BitShares Forum

Main => Technical Support => Topic started by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:02:23 pm

Title: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:02:23 pm
http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/announcing-bitshares-2.0/

We will be having a Mumble session at 4 PM EST today to discuss the latest news.   

bitshares.org will be updated shortly to point at http://bitshares.github.io

I would like to thank everyone who helped make this possible!   
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Ander on June 08, 2015, 06:04:59 pm
First? :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Permie on June 08, 2015, 06:05:19 pm
Quote
The BitShares development team is proud to make their biggest announcement since launching one year ago: the upgrade to BitShares 2.0.

This is the next step in the evolution of BitShares, and incorporates all of the feedback and lessons learned from the BitShares stakeholders, partners, developers, marketers, and other community leaders throughout this past year of research and development.

Up until now, the core development team has closely controlled the development and direction of BitShares. With BitShares reaching maturity at version 2.0, the team is ready to remove the training wheels, and let the direction of all future development be decided completely by stakeholder vote.

To help ensure the long-term success of BitShares technology, the core development team will be reorganizing into Cryptonomex Inc., an independent blockchain development company. By utilizing a new worker voting system that will be included in BitShares 2.0, this company will continue to help develop BitShares in whatever direction is approved by its stakeholders. With this new structure, BitShares will be more robust, sustainable, and fair than ever.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: CLains on June 08, 2015, 06:07:09 pm
Incredible. Only in BitShares: Buy the news!!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: nomoreheroes7 on June 08, 2015, 06:07:22 pm
Lol I like how we just skip right over the dreaded 1.0 and hit 2.0.

 +5%
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on June 08, 2015, 06:07:24 pm
Awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sent from my SGH-T999V using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: lovejoy on June 08, 2015, 06:08:37 pm
Bravo!

 +5%
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: CryptoPrometheus on June 08, 2015, 06:09:11 pm
Excellent News!!!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: carpet ride on June 08, 2015, 06:09:36 pm
Very proud of you guys! +5%


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: roadscape on June 08, 2015, 06:09:48 pm
It's beautiful :'( :'(
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: merivercap on June 08, 2015, 06:11:22 pm
 +5% +5% +5% :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: MrJeans on June 08, 2015, 06:11:42 pm
Oh yeah!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: hodor on June 08, 2015, 06:12:01 pm
http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/announcing-bitshares-2.0/
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

(http://overmental.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Who-replaces-Dany--1024x577.png)

Hodor!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: clayop on June 08, 2015, 06:12:29 pm
Wow!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: luckybit on June 08, 2015, 06:12:41 pm
http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/announcing-bitshares-2.0/

We will be having a Mumble session at 4 PM EST today to discuss the latest news.   

bitshares.org will be updated shortly to point at http://bitshares.github.io

I would like to thank everyone who helped make this possible!

How is it 2.0 when we don't even have 1.0?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: theoretical on June 08, 2015, 06:14:07 pm
There's a lot of awesome stuff here.  A metric ton of new information.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: maqifrnswa on June 08, 2015, 06:15:18 pm
it's a whole ecosystem! a lot of work to digest... One thing that stands out, it truly is a working more like you would expect a "company" to work - delegation of responsibilities and performance based compensation.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:15:37 pm
http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/announcing-bitshares-2.0/

We will be having a Mumble session at 4 PM EST today to discuss the latest news.   

bitshares.org will be updated shortly to point at http://bitshares.github.io

I would like to thank everyone who helped make this possible!

How is it 2.0 when we don't even have 1.0?

1.0 will have a very short shelf life.   This isn't the same code base as BitShares 0.9.x so calling it 1.0 wouldn't do it justice.   It is all just a naming convention anyway.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: BTSdac on June 08, 2015, 06:15:52 pm
 +5% +5% +5 +5%
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: merockstar on June 08, 2015, 06:17:44 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Bitcoinfan on June 08, 2015, 06:18:16 pm
New site is so top shelf beautiful. Its simple. This is great. 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:18:59 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Gentso1 on June 08, 2015, 06:19:34 pm
Who owns  Cryptonomex Inc?

What happens to I3?

Care to let us know about any partners involved with  Cryptonomex Inc?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Ander on June 08, 2015, 06:23:03 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.


And then all new, valuable names will be auctioned off, so we dont have the problem of squatters trying to take the name of every company, website, and famous person, correct?

Every other DNS naming system is overrun by these squatters, and it prevents the system from having any chance of catching on.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: merockstar on June 08, 2015, 06:23:39 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

but once the migration occurs such a race will happen?

By the way this all looks fantastic. Whoever's expectations aren't met by this is just an outright troll.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:23:45 pm
Who owns  Cryptonomex Inc?

What happens to I3?

Care to let us know about any partners involved with  Cryptonomex Inc?

Cryptonomex is mostly "employee owned" and exists with approval of I3 shareholders. 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:24:25 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

but once the migration occurs such a race will happen?

Perhaps, but quality names will cost much more. 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: fav on June 08, 2015, 06:25:22 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

please elaborate. does that mean our current account names will be gone with the new version?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Stan on June 08, 2015, 06:26:45 pm
http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/announcing-bitshares-2.0/

We will be having a Mumble session at 4 PM EST today to discuss the latest news.   

bitshares.org will be updated shortly to point at http://bitshares.github.io

I would like to thank everyone who helped make this possible!

How is it 2.0 when we don't even have 1.0?

1.0 will have a very short shelf life.   This isn't the same code base as BitShares 0.9.x so calling it 1.0 wouldn't do it justice.   It is all just a naming convention anyway.

Months ago we realized that the Graphene Toolkit (in R&D at the time) was going to blow the BitShares Toolkit out of the water.  This is why no 1.0 came out.  We were focusing on getting to 2.0 at flank speed - with our heads down and our mouths shut.  Graphene is re-engineered from the ground up - it is not a mere polishing of the current code, as 1.0 would imply.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:27:36 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

please elaborate. does that mean our current account names will be gone with the new version?

It is all covered in the migration page.   All current account names migrate as-is.   Any new names that are no "premium" also migrate as is.  Premium names are names with fewer than 8 characters and no numbers.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: robrigo on June 08, 2015, 06:27:49 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

please elaborate. does that mean our current account names will be gone with the new version?

They will be migrated, check out the migration strategy blog post for more details: http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/migrating-to-bitshares-2.0/
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Ander on June 08, 2015, 06:28:22 pm
please elaborate. does that mean our current account names will be gone with the new version?

I think it will mean that your name will be changed from 'favdesu' to something like 'legacy_favdesu'.  (Or some other prefix).

So you'll still have your name with your BTS, but the current account name squatters wont get good names in the new system, so that the name 'google' can actually be auctioned off and provide revenue to Bitshares, instead of being squatted by whoever got it first.   Thats my understanding at least.

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Permie on June 08, 2015, 06:29:18 pm
Referral Program details!

Quote
Referral Program

Earn $80 or more for every lifetime member you sign up.

BitShares™ has several different kinds of accounts: Basic Account, Annual Member, and Lifetime Member.

Basic Accounts are free, but do not qualify for the referral program, nor any cash back on transaction fees.

Annual Members pay a subscription fee of $20/year and earn 50% cash back on every fee they pay. They also qualify for up to 50% of the fees paid by anyone they refer to the network until their subscription expires.

Lifetime Members pay $100 and earn 80% cash back on every fee they pay. They also qualify for 80% of the fees paid by Basic Accounts they refer to the network. Additionally, they qualify for 30% of every fee paid by any Annual Member they have referred. In the event of a subscription expiration, the referral income falls back to the nearest Lifetime Member in the referral history.

These cashback referral rates, 50% and 80%, can be adjusted by the consensus of the BitShares Stakeholders at any time. Annual Accounts have their rates locked in for one year, while Lifetime Accounts have their rates locked in for life.

We estimate that the average fees paid over the lifetime of each Account will be in excess of $1002, which means that a membership could earn over $80 per referred user. Of course, it is your own responsibility to estimate how often you, and those you refer, will use the network. Keep in mind that the BitShares stakeholders have the ability to change transaction fees, which could impact future earnings.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Stan on June 08, 2015, 06:30:15 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

please elaborate. does that mean our current account names will be gone with the new version?

Existing names are grandfathered in - unchanged.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Ander on June 08, 2015, 06:31:28 pm
I love that the new client will be an entirely broswer based wallet.  This will greatly reduce the barrier to entry.

At present, its very easy for me to have a bitcoin wallet at blockchain.org, or a dogecoin wallet at dogechain, or whatever.  But having a Bitshares wallet was very difficult, required me to update the client, took a long time to sync the blockchain, and hogged my computer resources when I ran it. 

This will be a MASSIVE upgrade to usability. 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 08, 2015, 06:34:48 pm
There is a discussion thread for mostly every new feature in a newly create subforum:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/board,91.0.html

Overview (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16744.0.html)

Of particular interest should be this article:
Answers to the questions raised by the community (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16781.0.html)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: fav on June 08, 2015, 06:36:26 pm
oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

please elaborate. does that mean our current account names will be gone with the new version?

They will be migrated, check out the migration strategy blog post for more details: http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/migrating-to-bitshares-2.0/

nice, thanks!  +5%
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: roadscape on June 08, 2015, 06:39:10 pm
https://bitshares.github.io/technology/
Dynamic Account Permissions
Every account can be controlled by any weighted combination of other accounts and private keys.
This creates a hierarchical structure that reflects how permissions are organized in real life, and makes
multi-user control over funds easier than ever. Multi-user control is the single biggest contributor to
security, and, when used properly, it can virtually eliminate the risk of theft due to hacking.


multisig is solved..
(http://i.imgur.com/c9Kpwuk.gif)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 06:41:18 pm
https://bitshares.github.io/technology/
Dynamic Account Permissions
Every account can be controlled by any weighted combination of other accounts and private keys.
This creates a hierarchical structure that reflects how permissions are organized in real life, and makes
multi-user control over funds easier than ever. Multi-user control is the single biggest contributor to
security, and, when used properly, it can virtually eliminate the risk of theft due to hacking.


multisig is solved..
(http://i.imgur.com/c9Kpwuk.gif)

I was wondering how long it would take people to discover this and realize its importance :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: allseeinguy on June 08, 2015, 06:43:25 pm
Fantastic piece of software for any budding entrepreneurs. You might have hit the nail on the head with this!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: roadscape on June 08, 2015, 06:44:04 pm
https://bitshares.github.io/technology/
Dynamic Account Permissions
Every account can be controlled by any weighted combination of other accounts and private keys.
This creates a hierarchical structure that reflects how permissions are organized in real life, and makes
multi-user control over funds easier than ever. Multi-user control is the single biggest contributor to
security, and, when used properly, it can virtually eliminate the risk of theft due to hacking.


multisig is solved..
(http://i.imgur.com/c9Kpwuk.gif)

I was wondering how long it would take people to discover this and realize its importance :)

Win. Win. Win.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Ander on June 08, 2015, 06:45:59 pm
https://bitshares.github.io/technology/
Dynamic Account Permissions
Every account can be controlled by any weighted combination of other accounts and private keys.
This creates a hierarchical structure that reflects how permissions are organized in real life, and makes
multi-user control over funds easier than ever. Multi-user control is the single biggest contributor to
security, and, when used properly, it can virtually eliminate the risk of theft due to hacking.


multisig is solved..
(http://i.imgur.com/c9Kpwuk.gif)

I was wondering how long it would take people to discover this and realize its importance :)

Wow.

Bitshares 2.0 is going to blow everything else out of the water in terms of technical stats. 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: CalabiYau on June 08, 2015, 06:49:02 pm
Really impressing - congrats to the team !
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: MrJeans on June 08, 2015, 06:52:18 pm
While the wait was torture, I'm loving this new surprise us method!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: sschechter on June 08, 2015, 07:01:12 pm
Time to launch PeerTracks on this....
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: oldman on June 08, 2015, 07:02:33 pm
Reddit upvotes needed:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3929x3/bitshares_now_handles_more_tps_than_visa_and/ (http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3929x3/bitshares_now_handles_more_tps_than_visa_and/)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: biophil on June 08, 2015, 07:05:33 pm
mmmm, transferable accounts. You people are beautiful. :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: mavisjames on June 08, 2015, 07:06:35 pm
 +5%
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: svk on June 08, 2015, 07:08:31 pm
I love that the new client will be an entirely broswer based wallet.  This will greatly reduce the barrier to entry.

At present, its very easy for me to have a bitcoin wallet at blockchain.org, or a dogecoin wallet at dogechain, or whatever.  But having a Bitshares wallet was very difficult, required me to update the client, took a long time to sync the blockchain, and hogged my computer resources when I ran it. 

This will be a MASSIVE upgrade to usability.

The new client architecture is much easier to work with as well, and having built-in websocket support makes everything so much cleaner. Instead of constantly polling for updates we can now simply subscribe to updates for an account or a market, and get instant notifications whenever something happens. It's pure gold :)

We've also switched to using React instead of Angular so the new wallet will be much much faster.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Chuckone on June 08, 2015, 07:09:32 pm
I pissed my pants a little while reading about all those new and incredible features, and I'm still far from understanding all the implications.

Incredible job!!!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:10:11 pm
I love that the new client will be an entirely broswer based wallet.  This will greatly reduce the barrier to entry.

At present, its very easy for me to have a bitcoin wallet at blockchain.org, or a dogecoin wallet at dogechain, or whatever.  But having a Bitshares wallet was very difficult, required me to update the client, took a long time to sync the blockchain, and hogged my computer resources when I ran it. 

This will be a MASSIVE upgrade to usability.

The new client architecture is much easier to work with as well, and having built-in websocket support makes everything so much cleaner. Instead of constantly polling for updates we can now simply subscribe to updates for an account or a market, and get instant notifications whenever something happens. It's pure gold :)

We've also switched to using React instead of Angular so the new wallet will be much much faster.

SVK has made a HUGE contribution to the GUI that is as big as any other core developer.   Thank you SVK for joining the team and helping make the new UI better than ever!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Akado on June 08, 2015, 07:12:10 pm
Questions,

Will marketing be finally able to be done for BitShares after the trial period?

Regarding the transaction amount. Claiming it handles more than visa is a big statement, has this been tested? or will this be properly tested during the trial period?

btw, bad idea posting this on bitcoin subforum, you know it will get attacked and shredded to pieces, downvoted to oblivion, why do you even post there? We will only be seen as SPAM. Post on crypto sub reddit and radical decentralization, other places crypto people hang out but not there. That's my opinion.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: svk on June 08, 2015, 07:12:19 pm
I love that the new client will be an entirely broswer based wallet.  This will greatly reduce the barrier to entry.

At present, its very easy for me to have a bitcoin wallet at blockchain.org, or a dogecoin wallet at dogechain, or whatever.  But having a Bitshares wallet was very difficult, required me to update the client, took a long time to sync the blockchain, and hogged my computer resources when I ran it. 

This will be a MASSIVE upgrade to usability.

The new client architecture is much easier to work with as well, and having built-in websocket support makes everything so much cleaner. Instead of constantly polling for updates we can now simply subscribe to updates for an account or a market, and get instant notifications whenever something happens. It's pure gold :)

We've also switched to using React instead of Angular so the new wallet will be much much faster.

SVK has made a HUGE contribution to the GUI that is as big as any other core developer.   Thank you SVK for joining the team and helping make the new UI better than ever!

Thank you, it's been very exciting :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Xypher on June 08, 2015, 07:12:54 pm
https://bitshares.github.io/technology/
Dynamic Account Permissions
Every account can be controlled by any weighted combination of other accounts and private keys.
This creates a hierarchical structure that reflects how permissions are organized in real life, and makes
multi-user control over funds easier than ever. Multi-user control is the single biggest contributor to
security, and, when used properly, it can virtually eliminate the risk of theft due to hacking.


multisig is solved..
(http://i.imgur.com/c9Kpwuk.gif)

I was wondering how long it would take people to discover this and realize its importance :)
Multi-sig
Instant transactions.
Right in sync with a gaming project I've been working on.

Details go live soon :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: fav on June 08, 2015, 07:13:12 pm
Referrals: how does the client know who referred someone? will there be a special client download?

also,

Quote
Reward Vesting Requirements

All cashback and referral income are deposited into a special balance which must vest linearly for 1 year. This means that after 6 months you can withdraw about 50% of your cash back, but your remaining funds will take an additional year to vest. This is because the vesting process is based upon accumulating “BTS-years”, for each BTS-year accumulated you can withdraw 1 BTS. If you leave 100 BTS in the account for 1 year then you will have accumulated 100 BTS-years and can withdraw 100 BTS. On the other hand, if you withdraw 50 BTS after 6 months, then you will have consumed 50 BTS-years leaving your account with 50 BTS and 0 BTS-years. It will take a full year to accumulate another 50 BTS-years.

I don't like this at all. If you spent time bringing people to the network, you probably need some money for advertisement etc. you won't be able to reinvest this way

Edit: no marketer will join on this terms in my opinion.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: valzav on June 08, 2015, 07:14:02 pm
I love that the new client will be an entirely broswer based wallet.  This will greatly reduce the barrier to entry.

At present, its very easy for me to have a bitcoin wallet at blockchain.org, or a dogecoin wallet at dogechain, or whatever.  But having a Bitshares wallet was very difficult, required me to update the client, took a long time to sync the blockchain, and hogged my computer resources when I ran it. 

This will be a MASSIVE upgrade to usability.

The new client architecture is much easier to work with as well, and having built-in websocket support makes everything so much cleaner. Instead of constantly polling for updates we can now simply subscribe to updates for an account or a market, and get instant notifications whenever something happens. It's pure gold :)

We've also switched to using React instead of Angular so the new wallet will be much much faster.

Also we can use React Native to build native UIs for mobile platforms and reuse more than 50% of code between web and native apps.
There is some work already done on this side, see https://github.com/cryptonomex/graphene-ui/tree/master/ios
 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:14:55 pm
Questions,

Will marketing be finally able to be done for BitShares after the trial period?

Regarding the transaction amount. Claiming it handles more than visa is a big statement, has this been tested? or will this be properly tested during the trial period?

We have tested that we can handle the volume on a LOCAL network.    We presume that once all delegates are Tier 1 connected to each other it will behave like a giant local network.   
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Xypher on June 08, 2015, 07:15:27 pm
Referrals: how does the client know who referred someone? will there be a special client download?

also,

Quote
Reward Vesting Requirements

All cashback and referral income are deposited into a special balance which must vest linearly for 1 year. This means that after 6 months you can withdraw about 50% of your cash back, but your remaining funds will take an additional year to vest. This is because the vesting process is based upon accumulating “BTS-years”, for each BTS-year accumulated you can withdraw 1 BTS. If you leave 100 BTS in the account for 1 year then you will have accumulated 100 BTS-years and can withdraw 100 BTS. On the other hand, if you withdraw 50 BTS after 6 months, then you will have consumed 50 BTS-years leaving your account with 50 BTS and 0 BTS-years. It will take a full year to accumulate another 50 BTS-years.

I don't like this at all. If you spent time bringing people to the network, you probably need some money for advertisement etc. you won't be able to reinvest this way

The way the referral model is right now, it leaves us with zero means to bring in users for Bitshares.
Our user demographic would never spend money to try a new tech :/
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:16:17 pm
Referrals: how does the client know who referred someone? will there be a special client download?

also,

Quote
Reward Vesting Requirements

All cashback and referral income are deposited into a special balance which must vest linearly for 1 year. This means that after 6 months you can withdraw about 50% of your cash back, but your remaining funds will take an additional year to vest. This is because the vesting process is based upon accumulating “BTS-years”, for each BTS-year accumulated you can withdraw 1 BTS. If you leave 100 BTS in the account for 1 year then you will have accumulated 100 BTS-years and can withdraw 100 BTS. On the other hand, if you withdraw 50 BTS after 6 months, then you will have consumed 50 BTS-years leaving your account with 50 BTS and 0 BTS-years. It will take a full year to accumulate another 50 BTS-years.

I don't like this at all. If you spent time bringing people to the network, you probably need some money for advertisement etc. you won't be able to reinvest this way

Sadly, vesting was required to address a potential attack vector on the referral incentives.    Also, it helps mitigate Ponzi/Pyramid/Get Rich Quick type accusations.   
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:18:33 pm
Our user demographic would never spend money to try a new tech :/

It is really rather simple to finance things to get the funds.    Unfortunately, without required centralized ID verification there is no way to "give" samples away to new users.   
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Xypher on June 08, 2015, 07:22:15 pm
Our user demographic would never spend money to try a new tech :/

It is really rather simple to finance things to get the funds.    Unfortunately, without required centralized ID verification there is no way to "give" samples away to new users.

Why would a person want to undergo an ID verification to try a demo of bitshares ?
Or do you mean  the company raising funds in large sums for this purpose ?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:23:40 pm
Our user demographic would never spend money to try a new tech :/

It is really rather simple to finance things to get the funds.    Unfortunately, without required centralized ID verification there is no way to "give" samples away to new users.

Why would a person want to undergo an ID verification to try a demo of bitshares ?
Or do you mean  the company raising funds in large sums for this purpose ?

I mean it is a technical limitation of decentralized systems that without "proof of uniqueness" or "proof of work" the "free samples" given away will be sybil attacked and fail.   Bitcoin's referral program was proof of work... but now it has been abused.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: fav on June 08, 2015, 07:23:42 pm
Referrals: how does the client know who referred someone? will there be a special client download?

also,

Quote
Reward Vesting Requirements

All cashback and referral income are deposited into a special balance which must vest linearly for 1 year. This means that after 6 months you can withdraw about 50% of your cash back, but your remaining funds will take an additional year to vest. This is because the vesting process is based upon accumulating “BTS-years”, for each BTS-year accumulated you can withdraw 1 BTS. If you leave 100 BTS in the account for 1 year then you will have accumulated 100 BTS-years and can withdraw 100 BTS. On the other hand, if you withdraw 50 BTS after 6 months, then you will have consumed 50 BTS-years leaving your account with 50 BTS and 0 BTS-years. It will take a full year to accumulate another 50 BTS-years.

I don't like this at all. If you spent time bringing people to the network, you probably need some money for advertisement etc. you won't be able to reinvest this way

Sadly, vesting was required to address a potential attack vector on the referral incentives.    Also, it helps mitigate Ponzi/Pyramid/Get Rich Quick type accusations.

how do you invite people? is there a special client download page? ref links?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 08, 2015, 07:25:24 pm
how do you invite people? is there a special client download page? ref links?
The account that pays the fee for the account registration of someone else is the referrer ..
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: fav on June 08, 2015, 07:26:58 pm
how do you invite people? is there a special client download page? ref links?
The account that pays the fee for the account registration of someone else is the referrer ..

that means no traditional marketing methods would even work (like google ads)

nope, I think this referral program is a waste of time :<

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Xypher on June 08, 2015, 07:27:35 pm
Our user demographic would never spend money to try a new tech :/

It is really rather simple to finance things to get the funds.    Unfortunately, without required centralized ID verification there is no way to "give" samples away to new users.

Why would a person want to undergo an ID verification to try a demo of bitshares ?
Or do you mean  the company raising funds in large sums for this purpose ?

I mean it is a technical limitation of decentralized systems that without "proof of uniqueness" or "proof of work" the "free samples" given away will be sybil attacked and fail.   Bitcoin's referral program was proof of work... but now it has been abused.

Makes sense.
Thank you.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:27:49 pm
how do you invite people? is there a special client download page? ref links?
The account that pays the fee for the account registration of someone else is the referrer ..

If you use the faucet then the account specified via ?r=  will get a 50% of the referral income.   So not everyone needs to be a faucet.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Stan on June 08, 2015, 07:28:08 pm
...and the promised 17 Lessons Learned (http://bitshares.github.io/blog/2015/06/08/lessons-learned-from-bitshares-0.x/) + 2 bonus lessons...

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:29:57 pm
how do you invite people? is there a special client download page? ref links?
The account that pays the fee for the account registration of someone else is the referrer ..

that means no traditional marketing methods would even work (like google ads)

nope, I think this referral program is a waste of time :<

I think you have misjudged it.   Just use google adds with bitshares.org/?r=youraccunt   and you can get 50% of the referral stream
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: infovortice2013 on June 08, 2015, 07:30:42 pm
(https://thewomaninvisible.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/artworks-000059752349-ah4l45-original.jpg?w=300&h=270&crop=1)

thanks team you are great. need time to preccess all new features, and remake videos and tutos ect... one more time XD

but now bitshares can hug the world
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Stan on June 08, 2015, 07:33:14 pm
how do you invite people? is there a special client download page? ref links?
The account that pays the fee for the account registration of someone else is the referrer ..

that means no traditional marketing methods would even work (like google ads)

nope, I think this referral program is a waste of time :<

When bloggers and podcasters and exchanges and banks and gaming communities start signing up their existing user bases en masse, the value of a rate limit on their liquidation will become apparent. 

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: lil_jay890 on June 08, 2015, 07:37:53 pm
"

As soon as the software is ready, it will enter a public testing period for gathering community feedback. This testing period will last until the community is satisfied with the new system, after which an upgrade snapshot date will be announced with at least 30 days notice.

"

Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Xypher on June 08, 2015, 07:40:45 pm
how do you invite people? is there a special client download page? ref links?
The account that pays the fee for the account registration of someone else is the referrer ..

that means no traditional marketing methods would even work (like google ads)

nope, I think this referral program is a waste of time :<

When bloggers and podcasters and exchanges and banks and gaming communities start signing up their existing user bases en masse, the value of a rate limit on their liquidation will become apparent.

*Puts thinking cap on to figure how FS can do this*
Any inputs? :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: testz on June 08, 2015, 07:43:34 pm
Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?

Q3 2015
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Krills on June 08, 2015, 07:47:45 pm

Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?

Q3 2015
official answer?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Stan on June 08, 2015, 07:48:58 pm

Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?

Q3 2015
official answer?

"This Summer"
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: dannotestein on June 08, 2015, 07:53:03 pm

Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?

Q3 2015
official answer?

"This Summer"

Best to bear in mind that "E" in ETA then...
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 08, 2015, 07:59:56 pm
"

As soon as the software is ready, it will enter a public testing period for gathering community feedback. This testing period will last until the community is satisfied with the new system, after which an upgrade snapshot date will be announced with at least 30 days notice.

"

Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?

This summer.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: carpet ride on June 08, 2015, 08:00:19 pm


Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?

Q3 2015
official answer?

"This Summer"

Best to bear in mind that "E" in ETA then...
Let's just push it to Christmas


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: cass on June 08, 2015, 08:04:52 pm
I love that the new client will be an entirely broswer based wallet.  This will greatly reduce the barrier to entry.

At present, its very easy for me to have a bitcoin wallet at blockchain.org, or a dogecoin wallet at dogechain, or whatever.  But having a Bitshares wallet was very difficult, required me to update the client, took a long time to sync the blockchain, and hogged my computer resources when I ran it. 

This will be a MASSIVE upgrade to usability.

The new client architecture is much easier to work with as well, and having built-in websocket support makes everything so much cleaner. Instead of constantly polling for updates we can now simply subscribe to updates for an account or a market, and get instant notifications whenever something happens. It's pure gold :)

We've also switched to using React instead of Angular so the new wallet will be much much faster.

SVK has made a HUGE contribution to the GUI that is as big as any other core developer.   Thank you SVK for joining the team and helping make the new UI better than ever!

 +5%
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: theoretical on June 08, 2015, 08:05:31 pm
that means no traditional marketing methods would even work (like google ads)

nope, I think this referral program is a waste of time :<

You're worried that a referrer will have to run a full node, create a transaction on the user's behalf, get the user to sign it and return the signed tx, then broadcast the tx.

We realized this would be a problem soon after the initial design of the referral system, and we have a solution.  That's what the registrar is for.  Essentially we split the referral role into two parts:  the referrer can be a traditional internet marketer, all they have to do is get the user to click a link to some hosted wallet with ?r=youraccount.  The operator of the hosted wallet is a registrar who takes care of all the hard blockchain stuff.  The referrer and registrar split the commission (and the split doesn't have to be 50-50, any percentage is possible at the blockchain level.)

Any good marketer who can collect users can be their own registrar and get 100% of the commission, but marketers may not want to deal with the technology headaches of being a registrar.

By making it easy for them to split their commissions, any marketer (referrer) can partner with any technologist (registrar) and maximize their value because both are focused on their specialty instead of trying to simultaneously master both marketing and technology.

The official hosted wallet website will function as a registrar based on ?r= parameter on incoming links, but competing registrars will almost certainly spring up.  The free market should allow opportunity for a variety of cooperative and competitive relationships to form.

I should also note that payouts are based on income and vest for some time, which greatly mitigates a variety of potential referral abuses.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: fav on June 08, 2015, 08:10:03 pm
that means no traditional marketing methods would even work (like google ads)

nope, I think this referral program is a waste of time :<

You're worried that a referrer will have to run a full node, create a transaction on the user's behalf, get the user to sign it and return the signed tx, then broadcast the tx.

We realized this would be a problem soon after the initial design of the referral system, and we have a solution.  That's what the registrar is for.  Essentially we split the referral role into two parts:  the referrer can be a traditional internet marketer, all they have to do is get the user to click a link to some hosted wallet with ?r=youraccount.  The operator of the hosted wallet is a registrar who takes care of all the hard blockchain stuff.  The referrer and registrar split the commission (and the split doesn't have to be 50-50, any percentage is possible at the blockchain level.)

Any good marketer who can collect users can be their own registrar and get 100% of the commission, but marketers may not want to deal with the technology headaches of being a registrar.

By making it easy for them to split their commissions, any marketer (referrer) can partner with any technologist (registrar) and maximize their value because both are focused on their specialty instead of trying to simultaneously master both marketing and technology.

The official hosted wallet website will function as a registrar based on ?r= parameter on incoming links, but competing registrars will almost certainly spring up.  The free market should allow opportunity for a variety of cooperative and competitive relationships to form.

I should also note that payouts are based on income and vest for some time, which greatly mitigates a variety of potential referral abuses.

thank you! that's much better than my initial thoughts on it.

@bitsapphire moonstone needs this!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: infovortice2013 on June 08, 2015, 08:12:01 pm
and whats up with sparkles is waiting 1.0  :o
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: cass on June 08, 2015, 08:14:39 pm
and whats up with sparkles is waiting 1.0  :o

guess they will miss the train  ;D
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: mint chocolate chip on June 08, 2015, 08:18:33 pm
and whats up with sparkles is waiting 1.0  :o

guess they will miss the train  ;D

Sparkle was originally intended to be PoW, not DPOS. That was the whole point: bitshares functionality on a PoW chain.

Something tells me Sparkle is DOA.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Ander on June 08, 2015, 08:22:41 pm
and whats up with sparkles is waiting 1.0  :o

I wanted my sparkles. :(
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: infovortice2013 on June 08, 2015, 08:23:18 pm
whats DOA means?

i buy a quad processor for dig sparkles
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: onceuponatime on June 08, 2015, 08:24:57 pm
whats DOA means?

i buy a quad processor for dig sparkles

DOA:  dead on arrival
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Akado on June 08, 2015, 08:30:08 pm
reddit post seems it was removed. even if it was by the owner, major fuck up if you ask me. Why do you insist on post stuff on bitcoin sub reddit, post on other decentralized and crypto related subs. not there...

congrats
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: merivercap on June 08, 2015, 08:36:00 pm
Our user demographic would never spend money to try a new tech :/

It is really rather simple to finance things to get the funds.    Unfortunately, without required centralized ID verification there is no way to "give" samples away to new users.

Why would a person want to undergo an ID verification to try a demo of bitshares ?
Or do you mean  the company raising funds in large sums for this purpose ?

I mean it is a technical limitation of decentralized systems that without "proof of uniqueness" or "proof of work" the "free samples" given away will be sybil attacked and fail.   Bitcoin's referral program was proof of work... but now it has been abused.

What kind of ID verification is required? 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 08, 2015, 08:38:34 pm
What kind of ID verification is required?
no ID verification is required to use BitShares ..

ID verification may be required to use "some" User-Issued assets ..
If there was ID verification, sending out free samples to attract people would be possible ..
that's the reason we now have the more sophisticated referral program to attract people instead
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: blahblah7up on June 08, 2015, 08:44:13 pm
Our user demographic would never spend money to try a new tech :/

It is really rather simple to finance things to get the funds.    Unfortunately, without required centralized ID verification there is no way to "give" samples away to new users.

Why would a person want to undergo an ID verification to try a demo of bitshares ?
Or do you mean  the company raising funds in large sums for this purpose ?

I mean it is a technical limitation of decentralized systems that without "proof of uniqueness" or "proof of work" the "free samples" given away will be sybil attacked and fail.   Bitcoin's referral program was proof of work... but now it has been abused.

What kind of ID verification is required?

Let's rephrase the question then,

what kind of "proof of uniqueness" is required?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 08, 2015, 08:45:39 pm
Let's rephrase the question then,

what kind of "proof of uniqueness" is required?
none ..

It just doesn't make sense to try to abuse the system by referring to your own newly created accounts .. because they do not produce income for you
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Akado on June 08, 2015, 08:46:02 pm
Are there any prints of the GUI? I'm very curious. A small, basic video, just messing around and showing the tabs or voting would be nice to share around
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: merivercap on June 08, 2015, 09:00:00 pm
What kind of ID verification is required?
no ID verification is required to use BitShares ..

ID verification may be required to use "some" User-Issued assets ..
If there was ID verification, sending out free samples to attract people would be possible ..
that's the reason we now have the more sophisticated referral program to attract people instead

Essentially proof of stake with subscription fees? 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 08, 2015, 09:02:48 pm
What kind of ID verification is required?
no ID verification is required to use BitShares ..

ID verification may be required to use "some" User-Issued assets ..
If there was ID verification, sending out free samples to attract people would be possible ..
that's the reason we now have the more sophisticated referral program to attract people instead

Essentially proof of stake with subscription fees?

You have two options to increase adoption:
Hand out free bitUSD to new users ... this requires ID verification to not get abused

or alternatively make it like BitShares 2.0 and redistribute tx fees ...
that way no ID verification is required to incentivize user adoption ..

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: svk on June 08, 2015, 09:07:10 pm
Are there any prints of the GUI? I'm very curious. A small, basic video, just messing around and showing the tabs or voting would be nice to share around

We're waiting on Cass to finish up his work on bitshares.org etc so he can start Cassifying stuff (he probably needs a break right now though cause he's been working 24/7 for a while I think..), which means the current wallet is more function than form so far, we'll take some screens once Cass has worked his magic I think.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: merivercap on June 08, 2015, 09:08:32 pm
What kind of ID verification is required?
no ID verification is required to use BitShares ..

ID verification may be required to use "some" User-Issued assets ..
If there was ID verification, sending out free samples to attract people would be possible ..
that's the reason we now have the more sophisticated referral program to attract people instead

Essentially proof of stake with subscription fees?

You have two options to increase adoption:
Hand out free bitUSD to new users ... this requires ID verification to not get abused

or alternatively make it like BitShares 2.0 and redistribute tx fees ...
that way no ID verification is required to incentivize user adoption ..

Ok yeah. Transaction fee redistribution is very good.  There's also a subscription fee so I was wondering if that was part of proof of having stake too or just something additional. 
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 08, 2015, 09:10:59 pm
There's also a subscription fee so I was wondering if that was part of proof of having stake too or just something additional.
not sure about the economical part here ... but extra features should require extra fee, no?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: karnal on June 08, 2015, 09:20:21 pm
I love that the new client will be an entirely broswer based wallet.  This will greatly reduce the barrier to entry.

At present, its very easy for me to have a bitcoin wallet at blockchain.org, or a dogecoin wallet at dogechain, or whatever.  But having a Bitshares wallet was very difficult, required me to update the client, took a long time to sync the blockchain, and hogged my computer resources when I ran it. 

This will be a MASSIVE upgrade to usability.

Source? And by this I hope you mean it runs on localhost and accessible over http!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 08, 2015, 09:25:36 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/W4rfxB5.png)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: karnal on June 08, 2015, 09:26:17 pm
Also, it seems the new client is not the same codebase as 0.9.x.

Is TITAN also baked in the new codebase? Will we have privacy built-in by default?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: karnal on June 08, 2015, 09:28:15 pm
And finally, GOOD JOB guys, this is wonderful, a complete game changer. I can only hope the price stays low long enough to send a few thousands more before people catch up to this :)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Ben Mason on June 08, 2015, 10:25:18 pm
I'm speechless.  Bl00dy fantastic work guys.  It's awe inspiring.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: inarizushi on June 08, 2015, 10:32:59 pm
Absolutely awesome delivery :D. So much reading needed, this is just exciting as the first discovery ! Thank you !!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: canucklehead on June 08, 2015, 10:50:29 pm
Fantastic! All of you! I bet BTCJesus2.0 is gonna want some royalties for the name.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: biophil on June 08, 2015, 11:32:43 pm
Also, it seems the new client is not the same codebase as 0.9.x.

Is TITAN also baked in the new codebase? Will we have privacy built-in by default?
No, no TITAN. This is a good thing! TITAN wasn't really very effective for privacy, but it gave the illusion of privacy. Also, TITAN was one of the reasons the client was so unbelievably slow.

Sent from my LGL34C using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: wackou on June 08, 2015, 11:33:24 pm
I'm floored! This is an absolutely brilliant proposal, can't wait to see it in action :D
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Tuck Fheman on June 08, 2015, 11:38:16 pm
Referrals: how does the client know who referred someone? will there be a special client download?

also,

Quote
Reward Vesting Requirements

All cashback and referral income are deposited into a special balance which must vest linearly for 1 year. This means that after 6 months you can withdraw about 50% of your cash back, but your remaining funds will take an additional year to vest. This is because the vesting process is based upon accumulating “BTS-years”, for each BTS-year accumulated you can withdraw 1 BTS. If you leave 100 BTS in the account for 1 year then you will have accumulated 100 BTS-years and can withdraw 100 BTS. On the other hand, if you withdraw 50 BTS after 6 months, then you will have consumed 50 BTS-years leaving your account with 50 BTS and 0 BTS-years. It will take a full year to accumulate another 50 BTS-years.

I don't like this at all. If you spent time bringing people to the network, you probably need some money for advertisement etc. you won't be able to reinvest this way

 +5%

Sadly, vesting was required to address a potential attack vector on the referral incentives.    Also, it helps mitigate Ponzi/Pyramid/Get Rich Quick type accusations.

 :-\
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Tuck Fheman on June 08, 2015, 11:46:34 pm
Please elaborate on ...

... the value of a rate limit on their liquidation will become apparent.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: donkeypong on June 09, 2015, 01:13:04 am

Is there an ETA when the software will be ready?

Q3 2015
official answer?

"This Summer"

(http://midtownmonthly.net/blog/uploaded_images/Endlesssummer_big%5B1%5D-774518.jpg)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: donkeypong on June 09, 2015, 01:22:43 am
This news is great. Congrats to the team and thanks for all your hard work!

The referral program is a step in the right direction. For those of us who care and believe in BitShares as a long term earth-shaker, we will love using this referral program to help market it. As for the casual fan, I'm not so sure. Can BitShares' marketing really go viral with this vesting requirement? It sure can if the market cap rises to a certain point. We'll see if this can help us get to that point.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: zhangweis on June 09, 2015, 01:34:24 am
I'm excited that titan removed and market matching rule aligning most exchanges. What about maker-taker to improve the spread?
I'm bit dispointed that there's no burning any more but as long as the total supply doesn't change it should be ok.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: alt on June 09, 2015, 01:58:47 am
can we persist some name that used for business?
like: btsbots, transwiser

oh my goodness this is all gonna take my feeble mind a while to digest.

am I understanding this one small part correctly, is there going to be a race for valuable account names for DNS purposes?

all names registered after today will have a prefix appended to them.

That TODO item got lost in the rush to get this info out.

but once the migration occurs such a race will happen?

Perhaps, but quality names will cost much more.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: arhag on June 09, 2015, 03:51:02 am
Wow, great work. Can't wait until it's released.

A few things I was pleasantly surprised to hear:

I'm a little sad to hear that even the minimal existing barriers (in the form of TITAN) to prevent people from getting your transaction history and balance amounts will be removed (even though to someone sufficiently motivated they weren't actually protecting anyone's privacy), but I guess I expected that and it does provide a lot of other benefits. I just wish we can have some other tools later to help manage our privacy better.

One thing I am a little concerned with is if the fact that unique IDs are used rather than hashes means there are more vulnerabilities for successful attacks from a fake blockchain attack. If someone is able to fork everyone over to a new blockchain history with changes in that last 10 blocks or so could they possibly somehow cause someone elses transaction that was meant to send someone else funds send the attacker the funds instead if the attacker is able to "take over" the ID number the transaction was referring to? I guess I would need to actually understand how this new BitShares 2.0 blockchain engine works before I can better articulate this concern. Perhaps TaPOS where the transaction refers to a recent block on the correct chain could help prevent any potential attacks like that (if such attacks even exist)?

Another thing I was thinking about while reading about the changes was how the state is committed to disk only on exit. I understand that it stores the blocks to disk as it receives them so that it can always recover the database state from scratch if necessary. But I don't see why it couldn't periodically commit the database state to disk so that if it fails it doesn't need to replay from the last time the program successfully exited (which may be a long time ago). In fact, if memory usage is so low, I think it would be cool to use just double the memory by using some memory page copy-on-write system to take a snapshot of the memory state while continuing to evolve the other copy, and then asynchronously serializing the snapshot copy to disk. Then when that serialization is done, the memory of the snapshot copy can be freed from RAM to repeat the process over again by taking a snapshot of the evolved copy. In fact, maybe the serialization can be delayed by some period to ensure that the time limit for chain reorganization has passed and so that you know you (almost never) would need replay the blockchain from any committed state older the most recent one, which is probably less than 5 hours old.

Then there are the few things I would have really liked to see if we were going to have such a huge change that requires a complicated migration strategy, even though I of course didn't actually expect to see them. The biggest would be a way of repeatedly and asynchronously committing a snapshot of the state (one that could be agreed upon via the consensus protocol) to a single cryptographic hash that could be committed and approved by all the witnesses as part of their responsibilities. This could allow users to quickly bootstrap to the current state of the database using a copy of a recent serialized snapshot state (which would be less than a day old) and a trusted hash of a recent block. I know that the new engine should speed up replay dramatically, but this would also allow the node to not need to download the entire blockchain either (and they may be constrained by bandwidth more so than CPU speed) as long as they didn't care about transaction history. And in the long term, one of the old snapshot states (that everyone for sure agreed was valid) could effectively act as the new genesis state and allow for blockchain pruning to save disk space. Furthermore, if the commitment of the state snapshot to a single hash was done intelligently, it could allow anyone to provide small proofs of the existence of objects in the database state at the time of the snapshot, where the verifier only needs to trust that the majority of witnesses at the time they committed the hash of the state snapshot to the blockchain did not collude to provide a false proof. This could allow lightweight clients and hosted wallets to (independent of further participation by witnesses) provide the user extra assurance that their view of the database is correct (even if that extra assurance is delayed by a few hours).

Finally, I hope you guys haven't given up on the following:
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Riverhead on June 09, 2015, 04:02:01 am

Another thing I was thinking about while reading about the changes was how the state is committed to disk only on exit. I understand that it stores the blocks to disk as it receives them so that it can always recover the database state from scratch if necessary. But I don't see why it couldn't periodically commit the database state to disk so that if it fails it doesn't need to replay from the last time the program exited (which may be a long time ago). In fact, if memory usage is so low, I think it would be cool to use just double the memory by using some memory page copy-on-write system to take a snapshot of the memory state while continuing to evolve the other copy, and then asynchronously serializing the snapshot copy to disk. Then when that serialization is done, the memory of the snapshot copy can be freed from RAM to repeat the process over again by taking a snapshot of the evolved copy. In fact, maybe the serialization can be delayed by some period to ensure that the time limit for chain reorganization has passed and so that you know you (almost never) would need replay the blockchain from any committed state older the most recent one, which is probably less than 5 hours old. LimeWallet) to build the mobile-optimized BitShares clients?

I work with a large software package from IBM, called TM1, that runs an entire corporate financial planning system in RAM with state only written to disk on exit. It does store a transaction log which serves the same purpose as the blocks being written to disk. It has caused us some headaches during initial deployment but since has worked out fairly well. We do bring it down every other night to write out the state to disk to help contain transaction log size. This obviously isn't a concern where the blockchain is concerned since the whole thing will be downloaded regardless.

Anyway, my rambling point is that there is precedent in another major software package for this type of thing.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: arhag on June 09, 2015, 04:07:29 am
We do bring it down every other night to write out the state to disk to help contain transaction log size.

Now that I think about it, the witness nodes don't even need to go down. A separate node running in parallel could just successfully exit once per day to keep a daily serialization of database state to disk. It being offline when the witness node needs to sign blocks is irrelevant since the witness node would not need to exit. Then if the witness node crashes, the administrator can move the recent snapshot state from the disk of the other node to the witness node and just replay from there. So yeah, there is no need for the live periodic state dumps.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Riverhead on June 09, 2015, 04:14:03 am
We do bring it down every other night to write out the state to disk to help contain transaction log size.

Now that I think about it, the witness nodes don't even need to go down. A separate node running in parallel could just successfully exit once per day to keep a daily serialization of database state to disk. It being offline when the witness node needs to sign blocks is irrelevant since the witness node would not need to exit. Then if the witness node crashes, the administrator can move the recent snapshot state from the disk of the other node to the witness node and just replay from there. So yeah, there is no need for the live periodic state dumps.

In practice the other node would just become the block signing node and the crashed node would become the backup once recovered. This is due to the fact that recovery may take longer than a round depending on what went wrong and the backup node is already good to go.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode on June 09, 2015, 04:45:43 am

I want to thank bytemaster for bringing this technology from the future back to us today.. screw the other timelines, we deserve this.

I already have some ideas of things that could be done to make this more efficient. Or possibly create new markets.

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: tonyk on June 09, 2015, 05:00:04 am
OK for the  slower guys like me ...

after figuring out that Cryptonomex   is actually Crypto + Economics . And is pronounced like Crypto + Economics


Can someone help with the same for:
Graphene

I guess the first part is from Graph...
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: onceuponatime on June 09, 2015, 05:04:40 am
OK for the  slower guys like me ...

after figuring out that Cryptonomex   is actually Crypto + Economics . And is pronounced like Crypto + Economics


Can someone help with the same for:
Graphene

I guess the first part is from Graph...

 Graphene is an atomic-scale honeycomb lattice made of carbon atoms.

Graphene (/ˈɡræf.iːn/)[1][2] is an allotrope of carbon in the form of a two-dimensional, atomic-scale, hexagonal lattice in which one atom forms each vertex. It is the basic structural element of other allotropes, including graphite, charcoal, carbon nanotubes and fullerenes. It can also be considered as an indefinitely large aromatic molecule, the limiting case of the family of flat polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphene
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: btswildpig on June 09, 2015, 05:05:16 am
OK for the  slower guys like me ...

after figuring out that Cryptonomex   is actually Crypto + Economics . And is pronounced like Crypto + Economics


Can someone help with the same for:
Graphene

I guess the first part is from Graph...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphene (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphene)
meaning bts is like this thing 's cool feature
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on June 09, 2015, 06:26:34 am
Can someone help with the same for:
Graphene

I guess the first part is from Graph...

Damn ... @stan will DEFINITELY love this: http://arxiv.org/abs/1505.04254
TL;DR; scientists discovered a new propulsion system exploiting properties of graphene
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: liondani on June 09, 2015, 07:48:02 am
Graphene should be inferior than Ethereum...

Sent from my ALCATEL ONE TOUCH 997D

Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: MrJeans on June 09, 2015, 09:38:52 am
During yesterday's mumble. Loved it!
(http://s21.postimg.org/lpp0b3d6v/Untitled.jpg)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: cass on June 09, 2015, 09:44:24 am
OK for the  slower guys like me ...

after figuring out that Cryptonomex   is actually Crypto + Economics . And is pronounced like Crypto + Economics


yep right!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Xypher on June 09, 2015, 10:08:30 am
OK for the  slower guys like me ...

after figuring out that Cryptonomex   is actually Crypto + Economics . And is pronounced like Crypto + Economics


Can someone help with the same for:
Graphene

I guess the first part is from Graph...

 Graphene is an atomic-scale honeycomb lattice made of carbon atoms.

Graphene (/ˈɡræf.iːn/)[1][2] is an allotrope of carbon in the form of a two-dimensional, atomic-scale, hexagonal lattice in which one atom forms each vertex. It is the basic structural element of other allotropes, including graphite, charcoal, carbon nanotubes and fullerenes. It can also be considered as an indefinitely large aromatic molecule, the limiting case of the family of flat polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphene

http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2014/09/the-strongest-most-expensive-material-on-earth/380601/
Graphene is also one of the toughest material in the planet and yes, it makes Ethereum look inferior :P
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: bytemaster on June 09, 2015, 12:02:30 pm
During yesterday's mumble. Loved it!
(http://s21.postimg.org/lpp0b3d6v/Untitled.jpg)

+1   I always love a good BTTF reference!

Remember kids, if you put your mind to it you can accomplish anything!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: profitofthegods on June 09, 2015, 12:32:50 pm
I presume referrals made before the launch of 2.0 will still be counted after the big change?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Stan on June 09, 2015, 02:00:04 pm
OK for the  slower guys like me ...

after figuring out that Cryptonomex   is actually Crypto + Economics . And is pronounced like Crypto + Economics


yep right!

(http://i.gyazo.com/d168c55eefc2ad691cebc410a29fd8f8.png)
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: cass on June 09, 2015, 02:30:11 pm
argh @stan :) pls let me adding name and headline in a more CI conform habit ^^
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: karnal on June 09, 2015, 10:30:30 pm
Also, it seems the new client is not the same codebase as 0.9.x.

Is TITAN also baked in the new codebase? Will we have privacy built-in by default?
No, no TITAN. This is a good thing! TITAN wasn't really very effective for privacy, but it gave the illusion of privacy. Also, TITAN was one of the reasons the client was so unbelievably slow.

Sent from my LGL34C using Tapatalk

This is deeply disturbing. How do we use BitShares 2.0 with privacy, this being the case?

What is being done to preserve privacy in the system?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: roadscape on June 09, 2015, 10:50:17 pm
Also, it seems the new client is not the same codebase as 0.9.x.

Is TITAN also baked in the new codebase? Will we have privacy built-in by default?
No, no TITAN. This is a good thing! TITAN wasn't really very effective for privacy, but it gave the illusion of privacy. Also, TITAN was one of the reasons the client was so unbelievably slow.

Sent from my LGL34C using Tapatalk

This is deeply disturbing. How do we use BitShares 2.0 with privacy, this being the case?

What is being done to preserve privacy in the system?

What's being removed is the illusion of privacy (i.e. there's little to no actual privacy to preserve). He mentioned something about offering privacy as a product (PaaP) but won't discuss it yet.
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: karnal on June 09, 2015, 10:55:15 pm
See https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16823.0.html for the privacy discussion; easier to keep track of it there (and keep this thread on-topic)

Thanks!
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Tobo on October 06, 2015, 08:00:07 pm
Will smart contract or turing completeness be added into Bitshare2.0 in the future?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on October 06, 2015, 08:09:26 pm
Will smart contract or turing completeness be added into Bitshare2.0 in the future?
Bts is already a smart contract platform (since cfds are kind of smart)
as for turing completeness: who knows .. mayve someone is already working on a proposal to upgrade the protocol
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: Tobo on October 06, 2015, 08:27:53 pm
Bts is already a smart contract platform (since cfds are kind of smart)
as for turing completeness: who knows .. mayve someone is already working on a proposal to upgrade the protocol

Did you mean that users can program their own custom contracts in this platform like in Ethereum?
Title: Re: Announcing BitShares 2.0
Post by: xeroc on October 07, 2015, 07:18:51 am
Did you mean that users can program their own custom contracts in this platform like in Ethereum?
In theory yes .. but you need shareholder approval to get your contracts running ... it's not as easy as in ethereum since you need to construct your contracts on protocol level ... while in ethereum there is a separated "programming level"
Title: ShareBits.io ouvre la technologie de la blockchain aux utilisateurs moyens
Post by: Bitshares222 on November 16, 2015, 03:38:47 pm
ShareBits.io ouvre la technologie de la blockchain aux utilisateurs moyens grâce au micro transactions en ligne.

Une nouvelle initiative de la plateforme d'échange de crypto-monnaie CCEDK ainsi que du « Beyond Bitcoin show » à pour objectif d’apporter les avantages de la crypto-monnaie au plus grand nombre d'utilisateurs, y compris les utilisateurs des réseaux sociaux et les créateurs de contenu.

Bitcoin se rapproche rapidement de son septième anniversaire, mais bien que l'idée de la crypto-monnaie ne cesse de gagner de l’attention, il n'a pas encore rencontré l’adoption du grand public ou  un «killer app», c’est-à-dire l’application majeure qui ferait son succès. Le problème de la pénétration du marché est celui dont ShareBits.io espère surmonter en ciblant les clients du marché de masse. Sharebits.io est une plate-forme de solutions pour logiciels open source capables de remporter l’adhésion de masse à la crypto-monnaie, la rendant rapide, peu couteuse et facile pour les entreprises de distribuer des jetons cryptographiques à un grand nombre de ses utilisateurs.

Freebie, l'équipe de développement derrière Sharebits.io, offre une haute échelle, des solutions de logiciels rapides pour les entreprises et les professionnels travaillant dans la crypto-sphère. La société a construit son application sur la plate-forme BitShares, se nommant Openledger, qui a été conçu pour s’adapter aux rigueurs du marché moderne des consommateurs (en contraste avec le pionnier mais  relativement lent blockchain de Bitcoin. Alors que le temps d’un bloc bitcoin est d’environ dix minutes avec un volume de transaction faible (la question de l'échelle et de bloc est l'un des débats les plus virulents dans la communauté), BitShares à la capacité impressionnante de  100.000 transactions par seconde et des confirmations qui ne prennent qu’une poignée de secondes, et les coûts ne représentant que le quart des frais de transactions du Bitcoin.

La Sharebot de ShareBits permettra aux entreprises et aux particuliers de distribuer des jetons aux utilisateurs sur une large gamme de plates-formes sociales comme Reddit, Facebook, Twitter, Qora et plus. L'aspiration est d'apporter la même liberté financière et la responsabilisation aux utilisateurs des médias sociaux que l'Internet et les médias sociaux ont apportés à l'échange d'informations et de contenu. Il permettra aux marques d'optimiser leur présence sur ces plates-formes par des contributeurs et des communautés enrichissantes, la création de nouvelles économies de partage en dehors de l'influence des institutions financières centralisées. Contourner les banques et processeurs de paiement permet la distribution directe et à faible coût des récompenses financières pour l'activité bénéfique.

Integration with CCEDK and their flagship ‘nanocard’ – a crypto-enabled debit card that combines the security and independence of the blockchain with the convenience of a bank card – means that users will be able to withdraw rewards as cash from any ATM. This will have far-reaching implications for content creators and other freelancers, people CCEDK hopes will power the rise of the new economy and new ways of remitting money.

L’intégration avec CCEDK et son produit phare, la «nanocard » (une carte de débit crypto-monnaie qui combine la sécurité et l'indépendance de la blockchain avec la commodité d'une carte bancaire) signifie que les utilisateurs seront en mesure de retirer leurs plus-values en espèces dans tous les distributeurs automatiques de billets. Cela aura également des conséquences hautement bénéfiques pour les créateurs de contenu et d'autres indépendants de grande envergure, que CCEDK espère voir profiter et bénéficier de cette montée de la nouvelle économie et de nouvelles façons de gagner de l'argent.
Offre de bienvenue, programme d'affiliés et récompenses

ShareBits est construit sur la plate-forme  OpenLedger (BitShares 2.0). Les nouveaux comptes créés au mois de Novembre recevront des Qbits symboliques en guise de bienvenue. Qbits est un actif créé sur la plateforme Openledger à des fins marketing et basé sur la monnaie virtuelle Qora, permettant à Openledger de récompenser tous les utilisateurs actifs avec un actif de valeur, maintenant et à l'avenir. En outre, les utilisateurs seront en mesure de signer un nouveau programme d'affiliés, ce qui leur permettra de gagner un revenu pour chaque nouvel utilisateur qui signe via leur lien de parrainage (ouvert aux membres à vie et ceux qui ont un abonnement annuel). Les référents recevront 60% de tous les droits perçus de ceux qu'ils apportent à BitShares.

CCEDK continue d'ajouter des projets nouveaux et novateurs à sa plate-forme, y compris Qora et Qbits. Pour lier ces projets, l'équipe de CCEDK a créé un actif spécial nommé Obits. Ce programme sera lancer le 1er Décembre (ventes privées déjà en cours) et représentera un large portefeuille d'initiatives basées sur la plateforme OpenLedger. Les actifs Obits donneront aux clients lambda la possibilité de bénéficier de la volatilité des monnaies virtuelles sans nécessiter une connaissance approfondie des marchés.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/rogeraitken/2015/11/15/sharebits-ios-launch-bringing-crypto-technology-to-mass-market-solutions/