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Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: bitsapphire on March 22, 2015, 10:41:41 pm

Title: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 22, 2015, 10:41:41 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/M1HrhEz.jpg)

Hi everybody!

This is the official Moonstone development and crowdfunder diary. We will get all updates as soon as possible to this thread, so please subscribe to this thread if you want to be up to date!

Moonstone (https://moonstone.io/) development is continuing in great steps.We will be presenting the frontend for the first time at the Texas Bitcoin Conference March 28th. You'll be able to see the initial screenshots in our upcoming bitshares.tv video interview (thanks Max!).

Moonstone.io is currently being translated to Mandarin Chinese. The video is already available with Mandarin subtitles.

We are proud to announce that we will be integrating metaexchange natively with the Moonstone wallet. This means that you will be able to exchange BitShares and related UIAs within the wallet with BTC. The Metaexchange team will also help us in the crowdfunder with their phenomenal exchange daemon. We believe that this might be the future of how these crowdfunders will happen. Because we require a pay to public key functionality form the Metaexchange daemon we decided to be push back the crowdfunder campaign until that is developed. The new crowdfunding starting date is now April 7th  9th.

Until the end of March we will disclose the full timeline for future feature releases such as Identity Verification for gateway services (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=15098.msg195467#msg195467), multi-blockchain support (including Bitcoin through the Bitcore wallet suite (http://blog.bitpay.com/2015/03/05/bitcore-wallet.html)), and multisig support.

EDDIT April 5th:

We have decided to hold the fundraiser exclusively in BTC, there won't be a BTS or bitAsset option. The reasons are that the liquidity between BTS and BTC is so low that selling 130k USD worth opf BTS into BTC to cash out into fiat would according to our calculations move the market simply too much.

However we would like everybody to take part in the poll in this thread and let us know whether you would like to get 1.15 USD or 1.15 BTS through a buyback. Our original plan was to do a bitUSD buyback but it seems there might be interest in doing the unit of account in terms of BTS rather than USD. After all, the community is long on BTS.

Depending on the outcome of the poll we might have to postpone the crowdfunding campaign another day.

Please vote in the poll in this thread and let us know what you think!

EDDIT April 6th:

Based on the outcome of the poll we have decided to denominate the buyback in terms of BTS. This means that for every BTC you send in the price will be converted into the equivalent in terms of BTS at the time of donation, and you will receive 1.15 Moonstone tokens for every BTS equivalent you donated.

To accomodate the changes and to do some more testing on our crowdfunder setup we are postponing the start of the crowdfunding campaign to April 9th.

Once the wallet is released as version 1.0 the buyback with the d delegates will commence. Our delegates will be operational and can be voted in by May.

Final Timeline:


If you have any questions please let us know!

EDIT April 10th:

It seems that there is such a strong interest to donate BTS rather than BTC our crowdfunder that some people are thinking about buying MOONFUND tokens on the internal exchange straight with BTS. (See this thread https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15663.0/topicseen.html)

We're opening therefore a poll to see whether enough people are interested in us putting a sell order of Moonstones at about 0.9-0.92 BTS on the internal exchange. This way almost everybody should be able to participate (though at a slightly lower potential return rate, as we still need to cash out to fiat for operations). We would then also need to update the funds collected on the website manually a few times a day.

Please let us know what you think, and please vote in the poll!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: rgcrypto on March 23, 2015, 12:38:40 am
you guys rock! :)
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: TurkeyLeg on March 23, 2015, 02:12:22 am
 +5% Outstanding! Keep up the great work and continue to keep us posted!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: ebit on March 23, 2015, 03:04:43 am
 +5%
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fuzzy on March 23, 2015, 04:33:14 am
you guys rock! :)

+5%
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Pheonike on March 23, 2015, 05:14:32 am

I know this is not critical, will there be options to change the color scheme like light/dark?
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on March 23, 2015, 07:23:36 am
Moonstone.io is currently being translated to Mandarin Chinese. The video is already available with Mandarin subtitles.
Need assistance with German translation?
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sudo on March 23, 2015, 09:21:42 am
when can  release the beta version?
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 23, 2015, 09:41:33 am
when can  release the beta version?
Version 0.9 or 1.0 will be tentatively released 30 days after the fundraiser starts. So about May 7th.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 23, 2015, 09:43:03 am

I know this is not critical, will there be options to change the color scheme like light/dark?
Interesting idea, we haven't thought about that. We can add color switching to the V2 backlog.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: luckybit on March 23, 2015, 10:04:00 am
Multisig support is very important to me.

Can you also do what Airbitz does for multi-factor authentication?

http://cointelegraph.com/news/113739/airbitz-invents-first-one-touch-2-factor-authentication-for-mobile-wallet
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sudo on March 23, 2015, 10:19:03 am
do you have plans to enhance the wall of bts id,such as make it Twitter &can subscribe

来自我的 M812C 上的 Tapatalk

Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: cass on March 23, 2015, 11:05:48 am

I know this is not critical, will there be options to change the color scheme like light/dark?
Interesting idea, we haven't thought about that. We can add color switching to the V2 backlog.

 +5% (asked for this several times for classic BTS wallet)
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sudo on March 23, 2015, 11:10:30 am
it is better that  user can define. shortcut of. regulary comand in menu &share the option file


Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BTSdac on March 23, 2015, 01:33:46 pm
Have you announced in bitcointalk.org,  there are more viewers
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: vegolino on March 23, 2015, 03:15:33 pm
Quote
We are proud to announce that we will be integrating metaexchange natively with the Moonstone wallet. This means that you will be able to exchange BitShares and related UIAs within the wallet with BTC.
Is this going to be "smart wallet" that Max/bitmarket has been talking about?
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 23, 2015, 03:24:13 pm
Multisig support is very important to me.

Can you also do what Airbitz does for multi-factor authentication?

http://cointelegraph.com/news/113739/airbitz-invents-first-one-touch-2-factor-authentication-for-mobile-wallet

Multisig support depends on the blockchain level implementation. Because we have built our own RPC wrapper and deserlializer we might need to wait for the core Bitshares team to build an example so we can do our own version. Or we go ahead and build it for V2 or 3.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 23, 2015, 03:28:54 pm
Quote
We are proud to announce that we will be integrating metaexchange natively with the Moonstone wallet. This means that you will be able to exchange BitShares and related UIAs within the wallet with BTC.
Is this going to be "smart wallet" that Max/bitmarket has been talking about?

If I am not mistaken the smartwallet proposal includes automatic trading on your behalf. Things like that won;t be possible until V2 with the extension SDK. Then it will be possible to have a wallet daemon running on your computer or a remote server executing trades for you aromatically. Till then this is a simple wallet which awaits your commands.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 23, 2015, 03:29:28 pm
Have you announced in bitcointalk.org,  there are more viewers

Great idea! Will do!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on March 23, 2015, 03:37:49 pm
Multisig support depends on the blockchain level implementation. Because we have built our own RPC wrapper and deserlializer we might need to wait for the core Bitshares team to build an example so we can do our own version. Or we go ahead and build it for V2 or 3.
Check this out:
https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares/blob/develop/docs/multisig.md
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 23, 2015, 04:11:18 pm
Multisig support depends on the blockchain level implementation. Because we have built our own RPC wrapper and deserlializer we might need to wait for the core Bitshares team to build an example so we can do our own version. Or we go ahead and build it for V2 or 3.
Check this out:
https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares/blob/develop/docs/multisig.md

Very cool. Thanks for the link!

Do you have any opinion on this setup for HD wallet and Schamir's secret setup? http://zeropass.io/schematics
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on March 23, 2015, 04:18:31 pm
Multisig support depends on the blockchain level implementation. Because we have built our own RPC wrapper and deserlializer we might need to wait for the core Bitshares team to build an example so we can do our own version. Or we go ahead and build it for V2 or 3.
Check this out:
https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares/blob/develop/docs/multisig.md

Very cool. Thanks for the link!

Do you have any opinion on this setup for HD wallet and Schamir's secret setup? http://zeropass.io/schematics
On first sight the idea sounds awesome ..

I am not yet sure how they distinguish shamir secret sharing from multisig .. they are different in that you need all wif keys in plain text to recover from shamir
while you can also transfer funds with multi-sig keeping both 'parts' secret ...

I will read into their proposal .. but it sounds very interesting .. Thanks for pointing it out to me!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 23, 2015, 04:32:27 pm
Multisig support depends on the blockchain level implementation. Because we have built our own RPC wrapper and deserlializer we might need to wait for the core Bitshares team to build an example so we can do our own version. Or we go ahead and build it for V2 or 3.
Check this out:
https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares/blob/develop/docs/multisig.md

Very cool. Thanks for the link!

Do you have any opinion on this setup for HD wallet and Schamir's secret setup? http://zeropass.io/schematics
On first sight the idea sounds awesome ..

I am not yet sure how they distinguish shamir secret sharing from multisig .. they are different in that you need all wif keys in plain text to recover from shamir
while you can also transfer funds with multi-sig keeping both 'parts' secret ...

I will read into their proposal .. but it sounds very interesting .. Thanks for pointing it out to me!

Looking forward to your thoughts xeroc!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chronos on March 23, 2015, 10:30:46 pm
This is looking great so far! Looking forward to the presentation on the 28th!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on March 24, 2015, 06:54:01 am
Multisig support depends on the blockchain level implementation. Because we have built our own RPC wrapper and deserlializer we might need to wait for the core Bitshares team to build an example so we can do our own version. Or we go ahead and build it for V2 or 3.
Check this out:
https://github.com/BitShares/bitshares/blob/develop/docs/multisig.md

Very cool. Thanks for the link!

Do you have any opinion on this setup for HD wallet and Schamir's secret setup? http://zeropass.io/schematics
On first sight the idea sounds awesome ..

I am not yet sure how they distinguish shamir secret sharing from multisig .. they are different in that you need all wif keys in plain text to recover from shamir
while you can also transfer funds with multi-sig keeping both 'parts' secret ...

I will read into their proposal .. but it sounds very interesting .. Thanks for pointing it out to me!

Looking forward to your thoughts xeroc!


From their webpage:
Quote
Password/key gets paste-ed into desired field, and erased immediately after. It does not stay stored locally in any way, thus ensuring minimum possible exposure of the original password/key.
I am not sure if they understand what they are writing, but it seems they don't care that once your derive your key via SSS you will have to take a new key .. if SSS is applied correctly, the private key should never be used again once derived from SSS's components .. hence, encrypted stuff has to be re-encrypted.

Also, I don't see how you can use a SSS to derive a subsequent ECC pair in the sense of HD. These are two distinct techniques SSS is kind of based on Reed-Solomon codes and ECC is based on .. yhea .. elliptic curves .. you can't mix them up.

But for the application of 'login-with-derived-password' I can't see an alternative, you will need to be able to decrypt the password with the private key ..

When it comes to transfering funds or biebercoins (lol) I would concentrate on multisig and let the user decide whether or not to distribute a backup key (2-of-3 multisig) to friends using SSS ..
Just my thoughts ..

P.S. Also I think BTS is going the right way having an 'owner' key for a registered name and a separated 'active' key for funds .. who knows .. maybe we will see some more distinct keys in BTS soon ..
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: luckybit on March 24, 2015, 11:07:32 am
Quote
We are proud to announce that we will be integrating metaexchange natively with the Moonstone wallet. This means that you will be able to exchange BitShares and related UIAs within the wallet with BTC.
Is this going to be "smart wallet" that Max/bitmarket has been talking about?

If I am not mistaken the smartwallet proposal includes automatic trading on your behalf. Things like that won;t be possible until V2 with the extension SDK. Then it will be possible to have a wallet daemon running on your computer or a remote server executing trades for you aromatically. Till then this is a simple wallet which awaits your commands.

Very interesting!

It seems the success or failure of Bitshares could hinge on the success of Moonstone.io.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xiahui135 on March 24, 2015, 01:06:03 pm
good to hear the update of you. I think moonstone may be the game changer of BTS.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xiahui135 on March 24, 2015, 01:13:49 pm
can i ask a question?

how you profit form provide the service. people who join your crowd-fund will be interested in it.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xiahui135 on March 24, 2015, 01:27:29 pm
it is better that  user can define. shortcut of. regulary comand in menu &share the option file
I do not think so. we should make a tool for average people. once we get it people will come later.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 24, 2015, 03:35:57 pm
can i ask a question?

how you profit form provide the service. people who join your crowd-fund will be interested in it.

Our long-term business model is to provide identity verification to fiat/stock/bonds gateways around the world. That won;t happen for another few months though. The wallet itself must be fully open source as otherwise we wouldn't trust it ourselves.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on March 24, 2015, 08:13:35 pm
Moonstone.io is currently being translated to Mandarin Chinese. The video is already available with Mandarin subtitles.
Need assistance with German translation?

 +5% and +5%
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: mdj on March 28, 2015, 03:50:36 pm
Are there any UI prototypes/demos available of moonstone? Would be great to see some samples of the dev progress so far!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chronos on March 28, 2015, 04:27:20 pm
Are there any UI prototypes/demos available of moonstone? Would be great to see some samples of the dev progress so far!

Opening post contains this:

Moonstone (https://moonstone.io/) development is continuing in great steps.We will be presenting the frontend for the first time at the Texas Bitcoin Conference March 28th. You'll be able to see the initial screenshots in our upcoming bitshares.tv video interview (thanks Max!).

So, I guess we might see something today?
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 28, 2015, 05:14:40 pm
Saturday 28.03.2015 Update

Dite, one of our team members is with the Music/Peertracks team at the Texas Bitcoin Conference.

You can now watch the initial UI/UX of the Moonstone wallet on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0FU0OyaB94&feature=youtu.be)! This is an earlier version which we deemed stable for presentation purposes. The market interface will be presented in a more lengthy video in 1-2 weeks as it requires some more polishing.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: wuyanren on March 28, 2015, 05:15:25 pm
gu ji hui tiao piao :P cheng xu yuan de shi jian........
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on March 28, 2015, 05:20:30 pm
Moonstone (https://moonstone.io/) development is continuing in great steps.We will be presenting the frontend for the first time at the Texas Bitcoin Conference March 28th. You'll be able to see the initial screenshots in our upcoming bitshares.tv video interview (thanks Max!).

+5% and +5%
Taulant, your comments on the mumble today were awesome too, great work guys!!!!!!! :)
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: wuyanren on March 28, 2015, 05:23:27 pm
Moonstone (https://moonstone.io/) development is continuing in great steps.We will be presenting the frontend for the first time at the Texas Bitcoin Conference March 28th. You'll be able to see the initial screenshots in our upcoming bitshares.tv video interview (thanks Max!).

+5% and +5%
Taulant, your comments on the mumble today were awesome too, great work guys!!!!!!! :)
Why don't you go fishing? Rare holiday
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 28, 2015, 06:53:50 pm
Mandarin version of our the crowdfunding website is up https://moonstone.io/mandarin.html
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: mdj on March 28, 2015, 07:36:28 pm
Saturday 28.03.2015 Update

Dite, one of our team members is with the Music/Peertracks team at the Texas Bitcoin Conference.

You can now watch the initial UI/UX of the Moonstone wallet on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0FU0OyaB94&feature=youtu.be)! This is an earlier version which we deemed stable for presentation purposes. The market interface will be presented in a more lengthy video in 1-2 weeks as it requires some more polishing.

Very nice! :)
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: merivercap on March 28, 2015, 07:51:20 pm
 
Saturday 28.03.2015 Update

Dite, one of our team members is with the Music/Peertracks team at the Texas Bitcoin Conference.

You can now watch the initial UI/UX of the Moonstone wallet on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0FU0OyaB94&feature=youtu.be)! This is an earlier version which we deemed stable for presentation purposes. The market interface will be presented in a more lengthy video in 1-2 weeks as it requires some more polishing.

Very nice! :)

 +5%  Looks great!!!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: cass on March 30, 2015, 01:24:12 am
Saturday 28.03.2015 Update

Dite, one of our team members is with the Music/Peertracks team at the Texas Bitcoin Conference.

You can now watch the initial UI/UX of the Moonstone wallet on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0FU0OyaB94&feature=youtu.be)! This is an earlier version which we deemed stable for presentation purposes. The market interface will be presented in a more lengthy video in 1-2 weeks as it requires some more polishing.

Very nice! :)

 +5%  Looks great!!!

 +5%
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: alt on March 30, 2015, 02:50:58 am
Saturday 28.03.2015 Update

Dite, one of our team members is with the Music/Peertracks team at the Texas Bitcoin Conference.

You can now watch the initial UI/UX of the Moonstone wallet on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0FU0OyaB94&feature=youtu.be)! This is an earlier version which we deemed stable for presentation purposes. The market interface will be presented in a more lengthy video in 1-2 weeks as it requires some more polishing.

Very nice! :)

 +5%  Looks great!!!

 +5%
+5% awesome!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on March 30, 2015, 10:34:44 am
The Bitshares.tv interview is out! Lots of great details about Moonstone in here! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sDU-ooXq-E
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 02, 2015, 12:16:18 pm
This reply on another thread might be of interest to you:

1.0 isnt going to be some magical fix.

Back last winter, we had been told that there were fiat onramps and corresponding marketing campaign coming, and that these were just waiting on a 1.0 release.  That has since been revealed to be not true at all, and was likely just a cover by Brian Page for why he didnt accomplish anything.   ("Oh yeah, I'm totally working on things!  As soon as you guys get 1.0 released its ready to launch").   

So don't expect 1.0 to do anything magical to the price.  Moonstone might do some good however.

Contrary to what some people believe now I think that 1.0 (though a true 1.0!) is important for market adoption. Potential gateways are hesitant to integrate with unproven software which handles some sort of value exchange. Bitcoin only got away with it because its user base grew faster than the code quality.

As for Moonstone, we think of Bitshares as the potential combined order book and price discovery mechanism for tons of assets which could be issued in the near future via gateways (primarily stocks and bonds, secondarily fiat IOUs). BitAssets, the one feature the core team is currently pushing, won't be in our opinion the main driving factor for some time to come. That is because bitAssets have a chicken and egg problem: They need high liquidity to attract liquidity.

However, IOUs/UIAs don't have that problem and it is obvious that there is a huge unmet market out there of people and companies who want to have a combined, automated, and secure order book like that. This is why we position Moonstone not primarily as a bitAsset wallet but as a wallet where you can manage your IOUs/UIAs.

In the mid-to-long term Moonstone will hopefully start supporting the Bitshares market value by providing the on-blockchain ID verification for third party gateways. That way you can easily sign up to gateways around the world and trade all kinds of stocks/bonds legally. This is definitely part of our plan for 2015.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on April 02, 2015, 12:30:42 pm
That is because bitAssets have a chicken and egg problem: They need high liquidity to attract liquidity.
However, IOUs/UIAs don't have that problem and it is obvious that there is a huge unmet market out there of people and companies who want to have a combined, automated, and secure order book like that (BitShares). This is why we position Moonstone not primarily as a bitAsset wallet but as a wallet where you can manage your IOUs/UIAs.
In the mid-to-long term Moonstone will hopefully start supporting the Bitshares market value by providing the on-blockchain ID verification for third party gateways. That way you can easily sign up to gateways around the world and trade all kinds of stocks/bonds legally. This is definitely part of our plan for 2015.

 +5% I've got a wood.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xiahui135 on April 03, 2015, 05:18:37 am

Quote

Contrary to what some people believe now I think that 1.0 (though a true 1.0!) is important for market adoption. Potential gateways are hesitant to integrate with unproven software which handles some sort of value exchange. Bitcoin only got away with it because its user base grew faster than the code quality.

As for Moonstone, we think of Bitshares as the potential combined order book and price discovery mechanism for tons of assets which could be issued in the near future via gateways (primarily stocks and bonds, secondarily fiat IOUs). BitAssets, the one feature the core team is currently pushing, won't be in our opinion the main driving factor for some time to come. That is because bitAssets have a chicken and egg problem: They need high liquidity to attract liquidity.

However, IOUs/UIAs don't have that problem and it is obvious that there is a huge unmet market out there of people and companies who want to have a combined, automated, and secure order book like that. This is why we position Moonstone not primarily as a bitAsset wallet but as a wallet where you can manage your IOUs/UIAs.

In the mid-to-long term Moonstone will hopefully start supporting the Bitshares market value by providing the on-blockchain ID verification for third party gateways. That way you can easily sign up to gateways around the world and trade all kinds of stocks/bonds legally. This is definitely part of our plan for 2015.
Good! This is the right direction!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 04, 2015, 01:32:55 pm
We're in the final testing phase of our crowdfunding mechanism (Thanks metaexchange!). We would like to ask the community whether you want both a BTC and BTS based fundraiser or a pure BTC fundraiser. Please let us know about your preference and your reasoning!

We initially wanted to include both as to increase the total available liquidity for the fundraiser, however, looking at the order books of most of the BTS exchanges out there it seems selling the BTS on the market at market prices (rather than with a trade strategy) could potentially depress the price of BTS even further. This would obviously not be the case for BTC.

Looking forward to your input!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xiahui135 on April 04, 2015, 02:26:22 pm

We're in the final testing phase of our crowdfunding mechanism (Thanks metaexchange!). We would like to ask the community whether you want both a BTC and BTS based fundraiser or a pure BTC fundraiser. Please let us know about your preference and your reasoning!

We initially wanted to include both as to increase the total available liquidity for the fundraiser, however, looking at the order books of most of the BTS exchanges out there it seems selling the BTS on the market at market prices (rather than with a trade strategy) could potentially depress the price of BTS even further. This would obviously not be the case for BTC.

Looking forward to your input!
Will moonstone support bit-assets, like bitCNY crowdfunding?
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: chryspano on April 04, 2015, 02:32:46 pm
I think that "whales" won't have a problem if you exclude BTS, but smaller fish that only hold BTS and can't afford to purchase BTC with fiat will be forced to sell some of their BTS or will stay out of the fundraising. My guess is that there will be some selling pressure in any case. 
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: mdj on April 04, 2015, 05:24:37 pm
We're in the final testing phase of our crowdfunding mechanism (Thanks metaexchange!). We would like to ask the community whether you want both a BTC and BTS based fundraiser or a pure BTC fundraiser. Please let us know about your preference and your reasoning!

We initially wanted to include both as to increase the total available liquidity for the fundraiser, however, looking at the order books of most of the BTS exchanges out there it seems selling the BTS on the market at market prices (rather than with a trade strategy) could potentially depress the price of BTS even further. This would obviously not be the case for BTC.

Looking forward to your input!

It would be cool to use BitAssets like BitUSD - In all seriousness it would probably be silly to keep all of the raised funds in BTS or Bitcoin due to the volatility. It's far more important to know the dollar value of funds raised (unless of course you intend to pay everybody with a fixed BTS/BTC amount each month regardless of their exchange rate against the dollar).
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Shentist on April 04, 2015, 05:27:50 pm
someone suggested you are accepting bitGOLD etc. and pay it in bitGold back with interest. So could be a good way to give our main assets a purpose and you can collect a good portion of anything. And the investors can choose in which asset they "trust" the most to be stable and get the 15% interest on top.

Will spread the risk for you. Or do you need to sell everything on day 1 after the fundraiser?
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 04, 2015, 05:30:45 pm
Here is a copy of a PM that I sent to fuzzy:


I would really, really like to see the Moonstone fundraiser be successful.

That having been said, I will say that I am having second thoughts about being a large investor. I am worried about the value of the USD during the time of the repayment period. I think that the US is going to have to do another "quantitative easing" or do something else that will greatly diminish the value of its fiat currency.

Since Moonstone plans to convert any donations, no matter whether BTS, bitUSD, bitGOLD BTC. or whatever, at the time of donation into the fiat dollar equivalent price at that time - and then repay 1.15 times that fiat value - I think the risk to investors is greatly increased. If the fiat dollar value drops by one third, then getting back 1.15 times the dollar value of my donation is not very appealing.

If Moonstone would both accept bitGOLD and repay 1.15 times the bitGOLD investment - that would alleviate my concerns. And they could hold funds in bitGOLD except what they HAD to convert to another form for project purposes as the need arises.

I would like to hear Taulant's input on this fear of mine. Otherwise, I'm afraid my investment will be less than I would hope.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: CLains on April 04, 2015, 05:35:36 pm
My intuition says: "Use BitAssets!!"

using BitAssets, and NOT converting immediately, will

1) increases BitAssets exposure,
2) increase BitAssets liquidity,
3) increase BitShares marketcap
4) Provides stability for your fund,
5) Provides security for your fund (multi-sig!!)
6) Provides transparency for your fund (public audit!)
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Pheonike on April 04, 2015, 07:08:19 pm
I think you should do BTC and bitassets but maybe work it in a way that bitassets get a higher return percentage wise than BTC
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: mdj on April 04, 2015, 07:53:07 pm
Here is a copy of a PM that I sent to fuzzy:


I would really, really like to see the Moonstone fundraiser be successful.

That having been said, I will say that I am having second thoughts about being a large investor. I am worried about the value of the USD during the time of the repayment period. I think that the US is going to have to do another "quantitative easing" or do something else that will greatly diminish the value of its fiat currency.

Since Moonstone plans to convert any donations, no matter whether BTS, bitUSD, bitGOLD BTC. or whatever, at the time of donation into the fiat dollar equivalent price at that time - and then repay 1.15 times that fiat value - I think the risk to investors is greatly increased. If the fiat dollar value drops by one third, then getting back 1.15 times the dollar value of my donation is not very appealing.

If Moonstone would both accept bitGOLD and repay 1.15 times the bitGOLD investment - that would alleviate my concerns. And they could hold funds in bitGOLD except what they HAD to convert to another form for project purposes as the need arises.

I would like to hear Taulant's input on this fear of mine. Otherwise, I'm afraid my investment will be less than I would hope.

Agreed - it is a lot of risk to take on for a potential 15% (which could take a very long time). I'd much rather it if moonstone took an approach of say selling 20% of equity in the company/product at the crowdfunder with no buyback (with an IPO for the equity share on the internal exchange)
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitmarket on April 04, 2015, 07:57:31 pm
My thoughts:

Don't accept BTS for the reasons you stated.

If you are unwilling to keep bitUSD as bitUSD then don't accept that either.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Shentist on April 04, 2015, 08:08:25 pm
My thoughts:

Don't accept BTS for the reasons you stated.

If you are unwilling to keep bitUSD as bitUSD then don't accept that either.

this is a fundraiser in the BitShares Community, so we need absolutly bitAssets - who else will accept our solutions? We has to show what we can provide. I am not worried about selling pressure, this would be 130k so under 1 % of the market cap.

In my opinion as more ways are accepted, as more attractive it will be - so accept BTC, BTS and every major bitAsset (USD, CNY, Gold, Silver)
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 04, 2015, 08:18:42 pm
My thoughts:

Don't accept BTS for the reasons you stated.

If you are unwilling to keep bitUSD as bitUSD then don't accept that either.

this is a fundraiser in the BitShares Community, so we need absolutly bitAssets - who else will accept our solutions? We has to show what we can provide. I am not worried about selling pressure, this would be 130k so under 1 % of the market cap.

In my opinion as more ways are accepted, as more attractive it will be - so accept BTC, BTS and every major bitAsset (USD, CNY, Gold, Silver)

But what about return of investment should be 1.15 x (whatever asset used for donation)? Under that scenario I will make a much larger donation.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Shentist on April 04, 2015, 08:44:31 pm
My thoughts:

Don't accept BTS for the reasons you stated.

If you are unwilling to keep bitUSD as bitUSD then don't accept that either.

this is a fundraiser in the BitShares Community, so we need absolutly bitAssets - who else will accept our solutions? We has to show what we can provide. I am not worried about selling pressure, this would be 130k so under 1 % of the market cap.

In my opinion as more ways are accepted, as more attractive it will be - so accept BTC, BTS and every major bitAsset (USD, CNY, Gold, Silver)

But what about return of investment should be 1.15 x (whatever asset used for donation)? Under that scenario I will make a much larger donation.

i would suggest this. Yes!

bitsapphire wants to race 130k USD - so they could do it 130k worth of USD, they would just convert at the point of donation to the current exchange rate and the donors can be paid in their asset back. But maybe for this proposel they need more then one UIA to track what they collected. moonGold, moonSilver, moonUSD, moonBTC , moonBTS, moonCNY . Sounds nice to me, and i like the idea that the investors will be paid in their invested asset class.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 04, 2015, 10:09:54 pm
Thanks everybody for your thoughts! You definitely spawned a lot of ideas with the team!

We're in the final testing phase of our crowdfunding mechanism (Thanks metaexchange!). We would like to ask the community whether you want both a BTC and BTS based fundraiser or a pure BTC fundraiser. Please let us know about your preference and your reasoning!

We initially wanted to include both as to increase the total available liquidity for the fundraiser, however, looking at the order books of most of the BTS exchanges out there it seems selling the BTS on the market at market prices (rather than with a trade strategy) could potentially depress the price of BTS even further. This would obviously not be the case for BTC.

Looking forward to your input!

It would be cool to use BitAssets like BitUSD - In all seriousness it would probably be silly to keep all of the raised funds in BTS or Bitcoin due to the volatility. It's far more important to know the dollar value of funds raised (unless of course you intend to pay everybody with a fixed BTS/BTC amount each month regardless of their exchange rate against the dollar).

That is our main concern. While for the Moonstone fundraiser it is unimportant in what unit the funds are raised (because we need to convert it for business operations all to EUR anyway), it can and most likely will become an issue for the buyback via the delegates.If the unit of account fluctuates a lot vis-a-vis BTS (which is what delegates are paid in), then this can lead to the situation in which we can never buy-back all tokens.

Another concern of ours is that many people in the crypto scene want to be able to diversify their positions somehow. Because neither stocks not bonds are available, they seem to really like our approach which is denominated in terms of USD.

Here is a copy of a PM that I sent to fuzzy:


I would really, really like to see the Moonstone fundraiser be successful.

That having been said, I will say that I am having second thoughts about being a large investor. I am worried about the value of the USD during the time of the repayment period. I think that the US is going to have to do another "quantitative easing" or do something else that will greatly diminish the value of its fiat currency.

Since Moonstone plans to convert any donations, no matter whether BTS, bitUSD, bitGOLD BTC. or whatever, at the time of donation into the fiat dollar equivalent price at that time - and then repay 1.15 times that fiat value - I think the risk to investors is greatly increased. If the fiat dollar value drops by one third, then getting back 1.15 times the dollar value of my donation is not very appealing.

If Moonstone would both accept bitGOLD and repay 1.15 times the bitGOLD investment - that would alleviate my concerns. And they could hold funds in bitGOLD except what they HAD to convert to another form for project purposes as the need arises.

I would like to hear Taulant's input on this fear of mine. Otherwise, I'm afraid my investment will be less than I would hope.

Worrying about the stability of the USD during the buyback period is a fair concern. To be honest though, the USD is nonetheless the healthiest and most liquid currency out there. It will be the last to fall even if something really crazy happens. Our operational expenses are almost all EUR denominated, and we nonetheless are denominating the Moonstone crowdfunder in terms of USD because the Euro is much more likely to suffer some shock than the USD.

BitGold would suffer the same problem. Looking at the price chart of Gold for the last quarter you see a 10-15% fluctuation. If we denominated the crowdfunder in terms of bitGold that would expose the buy-back period also to a 10-15% per quarter fluctuation. What is even worse the donors would need to be by definition long on gold, or at least bitGold, something I doubt most people here are.

Reality is, most investors are at least to some extend long on USD because they know that nothing else is a safer bet. The USD wins in this regard as a unit of account not because it is good, but rather because it is not bad.

My intuition says: "Use BitAssets!!"

using BitAssets, and NOT converting immediately, will

1) increases BitAssets exposure,
2) increase BitAssets liquidity,
3) increase BitShares marketcap
4) Provides stability for your fund,
5) Provides security for your fund (multi-sig!!)
6) Provides transparency for your fund (public audit!)

While we agree with everything on your list, we think bitAssets are not ready for usage yet. As pointed out in earlier discussions, at Bitsapphire we believe that the initial beachhead market for BitShares is not bitAssets, but rather the decentralized exchange and order book for UIA and gateway assets such as stocks and bonds. While bitAssets have a chicken and egg problem (you need liquidity to get liquidity), UIAs and Gateway IOUs don;t have that problem. The only thing needed to kickcstart the liquidity of the UIA/IOU market on BitShares is in our opinion the ID certification mechanism for gateway KYC purposes. Creating sufficient liquidity on UIAS/IOUs should naturally lead people to using bitUSD or similar bitAssets as a liquid and instant open position against all other UIAs/IOUs on the chain. We think this is the right approach to create liquidity on BitShares.

This means that holding the fundraiser funds in bitUSD on the chain would be at this point counterproductive as we need all the funds for operational purposes anyway. However, I hope that 1-2 years down the line the created UIA/IOU liquidity will be so great that the bitUSD/USD spread will also be minimal and make such cumbersome conversions a thing of the past.

Agreed - it is a lot of risk to take on for a potential 15% (which could take a very long time). I'd much rather it if moonstone took an approach of say selling 20% of equity in the company/product at the crowdfunder with no buyback (with an IPO for the equity share on the internal exchange)

Good that you mention that! Version 1 of the wallet is intended to be open sourced. The community is really paying for it to become a public good rather than to become something closed source like coinbase. We included the buy-back mechanism just so at least some of the risk can be covered and so that at the end the community as a whole can repay the risk takers (via the delegates) for a public good, without having to take on risks which the public did not agree to.

As for selling stock, we hope to be able to do that for V2 and 3 of the wallet for which we already have the featureset defined. That is when the wallet will be able to ID users for gateways. Turns out we can do that quite easily and legally in Kosovo, we're just trying to figure out the legalities of offering stock in this way to citizens in the US, China, and other places. Many countries seem to have "lockin" laws which we might not be aware of at this point. With a successfull initial fundraiser for the MIT license we know we can finish up the wallet properly and get to the next stage faster.

My thoughts:

Don't accept BTS for the reasons you stated.

If you are unwilling to keep bitUSD as bitUSD then don't accept that either.

That seems to be the best approach so far, as we won't hold any position in any crypto anyways. It's all operational expenses.

But what about return of investment should be 1.15 x (whatever asset used for donation)? Under that scenario I will make a much larger donation.

i would suggest this. Yes!

bitsapphire wants to race 130k USD - so they could do it 130k worth of USD, they would just convert at the point of donation to the current exchange rate and the donors can be paid in their asset back. But maybe for this proposel they need more then one UIA to track what they collected. moonGold, moonSilver, moonUSD, moonBTC , moonBTS, moonCNY . Sounds nice to me, and i like the idea that the investors will be paid in their invested asset class.

This could only work in terms of BTS. We have pondered this option for some time. What we could do is issue 1.15 moonstone tokens for every BTS we receive (or BTC in terms of current BTS market price) and then repay directly in terms of BTS from the delegate proceedings. Some really early Bitcoin mining operations used to do this. However this would mean that only people long on BTS would donate.

Maybe we should do a poll about this potential implementation? We will look into this.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 04, 2015, 11:31:39 pm

"This could only work in terms of BTS. We have pondered this option for some time. What we could do is issue 1.15 moonstone tokens for every BTS we receive (or BTC in terms of current BTS market price) and then repay directly in terms of BTS from the delegate proceedings. Some really early Bitcoin mining operations used to do this. However this would mean that only people long on BTS would donate."


I will make a substantial donation if it can be in BTS and the return is 1.15 x BTS donated.
If that is not possible, I will still donate - but much less.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 04, 2015, 11:46:50 pm
I think 15% is a considerably high rate, if Moonstone will buy back in guarantee. I don't think it will take 30-ish months, but expecting 12~18 months. It's 10~15% APR. while Chinese banks have 5% interest rates now. So it's better to save your spare money in Moonstone than traditional bank in terms of profitability.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 04, 2015, 11:48:43 pm

"This could only work in terms of BTS. We have pondered this option for some time. What we could do is issue 1.15 moonstone tokens for every BTS we receive (or BTC in terms of current BTS market price) and then repay directly in terms of BTS from the delegate proceedings. Some really early Bitcoin mining operations used to do this. However this would mean that only people long on BTS would donate."


I will make a substantial donation if it can be in BTS and the return is 1.15 x BTS donated.
If that is not possible, I will still donate - but much less.

It's plausible IMO, but will take 52 months.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: merivercap on April 05, 2015, 12:02:02 am
It may be easier to pay back in BTS since Moonstone delegates will be paid in BTS.  I agree that most crowdfunders will expect BTS to rise over time and the primary reason people will be supporting the crowdfunding is to greatly help the Bitshares ecosystem rather than another ecosystem.  Hence the preference for crowdfunders would probably be to be paid back in an equivalent BTS amount.

Anyways I think this is an incredibly important project and an MIT license would really open things up for the ecosystem.  I was never a fan of GPL licenses.  It is better for people to view open source software as a gift to the society and those that contribute should be recognized & commended for it, but it's better for the ecosystem to not have strings attached.  If people wanted to make money off it instead of view it as a gift, then they could keep it closed and just sell it.  If people want to build branches off the an original open source project and make money off it that will help the ecosystem even more.  Contributers and donors to projects can always make free branches to compete against for-profit branches.  I'm a fan of Linus Torvalds, but I'm also a fan of economics and I don't think I would have had to live so many years with buggy & insecure Windows software all my life if someone could make money off building an easy-to-use Linux installation under a different license.  I know it's sacrilegious to say in tech circles, but I actually preferred Windows to Linux because it was and probably still is easier to use.  I know some of the tech elite don't really care to make things easier and would rather just have everyone start coding, learning advanced cryptography, cold store their coins etc. and it's fine to have that opinion.  One question I would ask is do they want to make money?  0.1% of the consumer market is not very big.

Anyways I shouldn't blab on too much... I think the Moonstone project is great and important.  I think the MIT license is better for the bitShares ecosystem & the Moonstone team. 

Sidenote: I do agree with onceuponatime the dollar is overvalued.  The Yen & Euro have depreciated via competitive devaluation and that trend  can extend for some time, but I would expect what goes up will go down and it will be the dollar's turn to weak significantly probably between 6 mo's to a few years time.  All speculation.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: monsterer on April 05, 2015, 10:33:56 am
If the majority of users are BTS holders, running the fundraiser in bitAssets like bitUSD will cause the same amount of downward pressure on BTS as if you just sold the UIA into the BTS market, since BTS holders would need to buy up bitUSD in order to then purchase the UIA.

If the goal is not to move the BTS price down, then running the fundraiser in BTC only is one way to achieve this.
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 05, 2015, 09:00:56 pm
We have decided to hold the fundraiser exclusively in BTC, there won't be a BTS or bitAsset option. The reasons are that the liquidity between BTS and BTC is so low that selling 130k USD worth opf BTS into BTC to cash out into fiat would according to our calculations move the market simply too much.

However we would like everybody to take part in the poll in this thread and let us know whether you would like to get 1.15 USD or 1.15 BTS through a buyback. Our original plan was to do a bitUSD buyback but it seems there might be interest in doing the unit of account in terms of BTS rather than USD. After all, the community is long on BTS.

Depending on the outcome of the poll we might have to postpone the corwdfunding campaign another day.

Please vote in the poll in this thread and let us know what you think!
Title: Re: Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: mdj on April 05, 2015, 09:29:37 pm
We have decided to hold the fundraiser exclusively in BTC, there won't be a BTS or bitAsset option. The reasons are that the liquidity between BTS and BTC is so low that selling 130k USD worth opf BTS into BTC to cash out into fiat would according to our calculations move the market simply too much.

Disappointing but your reasoning is certainly justified. This further emphasises how desperately we need t BTS/USD gateway! If I didn't live in a country so against cryptocurrencies I'd be pursuing that very lucrative venture...
Title: Re: [PLEASE VOTE] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 06, 2015, 03:12:05 am
bump
Title: Re: [PLEASE VOTE] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 06, 2015, 12:38:53 pm
Based on the outcome of the poll we have decided to denominate the buyback in terms of BTS. This means that for every BTC you send in the price will be converted into the equivalent in terms of BTS at the time of donation, and you will receive 1.15 Moonstone tokens for every BTS equivalent you donated.

To accomodate the changes and to do some more testing on our crowdfunder setup we are postponing the start of the crowdfunding campaign to April 9th.

Once the wallet is released as version 1.0 the buyback with the d delegates will commence. Our delegates will be operational and can be voted in by May.

Final Timeline:


If you have any questions please let us know!
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on April 06, 2015, 01:10:51 pm
from Buttercoin to Moonstone.. ;)
https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/bitcoin-exchange-buttercoin-closing
 
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Empirical1.2 on April 06, 2015, 02:49:05 pm
You seem to have a large talented team, good business acumen and can see the potential in what this technology can offer but at the same time you've seen how BitShares has struggled price wise these last 6 months.

Have you ever thought of starting a BitShares competitor instead?
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 06, 2015, 03:21:18 pm
You seem to have a large talented team, good business acumen and can see the potential in what this technology can offer but at the same time you've seen how BitShares has struggled price wise these last 6 months.

Have you ever thought of starting a BitShares competitor instead?

Thanks for the kind words!

We don't think that the price decrease has to worry anybody as Bitshare should be a longterm play for most people. Our only worry is that BTS (and really currently any crypto tokens) are first and foremost digital commodity tokens, then secondarily in the case of Bitshares actual shares. Because BTS are such hybrid tokens, market cap has almost no meaning as traditional market cap evaluations currently used for stocks simply don't work.

Generally speaking, we are against starting new "competitors" or alternative projects, primarily because blockchains are in our opinion codified social consensus/contracts. As such the actual value of the network is in the social network, not the code itself. In a sense, the community here is what actually back the value of BTS.

That said, we are working with 3 guys part time internally on a project called Pactum. It is blockchain tech, but does not compete in any way with Bitshares. Our plan is actually for it to use DPOS. We are expecting another 6-12 months of stealth development time until we have a PoC to show... if our hypothesis works out (some pretty big ifs).
Title: Re: [PLEASE VOTE] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: arhag on April 06, 2015, 03:28:08 pm
Based on the outcome of the poll we have decided to denominate the buyback in terms of BTS. This means that for every BTC you send in the price will be converted into the equivalent in terms of BTS at the time of donation, and you will receive 1.15 Moonstone tokens for every BTS equivalent you donated.

How about giving the user two tokens for every BTS worth of BTC donated rather than just 1? For every 1 BTS worth of BTC donated, the donor would receive 1 MOON.A and 1 MOON.B. You would first use the delegate funds to buy back MOON.A with BTS at a rate of 1 MOON.A = 1.05 BTS. You would not buyback MOON.B while you still have less BTS in reserve than 1.05 times the amount of outstanding MOON.A yet to be bought back and destroyed. Take the average price of BTS (in USD) over the past week at the time enough BTS has been raised from delegates to be larger than 1.05 times the outstanding MOON.A supply and call that price P USD/BTS. If the total amount of MOON.A originally created as part of the crowdfund (call that S) multiplied by the price P is sufficiently greater than USD value of the crowdfund (for example 1.05 * S * P > 150,000), then you would not need to buyback MOON.B and could instead simply retire the delegates. This means that if someone simply holds their MOON.A until all of it can be bought back for BTS, the maximum dollar value percentage gain of their BTS holdings from the time of donation to the time of buyback would be 15.4% (similar to what it was before when you wanted to do the 1.15 UIA per USD donated scheme).

However, if you buyback all of MOON.A but the price P is not high enough to satisfy the inequality 1.05 * S * P > 150,000, then you can begin the buyback of MOON.B so that donors can continue to receive some interest on their BTS. Actually instead of starting the actual buyback after enough BTS is collected to buy back all remaining MOON.A, you would instead start a stage 2 in which another reserve is allocated (which contains R BTS, where R grows over time as more delegate funds are added to the reserve) for the eventual MOON.B buyback. Stage 2 ends as soon as 3 years elapses since the start of the crowdfund or R * (the 1 week moving average price of BTS in USD/BTS) > (150,000 - 1.05*S*P), whichever happens first. After the stage 2 ends, the delegates are retired and the buyback of MOON.B begins at a rate of 1 MOON.B = R/S BTS.

The end result of all of this is that if amount of value raised by the delegates within a 3 year period can reach $150,000, then donors will get back their USD value (via BTS) that they donated with at least 15% interest (and at least 5% return on BTS donated). If 3 years passes without generating enough value, then the donors will obviously get back less money. However, there is no defined time limit on at least paying back the BTS donated (with 5% interest), assuming the delegates can stay elected long enough that is. This means if BTS value increases a lot, the donors will get paid back sooner (less than 3 years) and in this case they will always have more BTS then they started with (at least 5% more) and they will have at least 15% more USD value than they started with. If BTS value continues to stagnate or even drops more, then it will take much longer to get paid back and the returns will be less. If it takes longer than 3 years, then the donor will receive less than 15% additional USD value than they started with (perhaps they will even lose USD value), although they will most likely still get back more BTS than they started with (5% more, but over a period that is potentially indefinitely long).

Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: rgcrypto on April 06, 2015, 04:48:31 pm
I am buying. I love 10-15% return on my money :)
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 07, 2015, 03:02:04 pm
kenCode asked yesterday a bunch of great questions. I thought I'd post them here for anybody else who is interested.

Questions:
1. If BitSapphire got seed or vc backing, then why are you crowdfunding Moonstone?
2. Is Moonstone open source like Jay (NXT)?
3. Is Moonstone trustless like jay?
4. Is Moonstone decentralized like jay?
5. Comparisons: What does Moonstone offer that blockchain.info doesn't? Blackcoin? Counterwallet? Omniwallet?
6. Crowdfunding: What will my BTS be used for?
7. Crowdfunding: Will I earn interest on my BTS donation?
8. Crowdfunding: If the crowdfunding does not meet its goal, how do I get my BTS back?
9. Is Moonstone entirely web-based, or do I have to download and install an app?
10. How is Moonstone more secure than most web wallets?
11. Does Moonstone rely on a traditional centralized server, ever?
12. Will Moonstone allow me to access my existing BTS account info?
13. Will Moonstone allow me to import my BTS (from Linux) json backup file?
14. Will Moonstone allow me to stop using the Linux BTS client software and migrate to Moonstone exclusively?
15. How do I get my grandparents to understand, and use Moonstone?
 

Answers:
1. Bitsapphire has no VC backing whatsoever. We are fully bootstrapped. In the market of exploding funding for crypto startups capable developers are a more scarce resource than money. We have been able to position our business model accordingly.
2. If we reach our fudning goal of 130,000 USD in BTC within our 30 day funding period we will release both the front and backend under the permissive MIT license. This will allow other projects and startups to use parts of our code and add value in their own ways. If we don't reach our goal then only the frontend will be released open source, but under the less permissive GPL 3 licence. This would mean that startups and projects would have a harder time reusing our components.
3. Moonstone is trustless in as far as we don't hold any private keys and only store encrypted wallet files. In a sense, we just help you not lose your stuff. If you don;t feel comfortable with that then you can host your own server too (provided we reach our goal!) The closest comparison to another wallet would be copay.io by the Bitpay guys
4. Moonstone is not decentralized. It accesses a full client server which however cannot forge any signatures as the server holds no private keys.
5. Well, access to BitShares of course! But beyond that we have a timeline to add native Bitcoin support and through the integration of Metaexchange in-wallet cross-chain exchange. For V2 or 3 which is pretty close down the line we want to make it possible to verify your ID on the BitShares blockchain so you can trade legal fiat, stock, and bond IOUs from around the world.
6. The crowdfunder happens completely in BTC which will be converted immediately to fiat for operation purposes. For your donation you will get 1.15 Moonstone tokens per BTS equivalent exchange value of your BTC. As an example: If the amount of BTC you donate is worth 10,000 BTS then you will receive 11,500 Moonstone tokens in exchange. We plan to buy-back all Moonstone tokens via our pre-selected but opt-out wallet delegates at a 1-to-1 ratio with BTS. This means that if everything goes according to plan can make a 15% return in terms of BTS.
7. Yes! If everything goes according to plan you will be able to earn a 15% return in terms of BTS. The cutoff duration for the buyback via the delegates is 30 months after the start of the buyback.
8. If the crowdfunder is not successful, meaning we don't reach our goal of 130,000 USD worth of BTC within the 30 day window, we will proceed to release the frontend under the GPL3 license without releasing the backend. The delegate buyback commences nonetheless and we will buyback the tokens in the same manner. No BTC can be taken back.
9. Moonstone is primarily a web application but can be downloaded to your computer similar to how the current BTS wallet can be downloaded. You can chose to either download only the thin client or the full package including the server.
10. Most BTC web wallet hold your private keys. Hence, they are effectively banks as they hold your funds for you. Moonstone does not hold any private keys, that is your job. You are in charge of your assets.
11. The full blockchain is stored in our server (or any server you wish if we reach our goal). We cannot forge any transactions and cannot steal your funds. So yes, with V1 it relies on a central server-client setup.
12 & 13. Yes. You will be able to import your existing wallet securely.
14. V1 of Moonstone won't support TITAN names. So complete migration will only be possible if you are ok with that. Future versions of Moonstone will be capable of doing TITAN transfers. There are some technical challenges we need to resolve first.
15. The design is simple and intuitive enough to understand it. In fact it's pretty close to traditional non-crypto wallets currently out there. We believe that in the near future our user base will primarily consist of people who want to hold multiple assets (IOUs, UIAs) as well as potentially multiple blockchain tokens (e.g. BTS, BTC, ETH, etc) in one and the same interface and trade between each of them effortlessly. That is our target group.

One more thing. If we reach our fundraising goal we also pledge that V2 and V3 of the wallet will also be open source MIT licensed, the only potential exception being the ID verification module.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 07, 2015, 03:22:29 pm
Hi guys,

This is the fundraiser interface. Pretty simple and straight forward. You'll be able to generate a private/public key pair for your Moonstone tokens even if you currently have no BitShares wallet. You'll be able to import the keypair into your Moonstone wallet similar to how you can import your Bitcoin keypair to your current wallet.

(http://i.imgur.com/FRVelAG.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/JDGiJs4.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/26hKOdJ.jpg)

If you have any questions let us know!
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: arhag on April 07, 2015, 03:22:56 pm
4. Moonstone is not decentralized. It accesses a full client server which however cannot forge any signatures as the server holds no private keys.

Do you intend to eventually allow the client to poll multiple independent servers in future versions so that any one server cannot lie to the client without getting caught?

8. If the crowdfunder is not successful, meaning we don't reach our goal of 130,000 USD worth of BTC within the 30 day window, we will proceed to release the frontend under the GPL3 license without releasing the backend. The delegate buyback commences nonetheless and we will buyback the tokens in the same manner. No BTC can be taken back.

That seems like such a shame. What if the amount raised in 30 days was 120,000 USD? I'm sure people donating would rather see a cut in the 15% interest and get the MIT license rather than get nothing at all. If the first few months of delegate pay is sold to cover the deficit with interest, the amount of BTS estimated to be collected over the remaining months in the 30 month window can be used to calculate the new (lower) buyback rate.

One more thing. If we reach our fundraising goal we also pledge that V2 and V3 of the wallet will also be open source MIT licensed, the only potential exception being the ID verification module.

I'm curious regarding how the module system works. I expect to be able to compile (and audit) the client code myself for security reasons. So would these modules be plugins (some of which can be proprietary and pre-compiled) that the open source client can use? If so I would want to make sure that these plugins are in their own secure process sandbox because otherwise you would allow unknown proprietary code to have memory access to the client which they could use to steal private keys.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on April 07, 2015, 04:55:29 pm
Ohh  a real good one bits-app-hire!

Well done!

Not only you will not support the Bitshares ecosystem by using its products (bitAssets) - A giant red flag, as it speaks volumes about you not believing in the product yourself.

But you will make the hard core BTS believers sell their BTS (like the current sell off by what seems like everybody else is somehow not big enough), so they can provide you with precious BTC...before diluting the shares (with your scores of delegates) for everyone to pay the investors back...

I was thinking of starting to load up on BTS at 2K satoshi... now I can relax and load for even cheaper price in the not so distant future... 1.5K? maybe not a dream anymore.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: yellowecho on April 07, 2015, 05:00:13 pm
But you will make the hard core BTS believers sell their BTS (like the current sell off by what seems like everybody else is somehow not big enough), so they can provide you with precious BTC...before diluting the shares (with your scores of delegates) for everyone to pay the investors back...

This is what I was thinking as well.  I would consider donating bitUSD or bitEUR but I'm not selling BTS for BTC to donate.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chronos on April 07, 2015, 05:11:45 pm
You can't please everyone.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 07, 2015, 05:22:20 pm
4. Moonstone is not decentralized. It accesses a full client server which however cannot forge any signatures as the server holds no private keys.

Do you intend to eventually allow the client to poll multiple independent servers in future versions so that any one server cannot lie to the client without getting caught?
Yes. We intend to add this possibility down the line (V2 or 3).

8. If the crowdfunder is not successful, meaning we don't reach our goal of 130,000 USD worth of BTC within the 30 day window, we will proceed to release the frontend under the GPL3 license without releasing the backend. The delegate buyback commences nonetheless and we will buyback the tokens in the same manner. No BTC can be taken back.

That seems like such a shame. What if the amount raised in 30 days was 120,000 USD? I'm sure people donating would rather see a cut in the 15% interest and get the MIT license rather than get nothing at all. If the first few months of delegate pay is sold to cover the deficit with interest, the amount of BTS estimated to be collected over the remaining months in the 30 month window can be used to calculate the new (lower) buyback rate.
Yes that would be a shame. We are pretty confident though that we will reach our goal. The community has been responding very positively.
We are aiming to create a market solution for the creation of public goods. Combing a pure charity and for-profit model would in our opinion evolve the system into an unstable equilibrium. We have already plans how to potentially solve this dilemma for future Bitshares related projects but that would require our module based approach to be final and tested. Something which will take several more months.

One more thing. If we reach our fundraising goal we also pledge that V2 and V3 of the wallet will also be open source MIT licensed, the only potential exception being the ID verification module.

I'm curious regarding how the module system works. I expect to be able to compile (and audit) the client code myself for security reasons. So would these modules be plugins (some of which can be proprietary and pre-compiled) that the open source client can use? If so I would want to make sure that these plugins are in their own secure process sandbox because otherwise you would allow unknown proprietary code to have memory access to the client which they could use to steal private keys.
If you'd like to read up on it here is the official FBP page (http://www.jpaulmorrison.com/fbp/). We are using specifically noflo (http://noflojs.org/). V1 won't be FBP though but V2 and onward will be. We are currently switching the entire team to FBP as by our calculations it will increase our productivity several fold. You can read up on what new technology future we are actively preparing for here (https://medium.com/@itnom/the-best-way-to-predict-the-future-is-to-create-it-6b3251d9e701).
The ID verification module would not be client side, hence no memory access to your local machine.

You can't please everyone.
Agreed.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on April 08, 2015, 02:34:30 am
You can't please everyone.
Agreed.

I am already used to the bits-of-app-for-hire's arrogance, and so I am not the tiniest bit surprised that he is not trying to please anybody but himself. So, this is not an attempt to change his mind, it is more of an explanation that he fully realizes what he is doing and does it this way only to serve his own interest.

So, if he believed that selling such amount of BTS would not kick the price of BTS way down, he would have taken BTS and sold them himself. But why do it? This would mean accepting BTS at current  price and suffering the loss when he himself kicks the price down by selling those BTS. It is much better for him to accept the BTC (and valuate them at equivalent BTS value) at a point when somebody  has sold those BTS (for BTC) and by doing so has moved the price of BTS down.... In other words he very well knows what this 'funding' will do to the BTS price and he is doing it in a way he does not suffer from the consequences of his actions....
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: carpet ride on April 08, 2015, 02:55:00 am

You can't please everyone.
Agreed.

I am already used to the bits-of-apps-for-hire's arrogance, and so I am not the tiniest bit surprised that he is not trying to please anybody but himself. So, this is not an attempt to change his mind, it is more of an explanation that he fully realizes what he is doing and does it this way only to serve his own interest.

So, if he believed that selling such amount of BTS would not kick the price of BTS way down, he would have taken BTS and sold them himself. But why do it? This would mean accepting BTS at current  price and suffering the loss when he himself kicks the price down by selling those BTS. It is much better for him to accept the BTC (and valuate them at equivalent BTS value) at a point when somebody  has sold those BTS (for BTC) and by doing so has moved the price of BTS down.... In other words he very well knows what this 'funding' will do to the BTS price and he is doing it in a way he does not suffer from the consequences of his actions....

If it gets funded and is later successful, the moonstone project ends up being good for all bts holders. Those who are worried about what it will do to the price in the short run seem not to be very bullish on some combination of moonstone/bts projects in the long run.  I personally don't think it's worth worrying about what the crowd funder will "do to the price" because I see moonstone as a harbinger of long run value for bts. Further, we'd be worse off if moonstone didn't reach their fundraising goal just because of the cost of doing it in bts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: svk on April 08, 2015, 08:16:34 am
I'm still curious about the relationship of the Moonstone wallet to Bitshares Music and Peertracks. Apparently it will also be used for that blockchain, so are you essentially asking BTS holders to fund the development of the Music wallet? How come Peertracks/cob aren't funding it?

Also, is this the same wallet you showed us last year, not sure when, in September maybe?

What is the current status of the development, do you have a working implementation or are we only seeing mockups?
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 08, 2015, 11:35:49 am
I'm still curious about the relationship of the Moonstone wallet to Bitshares Music and Peertracks. Apparently it will also be used for that blockchain, so are you essentially asking BTS holders to fund the development of the Music wallet? How come Peertracks/cob aren't funding it?

Also, is this the same wallet you showed us last year, not sure when, in September maybe?

What is the current status of the development, do you have a working implementation or are we only seeing mockups?

Very good question.
Peertracks is committed to using Moonstone's codebase. Peertracks will contribute to this fundraiser as to offset some of the crowdfunder cost. The specific interface integration needed for Peertracks will be developed later for Peertracks and is not part of this fundraiser. Our plan for Moonstone is for it to connect to multiple blockchains from the same interface and be able to trade between all blockchains' tokens. This will include potentially all DPOS forks and Bitcoin, potentially Ethereum too (in the long run).

The wallet design we showed in September was the first design iteration we had finished. I think this would be a good time to mention what the development/iteration process has been like so far:

What you saw in the demo video all works and is real, however the universal transaction builder needs work and testing as well as the RPC interface/deserializer. The current demo still runs on the current wallet RPC.

It is important to note that we think Moonstone can spur the Startup/project econsystem around BitShares by providing a similar architecture to Bitpay's Bitcore Wallet Suite (http://blog.bitpay.com/2015/03/05/bitcore-wallet.html). That is our intention for our RPC interface. If it works out anything like Bitcore, you'll see many startups use it as the go-to BitShares/DPOS wrapper. Most Bitcoin startups we have worked with have used at least parts of Bitcore, which I think says a lot.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: svk on April 08, 2015, 12:00:03 pm
I'm still curious about the relationship of the Moonstone wallet to Bitshares Music and Peertracks. Apparently it will also be used for that blockchain, so are you essentially asking BTS holders to fund the development of the Music wallet? How come Peertracks/cob aren't funding it?

Also, is this the same wallet you showed us last year, not sure when, in September maybe?

What is the current status of the development, do you have a working implementation or are we only seeing mockups?

Very good question.
Peertracks is committed to using Moonstone's codebase. Peertracks will contribute to this fundraiser as to offset some of the crowdfunder cost. The specific interface integration needed for Peertracks will be developed later for Peertracks and is not part of this fundraiser. Our plan for Moonstone is for it to connect to multiple blockchains from the same interface and be able to trade between all blockchains' tokens. This will include potentially all DPOS forks and Bitcoin, potentially Ethereum too (in the long run).

The wallet design we showed in September was the first design iteration we had finished. I think this would be a good time to mention what the development/iteration process has been like so far:
  • Initial design concepts based on Google's newly released Material Design guidelines. Frontend work on the Angular app with Famo.us. Famo.us made it possible to have a buttery smooth UI for browsers as well as on the phone. The premise is "build it once, it works on all devices like a native app". It worked really nicely but Famo.us was at version 0.2 back then and once they upgraded up to 0.4 we had to abandon our plans as it broke too many things. In this iteration we still used the current wallet RPC interface.
  • This is when we started our second iteration of the design with complete overhaul. We put on a second designer and things went a lot faster. We switched from Famo.us to native Angular Material Design frameworks which also helped us a lot. The drawback is of course that for the mobile wallet we'll need to redo it again. We still used the current wallet RPC interface, though now server side as we changed plans for Moonstone to become a light wallet. This is also when we started doing extensive user testing with the half baked interface. We discovered that there would be a 80% drop in likelihood for anybody to use our wallet for every 2 minutes of waiting/loading time (this would include blockchain syncing if this was a full client).
  • After wrangling with for over a month with the BithShares RPC interface and trying to get it to be a scalable backend for the light wallet, we decided that the whole current wallet architecture (including the deserializer) was simply not intended for large scale deployment. It was rather build with the ideological backdrop of everybody downloading the whole blockchain. This was when we made the announcements on the forum ans started working on our own RPC interface and deserializer. Right after making the forum announcements we got the client-side universal transaction builder working, though there are still bugs that need to be worked out. We are currently working on the RPC interface/deserializer and the market interface. These two parts are also our two main milestones for the 0.9 release. Once fully tested we will release 1.0 for general use.

What you saw in the demo video all works and is real, however the universal transaction builder needs work and testing as well as the RPC interface/deserializer. The current demo still runs on the current wallet RPC.

It is important to note that we think Moonstone can spur the Startup/project econsystem around BitShares by providing a similar architecture to Bitpay's Bitcore Wallet Suite (http://blog.bitpay.com/2015/03/05/bitcore-wallet.html). That is our intention for our RPC interface. If it works out anything like Bitcore, you'll see many startups use it as the go-to BitShares/DPOS wrapper. Most Bitcoin startups we have worked with have used at least parts of Bitcore, which I think says a lot.

Excellent answers, thank you.

I too have my doubts as to the scalability of the client as a backend for multiple online clients, even for Bitsharesblocks I needed to build another layer on top of it in order to mitigate some performance issues.

I'm sure you are aware of jcalfee's work on Bitshares-JS, do you intend to build on that work at all?

Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: luckybit on April 08, 2015, 01:45:29 pm
4. Moonstone is not decentralized. It accesses a full client server which however cannot forge any signatures as the server holds no private keys.

Do you intend to eventually allow the client to poll multiple independent servers in future versions so that any one server cannot lie to the client without getting caught?
Yes. We intend to add this possibility down the line (V2 or 3).

8. If the crowdfunder is not successful, meaning we don't reach our goal of 130,000 USD worth of BTC within the 30 day window, we will proceed to release the frontend under the GPL3 license without releasing the backend. The delegate buyback commences nonetheless and we will buyback the tokens in the same manner. No BTC can be taken back.

That seems like such a shame. What if the amount raised in 30 days was 120,000 USD? I'm sure people donating would rather see a cut in the 15% interest and get the MIT license rather than get nothing at all. If the first few months of delegate pay is sold to cover the deficit with interest, the amount of BTS estimated to be collected over the remaining months in the 30 month window can be used to calculate the new (lower) buyback rate.
Yes that would be a shame. We are pretty confident though that we will reach our goal. The community has been responding very positively.
We are aiming to create a market solution for the creation of public goods. Combing a pure charity and for-profit model would in our opinion evolve the system into an unstable equilibrium. We have already plans how to potentially solve this dilemma for future Bitshares related projects but that would require our module based approach to be final and tested. Something which will take several more months.

One more thing. If we reach our fundraising goal we also pledge that V2 and V3 of the wallet will also be open source MIT licensed, the only potential exception being the ID verification module.

I'm curious regarding how the module system works. I expect to be able to compile (and audit) the client code myself for security reasons. So would these modules be plugins (some of which can be proprietary and pre-compiled) that the open source client can use? If so I would want to make sure that these plugins are in their own secure process sandbox because otherwise you would allow unknown proprietary code to have memory access to the client which they could use to steal private keys.
If you'd like to read up on it here is the official FBP page (http://www.jpaulmorrison.com/fbp/). We are using specifically noflo (http://noflojs.org/). V1 won't be FBP though but V2 and onward will be. We are currently switching the entire team to FBP as by our calculations it will increase our productivity several fold. You can read up on what new technology future we are actively preparing for here (https://medium.com/@itnom/the-best-way-to-predict-the-future-is-to-create-it-6b3251d9e701).
The ID verification module would not be client side, hence no memory access to your local machine.

You can't please everyone.
Agreed.

Can we do something like this through Bitshares? https://www.jumpstartfund.com
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 08, 2015, 03:57:43 pm
I'm sure you are aware of jcalfee's work on Bitshares-JS, do you intend to build on that work at all?

We used it as a good starting point. jcalfee also helped us with some explanations from time to time via skype.

Can we do something like this through Bitshares? https://www.jumpstartfund.com

Yes :D

We think with Flow Based Programming we could do some even better stuff in the future!
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fuzzy on April 08, 2015, 04:12:02 pm
You can't please everyone.
;)
This man is wise ^
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on April 08, 2015, 06:20:20 pm
I'm sure you are aware of jcalfee's work on Bitshares-JS, do you intend to build on that work at all?

We used it as a good starting point. jcalfee also helped us with some explanations from time to time via skype.
Yeha .. I like that guy alot .. and his code is crystal clear to read ...
Most of the python code i wrote for my cold storage solution (https://github.com/xeroc/python-bitsharestools/blob/master/bitsharestools/transactions.py) was no brainer having jcalfee's code as a base
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 08, 2015, 09:40:03 pm
The buy-back will take place what period basis, weekly or daily? (or monthly, yearly???)
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 08, 2015, 10:52:50 pm
The buy-back will take place what period basis, weekly or daily? (or monthly, yearly???)

The bids for the buyback will be set automatically daily on the BitShares exchange. BitShares treates all bids and asks FIFO.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 09, 2015, 01:01:07 pm
Hi Everybody!

The Moonstone fundraiser has officially started!

Use this link if you don't already use the current wallet and would like to start from scratch with Moonstone https://moonstone.io/. A custom simple wallet backup will be generated for you and you MOONFUND tokens (the official Moonstone fundraiser tokens) will be sent within 1 Bitcoin confirmation to your newly generated BTS addres!

If you'd like to actively trade MOONFUND tokens in the meanwhile, and already have a TITAN ID with the current BitShares wallet, you can use this alternative link: https://metaexchange.info/markets/MOONFUND/BTC

Both work the same way.

We will release a short howto video over the next 2-3 days of how to import your wallet file if you want to start trading MOONFUND tokens to your existing BitShares wallet.

Please ask all your questions in this official Moonstone help thread:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15601.0.html
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on April 09, 2015, 01:04:50 pm
cool ... yet another nice token on the chain :) +5%
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: rgcrypto on April 09, 2015, 04:52:41 pm
cool ... yet another nice token on the chain :) +5%

Can't wait to try your platform out. Hope we get to 150k!
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 09, 2015, 04:55:54 pm
I've tried out:  https://metaexchange.info/markets/MOONFUND/BTC


Very smooth.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 09, 2015, 06:05:44 pm
My first donation has 8 bitcoin confirmations - but the funded amount on moonstone.io hasn't budged from $3,797  -  2.92%funded.

I'm not worried - my MOONFUND shares showed up in my wallet after 1 confirmation. Just wondering and wanting to be able to see the progress.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on April 09, 2015, 06:14:02 pm
My first donation has 8 bitcoin confirmations - but the funded amount on moonstone.io hasn't budged from $3,797  -  2.92%funded.
I'm not worried - my MOONFUND shares showed up in my wallet after 1 confirmation. Just wondering and wanting to be able to see the progress.

I sent Taulant at Moonstone an extensively detailed email about this earlier today. I'm sure he's swamped right now, but he should be adding an angular/jquery update feature to the crowdfunding page regarding this issue. That was one of the topics I brought up with him today as well :)
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 09, 2015, 08:42:38 pm
My first donation has 8 bitcoin confirmations - but the funded amount on moonstone.io hasn't budged from $3,797  -  2.92%funded.

I'm not worried - my MOONFUND shares showed up in my wallet after 1 confirmation. Just wondering and wanting to be able to see the progress.

The bar is being updated manually at the moment as our Metaexchange integration script was insufficient to handle some exceptions. We'll fix that by tomorrow.

Your donations will all go to good use, that is important!
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 09, 2015, 08:55:20 pm
If kind of screenshot, or demo video is provided in pace with the launch, it would be better. People still cannot believe why Moonstone is important and how it is awesome.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 09, 2015, 08:58:37 pm
If kind of screenshot, or demo video is provided in pace with the launch, it would be better. People still cannot believe why Moonstone is important and how it is awesome.

Great Idea clayop!

I think a row of videos and giving more visual importance to the potential 15% return might be super important.

Anything else we should add or change?
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 09, 2015, 09:11:36 pm
Trezor compatibility is being tested. Initial tests look promising.

If we reach our funding we'll definitely add Trezor compatibility to our milestones!
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15604.0.html

(http://i.imgur.com/1mdNHTm.jpg)
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 09, 2015, 09:16:29 pm
Official Metaexchange and Bitsapphire cooperation announcement https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15607.0.html
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Troglodactyl on April 09, 2015, 11:00:41 pm
If kind of screenshot, or demo video is provided in pace with the launch, it would be better. People still cannot believe why Moonstone is important and how it is awesome.

Great Idea clayop!

I think a row of videos and giving more visual importance to the potential 15% return might be super important.

Anything else we should add or change?

^ This.  No offence, but at this point there's no actual video showing anything that works (as far as I know), and no publicly accessible source code.  The more you can show people to convince them it isn't vaporware, the more comfortable they'll be contributing.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: vlight on April 09, 2015, 11:11:58 pm
If kind of screenshot, or demo video is provided in pace with the launch, it would be better. People still cannot believe why Moonstone is important and how it is awesome.

Great Idea clayop!

I think a row of videos and giving more visual importance to the potential 15% return might be super important.

Anything else we should add or change?

^ This.  No offence, but at this point there's no actual video showing anything that works (as far as I know), and no publicly accessible source code.  The more you can show people to convince them it isn't vaporware, the more comfortable they'll be contributing.

Have you seen this video ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0FU0OyaB94
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Troglodactyl on April 09, 2015, 11:49:29 pm
If kind of screenshot, or demo video is provided in pace with the launch, it would be better. People still cannot believe why Moonstone is important and how it is awesome.

Great Idea clayop!

I think a row of videos and giving more visual importance to the potential 15% return might be super important.

Anything else we should add or change?

^ This.  No offence, but at this point there's no actual video showing anything that works (as far as I know), and no publicly accessible source code.  The more you can show people to convince them it isn't vaporware, the more comfortable they'll be contributing.

Have you seen this video ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0FU0OyaB94

No, I had not, thank you.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Ander on April 10, 2015, 12:34:41 am
So what happens if after the moonstone wallet is released, the community doesnt vote in the proposed moonstone delegates?



Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 10, 2015, 12:45:28 am
So what happens if after the moonstone wallet is released, the community doesnt vote in the proposed moonstone delegates?

Investors like me lose our investment. You're welcome.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: arhag on April 10, 2015, 03:21:19 am
So what happens if after the moonstone wallet is released, the community doesnt vote in the proposed moonstone delegates?

Then your donation to fund a public good and hopefully make some profit as well just becomes a donation to fund a public good.
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on April 10, 2015, 06:42:33 am
Trezor compatibility is being tested. Initial tests look promising.

If we reach our funding we'll definitely add Trezor compatibility to our milestones!
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15604.0.html
you are talking trezor for Bitcoin .. or trezor for BitShares?
Title: Re: [FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 10, 2015, 06:50:40 am
Trezor compatibility is being tested. Initial tests look promising.

If we reach our funding we'll definitely add Trezor compatibility to our milestones!
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15604.0.html
you are talking trezor for Bitcoin .. or trezor for BitShares?

He says BitShares: 
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15604.msg200759.html#msg200759
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 10, 2015, 09:48:56 pm
It seems that there is such a strong interest to donate BTS rather than BTC our crowdfunder that some people are thinking about buying MOONFUND tokens on the internal exchange straight with BTS. (See this thread https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15663.0/topicseen.html)

We're opening therefore a poll to see whether enough people are interested in us putting a sell order of Moonstones at about 0.9-0.92 BTS on the internal exchange. This way almost everybody should be able to participate (though at a slightly lower potential return rate, as we still need to cash out to fiat for operations). We would then also need to update the funds collected on the website manually a few times a day.

Please let us know what you think, and please vote in the poll!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: rgcrypto on April 10, 2015, 09:52:11 pm
It seems that there is such a strong interest to donate BTS rather than BTC our crowdfunder that some people are thinking about buying MOONFUND tokens on the internal exchange straight with BTS. (See this thread https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15663.0/topicseen.html)

We're opening therefore a poll to see whether enough people are interested in us putting a sell order of Moonstones at about 0.9-0.92 BTS on the internal exchange. This way almost everybody should be able to participate (though at a slightly lower potential return rate, as we still need to cash out to fiat for operations). We would then also need to update the funds collected on the website manually a few times a day.

Please let us know what you think, and please vote in the poll!

Where is the poll?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 10, 2015, 10:04:15 pm
It seems that there is such a strong interest to donate BTS rather than BTC our crowdfunder that some people are thinking about buying MOONFUND tokens on the internal exchange straight with BTS. (See this thread https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15663.0/topicseen.html)

We're opening therefore a poll to see whether enough people are interested in us putting a sell order of Moonstones at about 0.9-0.92 BTS on the internal exchange. This way almost everybody should be able to participate (though at a slightly lower potential return rate, as we still need to cash out to fiat for operations). We would then also need to update the funds collected on the website manually a few times a day.

Please let us know what you think, and please vote in the poll!

Where is the poll?

At the top of this thread!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Bitcoinfan on April 10, 2015, 10:17:25 pm
How are you going to exchange to fiat?  You'll have to convert to btc then to fiat which will still drive down the price?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 10, 2015, 10:20:30 pm
How are you going to exchange to fiat?  You'll have to convert to btc then to fiat which will still drive down the price?

If he just agrees to spread it out over a longer time period than 30 days then everything is good.  I don't see why he would need to change all donations to BTC/fiat right away anyway. His costs are presumably spread out over time.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on April 10, 2015, 11:46:21 pm
How are you going to exchange to fiat?  You'll have to convert to btc then to fiat which will still drive down the price?

If he just agrees to spread it out over a longer time period than 30 days then everything is good.  I don't see why he would need to change all donations to BTC/fiat right away anyway. His costs are presumably spread out over time.
^^ This and voted on the poll.Obviously 'yes'  of course.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: botfund on April 11, 2015, 02:02:50 am
It's a pity that moonstone can't use bitUSD directly and that's why we desperately need a USD bridge like what tradebts do for bitCNY<->CNY. They need fiat for operation anyway. A USD<->bitUSD bridge will make this easier without exposure to BTC price.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 11, 2015, 02:57:52 am
If he just agrees to spread it out over a longer time period than 30 days then everything is good.  I don't see why he would need to change all donations to BTC/fiat right away anyway. His costs are presumably spread out over time.

 +5%
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: merivercap on April 11, 2015, 06:28:46 am
It seems that there is such a strong interest to donate BTS rather than BTC our crowdfunder that some people are thinking about buying MOONFUND tokens on the internal exchange straight with BTS. (See this thread https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15663.0/topicseen.html)

We're opening therefore a poll to see whether enough people are interested in us putting a sell order of Moonstones at about 0.9-0.92 BTS on the internal exchange. This way almost everybody should be able to participate (though at a slightly lower potential return rate, as we still need to cash out to fiat for operations). We would then also need to update the funds collected on the website manually a few times a day.

Please let us know what you think, and please vote in the poll!

I think the more options the better so this is a good idea. 
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 11, 2015, 06:39:51 am
The bottom of the page at   http://whatarenotes.info/    talks about integration with Moonstone.

Sounds cool.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: rgcrypto on April 11, 2015, 06:36:38 pm
The MineBitshares project is interested in promoting Moonstone on its website as the wallet for miners once it is released. Would you mind if our branding colors matched? ;-)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Shentist on April 12, 2015, 08:48:02 am
What should you do to get a better understanding for your fundraiser!

1. Get a demo our a good video out, where you show, what you have already. So that anybody is aware, if we want to have moonstone as an open-source asset in the BitShares ecosystem. I think this
is one thing, that is for an investor not solved - what do i support here? So give us a chance to get a feeling of moonstone. I think you are not showing this beauty at all :D

2. Accepting BitShares as payment and maybe fix your counterparty risk.

On MetaExchange we have on a daily basis more buyers then sellers of BitShares, so we can offer you to get you BitShares out on a better rate, but not in one move. This could help you and the BitShares
community to get us to the funding goal faster. I don't know the timeframe you need the USD value out to pay your stuff in FIAT, but this could one stone to help us, to get your project faster to the goal. You could store the value in bitUSD as long as you have to convert it into FIAT.

3. Promote more in the Bitcoin community

Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 12, 2015, 12:00:49 pm
Based on everybody's feedback so far we've put together e redesign of our website and upgraded the donation flow.

To make sure everything is working correctly we'll pause the donation drive for a few hours.

In other good news, we'll put up MOONFUND tokens at 0.9 to BTS on the internal exchange today (Sunday).

Thanks everybody for your great feedback! Keep an eye out for some good news!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 12, 2015, 11:49:54 pm
About 50 mil MOONFUND is on sale in the internal market with 15% profit rate. I regret buying early...  :'(
Anyway, GO MOONSTONE!

Edit: It's from Moonstone. So unofficial fundraising in BTS started. (Announcement will be released tomorrow, Taulant said)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: testz on April 13, 2015, 10:40:35 am
Based on everybody's feedback so far we've put together e redesign of our website and upgraded the donation flow.

To make sure everything is working correctly we'll pause the donation drive for a few hours.

In other good news, we'll put up MOONFUND tokens at 0.9 to BTS on the internal exchange today (Sunday).

Thanks everybody for your great feedback! Keep an eye out for some good news!

Nice! Thanks! Why not at 0.85 (15% rate)?

Right now I see the order at 0.870 BTS
https://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on April 13, 2015, 10:48:53 am
Nice! Thanks! Why not at 0.85 (15% rate)?
Because of the spread when they have to convert towards FIAT ..
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on April 13, 2015, 01:17:11 pm
Based on everybody's feedback so far we've put together e redesign of our website and upgraded the donation flow.

To make sure everything is working correctly we'll pause the donation drive for a few hours.

In other good news, we'll put up MOONFUND tokens at 0.9 to BTS on the internal exchange today (Sunday).

Thanks everybody for your great feedback! Keep an eye out for some good news!

Nice! Thanks! Why not at 0.85 (15% rate)?

Right now I see the order at 0.870 BTS
https://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND
0.87 is as close to 15% as it gets (1/0.87 is 14.94%) - What I mean is they never promised 15% discount they promised 15% return.

So, basically they have changed all to what I initially wanted them to do - 1. offer the return in BTS (not USD); 2. Doing their funding in a may that has the least negative effect on the BTS price. (i.e. IOU priced in BTS not in BTC; selling the IOUs in BTC required the sell of BTS first before sponsoring their project, in the most likely cases).

The only questions remaining are: 1. Why the need to start doing it the wrong way and change midway through the process 2.At what time frame they will need to convert to actually fiat (hopefully many months, but pretty likely more than the remaining 27 days) 3.Will they actually meet the 130K USD goal 4. How long its gonna take to repay the amounts collected.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 13, 2015, 05:58:45 pm
Based on everybody's feedback so far we've put together e redesign of our website and upgraded the donation flow.

To make sure everything is working correctly we'll pause the donation drive for a few hours.

In other good news, we'll put up MOONFUND tokens at 0.9 to BTS on the internal exchange today (Sunday).

Thanks everybody for your great feedback! Keep an eye out for some good news!

Nice! Thanks! Why not at 0.85 (15% rate)?

Right now I see the order at 0.870 BTS
https://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND

If you flip the market, you will see 1.15 MOONFUND/BTS
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: carpet ride on April 13, 2015, 06:09:59 pm

Based on everybody's feedback so far we've put together e redesign of our website and upgraded the donation flow.

To make sure everything is working correctly we'll pause the donation drive for a few hours.

In other good news, we'll put up MOONFUND tokens at 0.9 to BTS on the internal exchange today (Sunday).

Thanks everybody for your great feedback! Keep an eye out for some good news!

Nice! Thanks! Why not at 0.85 (15% rate)?

Right now I see the order at 0.870 BTS
https://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND
0.87 is as close to 15% as it gets (1/0.87 is 14.94%) - What I mean is they never promised 15% discount they promised 15% return.

So, basically they have changed all to what I initially wanted them to do - 1. offer the return in BTS (not USD); 2. Doing their funding in a may that has the least negative effect on the BTS price. (i.e. IOU priced in BTS not in BTC; selling the IOUs in BTC required the sell of BTS first before sponsoring their project, in the most likely cases).

The only questions remaining are: 1. Why the need to start doing it the wrong way and change midway through the process 2.At what time frame they will need to convert to actually fiat (hopefully many months, but pretty likely more than the remaining 27 days) 3.Will they actually meet the 130K USD goal 4. How long its gonna take to repay the amounts collected.

And Will enough funds be used in their wallet to get the delegates elected?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 14, 2015, 01:31:54 am
Their FAQ is great!

https://moonstone.io/faq.php
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on April 14, 2015, 07:48:43 am
Their FAQ is great!
https://moonstone.io/faq.php

 +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 14, 2015, 10:47:44 am
Update

We just released the update to our fundraiser site https://moonstone.io/. You can now donate to our fundraiser again through our site.

We have also added an FAQ section based on the community's feedback so far here https://moonstone.io/faq.php. We will continue to update the FAQ as things progress.

You can now also buy MOONFUND tokens directly at the full 15% discount from the internal exchange. As of this writing 500k BTS have already been donated. We will update our crowdfunder script accordingly today to reflect the funds collected in terms of BTS too (it currently only reflects BTC collected).

Soon we will put up a Q&A thread on the forum. These questons will then become part of the FAQ on the website and we'll record a video answering all questions.

Thanks everybody for the support! We are on good track!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on April 14, 2015, 11:20:43 am
Update

We just released the update to our fundraiser site https://moonstone.io/. You can now donate to our fundraiser again through our site.

We have also added an FAQ section based on the community's feedback so far here https://moonstone.io/faq.php. We will continue to update the FAQ as things progress.

You can now also buy MOONFUND tokens directly at the full 15% discount from the internal exchange. As of this writing 500k BTS have already been donated. We will update our crowdfunder script accordingly today to reflect the funds collected in terms of BTS too (it currently only reflects BTC collected).

Soon we will put up a Q&A thread on the forum. These questons will then become part of the FAQ on the website and we'll record a video answering all questions.

Thanks everybody for the support! We are on good track!
+5%!

A new question: Having donated BTS .. how would you calculate the USD price for it for the fundraising? Are you counting them as the USD value they currently have without selling them .. or are you going to add the USD value incrementally as you sell BTS for BTC for USD?

Also, is there are way for us to verify the fundraising? With each donor having it's own bitcoin address we cannot see how much was really donated ... not that I wouldn't trust you (:
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Overthetop on April 14, 2015, 11:29:14 am
Where to find the introduction of the Moonstone Tokens ?

thanks

=======

I have found the answer from the link below :

https://moonstone.io/faq.php

Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: yellowecho on April 14, 2015, 04:28:50 pm
We just released the update to our fundraiser site https://moonstone.io/. You can now donate to our fundraiser again through our site.

Site is down
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: nomoreheroes7 on April 14, 2015, 04:29:48 pm
We just released the update to our fundraiser site https://moonstone.io/. You can now donate to our fundraiser again through our site.

Site is down

Works ok for me.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on April 14, 2015, 07:08:33 pm
I wonder why the fundraising counter hasn't changed for quite some time although I bought some today :\
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 14, 2015, 07:17:04 pm
I wonder why the fundraising counter hasn't changed for quite some time although I bought some today :\
I don't think the stats from the internal market are showing up yet. I bought some yesterday.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on April 14, 2015, 07:46:07 pm
Yeah, I think it would be cool if it showed the exact number of donations received via angular/jquery,  similar to how shapeshift does it.
It shows that cool progress bar when it's waiting, receiving, then when the donation has been posted.
nuthin beats real-time :)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Shentist on April 16, 2015, 08:16:35 pm
so website is back moonstone.io (http://moonstone.io)

 you can now buy internal with BTS http://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND  (http://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND) official price is at 0.87 BTS

the only thing we want to see is the wallet. I hope you can provide a better video, so that we can all get excited to buy MOONFUND.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on April 16, 2015, 08:30:15 pm
Hey Shentist, check out my latest tweet.........
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 16, 2015, 10:52:34 pm
The crowdfunder bar in https://moonstone.io/ now updates in real time (after the first BTC confirmation), and also takes into account the BTS donations on the internal market.

You can also see more of the Moonstone wallet interface here https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (click around!).

Updates and a newsletter coming soon!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: yellowecho on April 16, 2015, 11:02:11 pm
The crowdfunder bar in https://moonstone.io/ now updates in real time (after the first BTC confirmation), and also takes into account the BTS donations on the internal market.

You can also see more of the Moonstone wallet interface here https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (click around!).

Updates and a newsletter coming soon!

Looks cool
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 16, 2015, 11:41:52 pm
The crowdfunder bar in https://moonstone.io/ now updates in real time (after the first BTC confirmation), and also takes into account the BTS donations on the internal market.

You can also see more of the Moonstone wallet interface here https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (click around!).

Updates and a newsletter coming soon!

Wow nice job
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chronos on April 17, 2015, 03:40:02 pm
The crowdfunder bar in https://moonstone.io/ now updates in real time
Excellent. By the way, the dollar sign should go before the number, for example, $13,000 and not 13,000$. Having it on the wrong side is hurting your professional appearance.  :)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: lil_jay890 on April 17, 2015, 04:04:21 pm
At the current pace it doesn't seem like you will reach your crowdfunding goal... I'm not sure if money commonly flows in to a project near the end of the fund raising term.  Would you consider extending the crowdfunding term?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: rgcrypto on April 17, 2015, 04:07:26 pm
The crowdfunder bar in https://moonstone.io/ now updates in real time
Excellent. By the way, the dollar sign should go before the number, for example, $13,000 and not 13,000$. Having it on the wrong side is hurting your professional appearance.  :)

I am from Quebec, Canada and because of our European ties we actually write is this way: 13,000$. So from where he is from, it's probably not on the "wrong" side.

Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chronos on April 17, 2015, 04:40:21 pm
we actually write is this way: 13,000$.
I should have known. There are so many ways to punctuate money amounts, around the world!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on April 17, 2015, 04:45:46 pm
At the current pace it doesn't seem like you will reach your crowdfunding goal... I'm not sure if money commonly flows in to a project near the end of the fund raising term.  Would you consider extending the crowdfunding term?

there are around 500k bts which are not reflected on the crowd fund bar yet IIRC.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: mint chocolate chip on April 17, 2015, 05:17:13 pm
we actually write is this way: 13,000$.
I should have known. There are so many ways to punctuate money amounts, around the world!
It is on the wrong side if directly below it the $ sign is used on the opposite side.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitmeat on April 18, 2015, 02:16:53 am
So what does MOONFUND really give you?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on April 19, 2015, 10:40:48 pm

Remind me again. What is the plan for the Moonfund donors in the unlikely scenario that you do not meet your goal of 130K USD? How if at all do you plan to make such sponsors/donors whole?

Is it again the same principle - try to get N delegates elected and buy the Moonfund token at 1 BTS a piece? Or will those donations be treated as no string attached tips and no attempt will be made to pay them back?


PS
Do not get me wrong... I love Moonstone (as well as the Moon and The Stones), but just trying to decide on most appropriate trading strategy for my moonfund tokens. And for that I need clarity on the rules.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: yellowecho on April 19, 2015, 11:17:51 pm
Do not get me wrong... I love Moonstone (as well as the Moon and The Stones), but just trying to decide on most appropriate trading strategy for my moonfund tokens. And for that I need clarity on the rules.

This so hard.  I haven't donated yet because it's unclear to me how this whole thing is going to be handled.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on April 20, 2015, 04:23:16 am

Remind me again. What is the plan for the Moonfund donors in the unlikely scenario that you do not meet your goal of 130K USD? How if at all do you plan to make such sponsors/donors whole?

Is it again the same principle - try to get N delegates elected and buy the Moonfund token at 1 BTS a piece? Or will those donations be treated as no string attached tips and no attempt will be made to pay them back?


PS
Do not get me wrong... I love Moonstone (as well as the Moon and The Stones), but just trying to decide on most appropriate trading strategy for my moonfund tokens. And for that I need clarity on the rules.

It's my understanding that no matter what the result the delegates are the payback mechanism.. assuming they are voted in.

I made some recommendations tonight in the marketing meeting on how this fund could best see it's way to success. It still has 50 days to go.. so I think it has a good chance at making it if they take the direction of targeting other markets. I can see some good things coming down the pipeline with the coverage.. now this needs developers support.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on April 20, 2015, 12:53:58 pm
So what does MOONFUND really give you?

The MOONFUND tokens have value because they will be bought back in terms of BTS in the future through Moonstone delegate income.

Besides the potential profit motive you also help the Bitshares application ecosystem get kickstarted as startups rarely have the funding or time to develop the lower level stack. We want to make higher level service oriented startups easier to build.


Remind me again. What is the plan for the Moonfund donors in the unlikely scenario that you do not meet your goal of 130K USD? How if at all do you plan to make such sponsors/donors whole?

Is it again the same principle - try to get N delegates elected and buy the Moonfund token at 1 BTS a piece? Or will those donations be treated as no string attached tips and no attempt will be made to pay them back?


PS
Do not get me wrong... I love Moonstone (as well as the Moon and The Stones), but just trying to decide on most appropriate trading strategy for my moonfund tokens. And for that I need clarity on the rules.

This so hard.  I haven't donated yet because it's unclear to me how this whole thing is going to be handled.

If we don't reach our goal then we will make just the frontend open source under the more restrictive GPL3 license and keep the backend closed source. 3rd party applications will still be able to use our backend in a trust-less manner very similar to how Chain (https://chain.com/) works. The Bitshares startup ecosystem will in our opinion still profit from this, but open source is always better in our opinion.

Regardless of whether we reach our goal or not, the wallet will be released and all transactions going through our servers will ask for the pre-set (but opt-out) delegate list. We will continue with the buybck of all MOONFUND tokens in the market as planned even if we don't reach our goal.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 20, 2015, 04:29:23 pm
"open source is always better in our opinion"

Community Members:  IMHO, this is an opportunity to give proof to your open source philosophy, create a common (community) good, and increase your BTS hoiding by 15%. What's not to like?

Those of you thinking "well, the wallet will be released anyway" are missing a golden opportunity to demonstrate that open source is the future.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on April 20, 2015, 04:40:24 pm
"open source is always better in our opinion"
Community Members:  IMHO, this is an opportunity to give proof to your open source philosophy, create a common (community) good, and increase your BTS hoiding by 15%. What's not to like?
Those of you thinking "well, the wallet will be released anyway" are missing a golden opportunity to demonstrate that open source is the future.

 +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 20, 2015, 05:01:52 pm
"open source is always better in our opinion"

Community Members:  IMHO, this is an opportunity to give proof to your open source philosophy, create a common (community) good, and increase your BTS hoiding by 15%. What's not to like?

Those of you thinking "well, the wallet will be released anyway" are missing a golden opportunity to demonstrate that open source is the future.

 +5% +5% +5%

Imagine that our killer services, for example GEMspace, has its own tweaked wallet forked from Moonstone (GEMstone?)

Imagine that each gateway has a wallet which integrates on/off-ramp service using Moonstone.

Isn't it awesome?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on April 21, 2015, 03:09:07 am
Xeroc says:

"...this also means there will be no competition to bitUSD .. and that a crosschain capable wallet like moobstone will be desperately needed .. IMHO .. this news should pump their fundraising .. +5%"

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15672.msg201244.html#msg201244
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 21, 2015, 03:36:49 am
Xeroc says:

"...this also means there will be no competition to bitUSD .. and that a crosschain capable wallet like moobstone will be desperately needed .. IMHO .. this news should pump their fundraising .. +5%"

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,15672.msg201244.html#msg201244

 +5% LOLs for moobstone
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: liondani on April 21, 2015, 07:30:27 am
Normally the worst case scenario is that they will get their $130000, even if that means that bytemaster (and us) comes to the "uncomfortable" condition to buy whatever tokens remains at the "last minute period"...
The problem is that the bigger bitshares supporters are out of fresh money and they have the hope that new money comes in before they need to contribute one more time ....  they  have already to much exposure to BTS(?)...  Just a wild guess...

PS if the delegates get elected, without a successful Fund raise...  When will the project get open source ?... Because even with a delay you will collect the funds...

Sent from my ALCATEL ONE TOUCH 997D

Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on April 22, 2015, 11:21:30 pm
I noticed that the fundraising period is extended to 2 months. Will the second month provide the same profit rate? (1.15)

PS. I agree with liondani's statement. Big supporters are out of fresh money due to Music and Play. Once their price goes up significantly with enough liquidity, we will see big chunk of donations.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Ander on April 22, 2015, 11:42:24 pm
$130k could buy more than 26 million BTS.  Imagine what would happen if people bought up and held 26 million BTS, or 10% of the total BTS available on btc38. 

Given that prices have recently been stable with very little buying or selling pressure, this would probably break the downtrend and get traders buying BTS again. 

But no, gotta suck $130k out the bitshares community, already sucked dry by music, play, and buying up dilution shares.

Enjoy your IOUs for BTS instead of actual BTS which you could be buying right now.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on April 23, 2015, 06:33:10 am
there's an easy way to make a bitcoin faucet with xapo ( http://makebucks.today/how-to-free-xapo-bitcoin-faucet/ ) - will something like this be possible with moonstone?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on May 06, 2015, 02:21:00 pm
Hello there!

In this Youtube video we have answered most of the questions you have about the Moonstone wallet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhyyZmiNPn4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhyyZmiNPn4)
You can also listen to it at Soundcloud: https://soundcloud.com/bitsapphire/sound (https://soundcloud.com/bitsapphire/sound)

For any other questions related to the Moonstone wallet, you can ask them here: https://moonstone.io/faq.php#contact (https://moonstone.io/faq.php#contact) and we will answer them as soon as possible!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 07, 2015, 07:23:00 am
I appreciate the moonstone project a lot and I'm willing to donate.
Here is my feedback regarding the crowdfunding process:

1. It would be good if you placed this valuable link https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223) in a more exposed place - in my opinion this link is much more informative than the product demo in the form of a mute YouTube video.

2. When I am trying to donate I am asked to supply a password, a new wallet is created and I'm instructed to download it and keep to safe but there is no explicit guide how to use the new wallet. I guess I could figure it out on my own but it would be much better if I didn't have to. What is badly needed is a step by step guide what to do with the new wallet apart from keeping it safe, i.e. how to access the downloaded wallet and see the purchased Moonstone Tokes.

3. Currently the donation mechanism is not working - when I try to donate I get stuck with the message "Loading Bitcoin address" and nothing happens.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on May 07, 2015, 02:09:46 pm
I appreciate the moonstone project a lot and I'm willing to donate.
Here is my feedback regarding the crowdfunding process:

1. It would be good if you placed this valuable link https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223) in a more exposed place - in my opinion this link is much more informative than the product demo in the form of a mute YouTube video.

2. When I am trying to donate I am asked to supply a password, a new wallet is created and I'm instructed to download it and keep to safe but there is no explicit guide how to use the new wallet. I guess I could figure it out on my own but it would be much better if I didn't have to. What is badly needed is a step by step guide what to do with the new wallet apart from keeping it safe, i.e. how to access the downloaded wallet and see the purchased Moonstone Tokes.

3. Currently the donation mechanism is not working - when I try to donate I get stuck with the message "Loading Bitcoin address" and nothing happens.

Thank you for your feedback!

1. For the first suggestion, yes, we could do that! But we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week, and that will replace the Marvelapp.
2. After we release the demo version, you will be able to use it, test it, and “play” around with it. As for the “step by step guide”, I don’t think that would be necessary( unless the community wants for it be implemented - after they have used the Moonstone Wallet demo firsthand)
3. We tested the “Donate” button and it’s working fine! If you could take a screenshot of the problem, and send it to us, we would more than appreciate it!

Hopefully we could be of any help to you!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 07, 2015, 03:53:03 pm
I appreciate the moonstone project a lot and I'm willing to donate.
Here is my feedback regarding the crowdfunding process:

1. It would be good if you placed this valuable link https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223) in a more exposed place - in my opinion this link is much more informative than the product demo in the form of a mute YouTube video.

2. When I am trying to donate I am asked to supply a password, a new wallet is created and I'm instructed to download it and keep to safe but there is no explicit guide how to use the new wallet. I guess I could figure it out on my own but it would be much better if I didn't have to. What is badly needed is a step by step guide what to do with the new wallet apart from keeping it safe, i.e. how to access the downloaded wallet and see the purchased Moonstone Tokes.

3. Currently the donation mechanism is not working - when I try to donate I get stuck with the message "Loading Bitcoin address" and nothing happens.

Thank you for your feedback!

1. For the first suggestion, yes, we could do that! But we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week, and that will replace the Marvelapp.
2. After we release the demo version, you will be able to use it, test it, and “play” around with it. As for the “step by step guide”, I don’t think that would be necessary( unless the community wants for it be implemented - after they have used the Moonstone Wallet demo firsthand)
3. We tested the “Donate” button and it’s working fine! If you could take a screenshot of the problem, and send it to us, we would more than appreciate it!

Hopefully we could be of any help to you!

ad 2. What I meant is this: What am I supposed to do with the downloaded json file (apart from keeping it safe)? Do I import it to my existing BitShares wallet or the new Moonstone wallet once it is released? I've read all the FAQs but still this part of the crowdfunding process is not clear to me.

ad 3. For me it works fine in Chrome but still fails in Firefox (version 37.0.2 on Windows 7). I complete step 1 and after typing and retyping the password I move to step 2 and then get stuck without being able to see the BTC address for donation. Restarting the browser and clearing cache does not help.

The screenshot is here:
(http://neura.sx/bts/ms.png)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 08, 2015, 03:42:26 pm
@bitsapphire
As I understand the Moonstone wallet is a light wallet holding the user's private key whereas the entire blockchain is stored on the server. In your public announcements you have mentioned that your team had to dive deep into the BitShares source code, understand how it works and then create a customized RPC layer on top on the BitShares client so that your web wallet can talk to it.
My question is this: how is your RPC solution different from the one used by the official web client? (i.e the one available here https://wallet.bitshares.org (https://wallet.bitshares.org)). Why did you choose to create your own RPC layer instead of using the solution BitShares devs must have used to create the "official" light wallet?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: maverica on May 10, 2015, 08:29:28 am
@jakub

The downloaded JSON file is a wallet on its own. You can import it to your favorite client and the MOONFUNDS will be available to you through that wallet. You can either transfer these assets to your main account or keep them there. Depending on how are we doing time-wise we might get a mini-guide on how to access Moonfunds out there. Thanks for the idea its a good one!

As for the RPC client layer, we have created a few algorithms that will bring real time updated wallet to the masses. We have brought the design and user interface to a whole new level. We are also planning to integrate other coins and possible exchanges, thus creating a one-stop wallet and increasing liquidity among crypto world. On the second version we will bring forward identities manager which is in a sense verified accounts thus bringing more trust to the crypto-sphere and allowing entities to trade within each other. For all of our plans to work we need a custom layer between the actual blockchain and web implementation. There is a blockchain-web gap that needs to become smaller and we are working on it :).

-Dite from Bitsapphire
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 10, 2015, 09:43:04 am
The downloaded JSON file is a wallet on its own. You can import it to your favorite client and the MOONFUNDS will be available to you through that wallet. You can either transfer these assets to your main account or keep them there.

Thanks for the explanation, it seems clear now.
You should definitely add this information to your FAQ (or maybe even directly in Step 2 in your crowdfunding process) because otherwise people might feel confused. In my case I was about to donate but this information gap stopped me from doing so because I felt unsure what was going to happen.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Permie on May 10, 2015, 11:32:23 am
Thanks for the explanation, it seems clear now.
You should definitely add this information to your FAQ (or maybe even directly in Step 2 in your crowdfunding process) because otherwise people might feel confused. In my case I was about to donate but this information gap stopped me from doing so because I felt unsure what was going to happen.
+5%

I also can't find a way to donate in bts.
I've been using metaexchange.info to donate but they only swap btc/moonfund and not bts/moonfund.
I chose metaexchange and I didn't understand why I needed to create a new wallet on the moonstone.io site just to donate.
One great feature of BitShares is the ability to send to an account name with stealth addresses. Why can't I use the bts client to send bts to 'moonstone.funder' (example) and 10 seconds later receive my Moondfund UIA's back to the account that sent the transaction?

I think Moonstone is a key feature that BitShares needs but I don't think the crowdfunder process as it is now is intuitive enough to capture the 2 second attention span of potential donors
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: maqifrnswa on May 10, 2015, 03:50:09 pm
I also can't find a way to donate in bts.

the moonstone team is accepting donations in bts through the internal exchange. Just buy moonfund from them:
https://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: maverica on May 11, 2015, 04:08:06 am
I also can't find a way to donate in bts.

the moonstone team is accepting donations in bts through the internal exchange. Just buy moonfund from them:
https://bitsharesblocks.com/asset/orderbook?asset=MOONFUND

 +5%
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: monsterer on May 11, 2015, 09:11:33 am
I chose metaexchange and I didn't understand why I needed to create a new wallet on the moonstone.io site just to donate.

You don't need to do that - you can just type in your bitshares account name (on metaexchange.info), pay with BTC and the MOONFUND will be sent directly to your bitshares account.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 11, 2015, 10:24:48 am
You don't need to do that - you can just type in your bitshares account name (on metaexchange.info), pay with BTC and the MOONFUND will be sent directly to your bitshares account.
Thanks for that. It is really simple as it should be.
This makes me wonder why this straightforward approach has not been used on moonstone.io (http://moonstone.io). Why all this hassle with creating and downloading a json file and then importing it into a wallet if the same result can be accomplished in one simple metaexchange transaction?
Unless I'm missing something.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on May 11, 2015, 10:43:08 am
You don't need to do that - you can just type in your bitshares account name (on metaexchange.info), pay with BTC and the MOONFUND will be sent directly to your bitshares account.
Thanks for that. It is really simple as it should be.
This makes me wonder why this straightforward approach has not been used on moonstone.io (http://moonstone.io). Why all this hassle with creating and downloading a json file and then importing it into a wallet if the same result can be accomplished in one simple metaexchange transaction?
Unless I'm missing something.
You miss that people may want to join funding that DO NOT have an account yet .. :)

Btw .. moonstine.io uses metaexchange for this internally
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 11, 2015, 11:02:50 am
You don't need to do that - you can just type in your bitshares account name (on metaexchange.info), pay with BTC and the MOONFUND will be sent directly to your bitshares account.
Thanks for that. It is really simple as it should be.
This makes me wonder why this straightforward approach has not been used on moonstone.io (http://moonstone.io). Why all this hassle with creating and downloading a json file and then importing it into a wallet if the same result can be accomplished in one simple metaexchange transaction?
Unless I'm missing something.
You miss that people may want to join funding that DO NOT have an account yet .. :)

Btw .. moonstine.io uses metaexchange for this internally
That's a good point.
So on their webpage they should say: "If you already have a BitShares account go to metaexchange where you can buy our tokens with BTC. If you don't - proceed to our crowdfunding gateway and you will be able to import the downloaded the json file into our new wallet once it is released."
(Please note that I'm not complaining, I'm just trying to help them raise the funds.)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on May 13, 2015, 01:13:26 pm
You don't need to do that - you can just type in your bitshares account name (on metaexchange.info), pay with BTC and the MOONFUND will be sent directly to your bitshares account.
Thanks for that. It is really simple as it should be.
This makes me wonder why this straightforward approach has not been used on moonstone.io (http://moonstone.io). Why all this hassle with creating and downloading a json file and then importing it into a wallet if the same result can be accomplished in one simple metaexchange transaction?
Unless I'm missing something.
You miss that people may want to join funding that DO NOT have an account yet .. :)

Btw .. moonstine.io uses metaexchange for this internally
That's a good point.
So on their webpage they should say: "If you already have a BitShares account go to metaexchange where you can buy our tokens with BTC. If you don't - proceed to our crowdfunding gateway and you will be able to import the downloaded the json file into our new wallet once it is released."
(Please note that I'm not complaining, I'm just trying to help them raise the funds.)

Thank you for your suggestion, Jakub.
We added this information on https://moonstone.io/
(http://i.imgur.com/XgcgIdW.png)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on May 13, 2015, 01:17:49 pm
We also got some great news!
Factom and bitsapphire teamed up to create an Identity Management System for the Moonstone Wallet.
"Bitsapphire will be creating a new level of KYC for their Moonstone crypto wallet. It will allow users to transfer and trade among Bitcoin, BitAssets, User-Issued Assets, and other tokens. It will be available in the next 6-12 months with customer identification via the Factom protocol."
You can check this link for more information: http://blog.factom.org/post/118735295389/fun-new-things-happening-at-factom
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on May 13, 2015, 01:58:02 pm
We also got some great news!
Factom and bitsapphire teamed up to create an Identity Management System for the Moonstone Wallet.
"Bitsapphire will be creating a new level of KYC for their Moonstone crypto wallet. It will allow users to transfer and trade among Bitcoin, BitAssets, User-Issued Assets, and other tokens. It will be available in the next 6-12 months with customer identification via the Factom protocol."
You can check this link for more information: http://blog.factom.org/post/118735295389/fun-new-things-happening-at-factom

That is indeed great news...for factom that is.

It was not enough that peertracks are ripping the benefits of moonstone and not paying a dime, but now we have a new project that is milking Bitshares. Very nice thank you!

Do you have other project interested in bitshares money? I am hearing the left arm of factom - mastercoin is not doing so great? Don't they want to milk of BTS as well. Why the wait? Bring them on. I am sure they can think of feature that moonstone can provide for them...all paid using BTS delegate dilution! How can they say 'No'?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Akado on May 13, 2015, 02:26:13 pm
We also got some great news!
Factom and bitsapphire teamed up to create an Identity Management System for the Moonstone Wallet.
"Bitsapphire will be creating a new level of KYC for their Moonstone crypto wallet. It will allow users to transfer and trade among Bitcoin, BitAssets, User-Issued Assets, and other tokens. It will be available in the next 6-12 months with customer identification via the Factom protocol."
You can check this link for more information: http://blog.factom.org/post/118735295389/fun-new-things-happening-at-factom

That is indeed great news...for factom that is.

It was not enough that peertracks are ripping the benefits of moonstone and not paying a dime, but now we have a new project that is milking Bitshares. Very nice thank you!

Do you have other project interested in bitshares money? I am hearing the left arm of factom - mastercoin is not doing so great? Don't they want to milk of BTS as well. Why the wait? Bring them on. I am sure they can think of feature that moonstone can provide for them...all paid using BTS delegate dilution! How can they say 'No'?

Indeed. if that depends on the success of the moonstone wallet, why won't those projects fund the $130,000 you need? It's in their best interest to do so.

Might aswell add a powered by BitShares mark on Factom since it's squeezing BTS funds
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 13, 2015, 02:59:10 pm
We also got some great news!
Factom and bitsapphire teamed up to create an Identity Management System for the Moonstone Wallet.
"Bitsapphire will be creating a new level of KYC for their Moonstone crypto wallet. It will allow users to transfer and trade among Bitcoin, BitAssets, User-Issued Assets, and other tokens. It will be available in the next 6-12 months with customer identification via the Factom protocol."
You can check this link for more information: http://blog.factom.org/post/118735295389/fun-new-things-happening-at-factom

That is indeed great news...for factom that is.

It was not enough that peertracks are ripping the benefits of moonstone and not paying a dime, but now we have a new project that is milking Bitshares. Very nice thank you!

Do you have other project interested in bitshares money? I am hearing the left arm of factom - mastercoin is not doing so great? Don't they want to milk of BTS as well. Why the wait? Bring them on. I am sure they can think of feature that moonstone can provide for them...all paid using BTS delegate dilution! How can they say 'No'?

Indeed. if that depends on the success of the moonstone wallet, why won't those projects fund the $130,000 you need? It's in their best interest to do so.

Might aswell add a powered by BitShares mark on Factom since it's squeezing BTS funds

I don't know what this fuss is about. This is what the blog post says:
Quote
They are now building an identity management system backed up by Factom’s API for Moonstone.
Looks like Bitsapphire has chosen Factom’s technology to enhance the new Moonstone wallet - what's wrong with that? Factom is not a competitor for us.
I assume that Factom customers will not be using the wallet - but even if they do, it might be beneficial for us in the long term.
And Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA. Again, what's wrong with that?
(and it just happens that the cause of their fundraising, i.e. their new wallet, might be good for us)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on May 13, 2015, 04:38:18 pm
Thanks great news! That will go a long way towards helping with that element of functionality in moontone.

Are they contributing to the crowdfund also?

We should be days away from the first version of the wallet being made available for download if I recall correctly. From what I recall a lot of people are waiting on that before they contribute.

Please let us know where and when we can try it out!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Troglodactyl on May 13, 2015, 11:00:21 pm
We also got some great news!
Factom and bitsapphire teamed up to create an Identity Management System for the Moonstone Wallet.
"Bitsapphire will be creating a new level of KYC for their Moonstone crypto wallet. It will allow users to transfer and trade among Bitcoin, BitAssets, User-Issued Assets, and other tokens. It will be available in the next 6-12 months with customer identification via the Factom protocol."
You can check this link for more information: http://blog.factom.org/post/118735295389/fun-new-things-happening-at-factom

That is indeed great news...for factom that is.

It was not enough that peertracks are ripping the benefits of moonstone and not paying a dime, but now we have a new project that is milking Bitshares. Very nice thank you!

Do you have other project interested in bitshares money? I am hearing the left arm of factom - mastercoin is not doing so great? Don't they want to milk of BTS as well. Why the wait? Bring them on. I am sure they can think of feature that moonstone can provide for them...all paid using BTS delegate dilution! How can they say 'No'?

Indeed. if that depends on the success of the moonstone wallet, why won't those projects fund the $130,000 you need? It's in their best interest to do so.

Might aswell add a powered by BitShares mark on Factom since it's squeezing BTS funds

I don't know what this fuss is about. This is what the blog post says:
Quote
They are now building an identity management system backed up by Factom’s API for Moonstone.
Looks like Bitsapphire has chosen Factom’s technology to enhance the new Moonstone wallet - what's wrong with that? Factom is not a competitor for us.
I assume that Factom customers will not be using the wallet - but even if they do, it might be beneficial for us in the long term.
And Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA. Again, what's wrong with that?
(and it just happens that the cause of their fundraising, i.e. their new wallet, might be good for us)

Last I heard, BitShares is going to support whitelisting for UIAs natively, and BitSapphire wasn't particularly working with the core devs to make anything compatible.  Funding, making, and marketing a new wallet that relies on a tangle of other blockchains to support the basic features of our blockchain seems inefficient, at best.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on May 13, 2015, 11:33:08 pm
And Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA. Again, what's wrong with that?
(and it just happens that the cause of their fundraising, i.e. their new wallet, might be good for us)

Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA to be exact!

Moonstone benefits Bitshares, peertracks and now factom! yet only BTS is paying for it.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 14, 2015, 07:07:42 am
That is indeed great news...for factom that is.
It was not enough that peertracks are ripping the benefits of moonstone and not paying a dime, but now we have a new project that is milking Bitshares.
Indeed. if that depends on the success of the moonstone wallet, why won't those projects fund the $130,000 you need? It's in their best interest to do so.
Might aswell add a powered by BitShares mark on Factom since it's squeezing BTS funds

I don't know what this fuss is about. This is what the blog post says:
Quote
They are now building an identity management system backed up by Factom’s API for Moonstone.
Looks like Bitsapphire has chosen Factom’s technology to enhance the new Moonstone wallet - what's wrong with that? Factom is not a competitor for us.
I assume that Factom customers will not be using the wallet - but even if they do, it might be beneficial for us in the long term.
And Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA. Again, what's wrong with that?
(and it just happens that the cause of their fundraising, i.e. their new wallet, might be good for us)

Last I heard, BitShares is going to support whitelisting for UIAs natively, and BitSapphire wasn't particularly working with the core devs to make anything compatible.  Funding, making, and marketing a new wallet that relies on a tangle of other blockchains to support the basic features of our blockchain seems inefficient, at best.

Two very important points indeed.
1) Who's going to pay for the Factom/Moonstone integration (please prove it), and
2) Factom is a data layer for the Bitcoin blockchain, NOT for the BitShares blockchain.
 
I like Paul Snow (Factom), I've had long skype calls with him, he is a brilliant guy. I do want to make sure that we are not opening BitShares up to KYC/AML tyranny though. We really don't need to bridge to the Bitcoin POW blockchain either. The Moonstone footprint will only grow at that point too, not good. I'll have a chat with Taulant about this and report back here...
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 14, 2015, 07:57:22 am
Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA to be exact!
But this only happens if people prefer the Moonstone wallet to the "official" wallet.
My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem.
So for me it's a win-win situation and a fair deal offered to us and no information is being hidden from us.
If you don't like it don't use it and you will not pay for it.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 14, 2015, 08:14:52 am
I like Paul Snow (Factom), I've had long skype calls with him, he is a brilliant guy. I do want to make sure that we are not opening BitShares up to KYC/AML tyranny though. We really don't need to bridge to the Bitcoin POW blockchain either. The Moonstone footprint will only grow at that point too, not good. I'll have a chat with Taulant about this and report back here...
Ken, by cooperating with Moonstone we are not opening BitShares up to KYC/AML tyranny. This will never happen as BM has promised many times that MPA assets will never be changed in this respect.
All we are doing is giving a chance for the BitShares gateways to be KYC/AML compliant if they choose or need to go this way. You can still have gateways which take the risk and ignore KYC/AML. The BitShares ecosystem can have both types of gateways and people will have a choice which one they want to use.
So all Moonstone is doing is offer us a choice and is not forcing us to KYC/AML tyranny.
BitShares is about freedom and freedom is about being able to choose. If I want to be operate or use a BitShares gateway which is KYC/AML compliant I should be able to do so.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sumantso on May 14, 2015, 08:32:45 am

Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA to be exact!


Not if they are not elected. Though seeing the voter apathy (see how none supports or opposes pc's market price work), it might be moot.

I still don't get why Peertracks couldn't fund it. Remember, Peertracks raised funds to make their sits, the entire profits of which belong to them. Might as well throw us a bone by funding these diluters.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 14, 2015, 09:44:50 am
Ken, by cooperating with Moonstone we are not opening BitShares up to KYC/AML tyranny. This will never happen as BM has promised many times that MPA assets will never be changed in this respect.

Ok, roger that. I just get a little freaked out every time someone starts talking about "integrating" with these guys or those guys, etc ???
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on May 14, 2015, 12:17:54 pm
Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA to be exact!
But this only happens if people prefer the Moonstone wallet to the "official" wallet.
My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem.
So for me it's a win-win situation and a fair deal offered to us and no information is being hidden from us.
If you don't like it don't use it and you will not pay for it.

It will be nice if you stop  putting false statements (as well as random accusations like this (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16303.msg208863.html#msg208863)) in your posts !

Whether one likes or uses the wallet is of little consequence, she can end up pay for it regardless!

 Even worse the shareholder is put up in a position to make moral decision that is not his responsibility - Do I NOT vote for these investor re-paying delegates and say "Sorry guys, you paid for a good product, but I do not like Bitshares  being the only one paying for product used by so many others. So, NO you are not being paid back", or do I vote for said delegates and let, what seem every other project, suck money out of BTS?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 14, 2015, 01:04:10 pm
It will be nice if you stop  putting false statements (as well as random accusations like this (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16303.msg208863.html#msg208863)) in your posts !
I had my reasons to think it might be you after reading your list of random accusations.
Stan    -   Posting pictures of puppies - [approved]
Methodx   -   Promised great Marketing; Threw some funds in the Deep Web; metaexchange uses the funds as it finds fit till further notice. [edited/ added]
media.bitscape   -   Mainly spending BTS delegate pay on traveling for fun! [added]
provisional.bitscape   -   Keeping company of media.bitscape on his vacations! [added]
At least you now know what it feels like to be randomly accused. But still, if you say it wasn't you I do apologize.

Whether one likes or uses the wallet is of little consequence, she can end up pay for it regardless!

Even worse the shareholder is put up in a position to make moral decision that is not his responsibility - Do I NOT vote for these investor re-paying delegates and say "Sorry guys, you paid for a good product, but I do not like Bitshares  being the only one paying for product used by so many others. So, NO you are not being paid back", or do I vote for said delegates and let, what seem every other project, suck money out of BTS?
I've tried hard but I don't understand what you are trying to say.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on May 14, 2015, 01:20:48 pm
It will be nice if you stop  putting false statements (as well as random accusations like this (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16303.msg208863.html#msg208863)) in your posts !
I had my reasons to think it might be you after reading your list of random accusations.
Stan    -   Posting pictures of puppies - [approved]
Methodx   -   Promised great Marketing; Threw some funds in the Deep Web; metaexchange uses the funds as it finds fit till further notice. [edited/ added]
media.bitscape   -   Mainly spending BTS delegate pay on traveling for fun! [added]
provisional.bitscape   -   Keeping company of media.bitscape on his vacations! [added]
At least you now know what it feels like to be randomly accused. But still, if you say it wasn't you I do apologize.

Whether one likes or uses the wallet is of little consequence, she can end up pay for it regardless!

Even worse the shareholder is put up in a position to make moral decision that is not his responsibility - Do I NOT vote for these investor re-paying delegates and say "Sorry guys, you paid for a good product, but I do not like Bitshares  being the only one paying for product used by so many others. So, NO you are not being paid back", or do I vote for said delegates and let, what seem every other project, suck money out of BTS?
I've tried hard but I don't understand what you are trying to say.

I said it will be nice - not necessary! Feel free to do whatever you like with the accusations part.

For the not understanding part - You put several statement regarding the Moonstone that are not true and  pump the project using incorrect info!

 - "Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA"
False. Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA

- "My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem"
False - Bitsapphire makes profit if the wallet is funded. Its success is a fact with no consequence to their profit!

- "If you don't like it (the moonstone wallet )don't use it and you will not pay for it"
False - You will pay for it even if you have not touched it or do not like it. Paying for it has nothing to do with using it.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 14, 2015, 02:07:55 pm
For the not understanding part - You put several statement regarding the Moonstone that are not true and  pump the project using incorrect info!

 - "Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA"
False. Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA

- "My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem"
False - Bitsapphire makes profit if the wallet is funded. Its success is a fact with no consequence to their profit!

- "If you don't like it (the moonstone wallet )don't use it and you will not pay for it"
False - You will pay for it even if you have not touched it or do not like it. Paying for it has nothing to do with using it.

Bitsapphire offers us a deal which is clear: "Help us to bear the financial risk of launching the wallet and in return we will offer you (and everybody else) a free license to the code".
They never promised anything more and nothing more is included in the deal.
They have the right to make any business alliance they find suitable for them but during the fundraising they should share this information with us which is what they do.

Will it help us if Peertracks is excluded from making use of the wallet? No.
Will it help us if Factom is excluded from making use of the wallet? No.

Personally I don't care who they partner with. All I care for is if they can deliver a good wallet which has a chance for a mass adoption because this is good for the entire BitShares ecosystem.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on May 14, 2015, 03:16:24 pm
For the not understanding part - You put several statement regarding the Moonstone that are not true and  pump the project using incorrect info!

 - "Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA"
False. Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA

- "My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem"
False - Bitsapphire makes profit if the wallet is funded. Its success is a fact with no consequence to their profit!

- "If you don't like it (the moonstone wallet )don't use it and you will not pay for it"
False - You will pay for it even if you have not touched it or do not like it. Paying for it has nothing to do with using it.

Bitsapphire offers us a deal which is clear: "Help us to bear the financial risk of launching the wallet and in return we will offer you (and everybody else) a free license to the code".
They never promised anything more and nothing more is included in the deal.
They have the right to make any business alliance they find suitable for them but during the fundraising they should share this information with us which is what they do.

Will it help us if Peertracks is excluded from making use of the wallet? No.
Will it help us if Factom is excluded from making use of the wallet? No.

Personally I don't care who they partner with. All I care for is if they can deliver a good wallet which has a chance for a mass adoption because this is good for the entire BitShares ecosystem.

If the deal was so innocent why did you decide to pump it using the incorrect statements mentioned above?

Anyway, the market has given a clear answer to the question - "Hey BTS, why don't you give us some money using this convoluted scheme?"

Don't you think?



87%+ needed to target...initial 30 days passed... I would be thinking deep and hard why this went that way, instead of sending shills to fight the truth with lies and incorrect statements, but hey it's only me...
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 14, 2015, 03:17:22 pm
- "Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA"
False. Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA
If they had not issued UIA but borrowed fiat funds from a bank instead and then chose to repay the loan using their delegate pay - would you still say Bitsapphire is using BTS funds??
What they are going to earn through their delegates is THEIR money and not BTS funds any more.

- "My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem"
False - Bitsapphire makes profit if the wallet is funded. Its success is a fact with no consequence to their profit!
You are right.. assuming that it has cost them just $130,000 to create the wallet. I guess it might have been a bit more than this.

- "If you don't like it (the moonstone wallet )don't use it and you will not pay for it"
False - You will pay for it even if you have not touched it or do not like it. Paying for it has nothing to do with using it.
You are right.. but the same is true about a dozen other delegates that you find lazy and worthless yet still your transaction fees go to them.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on May 14, 2015, 03:35:10 pm
- "Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA"
False. Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA
If they had not issued UIA but borrowed fiat funds from a bank instead and then chose to repay the loan using their delegate pay - would you still say Bitsapphire is using BTS funds??
What they are going to earn through their delegates is THEIR money and not BTS funds any more.

No, Bitsapphire already got their money from the IOU investors. Now they are making the shareholders vote delegates to pay the IOU investors. As I said in the other post - convoluted scheme where Bitsapphire get their funds upfront and somebody else is left holding the bag/paying the bill - be it shareholders or IOU investors. They do not care they go their money already.

Quote

- "My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem"
False - Bitsapphire makes profit if the wallet is funded. Its success is a fact with no consequence to their profit!
You are right.. assuming that it has cost them just $130,000 to create the wallet. I guess it might have been a bit more than this.

- "If you don't like it (the moonstone wallet )don't use it and you will not pay for it"
False - You will pay for it even if you have not touched it or do not like it. Paying for it has nothing to do with using it.
You are right.. but the same is true about a dozen other delegates that you find lazy and worthless yet still your transaction fees go to them.


Yup, I thought so...  And yes I am asking generally the same question - "Why not get your asses elected as delegates and get paid for your work...but 'nooo '  you're too smart for that ...you can come with a better scheme to get your money, and faster at that!"

PS
and the "I guess it might have been a bit more than this." comment.. I wouldn't have not done it... you are suspected shill as it is, no need to drop insider info to confirm it.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: liondani on May 14, 2015, 04:07:48 pm
87%+ needed to target...initial 30 days passed... I would be thinking deep and hard why this went that way, instead of sending shills to fight the truth with lies and incorrect statements, but hey it's only me...

not only you, believe me !


Yup, I thought so...  And yes I am asking generally the same question - "Why not get your asses elected as delegates and get paid for your work...but 'nooo '  you're too smart for that ...you can come with a better scheme to get your money, and faster at that!"

hope they change their minds and decide to open source "moonstone" without the need to raise the $120000 first***...
stop the madness guys, what else must happen to recognize your mistakes?

***   (don't bet they get their money faster that way @tonyk2 ...  :D )
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/11230238_924441534245327_1885587377302940593_n.jpg?oh=530e0162658b3097c22a06ef863eeedc&oe=55BF0A67&__gda__=1439391455_ee8c6bf83005ce0f4c4b287feff7e1b8)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 14, 2015, 04:17:03 pm
- "Bitsapphire is not using BTS funds, they are just fund raising using the tools we have created for this purpose: BitShares UIA"
False. Bitsapphire IS using BTS funds - delegate pay to repay those UIA
If they had not issued UIA but borrowed fiat funds from a bank instead and then chose to repay the loan using their delegate pay - would you still say Bitsapphire is using BTS funds??
What they are going to earn through their delegates is THEIR money and not BTS funds any more.

No, Bitsapphire already got their money from the IOU investors. Now they are making the shareholders vote delegates to pay the IOU investors. As I said in the other post - convoluted scheme where Bitsapphire get their funds upfront and somebody else is left holding the bag/paying the bill - be it shareholders or IOU investors. They do not care they go their money already.

Quote

- "My point is this: Bitsapphire can make profit on us only if their wallet turns out to be a valuable contribution to the BitShares ecosystem"
False - Bitsapphire makes profit if the wallet is funded. Its success is a fact with no consequence to their profit!
You are right.. assuming that it has cost them just $130,000 to create the wallet. I guess it might have been a bit more than this.

- "If you don't like it (the moonstone wallet )don't use it and you will not pay for it"
False - You will pay for it even if you have not touched it or do not like it. Paying for it has nothing to do with using it.
You are right.. but the same is true about a dozen other delegates that you find lazy and worthless yet still your transaction fees go to them.


Yup, I thought so...  And yes I am asking generally the same question - "Why not get your asses elected as delegates and get paid for your work...but 'nooo '  you're too smart for that ...you can come with a better scheme to get your money, and faster at that!"

PS
and the "I guess it might have been a bit more than this." comment.. I wouldn't have not done it... you are suspected shill as it is, no need to drop insider info to confirm it.

Your arguments are plain stupid for me.
I think you lost this one, tonyk, so please stop spreading false information that Bitsapphire is using or will be using BTS funds.
It's a deal between IOU investors and Bitsapphire and BTS funds have nothing to do with it even if the delegate pay is used to repay those investors. The delegate pay is their money which they can spend however they like and this includes repaying IOU investors.
If you don't like the deal - stay away from it but don't say the deal is dishonest or misleading.

PS. I have no association with Bitsapphire, I just want them to succeed as part of the ecosystem.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: zerosum on May 14, 2015, 04:51:42 pm
stop spreading false information that Bitsapphire is using or will be using BTS funds.

What false info? You agreed that all I said is true and the only lies are in your own posts!


Your arguments are plain stupid for me.

How come? Not enough misleading information or lies to make them more convincing to your liking?

You came, stated 3 lies and now you are winning because my arguments are the truth?

What a joke....

Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: robrigo on May 14, 2015, 04:58:58 pm
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of forum members have had a particularly sandy crotch the past few days?

Everybody love everybody.   :-*
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 14, 2015, 05:02:30 pm
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of forum members have had a particularly sandy crotch the past few days?
Everybody love everybody.   :-*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6FaNFBl_Bc
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chuckone on May 14, 2015, 05:17:32 pm
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of forum members have had a particularly sandy crotch the past few days?

Everybody love everybody.   :-*

LOL - True, people seem particularly irritated these days!   :P
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sudo on May 15, 2015, 01:22:25 am
I appreciate the moonstone project a lot and I'm willing to donate.
Here is my feedback regarding the crowdfunding process:

1. It would be good if you placed this valuable link https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223) in a more exposed place - in my opinion this link is much more informative than the product demo in the form of a mute YouTube video.

2. When I am trying to donate I am asked to supply a password, a new wallet is created and I'm instructed to download it and keep to safe but there is no explicit guide how to use the new wallet. I guess I could figure it out on my own but it would be much better if I didn't have to. What is badly needed is a step by step guide what to do with the new wallet apart from keeping it safe, i.e. how to access the downloaded wallet and see the purchased Moonstone Tokes.

3. Currently the donation mechanism is not working - when I try to donate I get stuck with the message "Loading Bitcoin address" and nothing happens.

Thank you for your feedback!

1. For the first suggestion, yes, we could do that! But we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week, and that will replace the Marvelapp.
2. After we release the demo version, you will be able to use it, test it, and “play” around with it. As for the “step by step guide”, I don’t think that would be necessary( unless the community wants for it be implemented - after they have used the Moonstone Wallet demo firsthand)
3. We tested the “Donate” button and it’s working fine! If you could take a screenshot of the problem, and send it to us, we would more than appreciate it!

Hopefully we could be of any help to you!

we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week

may 15th
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Ander on May 15, 2015, 02:32:38 am
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of forum members have had a particularly sandy crotch the past few days?

Everybody love everybody.   :-*

LOL - True, people seem particularly irritated these days!   :P

Yeah, I'm not sure why.  People are really angry this week, lol!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BTSdac on May 15, 2015, 03:04:08 am
I like moonstone ,I don`t understand what you said , don`t forget  BTS is a open ecosystem



hope they change their minds and decide to open source "moonstone" without the need to raise the $120000 first***...

I think moonstone can open code or not  , it is just his strategy.
I think we should less comment about it .
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 15, 2015, 07:34:16 am
I ended up discussing in tonyk's style, which I find horrible and manipulative.
I regret this and I am sorry for letting myself be trapped in this.

These are my final thoughts on this subject.

1. There are three parties involved: Bitsapphire, IOU investors and BitShares shareholders.

2. The fundraising deal is only between Bitsapphire and IOU investors. If Bitsapphire fails to deliver, IOU investors will lose their money, but BitShares shareholders (or BTS funds as tonyk calls them) will not be negatively affected.

3. The outcome for BitShares shareholders can only be neutral or positive. BitShares shareholders are the ultimate judges who have the power to employ Bitsapphire and fire it whenever they choose to do so. It is true Bitsapphire's salary will be paid from BTS funds but this is trivial as it is the case with every other delegate we have. But the important distinction is that Bitsapphire will not be using BTS funds but will be paid from these funds only for services they deliver.

4. The BitShares shareholders should only care whether the Moonstone wallet has the potential to increase the adoption of BitShares or not. They should not care who else is using the wallet and whether some other third party using the wallet contributes to the wallet development or not. Also, they should not care whether Bitsapphire makes a profit on the fundraising or not. This is not our business.

However, if I am both a BitShares shareholder and an IOU investor a conflict of interest can occur. As a BitShares shareholder I might want to fire Bitsapphire but as an IOU investor I might want to keep them so they are able to repay me. This is a valid concern but it originates not from Bitsapphire's offer being "convoluted" but from the way our delegate and UIA systems work.
I am quite sure similar cases of delegates offering their IOUs will be happening in the future and we will need to find a way how to manage our loyalty is such situations. But again, this has nothing to do with Bitsapphire, they just happen to be the first entity to expose the existence of this loophole but this problem is on our side not on theirs.


Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on May 15, 2015, 07:49:23 am
Very nice summary .. thanks for posting
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sumantso on May 15, 2015, 08:22:23 am
Is it just me, or does it seem like a lot of forum members have had a particularly sandy crotch the past few days?

Everybody love everybody.   :-*

LOL - True, people seem particularly irritated these days!   :P

Yeah, I'm not sure why.  People are really angry this week, lol!

I for one am unhappy that we are paying a full delegate to work for 6.5 hours a month. The thing which really irritated me is that nobody seems to care.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sumantso on May 15, 2015, 08:25:18 am
Very nice summary .. thanks for posting

Nice summary? All he is  trying to do is dress up dilution to pay for stuff which Peertracks should've been paying for. With even you approving, it seems that Moonstone PR is working well; now if only BTS got such good spin doctors.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jakub on May 15, 2015, 08:47:14 am
I for one am unhappy that we are paying a full delegate to work for 6.5 hours a month. The thing which really irritated me is that nobody seems to care.
I would not be irritated even if that delegate worked 5 minutes a month but still delivered something useful.

Nice summary? All he is  trying to do is dress up dilution to pay for stuff which Peertracks should've been paying for. With even you approving, it seems that Moonstone PR is working well; now if only BTS got such good spin doctors.
All I am saying is that as long as Peertracks is not our competitor, our business is called BitShares, and not the relationship between Bitsapphire and Peertracks.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on May 15, 2015, 09:16:10 am
Nice summary? All he is  trying to do is dress up dilution to pay for stuff which Peertracks should've been paying for. With even you approving, it seems that Moonstone PR is working well; now if only BTS got such good spin doctors.
I technically don't care about their relation to peertracks and I don't know about arrangements made between peertracks and bitsapphare .. and I don't need to
 .. because bitsapphire offers a wallet to bitshares users (me) .. and I like it .. thus I bought some MOONFUND to support their efforts ..
If they manage to get in some delegates to pay back "investors" .. that's fine .. if not I see my moonfund as a donation .. much like a kickstarter project .. period

and please refrain from calling out brainwashing .. that's just impolite
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Riverhead on May 15, 2015, 10:36:24 am

A full delegate currently pays about $465 USD/month. For someone working 6.5 hour a month that works out to be about $70/hour. For a contractor that you're not paying benefits to that's dirt cheap.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chuckone on May 15, 2015, 12:40:09 pm
It is in our best interest to have a working, slick and easy to use wallet, and Moonstone's offering is exactly that. It might even increase user experience and adoption significantly if the development is done properly.

If it benefits other projects, then good for them. But why should we deprive ourself of the benefits it could bring us just to avoid others from benefiting from it? I would understand the concerns if they were offering it to a direct competitor to Bitshares, but it's not the case.

And you know what? It can only help Bitshares if the Moonstone wallet is used for several projects. Because all the new users that are brought in the ecosystem by the other projects (like PeerTracks) will be exposed to Bitshares because of the Moonstone wallet, thus increasing the probability of getting new Bitshares users. And the conversion will be very easy, they will already have the Moonstone wallet installed. They will only need to buy Bitshares or any assets, and bam! One conversion done.

Can someone correct me if I'm wrong?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chuckone on May 15, 2015, 12:53:10 pm
But why should we deprive ourself of the benefits it could bring us just to avoid others from benefiting from it?

Because we are haters.  We either hate ourselves, or others who succeed.  Where have you been?

lol, I guess I was in my own world thinking we could do better ;)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on May 15, 2015, 01:10:59 pm
But why should we deprive ourself of the benefits it could bring us just to avoid others from benefiting from it?

Because we are haters.  We either hate ourselves, or others who succeed.  That is the only reason to be against such positive goodness for humanity worldwide.  Where have you been?

Come on, get busy man, if you work hard enough, then you might actually encourage the Moonstone team to quit and go help some other community!

(http://assets.diylol.com/hfs/f3b/a92/faa/resized/jesus-says-meme-generator-haters-gonna-hate-jesus-gonna-jesus-638ed7.jpg)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Krills on May 16, 2015, 11:21:24 am
we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week

hello.Is it release?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Krills on May 17, 2015, 06:11:19 am

we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week

hello.Is it release?
?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sudo on May 17, 2015, 02:12:30 pm
any release plan please?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on May 17, 2015, 02:26:30 pm
lack of communication is not the best idea when you want people to fund you @bitsapphire
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: jaran on May 17, 2015, 03:45:05 pm
Based on the latest mumble it sounds like bytemaster is saying projects such as  this one should make their money off the upcoming referral program.  And it sounds like delegates wont be printing shares anymore.

Given that what is the status of this project?  Are the new bitshares changes going to effect this project?  Are you going to switch to making the money back based off the referral system rather than delegate pay?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 17, 2015, 08:06:12 pm
Love ya Taulant, but what's going on with Moonstone man?
I really could have used it at tonights BitShares Munich meetup.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on May 17, 2015, 08:25:42 pm
Love ya Taulant, but what's going on with Moonstone man?
I really could have used it at tonights BitShares Munich meetup.

He has arrived back from Singapore with much news, catching his breath, and will update us tomorrow (Monday) because Sunday is a slow day on the forums.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: 麥可貓 on May 18, 2015, 05:17:19 am
Love ya Taulant, but what's going on with Moonstone man?
I really could have used it at tonights BitShares Munich meetup.

You can find some clue here about the cooperation of bitsapphire and factom:
http://blog.factom.org/post/118735295389/fun-new-things-happening-at-factom

Quote
Anti-Corruption Tool - Bitsapphire and Factom are working on an anti-corruption tool to manage the land municipal registry databases in Kosovo. They plan to use the Factom API to build a cryptographic record to prove the databases haven’t been corrupted.
KYC Solution - Bitsapphire and Factom are also working on an innovative solution to the “Know Your Customer” problem many banks face. They are now building an identity management system backed up by Factom’s API for Moonstone.
Music Authentication - Bitsapphire will be working with Peertracks to build an external verification system for music. The Factom API will be used to audit and verify content for  intellectual property rights.

Quote
Factom and Bitsapphire will be working together to build a land registry tool for Kosovo municipalities, KYC Solution for Moonstone wallet, and music authentication for Peertracks. Our wonderful Peter Kirby, President of Factom, recently said, “Bitsapphire is building some of the most innovative solutions to KYC, data protection, and real time auditing on the blockchain. Factom makes it simple for them to create these products without bloating the Bitcoin Blockchain or building a complicated incentive system around a private blockchain.”
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on May 18, 2015, 08:15:19 am
(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/44/44d44af9cd3f3cf51f7220b386d3d52eb6d7e0027f80452ddbcd2ee9f4035119.jpg)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on May 21, 2015, 07:12:45 am
Love ya Taulant, but what's going on with Moonstone man?
I really could have used it at tonights BitShares Munich meetup.

He has arrived back from Singapore with much news, catching his breath, and will update us tomorrow (Monday) because Sunday is a slow day on the forums.

it seems we missed the announcement...
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on May 21, 2015, 07:28:46 am
it seems we missed the announcement...
I guess there are some strategic decisions to be made just now .. considering the upcoming improvements of BitShares
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 21, 2015, 08:40:10 am
we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week, and that will replace the Marvelapp.

How bad does accountability have to get before investors start demanding their money back?
I'm still vested in MOONFUND and NOTE, but Taulant, we have to know what you're doing, please.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on May 21, 2015, 12:11:22 pm
The last thing I heard was they were needing to contact BM to review the API changes that were mentioned in hangout on Friday. That was on Monday. Nothing since. I think they might want to make sure they are sorted with that before giving an update. That's just my guess.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 21, 2015, 12:14:43 pm
Ok, but that's no excuse for not being accountable to their Shareholders.
At least keep us in the loop.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on May 21, 2015, 12:22:55 pm
Ok, but that's no excuse for not being accountable to their Shareholders.
At least keep us in the loop.

Not trying to excuse it.. just filling the void I guess. I have personally urged for updates as well.. but it's up to them how they like to handle it. Some people have different ideas on what/when things should be communicated. In my experience when it comes to crowdfunding.. it's better to even post and update if it's not positive or exciting. It can sometimes turn to good.. look what happened with MineBitShares.. I only had bad news.. next thing I know we are making history in our delegate bid :) .. http://vote.bunkermining.com

I am guessing from what I know we should hear something soon though.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 21, 2015, 12:25:55 pm
it's better to even post and update if it's not positive or exciting.

Exactly. +5% +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sudo on May 21, 2015, 02:39:55 pm
I appreciate the moonstone project a lot and I'm willing to donate.
Here is my feedback regarding the crowdfunding process:

1. It would be good if you placed this valuable link https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223 (https://marvelapp.com/a31d7h#3555223) in a more exposed place - in my opinion this link is much more informative than the product demo in the form of a mute YouTube video.

2. When I am trying to donate I am asked to supply a password, a new wallet is created and I'm instructed to download it and keep to safe but there is no explicit guide how to use the new wallet. I guess I could figure it out on my own but it would be much better if I didn't have to. What is badly needed is a step by step guide what to do with the new wallet apart from keeping it safe, i.e. how to access the downloaded wallet and see the purchased Moonstone Tokes.

3. Currently the donation mechanism is not working - when I try to donate I get stuck with the message "Loading Bitcoin address" and nothing happens.

Thank you for your feedback!

1. For the first suggestion, yes, we could do that! But we are going to release the Demo version of the Moonstone Wallet next week, and that will replace the Marvelapp.
2. After we release the demo version, you will be able to use it, test it, and “play” around with it. As for the “step by step guide”, I don’t think that would be necessary( unless the community wants for it be implemented - after they have used the Moonstone Wallet demo firsthand)
3. We tested the “Donate” button and it’s working fine! If you could take a screenshot of the problem, and send it to us, we would more than appreciate it!

Hopefully we could be of any help to you!

two week passed  any progress?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on May 21, 2015, 08:27:38 pm
Hello everybody!

Thank you for your great patience! It's been an incredible past couple of weeks for our team as so many good things have happened.

We are pleased to announce that the community can play around with the dummy UI of the Moonstone wallet here http://app.moonstone.io/. Please note that this is still a very rough version of what we are working on as we had to take out quite some code which connects up to the backend which we want to open source through our crowdfunder. Most of the data is seeded and is not real and is only there for visual purposes. The account you create will be reset once the official beta starts. This demo is simply intended for everybody to have an idea of what the user's experience will be when using Moonstone.

Please send us any feedback via our online form (https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1_RFPQ4DYxEOtp_x4D4UUwyS0X_6q8hIyAlwuFWQsXHI/viewform?c=0&w=1)!

In other good news:

We want to thank Bytemaster for disclosing to us parts of the upcoming Bitshares announcement as it made it possible for us to make an informed decision on how to continue the project and crowdfunder. For everybody else we can say this much: We have experience with quite some blockchain technologies, so we can say without any hesitation that the upcoming announcement is going to be incredible. We are pumped!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on May 21, 2015, 08:46:36 pm
Sign up doesn't work!!!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Ander on May 21, 2015, 08:47:34 pm

We want to thank Bytemaster for disclosing to us parts of the upcoming Bitshares announcement as it made it possible for us to make an informed decision on how to continue the project and crowdfunder. For everybody else we can say this much: We have experience with quite some blockchain technologies, so we can say without any hesitation that the upcoming announcement is going to be incredible. We are pumped!

I hope with this "big announcment" that we will finally begin to see Bitshares achieve its potential, and that Moonstone will help it take off!

Its pretty much critical at this point that they get this right, and the delivery really does match the hype this time.  I don't think the community could survive another disappointment. 
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Akado on May 21, 2015, 09:03:03 pm


I hope with this "big announcment" that we will finally begin to see Bitshares achieve its potential, and that Moonstone will help it take off!

Its pretty much critical at this point that they get this right, and the delivery really does match the hype this time.  I don't think the community could survive another disappointment.

I think that's exactly why things will turn out good this time. There is so much on the line there is just no space for that to happen again.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on May 21, 2015, 09:29:04 pm
Sign up doesn't work!!!
Please report the issues via the Google form. We need as much feedback from as many testers on different platforms as possible! The devs get every Google form report directly.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on May 21, 2015, 09:32:23 pm
Sign up doesn't work!!!
Please report the issues via the Google form. We need as much feedback from as many testers on different platforms as possible! The devs get every Google form report directly.

I did, before I posted here.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsandtea on May 21, 2015, 09:57:15 pm
We are working on the signup server error. ETA is 30 minutes to 1 hour. Stay tuned and thanks for the feedback. I will keep updating here.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: eagleeye on May 21, 2015, 10:08:51 pm
Why does this page http://app.moonstone.io/#/signup have a circle thing going around beside the enter email?

I'm on iPad mini 3
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsandtea on May 21, 2015, 10:26:52 pm
Signup functionality is currently restored.

eagleey could you please provide me with a screenshot?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BTSdac on May 22, 2015, 02:22:56 am
Why does this page http://app.moonstone.io/#/signup have a circle thing going around beside the enter email?

I'm on iPad mini 3
I have same problem
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on May 22, 2015, 05:34:37 am
sign-up works now
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on May 22, 2015, 06:34:15 am
We have experience with quite some blockchain technologies, so we can say without any hesitation that the upcoming announcement is going to be incredible. We are pumped!
This!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: konelectric on May 27, 2015, 03:31:06 am
I set up an account at https://moonstone.io/ for the Moonstone crowdfunding campaign when I donated. Do I use that account info when seting up the wallet at http://app.moonstone.io/
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on May 27, 2015, 05:17:34 am
I set up an account at https://moonstone.io/ for the Moonstone crowdfunding campaign when I donated. Do I use that account info when seting up the wallet at http://app.moonstone.io/
This version is for UI/UX testing only. You don't need to import anything. We will send out emails once the final version of Moonstone is ready for regular usage.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 29, 2015, 05:17:36 pm
Hey Taulant, CoinTelegraph should be contacting you soon... 8)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: 麥可貓 on May 29, 2015, 05:53:17 pm
Hey Taulant, CoinTelegraph should be contacting you soon... 8)

You mean an interview about MoonStone or other topics? Anyway, that would be cool.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 29, 2015, 06:14:24 pm
Yes and we've been discussing the crowdfunder too, not just the wallet.
I wanted to grab as much attention as I could for his crowdfunder.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: 麥可貓 on May 29, 2015, 06:36:03 pm
Yes and we've been discussing the crowdfunder too, not just the wallet.
I wanted to grab as much attention as I could for his crowdfunder.

Yeah I really hope the crowdfunder can success and the MoonStone can be released in MIT, so that the code can  be used as cornerstone for future projects. As a linux user, I know I can't emphasize this anymore, also know that most users don't even feel it...
Anyway, I don't have much, but I have also bought some as I can.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on May 29, 2015, 06:45:04 pm
Me too. I'm invested in NOTE and MOONFUND both.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xiahui135 on June 09, 2015, 03:15:29 pm
How will moonstone go with the bitshares 2.0 rules?
Any change?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Permie on June 09, 2015, 03:50:48 pm
How will moonstone go with the bitshares 2.0 rules?
Any change?
BM said last night that bitsapphire (moonstone team) were informed 2 weeks ago, and were very happy with it.
Plus they can now make referral income from new wallet users
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on June 10, 2015, 08:40:11 pm
How will moonstone go with the bitshares 2.0 rules?
Any change?
BM said last night that bitsapphire (moonstone team) were informed 2 weeks ago, and were very happy with it.
Plus they can now make referral income from new wallet users
Not until 2.0 is released will they realize anything from the refer

Sent from my SGH-T999V using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on June 12, 2015, 09:01:50 pm
Hello there!
We would like to thank all those who have donated to the Moonstone Wallet fundraising campaign.

(https://moonstone.io/assets/thank-u.png)

We were able to reach 23,027 USD of our planned 130.000 USD fundraiser goal. Instead of releasing both the frontend and backend under the MIT license (meaning that anybody would have had the right to use our code also for for-profit reasons), now the Moonstone Angular frontend will be released under GPL3 which can still be used for non-for-profit purposes. The backend which makes the light client possible remains closed source. We plan on releasing our APIs to the public so you will be able to build great apps on top of our API infrastructure!

Nonetheless, the wallet will be released soon and we will continue its further development.
The Moonfund tokens you have received for your donation will be bought back (https://moonstone.io/faq.php) as planned with Bitshares 2.0 worker funds. Fortunately, Bitshares 2.0 will make this even simpler.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: davidpbrown on June 12, 2015, 09:16:03 pm
Thanks for the update.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: CLains on June 12, 2015, 09:49:32 pm
Next time do equity crowd-fund with % of referral-profit as dividends. ^^
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on June 12, 2015, 10:08:28 pm
Next time do equity crowd-fund with % of referral-profit as dividends. ^^

That's actually the plan now. We need a KYC solution for that first though to do it legally. That's where the first version of Moonstone will come into play. We'll make the next version of Moonstone possible with the first version. I think that has something beautiful to it.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sumantso on June 13, 2015, 12:41:59 am
Like anyone is going to trust their balance to a closed source wallet.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sittingduck on June 13, 2015, 12:48:38 am
Do you compile your own bts wallet?  If not then the devs could steal your funds.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: arhag on June 13, 2015, 01:24:12 am
Like anyone is going to trust their balance to a closed source wallet.

The frontend will be licensed GPLv3 which of course is open source. From a light wallet user's perspective (which nearly everyone will be), how the backend is licensed is nearly irrelevant since: 1) the backend cannot get access to their private keys; 2) if they don't control the computers the backend is running on, they have no guarantee the backend servers are running the code they claim to be running even if the backend was open source.

The backend not being open source because the crowdfunding was not fully successful just means that other developers won't be able to take that code base and easily run their own Moonstone wallet compatible services (unless they reimplement the protocol themselves).
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: rgcrypto on June 13, 2015, 02:37:41 pm
I am sure you've learned a ton from this experience. You had great design and great execution but the offer to market match wasn't completely align. It happens!
.
Anyhow, I'm glad you are in our community
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on June 13, 2015, 06:35:02 pm
Like anyone is going to trust their balance to a closed source wallet.

The frontend will be licensed GPLv3 which of course is open source. From a light wallet user's perspective (which nearly everyone will be), how the backend is licensed is nearly irrelevant since: 1) the backend cannot get access to their private keys; 2) if they don't control the computers the backend is running on, they have no guarantee the backend servers are running the code they claim to be running even if the backend was open source.

The backend not being open source because the crowdfunding was not fully successful just means that other developers won't be able to take that code base and easily run their own Moonstone wallet compatible services (unless they reimplement the protocol themselves).

this. I don't see any problems.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on June 14, 2015, 07:26:36 pm
Has peertracks donated to moonstone as promised?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Akado on June 14, 2015, 08:21:04 pm
I was told back then once the crowdfund ended, it would take more or less  a month for the wallet to be released, will we have it by mid July?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on June 14, 2015, 08:45:42 pm
Has peertracks donated to moonstone as promised?

 +5% I'm interested too.

I was told back then once the crowdfund ended, it would take more or less  a month for the wallet to be released, will we have it by mid July?

I think they will release the wallet with the new referral system in place.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on June 15, 2015, 12:23:32 pm
Has peertracks donated to moonstone as promised?

No. Peertracks decided to go with an integrated wallet interface instead (build by Bitsapphire). I can't disclose much more than that unfortunately. Nonetheless, Moonstone will work with MUSIC tokens once the chain is online.

I was told back then once the crowdfund ended, it would take more or less  a month for the wallet to be released, will we have it by mid July?

That's still our plan. Obviously some things have changed due to the Bitshares 2.0 announcement. Our current plan is to release the almost completely functional app within the same timeline as originally announced, and then release the final production ready version with Bitshares 2.0 integration asap. Obviously, the referral program is potentially a game-changer for our business model.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on June 15, 2015, 12:27:27 pm
Has peertracks donated to moonstone as promised?

No. Peertracks decided to go with an integrated wallet interface instead (build by Bitsapphire). I can't disclose much more than that unfortunately. Nonetheless, Moonstone will work with MUSIC tokens once the chain is online.

I was told back then once the crowdfund ended, it would take more or less  a month for the wallet to be released, will we have it by mid July?

That's still our plan. Obviously some things have changed due to the Bitshares 2.0 announcement. Our current plan is to release the almost completely functional app within the same timeline as originally announced, and then release the final production ready version with Bitshares 2.0 integration asap. Obviously, the referral program is potentially a game-changer for our business model.

will you act as a registrar for the referral system? eg. will affiliates be able to send people to your wallet and earn %?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on June 25, 2015, 05:21:10 pm
We were able to reach 23,027 USD of our planned 130.000 USD fundraiser goal.

Now we elect a Moonstone "worker" that will sit in the worker que collecting fees, converting them to BitUSD, and paying off the remaining 107,000 ButUSD so the team can release the rest of the code under the MIT license. 



(https://moonstone.io/assets/thank-u.png)

It is my understanding that they only have to pay off the  23,027 USD that they collected. Since the crowdfunder didn't reach it's objective, the consequence is that the wallet backend will be licensed for anyone who wants it for commercial uses (instead of free to use - which mught have brought in more developers and is why I donated to the project)..
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Ander on June 25, 2015, 10:01:06 pm
Now moonstone should buy $23k worth of BTS with the funds, wait until its worth $130k, and then release with the MIT license. :P
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: maqifrnswa on June 25, 2015, 10:28:30 pm
We were able to reach 23,027 USD of our planned 130.000 USD fundraiser goal.

Now we elect a Moonstone "worker" that will sit in the worker que collecting fees, converting them to BitUSD, and paying off the remaining 107,000 ButUSD so the team can release the rest of the code under the MIT license. 

It is my understandin that they only have to pay off the  23,027 USD that they collected. Since the crowdfunder didn't reach it's objective, the consequence is that the wallet backend will be licensed for anyone who wants it for commercial uses (instead of free to use - which mught have brought in more developers and is why I donated to the project)..

He means that they were $107k short; to get them $107k we should elect a worker so that they can release it open source. That is in addition to the $23k they already collected
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on June 26, 2015, 06:13:28 pm
We were able to reach 23,027 USD of our planned 130.000 USD fundraiser goal.

Now we elect a Moonstone "worker" that will sit in the worker que collecting fees, converting them to BitUSD, and paying off the remaining 107,000 ButUSD so the team can release the rest of the code under the MIT license. 

It is my understandin that they only have to pay off the  23,027 USD that they collected. Since the crowdfunder didn't reach it's objective, the consequence is that the wallet backend will be licensed for anyone who wants it for commercial uses (instead of free to use - which mught have brought in more developers and is why I donated to the project)..

He means that they were $107k short; to get them $107k we should elect a worker so that they can release it open source. That is in addition to the $23k they already collected
Yeah.. I don't think this is what will happen.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: maqifrnswa on June 29, 2015, 05:57:39 pm
Yeah.. I don't think this is what will happen.
I don't either, it's hard to sell the ROI on open-sourcing back-ends of platforms.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: MrJeans on July 01, 2015, 09:32:44 pm
I remember hearing something about Bitsapphire looking into providing white listing services.
Can anyone point me to information about that.

EDIT: @onceuponatime. Thanks!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: onceuponatime on July 01, 2015, 10:06:10 pm
I remember hearing something about Bitsapphire looking into providing white listing services.
Can anyone point me to information about that.

#12 MoonStone - The application layer begins.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sDU-ooXq-E&index=1&list=PLjgfpSQFJTLqbgHm8mkgPdD-ma7t0bRhK

(starts at 36 min. 52 sec.)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Yao on July 06, 2015, 02:46:34 pm
Has peertracks donated to moonstone as promised?

No. Peertracks decided to go with an integrated wallet interface instead (build by Bitsapphire). I can't disclose much more than that unfortunately. Nonetheless, Moonstone will work with MUSIC tokens once the chain is online.

I was told back then once the crowdfund ended, it would take more or less  a month for the wallet to be released, will we have it by mid July?

That's still our plan. Obviously some things have changed due to the Bitshares 2.0 announcement. Our current plan is to release the almost completely functional app within the same timeline as originally announced, and then release the final production ready version with Bitshares 2.0 integration asap. Obviously, the referral program is potentially a game-changer for our business model.
Nice!

来自我的 SM-N9002 上的 Tapatalk

Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: clayop on July 29, 2015, 09:54:21 pm
Why are you still selling MOONFUND on BitShares market?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sudo on July 30, 2015, 01:48:22 am
what the plan next?

can I still buy MOONFUND in bitshares?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on July 30, 2015, 06:31:39 am
can I still buy MOONFUND in bitshares?
Yes you can .. and the network does not distinguish between those then others .. they are all the same .. they just don't count for the moonstone crowdfunding goal
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on July 30, 2015, 02:09:47 pm
can I still buy MOONFUND in bitshares?
Yes you can .. and the network does not distinguish between those then others .. they are all the same .. they just don't count for the moonstone crowdfunding goal
If that's the case then anyone buying would have no agreement of payback like was outlined in the crowdfund.. right?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: xeroc on July 31, 2015, 08:45:58 am
If that's the case then anyone buying would have no agreement of payback like was outlined in the crowdfund.. right?
They do!! .. at least it seams that way ... @Taulant is still selling MOONTOKENs and will need to buy them back eventually .. the DEX cannot distinguish between pre- and post-deadline ..
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on September 02, 2015, 10:01:06 pm
So what is happening here? Any cool mockups to share from the past few months of dev?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on September 09, 2015, 06:13:16 pm
Moonstone current progress

As you know, blockchain technology is rapidly developing. People from the banking, music and many other industries are finding it can be a game-changer for them. This makes blockchain technology one of the most dynamic, unpredictable, and disruptive industries to be in. These are exciting times! And our Moonstone is trying to forge a way into the future.

(https://moonstone.io/assets/img/mail/market-charts-min.jpg)
Pic. 1.0 - Market Depth Chart

We are developing blockchains for some time now, and it’s difficult to end up with an elegant piece of code. When utilizing the complex concepts from the financial world, software development and cryptography, in order to bring about functionality that has never been seen before, you end up with a lot of tangled up C++ code. And with the pace of development this industry has, overnight everything changes and you need to adapt. Refactoring of the codebase into something SOLID (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SOLID_(object-oriented_design)) principles is also often out of the question once the code is up and running, due to the fear of disrupting the network. We have definitely experienced all of this with Moonstone.

Furthermore, very few people understand blockchains on a fundamental level, and those who say they do, have trouble explaining them. Few have actually used one in its raw sense. Even fewer people understand the nuanced functions of distributed ledgers, immutability, distributed or centralized time stamping, or optimisation requirements. Most throw all of these into a single bucket which they call “blockchain”.

Since Graphene got published on Github, we have been utilizing our resources to understand its range of capabilities. We originally planned to release Moonstone Alpha on Bitshares 1.0, but we decided to dive into Graphene.

Graphene, is still under development, nonetheless we have managed to integrate Moonstone with it. Currently we can: create markets and perform transactions successfully, create and search other users’ on-chain, transact with user-friendly names and public keys.
 
Moonstone’s mission is to be the intuitive one-stop interface for every blockchain out there, with a slick design and UX that can be easily integrated by every blockchain developer.
Buying, selling, exchanging, and transacting tokens all done in on the fly with an easy to use interface. We aim to keep it like that with every blockchain we integrate.


Features that we have been working on since the fundraiser:

We are waiting for the final release of Bitshares 2.0 to do final testing of Moonstone.
 
We would like to thank everyone that has tested our demo interface and sent us feedback. Your comments and suggestions have been invaluable to us and have guided us in our market interface modifications as well as the signup flow!
 
Moonstone team

(https://moonstone.io/assets/img/mail/home-min.jpg)
Pic. 2.0 - Homescreen

What’s new in here:

(https://moonstone.io/assets/img/mail/price-charts-min.jpg)
Pic. 3.0 - Adding Existing Market

What’s new in here:

(https://moonstone.io/assets/img/mail/buy-sell-asset-min.jpg)
Pic. 3.1 - Buying / Selling Assets

(https://moonstone.io/assets/img/mail/price-chart-min.jpg)
Pic. 3.2 - Market Price Chart

What’s new in here:

(https://moonstone.io/assets/img/mail/opern-orders-min.jpg)
Pic. 4.0 - Market Orders: Open Orders

What’s new in here:
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: fav on September 09, 2015, 06:17:22 pm
-snap-

 +5%

what about the affiliate program? are you going to offer it in moonstone?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on September 09, 2015, 08:04:32 pm
It's really looking amazing Taulant bravo!
If I could make one suggestion, as far as branding goes. It seems to me that some of the terms we use have become Case Sensitive. This is how I see them most often:
 
BitShares
BitAssets
Smartcoins
bitUSD
bitEUR
bitCNY
 etc
Bitcoin
 
I'm probably wrong on a few of those, but that is how I see those words most often. Branding-wise it would be good to stick to our standards if they exist.
 
Other than Case, it really looks great so far Taulant!! +5% +5% +5% :)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: MJK on September 10, 2015, 01:32:11 pm

 +5% +5%
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: kenCode on October 02, 2015, 06:00:14 pm
Will/does the Bitshares 2.0 Moonstone wallet have support for local trades with QR codes (sending and receiving funds) like mycelium?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Harvey on December 16, 2015, 02:13:00 pm
Hope everything goes well.  +5%
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: TravelsAsia on December 16, 2015, 02:53:09 pm
I can't wait to see the Peertracks version of Moonstone.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: TravelsAsia on December 18, 2015, 06:53:42 pm
@bitsapphire

With the existing prediction market pieces in the blockchain, have you considered adding a prediction market to your wallet software? With Augur raising millions, it might be an opportunity for everyone that missed out on that one to jump in. It also promotes another use of your wallet and makes it unique.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: topcandle on January 08, 2016, 02:53:30 pm
What the hell happened to MOONSTONE?!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: konelectric on January 08, 2016, 06:43:34 pm
What the hell happened to MOONSTONE?!

https://soundcloud.com/beyond-bitcoin-hangouts/122-bonus-hangout-w-taulant-of-bitsapphire-pactum-protocol-overview
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: cass on January 09, 2016, 10:15:53 am
https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?resid=1AF2071D73364463!472139&ithint=file,docx&app=Word&authkey=!AN-5YrZ1nmrR5eU
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: btswolf on March 01, 2016, 09:02:06 pm
sign of life
https://twitter.com/MoonstoneWallet/status/704346920370769920
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Akado on March 01, 2016, 09:19:29 pm
sign of life
https://twitter.com/MoonstoneWallet/status/704346920370769920

On the bright side, they might release a 100% complete product. It's taking a while but it will be worth it if it's complete, fully functional and friendly.

Couldn't we time that with any of BitShares' releases? Like the Stealth or rate limited fees or Microsoft Azure? More impact.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on June 14, 2016, 05:54:17 pm
Hello forum members and future Moonstone users.
We would like to invite any one of you that is interested in using Moonstone to become part of the alpha phase.
Just write to us on Skype ID: moonstone.bitsapphire or send us an e-mail at info@moonstone.io, and we'll immediately reply with an invitation link.
Just don't forget to report on any bugs or any inconsistencies that you may stumble upon.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: cube on June 15, 2016, 04:19:56 am
Hello forum members and future Moonstone users.
We would like to invite any one of you that is interested in using Moonstone to become part of the alpha phase.
Just write to us on Skype ID: moonstone.bitsapphire or send us an e-mail at info@moonstone.io, and we'll immediately reply with an invitation link.
Just don't forget to report on any bugs or any inconsistencies that you may stumble upon.

Finally, an alpha moonstone.

Sent skype pm.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on June 17, 2016, 04:05:55 pm
Take a look at the progress we've made with the Moonstone Wallet.
The video is from actual working alpha that is currently being tested by the community.

https://youtu.be/O7cY7kcP3lc (https://youtu.be/O7cY7kcP3lc)
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Chronos on June 17, 2016, 07:35:45 pm
Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsharesbrazil on June 17, 2016, 08:13:00 pm
What I really liked is the option contacts.....I like to make it social...

Is a browser wallet do you control your funds? How? Thanks.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: abit on June 19, 2016, 02:50:51 pm
Take a look at the progress we've made with the Moonstone Wallet.
The video is from actual working alpha that is currently being tested by the community.

https://youtu.be/O7cY7kcP3lc (https://youtu.be/O7cY7kcP3lc)
Nice video.
1. What's the avatars of the accounts?
2. email address for signing in? users have full control of funds?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on July 01, 2016, 07:57:26 pm
After doing Private Alpha Testing Phase with some of the Bitshares forum users and supporters of the Moonstone Wallet, we have identified and fixed several minor issues.Now we are ready to open up to the general community.

We are excited to announce that we are launching the Public Alpha Testing Phase, and to share with you all the progress we’ve made on the Moonstone Wallet.
All of you who want to test the Moonstone Wallet, you can sign up here (https://app.moonstone.io/register).

(https://moonstone.io/assets/moonstone-features-july.jpg)

We are still Alpha-testing the web application, meaning this is not production ready until we see fit that the application is stable and delivers a high level of reliability

We thank all of you for your valuable feedback over the past weeks.

Your Moonstone team
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on July 11, 2016, 02:51:30 pm
We present you the Moonstone Wallet UI Kit (https://moonstone.io/ui-kit.html) - Feel free to download or share with your coworkers and buddies.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: btswolf on July 11, 2016, 04:59:20 pm
@bitsapphire what are your plans for BitShares and Graphene based chains in 2016/2017?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: bitsapphire on July 20, 2016, 09:15:26 am
We've added the following new features and improvements on Moonstone Wallet (https://app.moonstone.io/register): 
  Wallet Import/Export Added
  Performance Improvements
  Minor Bug Fixes

We hope you'll find these useful.     
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Akado on July 20, 2016, 09:54:27 am
This is still Alpha right?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: cryptosile on April 14, 2017, 03:42:29 pm
Did anything happen with the crowdfunding moonstone tokens?  I contributed but not sure whatever happened there.   Where do I find the latest info ?
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Harvey on April 19, 2017, 03:01:32 am
I sent a message through the website of
https://bitsapphire.com/contact-us/

"
Hi,

I am harvey from the bitshares community.

In 2015, by participating the crowdfunding of moonstone, which is a project initialized by bitsapphire, I got 1,000,000 moonfund (check my bts account: dragongroup). 

Since it was promised that all moonfund will be buyback, I put a sell order of 1,000,000 moonfund in the bitshares exchange (moonfund:bts). Hope the project is going well, and moonfund can be buyback as promised. :)

Regards
Harvey
"

If you participated in the crowdfunding of moonstone, you might also want to leave a message here or the on website of bitsapphire.

More information of bitsapphire can be found by following links:
https://www.facebook.com/bitsapphire
https://twitter.com/bitsapphire
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: sva_h4cky0 on April 30, 2017, 07:27:53 am
I sent a message through the website of
https://bitsapphire.com/contact-us/

"
Hi,

I am harvey from the bitshares community.

In 2015, by participating the crowdfunding of moonstone, which is a project initialized by bitsapphire, I got 1,000,000 moonfund (check my bts account: dragongroup). 

Since it was promised that all moonfund will be buyback, I put a sell order of 1,000,000 moonfund in the bitshares exchange (moonfund:bts). Hope the project is going well, and moonfund can be buyback as promised. :)

Regards
Harvey
"

If you participated in the crowdfunding of moonstone, you might also want to leave a message here or the on website of bitsapphire.

More information of bitsapphire can be found by following links:
https://www.facebook.com/bitsapphire
https://twitter.com/bitsapphire

any update?  ;D
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: Harvey on May 07, 2017, 02:47:50 pm
I sent a message through the website of
https://bitsapphire.com/contact-us/

"
Hi,

I am harvey from the bitshares community.

In 2015, by participating the crowdfunding of moonstone, which is a project initialized by bitsapphire, I got 1,000,000 moonfund (check my bts account: dragongroup). 

Since it was promised that all moonfund will be buyback, I put a sell order of 1,000,000 moonfund in the bitshares exchange (moonfund:bts). Hope the project is going well, and moonfund can be buyback as promised. :)

Regards
Harvey
"

If you participated in the crowdfunding of moonstone, you might also want to leave a message here or the on website of bitsapphire.

More information of bitsapphire can be found by following links:
https://www.facebook.com/bitsapphire
https://twitter.com/bitsapphire

any update?  ;D

Have not received any word from Bitsapphire.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: konelectric on May 07, 2017, 06:55:16 pm
I sent a message through the website of
https://bitsapphire.com/contact-us/

"
Hi,

I am harvey from the bitshares community.

In 2015, by participating the crowdfunding of moonstone, which is a project initialized by bitsapphire, I got 1,000,000 moonfund (check my bts account: dragongroup). 

Since it was promised that all moonfund will be buyback, I put a sell order of 1,000,000 moonfund in the bitshares exchange (moonfund:bts). Hope the project is going well, and moonfund can be buyback as promised. :)

Regards
Harvey
"

If you participated in the crowdfunding of moonstone, you might also want to leave a message here or the on website of bitsapphire.

More information of bitsapphire can be found by following links:
https://www.facebook.com/bitsapphire
https://twitter.com/bitsapphire

any update?  ;D

Have not received any word from Bitsapphire.

I thought that Bitsapphire was not working with the Moonstone project anymore.
Title: Re: [ANN] Moonstone.io development and crowdfunder diary
Post by: R on May 07, 2017, 08:32:34 pm
Not all assets are showing in the search, for example I cannot find the EBA 'OPEN.GRC'.