BitShares Forum

Other => Graveyard => KeyID => Topic started by: toast on August 01, 2014, 11:08:19 pm

Title: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 01, 2014, 11:08:19 pm
Announcing the Decentralized Namespace Service - get your share by holding PTS before the end of August 21st

Featuring:

.p2p  - .bit killer and DNS cash cow
KeyID - replacing usernames everywhere

Enabling services like

Browsing .p2p websites - no spying, no seizures!
"SignIn with KeyID" - think google/facebook signin only MORE SECURE. OUTRAGEOUSLY SECURE if the website is a .p2p site.
"KeyMail"  -  more on this later... will be a critical piece of infrastructure for BTS ecosystem as a whole


Video (Draft): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeweF05tT50
Webpage: http://dotp2p.io/ (new webpage will be launched soon)


Features ready NOW (test net incoming):
* .p2p Punishing Throttled Auction (with hard-coded throttle) for initial distribution  -  more on this later
* .p2p Sell/Buy embedded market
* .p2p TITAN transfers
* KeyID "points" with upburn/downburn  - how much money will people spend adjusting a meaningless number associated with their account? Probably a bunch!
* Everything in the toolkit except Markets - *maybe* we will add BitUSD far in the future

Features ready at launch at end of august (hopefully, it's just a goal):
* Punishing auction throttle size set by delegates, with fallback to fixed rate
* .p2p "offers" - put up bids before a domain is for sale or before it even exists. Not everyone wants to risk the Punishing Auction.
* SignIn with KeyID  -  we can already do this with ID-to-ID but we want to be able to do ID-to-.p2p because then you can check the site you are logging in to is who you think it is

Features ready after launch:
* DNS servers / browser plugins / "invisible" clients  -  seamless browsing experience
* DNS delegates that act as smart oracles for other decentralized application platforms - ethereum, ripple, etc... KeyID usernames *all over crypto land*.

Allocation:

1bn to AGS
1bn to PTS
1bn MYSTERY sharedrops onto other crypto. Targets might include BTC, NMC, NXT, ETH (snapshot using presale), PPC. They will likely be scaled so that they all give the same price per DNS and all have the same price *disadvantage* compared to PTS - this is why I feel OK not disclosing the exact allocation yet.. UP TO 100m of the sharedrop *might* be reserved for backpay and bounties but I fear the consequences of perceived unfairness and so I'll probably try to avoid this.

7bn delegate subsidy, about 45% of the pool paid out per year. Remember, this is a theoretical maximum! Realistically you will not have 7bn new tokens printed for the delegates!


https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=6753.0


Delegate subsidy equation (assuming 10 second blocks):
     block_pay = delegate_subsidy_remaining / 5000000
So the *maximum* number of new tokens created after T years is given by:
     5000000000 - (5000000000 * (1 - 1/5000000)^((3153600)*T))
(there are 3153600 blocks per year)


Watch out for:
* PAID positions for content creation and development (web, core client, and DNS infrastructure)
* Instructions for migrating Keyhotee and BTSX names
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: taoljj on August 01, 2014, 11:41:41 pm
 +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Musewhale on August 01, 2014, 11:56:12 pm
 +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 02, 2014, 12:07:03 am
Sounds like a pay-to-play super secure web built on a blockchain?  Can you expand on this "Punish Auction" a bit?  That sort of came out of nowhere :) .  The KeyID burn sounds like you can pay to upgrade your own number...which sounds sort of like a rating but actually isn't since you can pay to adjust your number?  Can other people adjust yours for free?  This all sounds pretty cool and I understand this is an [ANN] thread...but is this documented in more depth somewhere else?

http://dotp2p.io/index.php

Looking forward to getting my .p2p domain  8) .
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: sfinder on August 02, 2014, 12:25:41 am
 ;D ;D ;D ;D +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: twitter on August 02, 2014, 12:26:44 am
wonderful +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: ssjpts on August 02, 2014, 12:37:41 am
good luck everyone
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: jwiz168 on August 02, 2014, 12:47:59 am
great ....  +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: 38PTSWarrior on August 02, 2014, 12:52:59 am
good luck everyone

yes
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: yellowecho on August 02, 2014, 01:00:11 am
 +5% +5% +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Empirical1 on August 02, 2014, 01:04:41 am
good luck everyone

yes

 +5% Good luck Toast and everyone else involved!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: cdryan on August 02, 2014, 01:12:04 am
nice
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: gyhy on August 02, 2014, 01:19:34 am
 8) +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: cgafeng on August 02, 2014, 01:25:01 am
 +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: yellowecho on August 02, 2014, 01:36:02 am
Bye bye Namecoin!  8)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Snail on August 02, 2014, 01:58:07 am
 +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: urbanpauper on August 02, 2014, 02:14:53 am
 +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: dexinwong on August 02, 2014, 02:19:34 am
great  +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 02, 2014, 04:11:02 am
 +5% +5% +5%

  :) :D ;D
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: testz on August 02, 2014, 04:15:23 am
Bye bye Namecoin!  8)

 :)  +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: svk on August 02, 2014, 05:10:17 am
Awesome! +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: arhag on August 02, 2014, 05:28:17 am
 +5%

KeyID - replacing usernames everywhere

What do you mean everywhere?

"SignIn with KeyID" - think google/facebook signin only MORE SECURE. OUTRAGEOUSLY SECURE if the website is a .p2p site.
* DNS delegates that act as smart oracles for other decentralized application platforms - ethereum, ripple, etc... KeyID usernames *all over crypto land*.

EVERYWHERE! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Osmcy1NO5lM&t=18)


All joking around aside, I am really excited for this DAC. Could we finally say goodbye to managing website passwords and worrying about man-in-the-middle attacks? I hope so. And I'm also intrigued by KeyMail and KeyID points. Can't wait to learn more about them.

I am a little concerned with downburns. The economics of a downburn don't make sense to me, if it is what I think it is. Why would someone spend their own money downvoting someone else? Seems like it suffers from the free rider problem. I do have some ideas on how "downburns" (or more like "downvote collateral") could be made into something that interacts with a Lending DAC, effectively making KeyID points into something like a credit score. I'll probably write it about it sometime later.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: charleshoskinson on August 02, 2014, 06:46:38 am
Goodwork Toast. You've worked very hard for this release. Proud of you.  +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: bitmeat on August 02, 2014, 07:46:50 am
If I may suggest, to ensure long term involvement and participation from established businesses. Make sure people with .com domains can somehow claim them. This will eliminate squatting names like Facebook, Microsoft, etc. perhaps if they can digitally sign using the DNS records you can award to their public key. Think long term 5 years from now.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: bitmeat on August 02, 2014, 07:47:45 am
In the spirit of air-drop I'd like to call that feature "name-drop" lol
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: muse-umum on August 02, 2014, 08:33:53 am
Anyone here thing the 7bn delegate subsidy is too high ? Lots of people in Chinese community complain about it.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Shentist on August 02, 2014, 09:05:16 am
if a understand the formular correct
Quote
7000000000 - (7000000000 * (1 - 1/5000000)^((3153600)*T))
then you get this share distribution.

Year   Total amount of shares       increasing of shares per year
           for delegates after x years      
         
1            3.274.540.924,57                   3.274.540.924,57
2            5.017.279.239,61              1.742.738.315,04
3            5.944.779.278,45                 927.500.038,84
4            6.438.402.626,62                 493.623.348,17
5            6.701.113.138,37                 262.710.511,75
6            6.840.929.889,83                 139.816.751,46
7            6.915.341.544,92                   74.411.655,09
8            6.954.944.055,74                   39.602.510,82
9            6.976.020.846,22                   21.076.790,48
10            6.987.238.091,99                   11.217.245,77
11            6.993.208.004,86                     5.969.912,86

@toast
maybe you can tell us your toughts about it? i never read before that you plan this kind of inflation. After 1 year the delegates are the biggest stakeholders and the inflation in the first 2 years are huge. thanks for starting the next DAC.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: yidaidaxia on August 02, 2014, 09:07:50 am
Anyone here thing the 7bn delegate subsidy is too high ? Lots of people in Chinese community complain about it.

I feel it's ok, we need resource to secure the network, and we don't know what's the best proportion. But 5bn(or a little bit lower) for delegates, others for public distribution(including PTSer/AGSer) should be a better balance between net security and public communication now... Anyway, let the market itself to verify how good this proposal is  :P +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: 天籁 on August 02, 2014, 09:19:23 am
Anyone here thing the 7bn delegate subsidy is too high ? Lots of people in Chinese community complain about it.

I feel it's ok, we need resource to secure the network, and we don't know what's the best proportion. But 5bn(or a little bit lower) for delegates, others for public distribution(including PTSer/AGSer) should be a better balance between net security and public communication now... Anyway, let the market itself to verify how good this proposal is  :P +5%
+5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mdw on August 02, 2014, 09:54:23 am
Nice job @toast the time is drawing near :)

The name punishing auctions sounds intimidating indeed. That possible feature of offers sounds like it's a much needed escape for those scared of the market, well, punishing them.

Would that offers feature mean that a domain registrant can ask for offers? Or put a price they would like to get out there and hope for offers?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 02, 2014, 10:24:22 am
If I may suggest, to ensure long term involvement and participation from established businesses. Make sure people with .com domains can somehow claim them. This will eliminate squatting names like Facebook, Microsoft, etc. perhaps if they can digitally sign using the DNS records you can award to their public key. Think long term 5 years from now.


This. No one wants to play that game again. How are squatters going to be handled?


UPDATE: It's explained here - http://dotp2p.io/faq/index.php#faq-squatting
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: GaltReport on August 02, 2014, 11:26:47 am
If I may suggest, to ensure long term involvement and participation from established businesses. Make sure people with .com domains can somehow claim them. This will eliminate squatting names like Facebook, Microsoft, etc. perhaps if they can digitally sign using the DNS records you can award to their public key. Think long term 5 years from now.
+5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: cass on August 02, 2014, 11:49:18 am
great  +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Ben Mason on August 02, 2014, 11:53:39 am
 +5% +5%  ;D
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: CLains on August 02, 2014, 12:32:27 pm
The Red Power Toast (http://i.imgur.com/Eo0Kffs.jpg) gets to Test D/POwerS of DPOS!!

Nothing but a bold goddamn move, excited and terrified and elated on your behalf :D

How are squatters going to be handled?

The whole concept of .p2p was conceived to avoid squatting with a clever auction-style selling of names (http://dotp2p.io/faq/index.php#faq-squatting).
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: 天籁 on August 02, 2014, 12:42:50 pm
以DNS为例,一个代表第一年平均可以挖到3150万。凑够当选票数的几个人合伙挖一年(100%自留),第二年再挖1400万,后面不干了。谁来买单?奈何?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Chuckone on August 02, 2014, 12:44:20 pm
 +5% +5%

Woot Woot! Can't wait to see the final results and the action on the PTS price! Not that I'm going to sell, I sure want my DNS shares!

Good job Toast!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: bitmeat on August 02, 2014, 12:54:03 pm
@CLains I'm familiar with the auction style technique. However, a big company would not participate in an extortion model. They are unlikely to care early on, and 5 years from now they'll prefer something easier to move over. Like keybase.io
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 02, 2014, 01:04:04 pm
The Red Power Toast (http://i.imgur.com/Eo0Kffs.jpg) gets to Test D/POwerS of DPOS!!

Nothing but a bold goddamn move, excited and terrified and elated on your behalf :D

How are squatters going to be handled?

The whole concept of .p2p was conceived to avoid squatting with a clever auction-style selling of names (http://dotp2p.io/faq/index.php#faq-squatting).


Thank!  That URL should be in the OP.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: CLains on August 02, 2014, 01:48:34 pm
homepage http://dotp2p.io/
introvideo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeweF05tT50
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: xeroc on August 02, 2014, 01:54:02 pm
+5% .. nice release .. are we supposed to add content to the wiki.bitshares.org site too?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: biophil on August 02, 2014, 02:55:10 pm
I have a feeling that I've missed a bit of discussion on this, but could someone explain what kind of gap we can expect between the theoretical maximum delegate dilution and a true delegate dilution? Does the gap come from delegate pay rate?


7bn delegate subsidy, about 45% of the pool paid out per year. Remember, this is a theoretical maximum! Realistically you will not have 7bn new tokens printed for the delegates!

Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: donkeypong on August 02, 2014, 03:00:54 pm
Cool!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 02, 2014, 03:12:33 pm
After reading through the .p2p site I can honestly say this has me super excited. I've long lamented the centralized nature of dns registration.
Perhaps because I'm more technical than business minded and just "get" this product I'm more excited about this release than BitsharesX.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: nethyb on August 02, 2014, 03:46:58 pm
V.Cool  +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: arhag on August 02, 2014, 04:43:32 pm
If I may suggest, to ensure long term involvement and participation from established businesses. Make sure people with .com domains can somehow claim them. This will eliminate squatting names like Facebook, Microsoft, etc. perhaps if they can digitally sign using the DNS records you can award to their public key. Think long term 5 years from now.

I agree. I don't want this DAC to just be limited to cryptogeeks. To reduce barriers to worldwide adoption, I think we should give the biggest websites on the internet as little reason as possible to refuse to try .p2p out.

How about we go down this list (http://www.alexa.com/topsites), remove the TLD, filter out the redundant sites, and filter out any sites that do not have an HTTPS version of their site available. Then reserve those names on the genesis block along with the SHA256 fingerprint of their current SSL public key. The companies could later claim that name by using their SSL key to sign a statement that proves to the DAC they are the holders of the private key. We could even have them pay some fixed reasonable amount to claim the name or give them the option of putting the name up for auction if they for some reason think they can get a lower price on the open market.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: donkeypong on August 02, 2014, 04:48:27 pm
If I may suggest, to ensure long term involvement and participation from established businesses. Make sure people with .com domains can somehow claim them. This will eliminate squatting names like Facebook, Microsoft, etc. perhaps if they can digitally sign using the DNS records you can award to their public key. Think long term 5 years from now.

I agree. I don't want this DAC to just be limited to cryptogeeks. To reduce barriers to worldwide adoption, I think we should give the biggest websites on the internet as little reason as possible to refuse to try .p2p out.

How about we go down this list (http://www.alexa.com/topsites), remove the TLD, filter out the redundant sites, and filter out any sites that do not have an HTTPS version of their site available. Then reserve those names on the genesis block along with the SHA256 fingerprint of their current SSL public key. The companies could later claim that name by using their SSL key to sign a statement that proves to the DAC they are the holders of the private key. We could even have them pay some fixed reasonable amount to claim the name or give them the option of putting the name up for auction if they for some reason think they can get a lower price on the open market.

Are you talking about brand names or about any website a company owns? The latter could take forever. Brand names will take care of themselves, because anyone who buys up a trademarked name is a fool...they will get it from you eventually.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: arhag on August 02, 2014, 05:00:16 pm
Are you talking about brand names or about any website a company owns? The latter could take forever. Brand names will take care of themselves, because anyone who buys up a trademarked name is a fool...they will get it from you eventually.

I am talking about a particular domain name like google.p2p or microsoft.p2p. I am not sure what you mean by could take forever?

I do think it is likely to be foolish for someone to squat a brand name, but I am afraid people will do it and it will hurt the DAC. Imagine an early auction on google.p2p. On one hand, people will be bidding up a lot because they think they can sell it for millions to Google later. On the other hand, the very fact that Google would need to pay a significant sum of money for their own established name on some obscure service means they would probably pass on it, hurting the entire DAC. This risk is priced in, and so google.p2p will probably be sold early on to someone (someone probably anonymous) for a cost that isn't too high. How is Google going to use lawsuits to take their trademarked name from an anonymous person on a decentralized system. They aren't, they would just ignore it instead, hurting the whole DAC by not having a powerful ally using the service. Instead, if we make it incredibly cheap and easy for the biggest, most popular websites to come on board with their recognized name, we significantly help our cause. Think of it as marketing.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: donkeypong on August 02, 2014, 06:10:47 pm
Trust me, Google and Microsoft will get theirs.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: bitmeat on August 02, 2014, 07:41:32 pm
I was suggesting that name like microsoft.com.p2p is reserved. In fact what I'm proposing is that we reserve .com period. I love the idea of using the SSL certificate, those are serious responsible site owners. Not Microsoft.p2p but Microsoft.com.p2p. In other words one day we could have Bitshares DNS be the place to renew your .com (and all other top TLDs)
Title: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: bitmeat on August 02, 2014, 07:42:40 pm
So in short reserve all TLDs and make available later for actual domain name sub accounts transfer/renew once p2p becomes the standard.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 02, 2014, 07:48:03 pm
Yep, there will be a bunch of "reserved words" which include all existing TLDs, for when we figure out the proper way to migrate domains.


Lots of great points in this thread, I will be sure to address all of them in the coming days.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: CLains on August 02, 2014, 07:52:26 pm
Yep, there will be a bunch of "reserved words" which include all existing TLDs, for when we figure out the proper way to migrate domains.


Lots of great points in this thread, I will be sure to address all of them in the coming days.

<3  +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: jae208 on August 02, 2014, 11:04:42 pm
 +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Fox on August 03, 2014, 12:11:03 am
I feel Keyhotee Founders should receive their .p2p in the genesis block.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: profitofthegods on August 03, 2014, 01:36:56 pm
Any more info on the 'paid positions for content creators' bit - I'm a writer and I'm curious as to whether I would be able to be part of that.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Shentist on August 04, 2014, 06:32:47 pm
Bitshares DNS

.p2p.io is the project name. in the future could include more DNS
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 04, 2014, 06:47:28 pm
I am not sure about name. Might start another thread to discuss.

The DAC is called the Decentralized Namespace Service, which collides with "DNS" by design. The "products/services" are, initially, .p2p and KeyID. I would like to avoid "BitShares" in the name.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Shentist on August 04, 2014, 06:54:05 pm
I would like to avoid "BitShares" in the name.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

why? would be good to have it. if bitshares will be big in the future, it will be a big advantage to have bitshares in the official name.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 04, 2014, 06:58:08 pm
Secure Open DNS

SO DNS.  Much domain.  8)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 04, 2014, 07:07:50 pm
I would like to avoid "BitShares" in the name.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

why? would be good to have it. if bitshares will be big in the future, it will be a big advantage to have bitshares in the official name.

IMO the bitshares brand is currently toxic and I think DNS will help it more than bitshares will help DNS.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 04, 2014, 07:08:30 pm
DNS Xplode
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Shentist on August 04, 2014, 07:17:34 pm
I would like to avoid "BitShares" in the name.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

why? would be good to have it. if bitshares will be big in the future, it will be a big advantage to have bitshares in the official name.


IMO the bitshares brand is currently toxic and I think DNS will help it more than bitshares will help DNS.

toxic? could you say something more?

my feeling is, nobody nows about this project or is waiting for the market function to be implimented in bitsharesX. would be like to say i don't want to take the surname of my parents it has a bad reputation at my neighborhood
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: tonyk on August 04, 2014, 07:21:54 pm

toxic? could you say something more?


Come on. Let him have an opinion. After all, this is HIS project.

If giving up his whole stake (mistake imo) for some complicated distribution scheme was not enough. Now he cannot even name it as he feels is better.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Empirical1 on August 04, 2014, 07:29:15 pm
I would like to avoid "BitShares" in the name.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

why? would be good to have it. if bitshares will be big in the future, it will be a big advantage to have bitshares in the official name.


IMO the bitshares brand is currently toxic and I think DNS will help it more than bitshares will help DNS.

toxic? could you say something more?

my feeling is, nobody nows about this project or is waiting for the market function to be implimented in bitsharesX. would be like to say i don't want to take the surname of my parents it has a bad reputation at my neighborhood

I would say it's the BitShares marketing more than the BitShares brand. (The allocation is potentially an issue in this DAC too.)

Marketing is publicity, press, announcements, interviews, videos, forum presences, competitions and promotions.

The NameSpace snapshot marketing has so far consisted of starting a thread in the general discussion area of the BitShares forum as far as I can tell...

BTSX has shown that even if you have a phenomenal product if it is released with hardly any of the marketing tools described above, the customer doesn't know about it and as a result there is no demand.

Edit: BitShares has come a long way in terms of it's marketing material (Content, websites etc.) and St. Martin looks promising but in terms of external marketing, BitShares is minimal. (I pointed out in the marketing sub-section an article which describes BitSharesX as a bucketshop is second only to the website itself in a google search.)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 04, 2014, 07:32:48 pm
On the music DAC the name BitTunes I felt had a nice ring to it.  BitDNS also does.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: tonyk on August 04, 2014, 07:34:18 pm
@Empirical1

 Let's market the hell out of a product that does not work yet.
 So everybody can try a TV with no screen, end never want to hear about it again.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: tonyk on August 04, 2014, 07:40:42 pm
In addition to my arguments that toast have full right to name it whatever he likes, I also think that because of the significant ‘air drop’ nor he neither Bitshares/I3 want this to be perceived as Bitshares are ‘air dropping’ on our coins.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Empirical1 on August 04, 2014, 07:46:17 pm
@Empirical1

 Let's market the hell out of a product that does not work yet.
 So everybody can try a TV with no screen, end never want to hear about it again.

 +5% Yes I hope this is the case.  Personally I think BTSX is brilliant. I dont think it can go much lower. So I'm buying more nearly everyday and I'm hoping there are good things in the pipeline. I thought the LTB interview was brilliant but as I haven't seen much else tangible yet, I won't be convinced BitShares can market something till I see it.

Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 04, 2014, 07:50:24 pm
I also think that because of the significant ‘air drop’ nor he neither Bitshares/I3 want this to be perceived as Bitshares are ‘air dropping’ on our coins.


Excellent point.  I hadn't considered this.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: CLains on August 04, 2014, 07:57:57 pm
why is it toxic? when coinmarket cap slowly gets taken over by "BitShares" the whole world will pay attention.. maybe some legal issues? :(
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 04, 2014, 08:02:14 pm
Maybe "toxic" was too negative of a word, I suppose I mean that people have a very specific perception of what "BitShares" means which is not accurate and generally negative.

IDK, maybe "BitShares DNS" really is the way to go. But if BTSX gets in trouble, I want it to be clear that DNS has nothing to do with "shares" or "trading" or anything.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Empirical1 on August 04, 2014, 08:02:43 pm
why is it toxic? when coinmarket cap slowly gets taken over by "BitShares" the whole world will pay attention.. maybe some legal issues? :(

If the Namespaces snapshot is popular you could even see both BitShares-PTS and BitSharesX in the top 10 soon, which would be pretty cool  8)  (BitShares-x.info is already moving nicely up the rankings thanks to the coinmarketcap listing)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Empirical1 on August 04, 2014, 08:13:11 pm
Maybe "toxic" was too negative of a word, I suppose I mean that people have a very specific perception of what "BitShares" means which is not accurate and generally negative.

IDK, maybe "BitShares DNS" really is the way to go. But if BTSX gets in trouble, I want it to be clear that DNS has nothing to do with "shares" or "trading" or anything.

I agree the individual DAC's shouldn't be named 'BitShares-Something', they should have their own cool names.

I also don't think you can get much consensus putting those kind of things to forums, so would be better if you named it. 
Or maybe came up with your 2/3 favourite names and let people have a say on that.

(Same with the allocation model, running 2/3 models by shareholders would have made it a non issue, when I fear now it may detract from the actual DAC. It's certainly influenced my trading decisions even though I'm a big fan of the DAC.)

Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: CLains on August 04, 2014, 08:13:37 pm
I think people overestimate the effect of chatter and rumors .

This is a free market and the brightest people with the coldest most honest minds are capitalizing on distorted perceptions and growing richer every day.

THEY rule this world, no one else. And THEY set the market cap of all the top coins. The fact that both BitShares X and PTS is in the top 10 proves that chatter is not putting its money where its mouth is.

This is a lesson I learned by watching NXT. Despite the vicious attack, near assault that chatter forced upon NXT, a market cap rising alarmingly fast was the result and underlying truth of the situation.

Someone, likely the brightest most honest and richest people among all of us, had already analyzed the situation thoroughly and invested accordingly, the rest of the chatterbox are still poor and unhappy.

The more we all learn to think like the best and brightest traders the better we will do marketcap wise. They don't have unlimited foresight and will capitalize equally short term on weak products as well as long term on strong ones, but I have no doubt that they see right through the surface chatter that permeates this space.

What they won't be able to predict, however, is what they don't know about. For instance the upcoming snapshots are likely still outside their range of analysis. As soon as we get the information out there, we can rely on the market to do a fair assessment, regardless of what everyone on the forums are spouting.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: GaltReport on August 04, 2014, 08:19:58 pm
@Empirical1

 Let's market the hell out of a product that does not work yet.
 So everybody can try a TV with no screen, end never want to hear about it again.

 +5% Yes I hope this is the case.  Personally I think BTSX is brilliant. I dont think it can go much lower. So I'm buying more nearly everyday and I'm hoping there are good things in the pipeline. I thought the LTB interview was brilliant but as I haven't seen much else tangible yet, I won't be convinced BitShares can market something till I see it.

 +5%

I pretty much agree with most of this...however I can understand the reluctance to put a lot of effort/money into marketing something that is still missing key features.  I think they just  couldn't wait any longer to produce something to show positive progress and that the product is worthy of continued support but not a full-on marketing blitz.  Hopefully it gives some of us  more time to get in. 
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Shentist on August 04, 2014, 08:51:59 pm

toxic? could you say something more?


Come on. Let him have an opinion. After all, this is HIS project.

If giving up his whole stake (mistake imo) for some complicated distribution scheme was not enough. Now he cannot even name it as he feels is better.

i don't care about the name. but i don't understand to throw something away, what will be in the future a really big asset for the bitshares chain family aca ecosystem. if i wouldn't believe this "fact" why would i care? toast self called it all the time DNS here at this snapshot the last time. i don't get it how you can start a snapshot and no name is ready or decided on. we should fix this asap. our big disadvantage against everyone else is all the time the difficult structure about who will honor and succed who and this "name" issue will not help at all.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Empirical1 on August 04, 2014, 10:02:14 pm
I also think that because of the significant ‘air drop’ nor he neither Bitshares/I3 want this to be perceived as Bitshares are ‘air dropping’ on our coins.


Excellent point.  I hadn't considered this.

Yeah but we should want to be perceived that way imo,  unless we don't believe in PTS.

What makes BitShares-PTS great is that nothing else does that job. BitShares-PTS serves no other purpose than being a vessel for snapshots. Anybody holding PTS on 21st Aug will specifically want the Namespaces DAC and they would have paid a premium for the priveledge.

People holding other alts are holding them because they like them for other reasons, most won't be particularly interested in the DAC nor have paid a premium to own it. (If they did want Namespaces, they would have bought PTS before the snapshot - if it's properly advertised.) Anyone sharedropped equity on other alts will likely be a seller. That's why if you want to get a distributed, strong base of supportive shareholders you do a snapshot to PTS.

That premise has already taken a hit with the BitSharesX, post-launch sell off, but that was the result of a big (worthwhile) delay from snapshot and no marketing on launch. (Again for good reason they're waiting) but still, it makes BitShares-PTS look to the market, like it didn't do it's job. (The shareholders weren't supportive.)

In this DAC by dropping such a large amount on other coins we're going to be creating a lot of potential selling pressure on launch, given that our launch marketing isn't proven yet, I'm personally predicting another potential post-snapshot drop.

The fact that we share-dropped significantly elsewhere in the first place, makes PTS look slightly negative imo and the fact that the sharedrop could create a sell off, will after the BTSX launch cement the idea incorrectly in the markets mind that BitShares doesn't give a strong supportive shareholder base.

It's unfortunate that I will be pre-snapshot seller, and AGS on launch seller, even though I'll most likely be a long term buyer of the DNS DAC.

(I think large sharedrops to people who aren't specifically wanting to be shareholders is probably a mistake. Again this is just my personal opinion & I hope to be proven wrong and I hope people know that I am a long term supporter of BitShares and am generally very positive about it. )
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: cass on August 13, 2014, 08:51:50 pm
http://bitshares.org/industries/domains/

Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: CLains on August 13, 2014, 11:27:08 pm
http://bitshares.org/industries/domains/

Excellent  +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: dankeykang on August 20, 2014, 07:13:31 pm
I am definitely interested in purchasing a domain name using DNS. I currently own some PTS and some BTSX, I will be importing my PTS wallet.dat into the DNS wallet in order to receive my credited DNS. I am also hoping that I can use some BTSX to purchase more DNS. I have a few questions though.

1. When I import my PTS wallet.dat into the DNS wallet, will I lose the PTS? I believe I will keep the PTS, but I am not sure.

2. Will I be able to use my BTSX to purchase more DNS?

3. How will I use the DNS to purchase the domain? I understand there will be an auction, but my domain will not be wanted by anyone else. Will the DNS wallet have the auction software running or is this done in a browser?

3. Even though I anticipate that my domain will not requested by any others, can I expect to have competition from others that might be just wanting to bid me up?

Thanks for your help BTS friends!

                                          ^        ^
                                          = o   o=
                                                ^
     meow                                         
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 20, 2014, 07:22:01 pm
1. When I import my PTS wallet.dat into the DNS wallet, will I lose the PTS? I believe I will keep the PTS, but I am not sure.


The DNS blockchain is a "SnapShot" of the PTS blockchain. This means it's a copy at a specific time. The PTS blockchain will remain unchanged. When you "Import" your wallet.dat from your PTS wallet you're basically just importing the private keys. I don't know the answers to your other questions.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 20, 2014, 07:25:29 pm
http://bitshares.org/industries/domains/ (http://bitshares.org/industries/domains/)


Very nice!  +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: dankeykang on August 20, 2014, 07:44:24 pm
http://bitshares.org/industries/domains/ (http://bitshares.org/industries/domains/)


Very nice!  +5%
Awesome thanks for the link!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: jakub on August 21, 2014, 11:50:55 am
I have a very dumb question: where is the source code for this project?
I've looked here
https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares_toolkit
but could not find anything related to DNS
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: xeroc on August 21, 2014, 11:53:03 am
I have a very dumb question: where is the source code for this project?
I've looked here
https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares_toolkit
but could not find anything related to DNS
the sorce code as well as the blockchain are not yet released ... the dev (toast) might need some more days .. give him the time ..

ahyea .. and the blockchain cannot be released BEFORE the snapshot .. which will take place in about 10 hours
http://bitshares.org/industries/domains/
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: fluxer555 on August 21, 2014, 05:51:20 pm
Will snapshot occur the last block of August 21st? or the first block of August 22nd?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: testz on August 21, 2014, 06:05:25 pm
Will snapshot occur the last block of August 21st? or the first block of August 22nd?

No, only last block of 21 August time should be less or equal 23:59:59.999 GMT
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 08:58:22 pm
will somebody make a confirmation reply here  that the snapshot has taken place?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 08:59:24 pm
is it in1 min? can someone confirm?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 09:01:54 pm
normaly we are ok right now!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 09:03:13 pm
no one is selling and no one is buying...lol...
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 09:04:00 pm
There are like 3 more hours...
why?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 09:06:15 pm
yes why?

http://dotp2p.io/

I see zero on this link!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: xeroc on August 21, 2014, 09:11:36 pm
I see 50 minutes ...

$ date -u                                               # for UTC
Do 21. Aug 21:11:21 UTC 2014


edit:// it seems forum time is UTC
upper left corner .. below your username
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 09:15:50 pm
so we still have 3 hours to go?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 21, 2014, 09:17:30 pm
SnapShot is at midnight GMT. About 6 hours and 45 minutes from now. More accurately the last block produced on August 21st GMT is the last block in the snapshot.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 09:22:16 pm
why have you made the fucking countdown counter !!!!!!!!!!  It should work independly with our local times   !!!!!!!!!!!!
it is zero for us in Greece zero for you xeroc in 40 minutes etc...
All are confused right now CONGRATS  >:(
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: tonyk on August 21, 2014, 09:22:35 pm
I though it was Greenwich time. NO?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 09:22:45 pm
EDT OR UTC?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 21, 2014, 09:24:58 pm
I though it was Greenwich time. NO?


You are correct, I remembered wrong. And the bugged count down timer collaborated with my bad memory.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: xeroc on August 21, 2014, 09:25:18 pm
puh .. that clearly was not well communicated .. (I stick with UTC - forum time) ... don't nail me on that one pls .. I won't take any snapshot :)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Akado on August 21, 2014, 09:26:24 pm
will somebody make a confirmation reply here  that the snapshot has taken place?

Would be helpful. ~1h30m to go
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 21, 2014, 09:28:41 pm
It is UTC.

The website is wrong, I am chewing out the web team right now. I made it very clear to them before.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: biophil on August 21, 2014, 09:29:40 pm
It is UTC.

The website is wrong, I am chewing out the web team right now. I made it very clear to them before.

So confirm: 2h 30m to go?

Protip: type "what time is it in UTC" into google and it'll tell you.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 21, 2014, 09:30:01 pm
It is UTC.

The website is wrong, I am chewing out the web team right now. I made it very clear to them before.

So confirm: 2h 30m to go?

Yes
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: tonyk on August 21, 2014, 09:33:52 pm


http://www.worldtimeserver.com/current_time_in_UTC.aspx
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 09:34:06 pm
Nice....I just sold half of the PTS of my brother in law...He will be very happy...
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 21, 2014, 09:34:54 pm
The timer is spot on for our friends in West Africa.


(http://i.imgur.com/LOKytpo.png)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: tonyk on August 21, 2014, 09:36:17 pm
Nice....I just sold half of the PTS of my brother in law...He will be very happy...

You have time to buy them back! You do not have to move them out of bter.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 09:36:30 pm
so that means that many last minutes investors from some countrys will think it is to late right now....   :(
or "in time" investors move their funds and will informed the next days that they don't participated in reality on the snapshot...


PS it is not to late to fix the counters on both sites !!!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: bitmeat on August 21, 2014, 09:40:03 pm
the countdown seems wrong on the dotp2p.io
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 09:40:25 pm
and I was so happy when I thought that I will go to sleep now... ooooo well....
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 21, 2014, 09:40:36 pm
For those of us that are buy/hold PTS this is a non issue. I'm not seeing a huge movement on Bter so perhaps that's the majority.


It will make a good story one day.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 21, 2014, 09:40:52 pm
Fortunately cass is online now so he is changing it to just give the exact time right now.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 21, 2014, 09:41:30 pm
Apologies to everyone. "If you want it done right, do it yourself"  =[
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 09:43:51 pm
mistakes are for humans...
"unfortunately" we are not the BTSX avatar robots  :P
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 21, 2014, 09:47:13 pm
Looks good now. Cass to the rescue!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Akado on August 21, 2014, 09:49:48 pm
It is UTC.

The website is wrong, I am chewing out the web team right now. I made it very clear to them before.

then like liondani suggested, it would be better if someone annouced the snapshot has been taken right after the right time
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 09:53:06 pm
It is UTC.

The website is wrong, I am chewing out the web team right now. I made it very clear to them before.

then like liondani suggested, it would be better if someone announced the snapshot has been taken right after the right time

here and on the 2 webpages (.io .org)
something like  :

"Snapshot is successfully taken !!!"
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: mf-tzo on August 21, 2014, 10:02:03 pm
Quote
For those of us that are buy/hold PTS this is a non issue. I'm not seeing a huge movement on Bter so perhaps that's the majority.


It will make a good story one day.

well this is why I have moved to AGS so I don't have to bother about these things anymore...but now i have to manage the PTS on behalf of others who don't know what to do with them...
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: jbutta2k13 on August 21, 2014, 10:06:54 pm

Quote
For those of us that are buy/hold PTS this is a non issue. I'm not seeing a huge movement on Bter so perhaps that's the majority.


It will make a good story one day.

well this is why I have moved to AGS so I don't have to bother about these things anymore...but now i have to manage the PTS on behalf of others who don't know what to do with them...

Any thoughts about having a second round of ags donations?  I am looking to get out of my pts.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 10:36:08 pm
1 hour and 23 minutes to go !!!
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: room0.00000101 on August 21, 2014, 11:16:34 pm
Hi has the snapshot taken place? please confirm
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 21, 2014, 11:21:40 pm
Hi has the snapshot taken place? please confirm

No, 40 minutes to go
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 11:41:03 pm
18 minutes to go...
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 21, 2014, 11:57:30 pm
3 minutes
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: cass on August 22, 2014, 12:00:20 am
done :)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: liondani on August 22, 2014, 12:00:48 am
 +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: biophil on August 22, 2014, 12:08:21 am
Can someone confirm PTS block number 72,654 as the snapshot block?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Akado on August 22, 2014, 12:25:40 am
so it's done right?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 22, 2014, 12:29:27 am
It is done. I can't check which block it is ATM but you can cross-check some existing block explorers maybe.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: biophil on August 22, 2014, 12:34:31 am
It is done. I can't check which block it is ATM but you can cross-check some existing block explorers maybe.

It should be the last block dated 8/21 UTC, right?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 22, 2014, 12:36:01 am
It is done. I can't check which block it is ATM but you can cross-check some existing block explorers maybe.

It should be the last block dated 8/21 UTC, right?

yes
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: tonyk on August 22, 2014, 12:43:51 am
Those this time seem correct?



{
"hash" : "0000001301ec4eeddf3dbb55c785a83ae948ca1fddff9ffa980c1e41a5c115d1",
"confirmations" : 54,
"size" : 888,
"height" : 72651,
"version" : 2,
"merkleroot" : "db7a770c9ce3f6c0e623f2cbcd30c030c19fdba93a168912c1fab27d6a1b37a2",
"tx" : [
"ccdcd92fa5c221a845063c0127ea44ab14ef0b0520e8c882d5d5afdb8ea044f0",
"eedd34e2af6a585cdede695283965ad0ae2b559bcf6b3fddfd98574a376f9415",
"274d47f1ee6b3759d23f4a052159a7bbf2df039fc6fda9782290f885705d01f0",
"2310996ebb3d5915ff78f0f7e1eab2cb1c1b2706cb4dc445ffd8402c9b790ec0"
],
"time" : 1408647310,
"nonce" : 1739310306,
"bits" : "1d154913",
"difficulty" : 0.04697974,
"previousblockhash" : "00000011cc72d188976b8c29f736920ea955c942e0d76331db66bef6fc0707b3",
"nextblockhash" : "00000008d4f9ec69638e805596768df98ce6854fd3a10464d262347da3dbd79e"
}

[edit]
Next block is


{
"height" : 72652,
""time" : 1408647600,
"previousblockhash" : "0000001301ec4eeddf3dbb55c785a83ae948ca1fddff9ffa980c1e41a5c115d1",
"nextblockhash" : "0000000bfdf6829f1da9db1f0af2d4006142dd8d89bd7b51204660f594ab272d"
}

Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 22, 2014, 12:44:50 am
Someone else please confirm
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: weryx on August 22, 2014, 12:33:57 pm
No, block 72651 has time 1408647310 which is 21 Aug 2014 18:55:10 GMT  (use http://www.epochconverter.com/  to convert)

Coinplorer sees 72695 as the last PTS block on August 21 (8/21/2014 11:55:29 PM (UTC))



Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: DavefromPhilly on August 22, 2014, 02:27:24 pm
Forgive me for being naive, but I'm new to pts, as I thought it would be a great thing to be involved in. Hopefully I'm not the only dummy with this question.

I'm not worried about when the snapshot was taken or what exact block (unless I need it) because I'm "hodling" for sure.

BUT... now that it has been taken, how do I actually go about getting my shares in the 2 DACs?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 22, 2014, 02:49:46 pm
Once they are released you import your private keeps from the BitShares-PTS wallet.dat. Since the new DAC's are a snapshot your existing private keys will match up with your funds in the new blockchain. Your PTS balance does not change as that's in a different blockchain.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: DavefromPhilly on August 22, 2014, 02:59:37 pm
Once they are released you import your private keeps from the BitShares-PTS wallet.dat. Since the new DAC's are a snapshot your existing private keys will match up with your funds in the new blockchain. Your PTS balance does not change as that's in a different blockchain.

Ok, cool. So I definitely understood the first part correctly. I think I was just misunderstanding when they were actually being released. I was under the impression the snapshot and release were at the same time. So there's nothing for me to do right now? Just waiting for when they're released (both DNS and VOTE)? And then i'll put in my private key, which I'm assuming is my "wallet address"?

Sorry man. I know I probably sound retarded.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 22, 2014, 03:20:32 pm

Sorry man. I know I probably sound retarded.


It's a tricky paradigm to get your head around for sure. There is nothing for you to do right now. Your private keys are not your public addresses.

There are a couple ways to go about it. Here is the high level run down. I'll explain it in detail, hope it doesn't seem condescending :) .

1 ) Launch the new DAC. This will create the directory structure it uses to store your wallet, blockchain etc.
2 ) Encrypt the new wallet and let the client relaunch.
2 ) Copy and paste the Receive address to your notepad and shut down the client.
3 ) Make a copy (or a hundred) of the now Encrypted wallet.dat file.  Call it something like dns_wallet.dat.
4 ) Copy your BitShares-PTS wallet.dat file to the working directory of the new DAC
5 ) Launch the client and let it sync. You'll notice you have a cubic a**load of tokens.
6 ) Send the entire balance to the address you copied in step 2.
7 ) Shutdown the client, delete the wallet.dat (this would be the Bitshares-pts wallet you copied in)
8 ) Put the dns_wallet.dat back as wallet.dat
9)  Launch the client and enjoy all your coins!

Alternate method for advanced users:

1) In the console screen of your BitShares-PTS wallet export all your private keys (don't forget change addresses!)
2) Import those private keys via the console in the new DAC wallet.
3) Enjoy all your coins!



Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 22, 2014, 03:21:40 pm
He gets that, he's now asking when we will launch.

SoonTM

(setting up dev test net now)
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 22, 2014, 03:25:25 pm
He gets that, he's now asking when we will launch.


Eh, maybe someone else will find the steps useful.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: DavefromPhilly on August 22, 2014, 03:36:05 pm
It's a tricky paradigm to get your head around for sure. There is nothing for you to do right now. Your private keys are not your public addresses.

There are a couple ways to go about it. Here is the high level run down. I'll explain it in detail, hope it doesn't seem condescending :) .

It absolutely wasn't condesending. While there were steps in there I had already assumed, it was more than helpful! You never know who you're explaining something to, and they could be a complete moron so I always include the obvious details too.

I didn't know there was going to be a wallet for the new DAC's. That's why I wasn't sure what the process would be. And I'm glad you went into that much detail because I wouldn't have known to send the tokens to the new address. I would have just kept the copied wallet in there and called it a day.

And Toast, thanks for the update. Please don't think I'm being impatient or bitching. I just understood wrong and thought the snapshot and release were simultaneous actions. Thanks for all of the hard work and everything you've done. Also for giving me a little more credit than I deserved in my understanding haha.

So one last dumb question, I promise. Will VOTE and DNS wallet's come out at the same time, or are they scheduled separately?
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: toast on August 22, 2014, 03:39:17 pm
Separate. DNS core functionality is basically finished, VOTE has barely started. VOTE will launch without features just to get shares trading and get delegates paid.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: cryptkeeper on August 22, 2014, 03:43:56 pm
He gets that, he's now asking when we will launch.


Eh, maybe someone else will find the steps useful.

I know I did thanks river.  :D
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 22, 2014, 04:06:33 pm
He gets that, he's now asking when we will launch.


Eh, maybe someone else will find the steps useful.

I know I did thanks river.  :D


My pleasure. Keep in mind those steps are for the traditional QT wallets we know and love from the BTC forks. The BitShares tool kit is completely different but has its own built in methods for importing wallets. Toast might have something different in mind too.

The basic principles are the same though.




Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Chuckone on August 29, 2014, 03:34:40 pm

Sorry man. I know I probably sound retarded.


It's a tricky paradigm to get your head around for sure. There is nothing for you to do right now. Your private keys are not your public addresses.

There are a couple ways to go about it. Here is the high level run down. I'll explain it in detail, hope it doesn't seem condescending :) .

1 ) Launch the new DAC. This will create the directory structure it uses to store your wallet, blockchain etc.
2 ) Encrypt the new wallet and let the client relaunch.
2 ) Copy and paste the Receive address to your notepad and shut down the client.
3 ) Make a copy (or a hundred) of the now Encrypted wallet.dat file.  Call it something like dns_wallet.dat.
4 ) Copy your BitShares-PTS wallet.dat file to the working directory of the new DAC
5 ) Launch the client and let it sync. You'll notice you have a cubic a**load of tokens.
6 ) Send the entire balance to the address you copied in step 2.
7 ) Shutdown the client, delete the wallet.dat (this would be the Bitshares-pts wallet you copied in)
8 ) Put the dns_wallet.dat back as wallet.dat
9)  Launch the client and enjoy all your coins!

Alternate method for advanced users:

1) In the console screen of your BitShares-PTS wallet export all your private keys (don't forget change addresses!)
2) Import those private keys via the console in the new DAC wallet.
3) Enjoy all your coins!





Hi Riverhead,

First I'll start with a little explanation of what I did and then will come the question, it's not directly linked to DNS, but direclty related to the key importing part. I'm kind of a newbie, so it might really be an easy one for you.

I had an issue with LTS client and "lost" my wallet when I updated to the new client version (I mean I wasn't seeing my coins but I didn't erase the wallet so I thought it must still be somewhere) and here's what I did to recover my LTS shares:

- Made a couple of backups of the LTS wallet
- Took a copy of my PTS wallet and replaced the LTS wallet in the LTS folder
- Started the LTS client

Now I see in the "unconfirmed" part my number of PTS and in the "immature" part my LTS... From the description you gave, I understand I've done something wrong, since I haven't sent the coins to the LTS wallet.

Here comes the question: If I put back my LTS wallet in place of the PTS wallet in my LTS folder (every wallet will have several backups, just in case), take the receiving address from the client, put back the PTS wallet instead of the LTS, then send the coins to the LTS wallet, then again put back the LTS wallet in place, will it do exactly what you described?

Also, is there a simplier way to do it? I mean it's nothing complicated, but if there's a one or two steps procedure to do what I want instead of doing all that back and forth with my wallets, that would be great.

And if I'm completely off, please let me know!

Thanks in advance
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Riverhead on August 29, 2014, 06:16:00 pm
If you have no LTS in an LTS wallet (like you didn't buy on an exchange and send them to a new LTS wallet) then there's no reason to swap out the wallet.dat from PTS. The client did it's job of reading the private keys when you unlocked the wallet and now it's good to go.


The extra steps were for people who had been using their wallets and then wanted to claim their PTS share drop. Also there are times when coins aren't considered "claimed" until they are moved to a new address however you can do that within the same wallet.  Just send them all to yourself at a new address in the wallet and then backup the wallet.dat file.
Title: Re: [ SNAPSHOT: 8/21 ] DNS
Post by: Chuckone on August 29, 2014, 11:04:16 pm
Thanks! +5%