from innovation rather than from political incumbency.
I think at this point Bitcoin would rather die, and so eventually it will, but most likely not for a good while.
exactly what i think too
What is your (jaba and troc) reasoning based on?
luckybit basicly points it out
But miners have different interests than Bitcoin holders / whales. They are not the same group. Minders want to keep POW. Bitcoin holder want to safe Bitcoin and could organize a consensus among Bitcoin holders to fork Bitcoin. The question is where would the Bitcoin foundation stand here??

And here we come to one of BM main points - when a company is held hostage by its employees...no bright future is expected.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 04:37:04 pm by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline bobmaloney

Bitcoin will have to change DPoS (or something very similar) when the community realizes that the merchant providers hold more power than the miners.

I think it will happen much sooner than most people think.


What do you think would happen if Bitpay, Coinbase, Circle, etc., threaten to take a hard fork Bitcoin?
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 04:31:29 pm by bobmaloney »
"The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw."
- Jack Handey (SNL)

Offline santaclause102

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Not all of them will. A lot of people have invested a lot of time and money into PoW. They are in pivotal positions on the chess board. They are going to milk PoW for all it has to offer and why shouldn't they? Not everyone cares about the best technology and many people are in it just to make the maximum profit from the ecosystem.

I would like to profit but I think if given a choice I would choose to profit from innovation rather than from political incumbency.
I think at this point Bitcoin would rather die, and so eventually it will, but most likely not for a good while.
exactly what i think too
What is your (jaba and troc) reasoning based on?
luckybit basicly points it out
But miners have different interests than Bitcoin holders / whales. They are not the same group. Minders want to keep POW. Bitcoin holder want to safe Bitcoin and could organize a consensus among Bitcoin holders to fork Bitcoin. The question is where would the Bitcoin foundation stand here??

Offline JA

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Not all of them will. A lot of people have invested a lot of time and money into PoW. They are in pivotal positions on the chess board. They are going to milk PoW for all it has to offer and why shouldn't they? Not everyone cares about the best technology and many people are in it just to make the maximum profit from the ecosystem.

I would like to profit but I think if given a choice I would choose to profit from innovation rather than from political incumbency.
I think at this point Bitcoin would rather die, and so eventually it will, but most likely not for a good while.
exactly what i think too
What is your (jaba and troc) reasoning based on?
luckybit basicly points it out

Offline luckybit

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Can you imagine a day when BitShares success forces POW based coins to adapt DPOS to stay competitive?
Do you think there may come a day when even Bitcoin itself dumps POW and goes DPOS?

Not all of them will. A lot of people have invested a lot of time and money into PoW. They are in pivotal positions on the chess board. They are going to milk PoW for all it has to offer and why shouldn't they? Not everyone cares about the best technology and many people are in it just to make the maximum profit from the ecosystem.

I would like to profit but I think if given a choice I would choose to profit from innovation rather than from political incumbency.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline santaclause102

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I think at this point Bitcoin would rather die, and so eventually it will, but most likely not for a good while.
exactly what i think too
What is your (jaba and troc) reasoning based on?

Offline JA

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I think at this point Bitcoin would rather die, and so eventually it will, but most likely not for a good while.
exactly what i think too

Offline cgafeng

I won't surprise when this happen.
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Offline Troglodactyl

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I think at this point Bitcoin would rather die, and so eventually it will, but most likely not for a good while.

Offline bitcoinerS

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Can you imagine a day when BitShares success forces POW based coins to adapt DPOS to stay competitive?
Do you think there may come a day when even Bitcoin itself dumps POW and goes DPOS?
« Last Edit: August 16, 2014, 12:19:43 pm by bitcoinerS »
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