Greek referendum

[cylonmaker2053]

This keeps getting more interesting...

http://www.ekathimerini.com/199945/article/ekathimerini/news/varoufakis-claims-had-approval-to-plan-parallel-banking-system

they're not the only government in history to plot mass theft, nor will they be the last. again, humanity needs crypto!

[Brekyrself]

This keeps getting more interesting...

http://www.ekathimerini.com/199945/article/ekathimerini/news/varoufakis-claims-had-approval-to-plan-parallel-banking-system

[cylonmaker2053]

I have a friend who's node is shutting down because businesses will no longer accept credit cards issued from Greek banks. 

unreal! as i always say, humanity needs crypto!

[Buck Fankers]

I have a friend who's node is shutting down because businesses will no longer accept credit cards issued from Greek banks. 

[JoeyD]

A good interview with the former Greek finance minister Yanis Varoufakis:
http://www.newstatesman.com/world-affairs/2015/07/yanis-varoufakis-full-transcript-our-battle-save-greece

The interview was done before Tsipras made the infamous deal last Sunday but still it gives some interesting insight of what's going on behind the scenes.
And it looks like Varoufakis expected this to happen as he says:

It wouldn’t shock me [if Tsipras] stays on and accepts a very bad deal.

Yeah I read that already when I checked Varoufakis twitter feed to see what he had to say.
While I found some points in that interview interesting, it also gives the impression that Varoufakis is new to politics or people in general. I'm surprised that both Tsipras and Varoufakis seem to have been completely surprised by these political(human) schemes. I wonder what their backgrounds are, because I've dealt with so many of these kinds of backstabbing self-serving assholes that I can't even remember the last time I met somebody who had some form of moral standard or interest in helping someone or genuinely attempted to do the best job he could.

Where can I go that you can actually survive while being naive like that? I'm pretty exhausted dealing with bloodsuckers all the time, so I could use a little break.

[cylonmaker2053]

A good interview with the former Greek finance minister Yanis Varoufakis:
http://www.newstatesman.com/world-affairs/2015/07/yanis-varoufakis-full-transcript-our-battle-save-greece

The interview was done before Tsipras made the infamous deal last Sunday but still it gives some interesting insight of what's going on behind the scenes.
And it looks like Varoufakis expected this to happen as he says:

It wouldn’t shock me [if Tsipras] stays on and accepts a very bad deal.

Peter Schiff made some interesting comments about how Greece was going to default one way or another and that the politicians' dominant strategy was to go with the option they could blame on others. Refusing to accept a deal would mean no funds for the bloated government and lots of domestic defaults and forced austerity (pensions cut, govt workers fired, welfare cut, etc.); except this outcome comes with no scapegoats, just the inevitable consequences of a rational choice to default. The troika deal means austerity, as well, but one that domestic politicians can continue to pin on foreigners for the inevitable bad times to come.

[jakub]

A good interview with the former Greek finance minister Yanis Varoufakis:
http://www.newstatesman.com/world-affairs/2015/07/yanis-varoufakis-full-transcript-our-battle-save-greece

The interview was done before Tsipras made the infamous deal last Sunday but still it gives some interesting insight of what's going on behind the scenes.
And it looks like Varoufakis expected this to happen as he says:

It wouldn’t shock me [if Tsipras] stays on and accepts a very bad deal.

[cylonmaker2053]

I shared this story in my facebook feed today:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/13/euro-family-angela-merkel-greek-bailout

TLDR:

The machinations of financial institutions (the troika) have been exposed as much as the institutions themselves. Who runs these banks, and for whom? Twitter slogans talk of the three world wars: the first waged with guns, the second with tanks and this third world war waged by banks. Extreme? Well, there clearly is more than one way to take over a country.

the sooner we create a superior peaceful financial system in parallel, the better.

[BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode]

I shared this story in my facebook feed today:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/13/euro-family-angela-merkel-greek-bailout

TLDR:

The machinations of financial institutions (the troika) have been exposed as much as the institutions themselves. Who runs these banks, and for whom? Twitter slogans talk of the three world wars: the first waged with guns, the second with tanks and this third world war waged by banks. Extreme? Well, there clearly is more than one way to take over a country.

[cylonmaker2053]

i just want to say you guys are awesome and i'm happy more people are waking up to the farce that is government. Viva a free, peaceful ancap world built on crypto!

[JoeyD]

When I mentioned the word "democracy" Pernie jumped in and spoke about anarcho-capitalism..In the beggining I was what is he talking about..Now I understand..

I never felt so stupid living in "democracy"...My God democracy apparently is an illusion..I realise that now...

The Greek referendum will remain in history as the world's most unnecessary and  useless and pointless referendum..I never felt so ashamed beeing Greek in my life..

People voted clearly NO. and by voting NO it was obvious that they

1. Do not want new austerity measures
2. Do not really care if we left the EURO

And the fucking loser politicians, turned a NO vote to more and more and more austerity measures. Not only that but they are clearly negotiating of selling and giving the national property.. Let's give a couple of islands in order to stay in the Euro...OOOhhh my God...I really can't believe this is happening in my country...

I am so pissed off right now..I can't believe how someone is urging people to vote NO, says for the last 6 months that Greece will not stay in Euro at any cost, people clearly vote in favor of not giving up and then he turns a NO vote to the biggest "mnimonio" ever just because Markets didn't react very negatively to a Grexit and is he is afraid to take the road he was preaching for the last 6 months..Of course the markets would not react unless Grexit really does happen you f..ing moron...

He is planning to destroy the farmers, agriculture, tourism, shipowners, retirements, health and insurance, sell the national property, increase immensely the taxation..He really hasn't left anything not to destroy because he is afraid to issue IOUs and get out of the EU..

I will never ever keep another Euro in my bank account and I refuse to be part of this corrupted system..Go Crypto Go!!

Are you seriously saying that I've convinced you of anarcho-capitalism >> democracy??
When I wrote it I remember thinking 'this isn't going to change anyone's view but I'd like to be able to say I put my reasoning out there'

I'm afraid that bankrupting Greece and then raiding it's public resources was probably the plan all along. It's really terrible.
If people don't start to take notice or care what's happening to PEOPLE JUST LIKE THEM in other countries then I think a few small islands may seem trivial compared to the landgrab that could be coming.
"That debt we gave you looks pretty hefty... How about you give us all your land-rights and veto-power over any laws you make and we'll call it... not 'even' but yknow, we'll go and fuck someone else for a bit"

While I'm not a fan of Max Keiser, I do have to hand it to him when he described what's going on as "leveraged buyouts", which is sorta like naked short selling a country so you can buy and take it over for practically free. First a couple of small pilots and now they are scaling up. Greece will not be the last.

I'm really disappointed in the general populace, so much for internet preventing brainwashing on a grand scale, brainwashing seems to be easier then ever before.

[Permie]

When I mentioned the word "democracy" Pernie jumped in and spoke about anarcho-capitalism..In the beggining I was what is he talking about..Now I understand..

I never felt so stupid living in "democracy"...My God democracy apparently is an illusion..I realise that now...

The Greek referendum will remain in history as the world's most unnecessary and  useless and pointless referendum..I never felt so ashamed beeing Greek in my life..

People voted clearly NO. and by voting NO it was obvious that they

1. Do not want new austerity measures
2. Do not really care if we left the EURO

And the fucking loser politicians, turned a NO vote to more and more and more austerity measures. Not only that but they are clearly negotiating of selling and giving the national property.. Let's give a couple of islands in order to stay in the Euro...OOOhhh my God...I really can't believe this is happening in my country...

I am so pissed off right now..I can't believe how someone is urging people to vote NO, says for the last 6 months that Greece will not stay in Euro at any cost, people clearly vote in favor of not giving up and then he turns a NO vote to the biggest "mnimonio" ever just because Markets didn't react very negatively to a Grexit and is he is afraid to take the road he was preaching for the last 6 months..Of course the markets would not react unless Grexit really does happen you f..ing moron...

He is planning to destroy the farmers, agriculture, tourism, shipowners, retirements, health and insurance, sell the national property, increase immensely the taxation..He really hasn't left anything not to destroy because he is afraid to issue IOUs and get out of the EU..

I will never ever keep another Euro in my bank account and I refuse to be part of this corrupted system..Go Crypto Go!!

Are you seriously saying that I've convinced you of anarcho-capitalism >> democracy??
When I wrote it I remember thinking 'this isn't going to change anyone's view but I'd like to be able to say I put my reasoning out there'

I'm afraid that bankrupting Greece and then raiding it's public resources was probably the plan all along. It's really terrible.
If people don't start to take notice or care what's happening to PEOPLE JUST LIKE THEM in other countries then I think a few small islands may seem trivial compared to the landgrab that could be coming.
"That debt we gave you looks pretty hefty... How about you give us all your land-rights and veto-power over any laws you make and we'll call it... not 'even' but yknow, we'll go and fuck someone else for a bit"

[BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode]

Democracy is two wolves and one sheep voting on what to have for dinner.

[mf-tzo]

When I mentioned the word "democracy" Pernie jumped in and spoke about anarcho-capitalism..In the beggining I was what is he talking about..Now I understand..

I never felt so stupid living in "democracy"...My God democracy apparently is an illusion..I realise that now...

The Greek referendum will remain in history as the world's most unnecessary and  useless and pointless referendum..I never felt so ashamed beeing Greek in my life..

People voted clearly NO. and by voting NO it was obvious that they

1. Do not want new austerity measures
2. Do not really care if we left the EURO

And the fucking loser politicians, turned a NO vote to more and more and more austerity measures. Not only that but they are clearly negotiating of selling and giving the national property.. Let's give a couple of islands in order to stay in the Euro...OOOhhh my God...I really can't believe this is happening in my country...

I am so pissed off right now..I can't believe how someone is urging people to vote NO, says for the last 6 months that Greece will not stay in Euro at any cost, people clearly vote in favor of not giving up and then he turns a NO vote to the biggest "mnimonio" ever just because Markets didn't react very negatively to a Grexit and is he is afraid to take the road he was preaching for the last 6 months..Of course the markets would not react unless Grexit really does happen you f..ing moron...

He is planning to destroy the farmers, agriculture, tourism, shipowners, retirements, health and insurance, sell the national property, increase immensely the taxation..He really hasn't left anything not to destroy because he is afraid to issue IOUs and get out of the EU..

I will never ever keep another Euro in my bank account and I refuse to be part of this corrupted system..Go Crypto Go!!
 

[cylonmaker2053]

ZeroHedge keeps posting interesting stuff on the whole Greek euro mess.

While he does accurately describe the history of the creation of Europe and it's nice that somebody is speaking up inside the EU-madhouse, but I'm not sure Greece will get out of Europe unscathed as easily as that. I'm not aware of massive Greek export products, so they will take a hit either way.

i enjoy reading ZH as much as the next guy, but i do find them to be rather overzealous in posting predictions and viewing events in a very negative lens. There are a variety of scenarios that could unfold here: Greeks agree to some haircut and payment reschedule despite the referendum, the country defaults and possibly restructures on its debt, it abandons the euro, and/or it gets kicked out of the EU completely. there are probably other scenarios too, but in general i don't see why debt default has to mean currency abandonment (sovereign default ought to be independent of currency), nor do i see why Greece would have to leave the trade and open border treaties, even if they completely abandoned the euro?

The single currency thing is a flawed concept no matter who says it. It's an attempted coup and trying to force all these completely different and incompatible cultures in the exact same format is a ludicrous concept. Plus wasn't the whole central planning thing supposed to be a flawed concept?

I agree about zerohedge and I don't share all of their views, however not many media-agencies seem to be all that interested in showing both sides of the stories in my country. It's also to bad that it's not only zerohedge that's overzealous and too extreme apparently. I completely agree with your points and would have wished the discussion was about how to fix things or make a clean start. But alas that's not the way things seem to be going, both sides are to blame for that in my humble opinion.

And if they wanted to blame and haircut somebody they should have done that at the shoulderlevel with all the banks and gamblers who consciously and willingly created this mess. They damn well knew that their loans were toxic and they are trying to make a buck out of the institutions bailing them out of it. That sounds like high-treason to me and people like that deserve a whole lot more terrorist-treament than they are getting. But instead they have their hands way up the euro-politicians asses so they are now moving their mouths.

yup! the crime of the century has been governments guaranteeing private bets.