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Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: nomoreheroes7 on July 16, 2016, 03:41:35 pm

Title: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: nomoreheroes7 on July 16, 2016, 03:41:35 pm
So it looks like the STEEM hack might be worse than thought. The site has been read-only all morning and has been completely down for the last hour. Last I read regarding the hack was from @ash about 8 hours ago saying that the attacker is continuing to milk accounts.

Since Steemit is obviously down right now, I figured I'd bring the discussion over here. Anyone have a clue what the hell's going on?
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: yvv on July 16, 2016, 03:50:05 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: nomoreheroes7 on July 16, 2016, 03:54:06 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Yea I'm pretty shocked about that. I wouldn't have thought something like this was even possible.

Of course I never got around to changing my keys over the past couple days. Easy come easy go?  :-\

Also makes me wonder if our openledger wallets are exposed to the same risk...?

And wtf wasn't 2FA authentication set up by now? That would have probably saved a lot of headache.   ???
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: Akado on July 16, 2016, 03:58:04 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

I've used it because I like the concept but I've also wondered about this. why is that? because they're still not using IPFS?
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: Shentist on July 16, 2016, 05:00:19 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

I've used it because I like the concept but I've also wondered about this. why is that? because they're still not using IPFS?

would be good to get some information about our web wallets. Sop @svk how is the situation is bitshares save?
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on July 16, 2016, 05:04:15 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Yea I'm pretty shocked about that. I wouldn't have thought something like this was even possible.

Of course I never got around to changing my keys over the past couple days. Easy come easy go?  :-\

Also makes me wonder if our openledger wallets are exposed to the same risk...?

And wtf wasn't 2FA authentication set up by now? That would have probably saved a lot of headache.   ???

2FA is not so simple in blockchain.. it also creates a barrier to onboarding.. eg. you don't have 2FA in facebook.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on July 16, 2016, 05:06:58 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

I've used it because I like the concept but I've also wondered about this. why is that? because they're still not using IPFS?

IPFS wouldn't have prevented the attack as it was an XSS attack. IPFS is just a storage medium. It was a coding vulnerability in posting that allowed for this to happen.

This is unique to steem so OL is not exposed the same way.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: Shentist on July 16, 2016, 05:33:04 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Yea I'm pretty shocked about that. I wouldn't have thought something like this was even possible.

Of course I never got around to changing my keys over the past couple days. Easy come easy go?  :-\

Also makes me wonder if our openledger wallets are exposed to the same risk...?

And wtf wasn't 2FA authentication set up by now? That would have probably saved a lot of headache.   ???

2FA is not so simple in blockchain.. it also creates a barrier to onboarding.. eg. you don't have 2FA in facebook.

on facebook i do not hold money! 2FA could work if you setup every account as a multi account end the second one is just for 2FA confirmation on your smartphone.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: yvv on July 16, 2016, 05:35:27 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Yea I'm pretty shocked about that. I wouldn't have thought something like this was even possible.

Of course I never got around to changing my keys over the past couple days. Easy come easy go?  :-\

Also makes me wonder if our openledger wallets are exposed to the same risk...?

And wtf wasn't 2FA authentication set up by now? That would have probably saved a lot of headache.   ???

2FA is not so simple in blockchain.. it also creates a barrier to onboarding.. eg. you don't have 2FA in facebook.

on facebook i do not hold money! 2FA could work if you setup every account as a multi account end the second one is just for 2FA confirmation on your smartphone.
And who is going to do this confirmation?

Sent from my SM-P900 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: pc on July 16, 2016, 06:01:50 pm
would be good to get some information about our web wallets. Sop @svk how is the situation is bitshares save?

The openledger web wallet is less vulnerable, because BitShares doesn't have to display lots of user generated content.

The principal risk remains, however. If someone manages to sneak some JavaScript code into the site, then your keys will be compromised.

Hm, now that I think about it - the memo is user generated... @svk please confirm that the memo field is properly escaped.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: Shentist on July 16, 2016, 06:17:27 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Yea I'm pretty shocked about that. I wouldn't have thought something like this was even possible.

Of course I never got around to changing my keys over the past couple days. Easy come easy go?  :-\

Also makes me wonder if our openledger wallets are exposed to the same risk...?

And wtf wasn't 2FA authentication set up by now? That would have probably saved a lot of headache.   ???

2FA is not so simple in blockchain.. it also creates a barrier to onboarding.. eg. you don't have 2FA in facebook.

on facebook i do not hold money! 2FA could work if you setup every account as a multi account end the second one is just for 2FA confirmation on your smartphone.
And who is going to do this confirmation?

Sent from my SM-P900 using Tapatalk

what i mean is, if you create an account you are creating 2 accounts at the same time on 2 machines. Like your desktop computer and on the smartphone an account just for 2FA without any other information, just for confirmation an transaction. You are creating 50/50 accounts and you are the sole owner of both accounts.

a simpler way would be google 2FA but it was said it would be not possible because of the decentraliced network. This point i do not get, because on the webwallet the wallet is already hosted on a website so it should be not a problem.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: dritz3r on July 16, 2016, 07:25:21 pm
My account is not on the list of hacked accounts but it is and is blocked. I didn't received answer from the team, even not automatic reply.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: yvv on July 16, 2016, 08:01:46 pm
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Yea I'm pretty shocked about that. I wouldn't have thought something like this was even possible.

Of course I never got around to changing my keys over the past couple days. Easy come easy go?  :-\

Also makes me wonder if our openledger wallets are exposed to the same risk...?

And wtf wasn't 2FA authentication set up by now? That would have probably saved a lot of headache.   ???

2FA is not so simple in blockchain.. it also creates a barrier to onboarding.. eg. you don't have 2FA in facebook.

on facebook i do not hold money! 2FA could work if you setup every account as a multi account end the second one is just for 2FA confirmation on your smartphone.
And who is going to do this confirmation?

Sent from my SM-P900 using Tapatalk

what i mean is, if you create an account you are creating 2 accounts at the same time on 2 machines. Like your desktop computer and on the smartphone an account just for 2FA without any other information, just for confirmation an transaction. You are creating 50/50 accounts and you are the sole owner of both accounts.

a simpler way would be google 2FA but it was said it would be not possible because of the decentraliced network. This point i do not get, because on the webwallet the wallet is already hosted on a website so it should be not a problem.

OL does not host any wallets. Nothing stops you to set up multisig account right now.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: milkme on July 16, 2016, 09:42:40 pm
My account is not on the list of hacked accounts but it is and is blocked. I didn't received answer from the team, even not automatic reply.

Where did u found list of hacked accounts?
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: okidoki on July 16, 2016, 10:22:54 pm
You can find it on Github. The actual compromised users seem to be 150 not 260.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: nmywn on July 16, 2016, 11:53:49 pm
The openledger web wallet is less vulnerable, because BitShares doesn't have to display lots of user generated content.

The principal risk remains, however. If someone manages to sneak some JavaScript code into the site, then your keys will be compromised.

Hm, now that I think about it - the memo is user generated... @svk please confirm that the memo field is properly escaped.
Also trollbox and UIA's descriptions
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: milkme on July 17, 2016, 12:15:16 am
You can find it on Github. The actual compromised users seem to be 150 not 260.

Can you give me link
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on July 17, 2016, 06:15:55 am
Hardfork coming in tomorrow that introduces a new 'account recovery' feature:

https://github.com/steemit/steem/releases/tag/v0.11.0

Details written by bytemaster about it here: https://github.com/steemit/steem/issues/169
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: karnal on July 17, 2016, 08:23:39 am
Their centralized wallet got hacked after all this advertisement of advantages of decentralized blockchain. LMAO!

Yea I'm pretty shocked about that. I wouldn't have thought something like this was even possible.

Of course I never got around to changing my keys over the past couple days. Easy come easy go?  :-\

Also makes me wonder if our openledger wallets are exposed to the same risk...?

And wtf wasn't 2FA authentication set up by now? That would have probably saved a lot of headache.   ???

2FA is not so simple in blockchain.. it also creates a barrier to onboarding.. eg. you don't have 2FA in facebook.

on facebook i do not hold money! 2FA could work if you setup every account as a multi account end the second one is just for 2FA confirmation on your smartphone.
And who is going to do this confirmation?

Sent from my SM-P900 using Tapatalk

what i mean is, if you create an account you are creating 2 accounts at the same time on 2 machines. Like your desktop computer and on the smartphone an account just for 2FA without any other information, just for confirmation an transaction. You are creating 50/50 accounts and you are the sole owner of both accounts.

a simpler way would be google 2FA but it was said it would be not possible because of the decentraliced network. This point i do not get, because on the webwallet the wallet is already hosted on a website so it should be not a problem.

Without more information, this seems like security theatre - if both accounts will be accessed through a browser, both vulnerable to the same style of attack ..
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: karnal on July 17, 2016, 08:24:44 am
Also, does someone know the EXACT nature of the attack?

Preferably with code to study?

I was out a day, could not find anything anywhere .. very likely I missed it.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: mf-tzo on July 17, 2016, 09:21:22 am
You can find it on Github. The actual compromised users seem to be 150 not 260.

Can you please post the list of the compromised accounts here since not everyone can read github?
thanks
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: chryspano on July 17, 2016, 10:29:41 am
You can find it on Github. The actual compromised users seem to be 150 not 260.

Can you please post the list of the compromised accounts here since not everyone can read github?
thanks


I don't know if this list includes the recent ones
just scroll down a bit...
https://github.com/steemit/steem/commit/98e2ac39e70c4c3d95674b964fe2d3d5dcbaedf6#diff-ba3ead933873eada66a3e95c99516c7fR269

Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: karnal on July 17, 2016, 10:55:38 am
Here's my take on the hack, and possible solutions for the future:

https://steemit.com/steem/@karnal/hackmoar-hindering-attackers-coming-and-kidnapping-my-outrageously-armored-resources
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: abit on July 17, 2016, 12:18:10 pm
Also, does someone know the EXACT nature of the attack?

Preferably with code to study?

I was out a day, could not find anything anywhere .. very likely I missed it.
Please check posting history of account "goodgame" on Steem.

You can find it on Github. The actual compromised users seem to be 150 not 260.
Lately the team decided to not include some "small" accounts into the list.

My account is not on the list of hacked accounts but it is and is blocked. I didn't received answer from the team, even not automatic reply.
You can contact @fav
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: yvv on July 17, 2016, 12:46:05 pm
Here's my take on the hack, and possible solutions for the future:

https://steemit.com/steem/@karnal/hackmoar-hindering-attackers-coming-and-kidnapping-my-outrageously-armored-resources

So, is it possible that our bitshares private keys are shipped away by XSS program?
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on July 17, 2016, 01:08:06 pm
Here's my take on the hack, and possible solutions for the future:

https://steemit.com/steem/@karnal/hackmoar-hindering-attackers-coming-and-kidnapping-my-outrageously-armored-resources

So, is it possible that our bitshares private keys are shipped away by XSS program?

It's not likely because  OL hosted wallet is not designed for user input the same way Steemit is. Though I would imagine after seeing this @svk is checking to make sure the same thing can't happen.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: svk on July 18, 2016, 05:44:21 am
would be good to get some information about our web wallets. Sop @svk how is the situation is bitshares save?

The openledger web wallet is less vulnerable, because BitShares doesn't have to display lots of user generated content.

The principal risk remains, however. If someone manages to sneak some JavaScript code into the site, then your keys will be compromised.

Hm, now that I think about it - the memo is user generated... @svk please confirm that the memo field is properly escaped.

There's no escaping being done but it's just rendered as a simple string of text, not interpreted as html in any way. That's why I don't parse links either in memos or in the trollbox, so if you're gonna click a malicious link at least you have to copy paste it yourself..
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: pc on July 18, 2016, 06:14:54 am
Great, thanks!
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: BobDownlove on July 19, 2016, 03:02:37 am
So where do we go if our account was compromised and we've had our funds taken and been locked out? Loving the whole "enjoy the darkness" method of support this has...

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: pc on July 19, 2016, 06:29:59 am
https://steemit.com/steem/@bitcube/recovering-your-hacked-account-with-a-local-ms-windows-steem-wallet
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: BobDownlove on July 19, 2016, 02:14:27 pm
Yeah that only works if your recovery agent isn't steem, in which case,  mine is. Good link tho I got real excited when I first saw it...

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: Frodo on July 20, 2016, 08:47:54 am
Yeah that only works if your recovery agent isn't steem, in which case,  mine is. Good link tho I got real excited when I first saw it...

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

I'm in the same boat right now, but I'm optimistic that steem support will eventually get to us. They probably have A LOT of requests to handle currently.

EDIT: There is also a new update: https://steemit.com/steemit/@steemit3/third-update-to-july-14th-security-announcement-account-recovery-begins
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: BobDownlove on July 20, 2016, 11:19:55 am
Yes I tried this first thing this morning  and last step of recovery failed. I am in contact now and we're working on it. I surely don't envy these support guys, imagine their workload this week
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: Frodo on July 21, 2016, 08:40:02 am
Everything worked out for me. Huge thanks to the Steemit support team. Great way to handle a situation like this.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: Akado on July 24, 2016, 02:48:52 pm
Why is it that when I refresh a post that has the same votes, the value of the rewards keeps increasing? Assume there's a post that has $1000 in rewards and 100 upvotes. Then I refresh, it still has the same 100 upvotes but then the rewards are $1001, then I do the same and it's $1002. Is it normal?
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: nomoreheroes7 on July 24, 2016, 02:58:01 pm
Why is it that when I refresh a post that has the same votes, the value of the rewards keeps increasing? Assume there's a post that has $1000 in rewards and 100 upvotes. Then I refresh, it still has the same 100 upvotes but then the rewards are $1001, then I do the same and it's $1002. Is it normal?

Pretty sure this is just due to the fluctuations in the 7 day average value of STEEM. When price is down a bit, you'll see the rewards slowly decrease, also.
Title: Re: STEEM hack discussion
Post by: xeroc on July 26, 2016, 05:49:10 am
Pretty sure this is just due to the fluctuations in the 7 day average value of STEEM. When price is down a bit, you'll see the rewards slowly decrease, also.
Exactly .. If the market cap of Steem goes down, it simply can't effort to pay a high payout .. If market cap goes up .. it can ..
This mechanism helps to make an insolvency unlikely ... otherwise you would pay out SteemDollars that you couldn't back by actual value ..