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Where is the outrage for BTC miners not doing any marketing or development to further BTC? They sign blocks, the minimum requirement of a delegate, and take 100% pay. What they don't dump to pay for power and infrastructure goes straight into their pockets.So BTC has higher inflation and 100% delegates with zero job requirements other than signing blocks. This is the gold standard we're held to?
Quote from: CLains on January 24, 2015, 05:47:26 pmI will hold out a few months more, but from what I have seen so far it seems self-funding with Delegates are working like a charm.I have yet to see any tangible evidence that proves bitshares wouldn't be in the exact same spot had there been no 100% delegates. I have yet to see any evidence of anything beyond the status quo in October 2014.Marketing delegates with no marketing results. No offense guys. I know you all talk and theorize about the possibilities but nothing has panned out so far. A pretty good indicator is the subReddit subscribers or lack thereof. Yeah, yeah, yeah we waiting for 1.0. You cant sell a product before its released (Video Games, Movies, BitReserve, iPhones.... )Developers would be doing the exact same thing had they not been a 100% delegate. Otherwise there high hopes of huge windfalls from their enormous holding would have zero chance of coming to fruition.Gateway delegates have not produced any fiat to BTS gateway. Still producing a gateway using BTC which already existed and still exists had there not been a 100% delegate.As I have stated before, Bitcoin is in the spot BitShares wants to be in. BTC did not need what all of you propose is necessary to grow BitShares. It happened because BTC holders wanted to grow their holdings or make a buck of the potential. You guys realize that BitShares is more like a welfare program with its 100% delegates.
I will hold out a few months more, but from what I have seen so far it seems self-funding with Delegates are working like a charm.
Quote from: Ander on January 25, 2015, 12:22:48 amIncredibly we are STILL below the hard fork supply, almost 3 months later.Nice try. I think the only reason you are under is because of all the burned bts when the share cap was 2 billion. Add the pre merger burns and we are probably over.
Incredibly we are STILL below the hard fork supply, almost 3 months later.
Change in supply since the hardfork: -211,517.62 BTS
BTW, I'd recommend every delegate to fill in some data into the public json data. Some weeks ago we came up with a consensus about the protocol:http://wiki.bitshares.org/index.php/Delegate/PublicDataExample script to do so:https://raw.githubusercontent.com/xeroc/pytshares/master/setPublicData.py ### use with caution as the payrate is part of it!
New mine also ignores the fact that so far the supply is down and had yet to surpass 2.5 billion. Also everyone would be looking for work rather than focus on development.
> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,526,616.14493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,526,564.64493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,526,506.74493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,526,497.74493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,526,493.24493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,526,490.24493 BTS]
>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,527,138.64493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,527,088.64493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,527,085.64493 BTS>> blockchain_calculate_supply BTS2,498,527,084.14493 BTS]
As I have stated before, Bitcoin is in the spot BitShares wants to be in. BTC did not need what all of you propose is necessary to grow BitShares. It happened because BTC holders wanted to grow their holdings or make a buck of the potential.
Quote from: CLains on January 24, 2015, 05:47:26 pmI will hold out a few months more, but from what I have seen so far it seems self-funding with Delegates are working like a charm.As I have stated before, Bitcoin is in the spot BitShares wants to be in. BTC did not need what all of you propose is necessary to grow BitShares. It happened because BTC holders wanted to grow their holdings or make a buck of the potential.
I dont think we need a delegate to look after the other delegates. I think this is something that investors should want to do. The community should be doing this (and will be), without needing to be paid.
A few delegates away from hitting a million shares per week dilution. Plus the vesting share dilution every day will equal a zero or negative growth over the next few years. All the while, bitcoin sidechains and centralized wannabes slowly gain faster acceptance. And ethereum too. What are all you delegates doing exactly? We even have a new delegate inspector delegate proposal. WTF? Id like to propose a 100% delegate to oversee the inspector delegate.OrHow about a BS delegate? This delegate's primary job would be to make wild and amazing promises that never see the light of day. Just as every promise is supposed to be realized, I will flood you guys with excuses and more promises for future dates. Rinse repeat. The whole time this is going on I will trade my BTS for bitUSD giving the bitISD ever so much more liquidity on an ongoing basis until I have gathered enough bitUSD to buy a vacation home on cryptofresh.
Quote from: Rune on January 23, 2015, 10:51:44 pmQuote from: Ander on January 23, 2015, 10:34:28 pmI dont think we need a delegate to look after the other delegates. I think this is something that investors should want to do. The community should be doing this (and will be), without needing to be paid.At scale there should absolutely be HR delegates that provide reports, metrics, etc. about all delegates, all their projects and all their employees. No delegate should go unscrutinized and all delegate expenses should be 100% accounted for. Shareholders are meant to make the executive decisions - doing actual research and reports at the massive scale the bitshares bureacracy will reach at 5 billion (or just 500 million really) will require loads of resources that we can't expect individuals to donate. Of course ultimately there will be many situations where grassroots investigation or shareholder activism is required, and it will probably happen much more often compared to traditional publicly traded companies, but if we rely solely on altrustic shareholders doing in-depth delegate investigation in their free time we will not be able to have a functional team at scale.Eventually yes, delegates will need to be whole organizations. I should say: At the present time, I dont think this is so complicated that it needs to be a paid position, it is something that we the community should be doing.Later on if we get huge things will change.
Quote from: Ander on January 23, 2015, 10:34:28 pmI dont think we need a delegate to look after the other delegates. I think this is something that investors should want to do. The community should be doing this (and will be), without needing to be paid.At scale there should absolutely be HR delegates that provide reports, metrics, etc. about all delegates, all their projects and all their employees. No delegate should go unscrutinized and all delegate expenses should be 100% accounted for. Shareholders are meant to make the executive decisions - doing actual research and reports at the massive scale the bitshares bureacracy will reach at 5 billion (or just 500 million really) will require loads of resources that we can't expect individuals to donate. Of course ultimately there will be many situations where grassroots investigation or shareholder activism is required, and it will probably happen much more often compared to traditional publicly traded companies, but if we rely solely on altrustic shareholders doing in-depth delegate investigation in their free time we will not be able to have a functional team at scale.
Id like to propose a 100% delegate to oversee the inspector delegate.
You should run for the BS delegate position. You are following my outline to a T. Otherwise Stan should hold this position.
Quote from: NewMine on January 23, 2015, 09:36:49 pmWhat are all you delegates doing exactly? Its not that difficult to figure out, if you've been following along. Hopefully we will have better tools for the uninitiated, or for those without the time or inclination to do the necessary research.Quote from: NewMine on January 23, 2015, 09:36:49 pmWe even have a new delegate inspector delegate proposal. WTF? You read the proposal right? It didn't say anything about requesting a delegate. In fact it expressly stated not needing one.Quote from: NewMine on January 23, 2015, 09:36:49 pmId like to propose a 100% delegate ...How about a BS delegate? Well I think you have all the qualifications. Go for it! This would at least offer a quick learning experience on how the system works, how those most interested in the success of the system are able to keep out the trash and otherwise unproductive.
What are all you delegates doing exactly?
We even have a new delegate inspector delegate proposal. WTF?
Id like to propose a 100% delegate ...How about a BS delegate?
Step 1 was getting people hired and working for bitshares. We are casting our net for productive fish right now. We are going to find some productive people and some unproductive people, that is inevitable. Thinking that Bitshares will never hire anyone who then just takes the money and does nothing id foolish, that will occur sometimes, we jsut have to make sure we deal with it appropriately.Step 2 will be coming soon, which is having these delegates show us what they have done in a month, and beginning to weed out those that are not producing value. If this is successful and we can see that productive delegate remain in, while low productivity delegates get booted, then we will have a lot of confidence that the system is working, and that voting is working.
Up to 27 100% delegates. Really?