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Offline arhag

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I am concerned with the community support for low delegate payrates (for example see this thread: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=7553.0).

There is a reason public corporations do not pay out dividends to shareholders until much later in their lifetime. That money can be better used by reinvesting into the company. The growth in the company's stock made possible from the reinvested money (if done well) can provide greater value to shareholders than giving out dividends.

DACs are no different. The income of the DAC is the network fees which are collected by the delegates. By lowering the payrate, delegates are essentially paying out dividends to the DAC stakeholders. But in the early stages of DACs like BitShares X, that money can be more efficiently used by reinvesting in the DAC. In the case of DACs, that means the delegates need to transfer the money collected from fees to individuals/organizations/firms that have a plan to improve the DAC and the ecosystem. Transparency is incredibly important so that stakeholders know the appropriate amount of BTSX was transferred from the delegate who received the fees to the organizations who deserve to get them. The stakeholders indirectly get to choose which organizations receive the money by voting for delegates that pay the fees to the desired organizations. I think Agent86's worker model would be a better way of doing this personally, but this is the way it has to be done in the current system.

I think it is incredibly important in these early stages to use the vast majority of the network fees to fund further development and marketing. There are so many important things to fund. I would like to see some funds go to I3 so they can hire more people to work on important efforts such as lightweight clients, further improving the user interface, and porting the clients to all relevant platforms (mobile, desktop, web). I would like to see funds go to firms who want to create multisig security companies, chain servers, and even a BitPay-like service that provides (initially) free technical support for merchants who want to set up clients to accept BitUSD. And of course funds should also go to marketing organizations who will spread the news about BitShares, make the mechanics and value of the system very easy to understand, convince merchants to accept BitUSD, and convince users of the benefits of holding BitUSD or other similar BitAssets.

The purpose of this thread is to convince people to not waste our potential. Bitcoin core developers have trouble getting funding even though BTC has over a $6 billion market cap. DPOS can fix this problem because it makes DACs profitable. Let's take that profit and reinvest it to grow the value of BTSX even more. I hope this starts the discussion of how we should spend the profit and which organizations are best able to execute the plans that we envision will grow BTSX value.


Offline CoinHoarder

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I just wanted to pop in and say I agree with you.  +5%
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Offline santaclause102

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Agree!
I think the reason is that there is no other parameter yet for voting sh. This will change. 

Offline oco101

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Yup  good  point !! So  basically you are saying that delegates should use there funds to promote or reinvest in Bitshare X. This is something to be considered for sure !! What is the best way to help the system ?  But in the other hand having more dividends it more appealing to new users too. There should be some kind of balance in between I guess.
More user more money for delegates too. I like Clout approach tough, not having fee he was helping the whole system to be more  rewarding for everybody.
Don't forget to be a delegate is is a lot of work you need to make money out of it as any other business. Delegates need to cover there cost  for  servers  and time spent.

Offline maqifrnswa

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which is also why I've been saying fees should go up and down, to react to market forces...
low fees is reinvesting in bitshares, but dynamic fees allows one to make profit when they need to, drop fees to zero when they want to. Overall it is more efficient for the system as a whole.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2014, 03:36:54 AM by maqifrnswa »
maintains an Ubuntu PPA: https://launchpad.net/~showard314/+archive/ubuntu/bitshares [15% delegate] wallet_account_set_approval maqifrnswa true [50% delegate] wallet_account_set_approval delegate1.maqifrnswa true

Offline bitmeat

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What I would love to see is delegates who dedicate % of their pay to developers. I would love to be building DAC tools and even quit my amazing full time job, if I know the community will support me. At the same time I think I can create a lot more value for everyone than what my services would cost.

Offline emski

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What I would love to see is delegates who dedicate % of their pay to developers. I would love to be building DAC tools and even quit my amazing full time job, if I know the community will support me. At the same time I think I can create a lot more value for everyone than what my services would cost.
Angel delegate is dedicated just for that. Pitch your project and you might get funded.

UPDATE: It seems though that delegate lost support along with lotto. So the funds in the angel fund might not be enough.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2014, 06:57:09 AM by emski »

Offline svk

I agree with this, which is why I'm keeping my pay rate at 80%. That seems a good compromise between giving dividends back to the users and funding VPNs and other activities like my block explorer website development. Now that I got elected, I feel more comfortable beefing up my delegate VPN as well as adding a seed node VPN, but with too low of a payrate I wouldn't be able to do those things.

So please don't judge delegates only by their payrate, also look at their contributions to the ecosystem.
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Offline betax

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What do you think about my idea 45% for forum users (lottery based) and 45% for charity, maybe part of the charity fund could be use for bitshares development. I don't know if will be sort on the 10% for cost etc.. after a while but I guess if I can justify it nobody would mind.
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Offline Xeldal

I totally agree.  I've said the same before.  I think targeted pay will always be better then blanket destruction, this is how I cast my vote anyways.

Please consider voting for bitshares-dev.invest.xeldal

All income over cost is put to the development of the BitShares ecosystem.

Offline maqifrnswa

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I totally agree.  I've said the same before.  I think targeted pay will always be better then blanket destruction, this is how I cast my vote anyways.

Please consider voting for bitshares-dev.invest.xeldal

All income over cost is put to the development of the BitShares ecosystem.

how so, do you have a business plan/accounting posted or set up? Would you like people to apply to you for projects? I think this is a good idea, and I've seen over a dozen say the same - but I'm curious as to what it actually means
maintains an Ubuntu PPA: https://launchpad.net/~showard314/+archive/ubuntu/bitshares [15% delegate] wallet_account_set_approval maqifrnswa true [50% delegate] wallet_account_set_approval delegate1.maqifrnswa true

Offline Akado

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Quick question: Is there a charity fund for delegates to donate part of their earnings? So they could be further applied into the system to develop it? I want to know because lately I've been seriously thinking about this and I would like to know where to donate to if I can ever make it work out
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Offline Riverhead

What I would love to see is delegates who dedicate % of their pay to developers. I would love to be building DAC tools and even quit my amazing full time job, if I know the community will support me. At the same time I think I can create a lot more value for everyone than what my services would cost.


I would be willing to go back to a higher % if there was a fund for paying developers. I'm happy to donate some of my earnings (as you know) but so far there is no slick way to do this other than to scan the forums and look for worthy developers to donate to. I don't think you'd want to quit your job on the hope that I find you.

Offline Xeldal

I totally agree.  I've said the same before.  I think targeted pay will always be better then blanket destruction, this is how I cast my vote anyways.

Please consider voting for bitshares-dev.invest.xeldal

All income over cost is put to the development of the BitShares ecosystem.

how so, do you have a business plan/accounting posted or set up? Would you like people to apply to you for projects? I think this is a good idea, and I've seen over a dozen say the same - but I'm curious as to what it actually means

Currently it would be with trust and at my discretion.  I will put something more concrete together and post somewhere.  Hopefully as the system grows we will have better tools for this purpose.

Offline xeroc

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I should offensively start sending out tips and offer more bounties :)
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