BitShares Forum

Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: sparkles on November 23, 2014, 09:22:18 pm

Title: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 23, 2014, 09:22:18 pm
Sparkle combines the features of BitShares with the consensus of Proof of Work and is targeted at those who don't trust anything other than proof of work. 

All of the "Bitcoin 2.0" block chains are based upon proof of stake or are hobbled by Bitcoin's slow transaction times.   As a result there exists an opening in the market for a next generation system built on top of proof of work.   I recognize that in the BitShares community POW means Proof of Waste, but if you review comments from Bitcointalk and around the web there must be 10's of thousands of proof of work die-hards that are looking for a system they can trust.

Sparkle is attempting to mirror all of the benefits of BitShares while using Proof of Work for its security model.   This will give Sparkle the advantage of allowing many people to try BitShare's unique features for the first time.   

Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

I have been refining the specs a bit since my first post.

0) Spark (SPK) is the base currency
1) 100 million initial allocation among AGS/PTS
2) 20 second average block times 
3) 100 Sparks per block will be created, 50% paid to miner and 50% divided among elected workers.
4) About ~160 million sparks will be created the first year representing 60% of the total supply, After 2 years 75% of the supply, After 3 years 82%

In this thread I hope to have a fresh start where I am looking for those who would like to help with the project and to provide support.  Right now I am looking for someone to host a seed node and help with graphics.   

I would like permission to keep this single thread in general discussion until the DAC has some momentum of its own.

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 23, 2014, 09:55:55 pm
I have just completed initial testing.  Miners and workers are now paid properly. 

I am working to set up a seed node and will aim to have a working Mac OS X binary released later tonight.   I am looking for a trusted community member who would be willing and able to build a Windows binary for Sparkle.

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: zerosum on November 23, 2014, 09:59:07 pm
WOW big changes for less than 24h. Sparkling changes should I say. (3x faster blocktimes and 3X more dilution)

I will reserve any more comments for now cause in 48h you may have gone to 5 sec blocktimes and 240% dilution...
It seem you have solid plans, that one can comment on.


Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 23, 2014, 10:03:24 pm
WOW big changes for less than 24h. Sparkling changes should I say. (3x faster blocktimes and 3X more dilution)

I will reserve any more comments for now cause in 48h you may have gone to 5 sec blocktimes and 240% dilution...
It seem you have solid plans, that one can comment on.

Dilution rate didn't change.   

Initial feed back was that 1 minute would be too slow, so I did some research on fastest sustainable POW times and it seems Ethereum's blog has looked at all the issues and concluded that 12 seconds is the best the internet can support for propagation delay and to minimize orphans I went with 20 seconds.   

Other than that I am keeping this as clean and simple as possible.   

Several people have asked me to share drop on BTS.    If I can get some help from the BTS community I will consider doing a 30/30/30 drop. 
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Riverhead on November 23, 2014, 10:07:53 pm
Is this on the testchain? Can you post the url for the source? I'll see if I can setup a seed on my dev server.

Also if you haven't already give a read of the Play allocation threads. Showing a willingness to adjust your distribution share drops can get messy. Not saying don't do it...Just worth a read so you go into it eyes opened.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: zerosum on November 23, 2014, 10:15:57 pm
WOW big changes for less than 24h. Sparkling changes should I say. (3x faster blocktimes and 3X more dilution)

I will reserve any more comments for now cause in 48h you may have gone to 5 sec blocktimes and 240% dilution...
It seem you have solid plans, that one can comment on.


Initial feed back was that 1 minute would be too slow, so I did some research on fastest sustainable POW times and it seems Ethereum's blog has looked at all the issues and concluded that 12 seconds is the best the internet can support for propagation delay Dilution rate didn't change.   
and to minimize orphans I went with 20 seconds.   

Other than that I am keeping this as clean and simple as possible.   

Several people have asked me to share drop on BTS.    If I can get some help from the BTS community I will consider doing a 30/30/30 drop.

How comes - 3x more blocks, same new Sparks per block? Should be some higher math, than the one thought in my middle school?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 23, 2014, 10:26:29 pm
WOW big changes for less than 24h. Sparkling changes should I say. (3x faster blocktimes and 3X more dilution)

I will reserve any more comments for now cause in 48h you may have gone to 5 sec blocktimes and 240% dilution...
It seem you have solid plans, that one can comment on.


Initial feed back was that 1 minute would be too slow, so I did some research on fastest sustainable POW times and it seems Ethereum's blog has looked at all the issues and concluded that 12 seconds is the best the internet can support for propagation delay Dilution rate didn't change.   
and to minimize orphans I went with 20 seconds.   

Other than that I am keeping this as clean and simple as possible.   

Several people have asked me to share drop on BTS.    If I can get some help from the BTS community I will consider doing a 30/30/30 drop.

How comes - 3x more blocks, same new Sparks per block? Should be some higher math, than the one thought in my middle school?

Err... you are right.  I will go hide now.   
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 23, 2014, 10:28:10 pm
Is this on the testchain? Can you post the url for the source? I'll see if I can setup a seed on my dev server.

Also if you haven't already give a read of the Play allocation threads. Showing a willingness to adjust your distribution share drops can get messy. Not saying don't do it...Just worth a read so you go into it eyes opened.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

Thanks Riverhead!   https://github.com/sparkle5/Sparkle

If you can post an IP/PORT I add it to the default list to help people connect to the test network.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: cass on November 23, 2014, 10:31:37 pm
https://github.com/sparkle5/Sparkle  (https://github.com/sparkle5/Sparkle)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: CLains on November 24, 2014, 12:57:28 am
Brilliant.  ;D
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 01:20:48 am
The more I get into this, the better it seems.  Invictus and their sharedropping technique can never be accomplished via mining unless done in a way similar to this.  Gives a real reason to buy and hold knowing competition needs to sharedrop on these tokens.

I can actually see sparkle as a means of replacing hybrid pow/pos as it is today.  Pow/dpos is the future for miners.

If only we had an exchange of our own where all these could be traded...oh wait. Bts is going to do that pretty well ;)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 24, 2014, 01:26:57 am
 +5% This sounds interesting, good luck :)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bytemaster on November 24, 2014, 01:28:01 am
The more I get into this, the better it seems.  Invictus and their sharedropping technique can never be accomplished via mining unless done in a way similar to this.  Gives a real reason to buy and hold knowing competition needs to sharedrop on these tokens.

I can actually see sparkle as a means of replacing hybrid pow/pos as it is today.  Pow/dpos is the future for miners.

Proof of Stake always has the initial ownership problem to solve.   

I personally like Sparkle despite being proof of work.    If it will bring BitShares to the attention of POW die hards that won't buy into anything else then I welcome it.   We certainly wouldn't win them over any time soon without Sparkle.   

I would just advise sparkles to be careful with the fork management with our code.  POW has many more forks than DPOS and our fork management code is less robust that may be required for a POW system. 

I would recommend this community look at Sparkles as an advertising/marketing play and help this guy out.   We all are getting an initial cut in it so it isn't a threat to us personally if we hold/help.   It could actually boost BitShares and/or fill a market segment that we do not / cannot occupy.   Why leave money on the table. 

If we don't support Sparkle then someone could take Sparkle and do a 0% pre-mine and we would get nothing.   

Lets make the best of Sparkle.   

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: emailtooaj on November 24, 2014, 01:48:10 am
Yes, this could get interesting!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: zerosum on November 24, 2014, 02:07:48 am
Yes, this could get interesting!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well, it already is very interesting.

It is one of the best nonsensical ideas of 2014 as we speak (and that year brought a lot of them, and I mean A LOT).

Let put some work to prove we can Sparkle! (especially if we cannot prove our stakes can shine).

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 02:08:30 am
100% agree on all accounts.  I will help where I can for sure.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Stan on November 24, 2014, 02:20:02 am
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   


Happy to see AGS/PTS still getting treated with respect.
No beef with the decision on BTS.

But...

I'd like to question the reasoning here:
The two "because's" above are non-sequitors!

Honoring a particular chain really has nothing to do with the policy of its developers.
Do you want the support of its stakeholder demographic, or not?

You don't honor a chain to please its developers, or to perhaps motivate a change in their attitudes.
(Your competitor probably would prefer that you NOT sharedrop on their supporters.)
You honor the people who hold your competitor's shares, because you want them to honor you.

It is perfectly valid, nay profoundly wise, to honor your competition's customers and stakeholders.
Best case is that every one of them has just as many shares of your product as those of your competitors.
Then you are suddenly competing on a level playing field with them.

I am not making any policy statements here about competition or cooperation with Sparkle.

Just trying to promote a correct understanding of BitShares Sharedrop Theory.

Its about courting stakeholders, not pleasing developers.

 :)

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: donkeypong on November 24, 2014, 02:24:49 am
Calling those statements "non sequitors" in generous. They are contradictory. I'm assuming the consensus to PTS/AGS is being honored as a tribute to the BitShares developers and the community.

I thought Proof of Work died and went to heaven. But if you're nice enough to give me a cut of it, then best of success to you.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 24, 2014, 02:32:31 am
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

This makes a lot of sense to me. I think this will be positively received in the Chinese community too.
You obviously understand the market and marketing. 30/30/30 as you mentioned later should work too.

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 02:40:35 am
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

This makes a lot of sense to me. I think this will be positively received in the Chinese community too.
You obviously understand the market and marketing. 30/30/30 as you mentioned later should work too.

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

I am a big fan of PTS/AGS as I was one of the first to be entranced by them...but I will gladly do anything I do to help get BTS shareholders a slice of the pie.  It doesn't really do too much difference to me either way as I am pretty much diversified across all of them...but I do believe that as long as BTS community helps support it that they deserve a bit of the stake. 

Plus...this is a good opportunity to teach new BTS holders the value of working to show we deserve to be sharedropped on.  I believe if we all took this vantage point and really asked ourselves what we each have done to deserve to be honored...and honestly answer these quesions, we would likely surpass our competitors within a year in terms of network effect.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Method-X on November 24, 2014, 02:42:11 am
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

This makes a lot of sense to me. I think this will be positively received in the Chinese community too.
You obviously understand the market and marketing. 30/30/30 as you mentioned later should work too.

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

 +5% I like this. Just 'Spark'.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: zerosum on November 24, 2014, 02:42:47 am
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

This makes a lot of sense to me. I think this will be positively received in the Chinese community too.
You obviously understand the market and marketing. 30/30/30 as you mentioned later should work too.

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

[hint hint]
Sounds like you have missed how sprakly is handling your favorite issue.

...now biggie from 20% to 60% inflation in less than 24h...but still reasonable  :), but who knows after 36h or god forbid 1 week  ;)
Just saying it might get very masculine and impactful
  :)
[/hint hint]
 :)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 02:43:32 am
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

This makes a lot of sense to me. I think this will be positively received in the Chinese community too.
You obviously understand the market and marketing. 30/30/30 as you mentioned later should work too.

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

 +5% I like this. Just 'Spark'.

But how will you bring the ladies (other than pics of my oiled nude body)?  A second chain called sparkles that mines bitcoin?

@tonyk...man, you really seem to have turned into a beautiful woman.  The surgery must have cost a fortune :D


*^ inside joke for tonyk and a few others *
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: clayop on November 24, 2014, 02:47:01 am
I love 50/50 allocation. So happy :D
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: BTSdac on November 24, 2014, 03:00:00 am
I love 50/50 allocation. So happy :D
I also like this
what a specific function this DAC support ,or just a copy?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: zerosum on November 24, 2014, 03:09:52 am

But how will you bring the ladies (other than pics of my oiled nude body)?  A second chain called sparkles that mines bitcoin?

@tonyk...man, you really seem to have turned into a beautiful woman.  The surgery must have cost a fortune :D

If you start saving on the oil that you put all over your body, you will be amazed how little time it takes.... :)

..Assuming you are as handsome as you sound on the radio.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 05:14:19 am

But how will you bring the ladies (other than pics of my oiled nude body)?  A second chain called sparkles that mines bitcoin?

@tonyk...man, you really seem to have turned into a beautiful woman.  The surgery must have cost a fortune :D

If you start saving on the oil that you put all over your body, you will be amazed how little time it takes.... :)

..Assuming you are as handsome as you sound on the radio.

you mean 5-pack-a-day smoking stevo...good?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: hpenvy on November 24, 2014, 05:39:48 am
This turned dark quickly. My eyes, my eyes!
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: clayop on November 24, 2014, 06:43:51 am
I love 50/50 allocation. So happy :D
I also like this
what a specific function this DAC support ,or just a copy?

I guess Sparkle is a kind of experiment that examines whether PoW can survive  in the future. ;)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 24, 2014, 12:53:37 pm
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

This makes a lot of sense to me. I think this will be positively received in the Chinese community too.
You obviously understand the market and marketing. 30/30/30 as you mentioned later should work too.

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

I am a big fan of PTS/AGS as I was one of the first to be entranced by them...but I will gladly do anything I do to help get BTS shareholders a slice of the pie.  It doesn't really do too much difference to me either way as I am pretty much diversified across all of them...but I do believe that as long as BTS community helps support it that they deserve a bit of the stake. 

Plus...this is a good opportunity to teach new BTS holders the value of working to show we deserve to be sharedropped on.  I believe if we all took this vantage point and really asked ourselves what we each have done to deserve to be honored...and honestly answer these quesions, we would likely surpass our competitors within a year in terms of network effect.

 +5% Yeah that's why I think 1/3 each could work too. But OP is correct, AGS & PTS are specifically and carefully marketed and funnelled to be DAC savvy supporters. I'm also of the opinion, BTS is still currently valued at less than the sum of its parts were, which suggests that you may want to sharedrop pre-merger to maximise value. I also think it will appeal to the Chinese community more.

[hint hint]
Sounds like you have missed how sprakly is handling your favorite issue.

...now biggie from 20% to 60% inflation in less than 24h...but still reasonable  :), but who knows after 36h or god forbid 1 week  ;)
Just saying it might get very masculine and impactful
  :)
[/hint hint]
 :)

Yes the inflation model for Sparkle is quite high for me and I also think POW is probably doomed medium term+.

But as long as the inflation is defined and set in, I prefer it to dilution which can be changed. (Once BitShares has a mainstream BitAsset market, that doesn't care about BitShares on the back end, there's a risk large stakeholders can dilute you a lot more than Sparkle unless BitShares markets itself as having a fixed future supply.)

I love 50/50 allocation. So happy :D
I also like this
what a specific function this DAC support ,or just a copy?

I guess Sparkle is a kind of experiment that examines whether PoW can survive  in the future. ;)

Yip, I see it as an experiment about whether POW is better at driving network effect. It will be interesting. Personally the one thing I'm a 100% convinced on is that BitAssets will change the world. The only question is which model will bootstrap them first. Most of my money is still on BitShares but I'm hedging in competitors too.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Gentso1 on November 24, 2014, 03:00:24 pm
Firstly congrats on a new and interesting product I wish you much success.

I am not going to post my thoughts  on pow/pos/dpos because I think its best just to let the market to decide and I honestly dont know how they will fee about this. You make a very good point on this being a possible bridge between pow and dpos so I think it stands at least a better then 50% chance of some success.

I do find your argument of competition being bad, well not great. I grew up playing sports all my life and I have seen both the good and bad sides of competition. Competition in it's purest form can not only be healthy but can push both sides to new heights and expand a community as a whole. Competition and its sometimes misunderstood friend pressure, in moderate doses will not only bring out the best of group of people,idea,product but can lead to a inner fulfillment that is better then the highest of highs.Its sometimes a hard fought victory that will make the finish all that much sweeter.

Don't take this as a insult but using competition as a argument for not having a different allocation just makes you sound sore or resentful of perhaps a past allocation. Oh and I am a bts/ags holder so take it for what its worth. No matter the allocation I sincerely hope your project is able to serve as a bridge between 2 beliefs.     
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: donkeypong on November 24, 2014, 05:50:57 pm

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

Sparkplug?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 24, 2014, 06:11:23 pm

Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

Sparkplug?

(http://sd.keepcalm-o-matic.co.uk/i/keep-calm-and-think-pink-sparkly.png)


Or think of your own signature with Sparkles...

Quote
Paper money is for cleaning oneself. Real Men use BitUSD.
Ain't no BS in BTS. Get yo'self a wallet and start savin'.

Paper money is for cleaning oneself. Real Men use SparkleUSD.
Ain't no BS in Sparkle. Get yo'self a sparkly wallet and start saving'


Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Ander on November 24, 2014, 06:52:03 pm

Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

I really take offense at the fact that you went beyond simply not honoring BTS, but actively gave us a big 'f*ck you', in your initial announcement post.

It almost looks like you are going out of your way to create a coin specifically so that you can say how bitter you are about the merger.

This does not foster community unity, and I am not sure why you would specifically try to create more enemies by singling out BTS holders and telling them that you hate them.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: zerosum on November 24, 2014, 07:08:36 pm

Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   

I really take offense at the fact that you went beyond simply not honoring BTS, but actively gave us a big 'f*ck you', in your initial announcement post.

It almost looks like you are going out of your way to create a coin specifically so that you can say how bitter you are about the merger.

This does not foster community unity, and I am not sure why you would specifically try to create more enemies by singling out BTS holders and telling them that you hate them.

Do not take it too seriously Ander. The sparkly thing is either insider joke/count the idiots project (those that are exited about it in both this and the POW crowds). Or an attempt by the competition to get exactly the response you are showing now. At any rate this this project will not make money for the AGS/PTS holder and would have not made you money even if they were dropping on BTS.
Just get yourself a pop-corn and enjoy the show.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Vizzini on November 24, 2014, 07:11:17 pm
(http://allsparklyandshit.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/my-little-pony-copy.jpg)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Ander on November 24, 2014, 07:45:50 pm
Indeed Vizzini, that was my first thought based on the name.

See if it can go viral among the MLP fans, similar to Dogecoin going viral. :P
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 09:49:53 pm
If anyone is paying attention outside this little community, they will see that counterparty is now a protocol layered over 3 coins (at least...) and growing.  BTC, DOGE and now Vericoin are using CounterParty protocol for their --Party coins. 

They are essentially giving it away to people who mine and they have a means by which they can have people burn their tokens to buy into it, thus getting a stake.  However, Counterparty is severely limited in what it can do--limited by the constraints of the chains on which it resides. 

Sparkle could be used for us to clone to hundreds of POW coins, and the original communities could have 80% stake while the rest is sharedropped equally on PTS/AGS/BTS/Sparkle holders.  This could be a very good strategy to prepare other communities for a later switch to full DPOS.  Try not to get caught up in the numbers sharedropped...

Let's just consider the simple fact that if we do not let our protocol spread far and wide, we are far less likely to see mass adoption that we want to see.  Not only that...but I can assure you counterparty will continue spreading, which is fine...if you want to watch their devs getting rich from the sidelines.  I for one am all for giving the technology to other communities and sincerely hope we see some forks coming out of this and honoring other coins.  If people open their eyes and see the writing on the wall, it is worth receiving a smaller cut of many other chains with something like Sparkle Clones than to just do nothing.  This is another tool in our toolbox and I hope we use it to full effect.

Does anyone know of a Dev we could pay with a 100% delegate to clone "Sparkles" to every POW chain out there?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: mf-tzo on November 24, 2014, 09:54:56 pm
 +5% fuzzy.. go sparkles go...
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: matt608 on November 24, 2014, 10:15:00 pm
Awesome thinking fuzzy  +5%

Not being a developer I don't really know what I can do to help sparkles be dropped on BTS.  Other than throwing some sparkly pixie dust in the air and putting on my fairy dress up suit (which I already do everyday anyway), what else can I do? :P. 





Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 10:18:19 pm
Awesome thinking fuzzy  +5%

Not being a developer I don't really know what I can do to help sparkles be dropped on BTS.  Other than throwing some sparkly pixie dust in the air and putting on my fairy dress up suit (which I already do everyday anyway), what else can I do? :P.
+5% fuzzy.. go sparkles go...

Seriously, lets start recruiting Solid POW coins Devs.  Let's tell them that if they implement this, we will give them a Delegate in BTS (which will ensure they sharedrop on BTS'ers, btw) to implement it on their chain. 
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: matt608 on November 24, 2014, 10:26:02 pm
Awesome thinking fuzzy  +5%

Not being a developer I don't really know what I can do to help sparkles be dropped on BTS.  Other than throwing some sparkly pixie dust in the air and putting on my fairy dress up suit (which I already do everyday anyway), what else can I do? :P.
+5% fuzzy.. go sparkles go...

Seriously, lets start recruiting Solid POW coins Devs.  Let's tell them that if they implement this, we will give them a Delegate in BTS (which will ensure they sharedrop on BTS'ers, btw) to implement it on their chain.

I see, so the plan would be clone sparkle, sharedrop e.g. doge 80%, split the 20% between BTS/AGS/PTS or just BTS and then just that repeat for bitcoin, litecoin, every major alt coin.  Each coin this was done with would then get the features of BTS, and the support of the entire BTS community, it's win win.  Good for the POW coin and good for BTS holders.  I'd definitely vote for a delegate who wanted (and was capable) of carrying out that plan (if that's what you meant)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 24, 2014, 10:29:31 pm
Awesome thinking fuzzy  +5%

Not being a developer I don't really know what I can do to help sparkles be dropped on BTS.  Other than throwing some sparkly pixie dust in the air and putting on my fairy dress up suit (which I already do everyday anyway), what else can I do? :P.
+5% fuzzy.. go sparkles go...

Seriously, lets start recruiting Solid POW coins Devs.  Let's tell them that if they implement this, we will give them a Delegate in BTS (which will ensure they sharedrop on BTS'ers, btw) to implement it on their chain.

I see, so the plan would be clone sparkle, sharedrop e.g. doge 80%, split the 20% between BTS/AGS/PTS or just BTS and then just that repeat for bitcoin, litecoin, every major alt coin.  Each coin this was done with would then get the features of BTS, and the support of the entire BTS community, it's win win.  Good for the POW coin and good for BTS holders.  I'd definitely vote for a delegate who wanted (and was capable) of carrying out that plan (if that's what you meant)

Don't forget new Sparkle Holders...We should be willing to share the pie for them too--Well the ones who believe in Sparkle.  They ARE us after all...so it isn't like it hurts anyone but those who don't believe in it and sell off thinking it is a piece of shit. 

Reward the risk takers right?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: donkeypong on November 24, 2014, 10:34:19 pm
Sparklers, you mean?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: matt608 on November 24, 2014, 10:36:33 pm
Awesome thinking fuzzy  +5%

Not being a developer I don't really know what I can do to help sparkles be dropped on BTS.  Other than throwing some sparkly pixie dust in the air and putting on my fairy dress up suit (which I already do everyday anyway), what else can I do? :P.
+5% fuzzy.. go sparkles go...

Seriously, lets start recruiting Solid POW coins Devs.  Let's tell them that if they implement this, we will give them a Delegate in BTS (which will ensure they sharedrop on BTS'ers, btw) to implement it on their chain.

I see, so the plan would be clone sparkle, sharedrop e.g. doge 80%, split the 20% between BTS/AGS/PTS or just BTS and then just that repeat for bitcoin, litecoin, every major alt coin.  Each coin this was done with would then get the features of BTS, and the support of the entire BTS community, it's win win.  Good for the POW coin and good for BTS holders.  I'd definitely vote for a delegate who wanted (and was capable) of carrying out that plan (if that's what you meant)

Don't forget new Sparkle Holders...We should be willing to share the pie for them too--Well the ones who believe in Sparkle.  They ARE us after all...so it isn't like it hurts anyone but those who don't believe in it and sell off thinking it is a piece of shit. 

Reward the risk takers right?

Oh yes of course I forgot about them, also realised my description of 'the plan' would could be done on current BTS not with sparkles, so with sparkles there's the miners and the 'elected workers' who get the rest of the funds over time. 

I actually like the sound of sparkles. 

This 'plan' sounds like it might be a better version of Rune's 'upgrading bitcoin' idea, where this time it is an actual upgrade and not an attack.  It's creating a Bitshares version of any POW coin where the original miners are rewarded as well as sparkle devs and current Bitshares investors.  They'll be lots of squabbling over sharedrop allocation but something could be worked out.

I really hope this goes ahead! (unless I've misunderstood it all...)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bytemaster on November 24, 2014, 10:36:40 pm
Sparklers, you mean?
(https://www.sentinelha.org.uk/images/shutterstock_144977689.jpg)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: arhag on November 24, 2014, 10:42:52 pm
Just get yourself a pop-corn and enjoy the show.

(http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/tumblr_ljh0puClWT1qfkt17.gif)

It's like I am watching the cryptocurrency version of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" where the Proof-of-Waste "PoW people" are slowly replacing members of this forum.

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: jwiz168 on November 24, 2014, 10:44:07 pm
If this pushes through , it will be good. Imagine free money.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bytemaster on November 24, 2014, 10:45:52 pm
Just get yourself a pop-corn and enjoy the show.

(http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/tumblr_ljh0puClWT1qfkt17.gif)

It's like I am watching the cryptocurrency version of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" where the Proof-of-Waste "PoW people" are slowly replacing members of this forum.

LOL... too bad we already lost all of the POW people on this forum when I abandoned PTS.   Poor Sparkle, he won't be loved by anyone being the love child of proof of work and DPOS. 
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 24, 2014, 11:20:55 pm
If anyone is paying attention outside this little community, they will see that counterparty is now a protocol layered over 3 coins (at least...) and growing.  BTC, DOGE and now Vericoin are using CounterParty protocol for their --Party coins. 

They are essentially giving it away to people who mine and they have a means by which they can have people burn their tokens to buy into it, thus getting a stake.  However, Counterparty is severely limited in what it can do--limited by the constraints of the chains on which it resides. 

Sparkle could be used for us to clone to hundreds of POW coins, and the original communities could have 80% stake while the rest is sharedropped equally on PTS/AGS/BTS/Sparkle holders.  This could be a very good strategy to prepare other communities for a later switch to full DPOS.  Try not to get caught up in the numbers sharedropped...

Let's just consider the simple fact that if we do not let our protocol spread far and wide, we are far less likely to see mass adoption that we want to see.  Not only that...but I can assure you counterparty will continue spreading, which is fine...if you want to watch their devs getting rich from the sidelines.  I for one am all for giving the technology to other communities and sincerely hope we see some forks coming out of this and honoring other coins.  If people open their eyes and see the writing on the wall, it is worth receiving a smaller cut of many other chains with something like Sparkle Clones than to just do nothing.  This is another tool in our toolbox and I hope we use it to full effect.

Does anyone know of a Dev we could pay with a 100% delegate to clone "Sparkles" to every POW chain out there?

Good points about Counterparty. We throw a lot of trash talk at POW, but as I said before even though Counterparty burnt all of their development funding, have no inflation and are tied to 'Proof of Waste', they've managed to give me 1200%+ returns on my proof of burn stake this year. So I'm glad I diversified a bit.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: zerosum on November 24, 2014, 11:33:08 pm

I will give  all of you sparkly lovers and enthusiasts this much:

260% inflation in a Sparkling NEW POW coin is exiting, up to 6.5% in DPOS sent a mass sell waves to the exchanges...go figure.



PS
Speaking of percentages - 2 times increase in the price of a bitAsset is 50% drop in the price of BTS not 33%...
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: mira on November 24, 2014, 11:33:50 pm
Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

Good grief!   ::)   Your comment sparked me.   

I would think it's empirically obvious that feminine IS impactful.  What's your problem with feminine?  And anyway, I don't particularly like the name BitShares, but think it would be silly to get sidetracked by aesthetics instead of finding out if it were a worthwhile thing or not.

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 24, 2014, 11:52:31 pm
Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

Good grief!   ::)   Your comment sparked me.   

I would think it's empirically obvious that feminine IS impactful.  What's your problem with feminine?  And anyway, I don't particularly like the name BitShares, but think it would be silly to get sidetracked by aesthetics instead of finding out if it were a worthwhile thing or not.

Apologies for the offence Mira :) The crypto-equity & currency demographic is 90%+ male and will remain predominantly male even as it expands into other key markets in the next few years. So something masculine/neutral is better than something overly feminine from a branding POV & 'Sparkle/s' is particularly feminine.

Your POV about focusing on the technology/whether it would work vs. aesthetics is valid. Once the tech is out there though (& Sparkle is mostly a clone), it comes down to who can sell it the best. Which is branding and marketing.

(Donkeypongs signature revised for the brand Sparkle gives you an idea of the issue - https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=11662.msg153882#msg153882)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Ander on November 25, 2014, 12:11:41 am
Apologies for the offence Mira :) The crypto-equity & currency demographic is 90%+ male and will remain predominantly male even as it expands into other key markets in the next few years. So something masculine/neutral is better than something overly feminine from a branding POV & 'Sparkle/s' is particularly feminine.

As a male, I have to say that I think sparkle is a far better name than spark. 

I am also sad that the creator of this coin apparently really hates BTS.  It wouldve been fun trying to create pony memes for it. :P
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 25, 2014, 12:26:11 am
Apologies for the offence Mira :) The crypto-equity & currency demographic is 90%+ male and will remain predominantly male even as it expands into other key markets in the next few years. So something masculine/neutral is better than something overly feminine from a branding POV & 'Sparkle/s' is particularly feminine.

As a male, I have to say that I think sparkle is a far better name than spark. 

I am also sad that the creator of this coin apparently really hates BTS.  It wouldve been fun trying to create pony memes for it. :P

Yip, your answer highlighted the only way the brand name works, as a meme/joke. Like make it really pink, sparkly with pony memes & calling their wallet a purse  :P  'Damn bro, my pink purse is all out of sparkles!'

(OP's sharedrop decision is just branding and marketing again. BitShares is a competitive DAC, it tries to poach the best devs, potentially merge competitors and copies/cannibalises the best features out there regardless of whether it gets sharedropped on. It's not designed/marketed/funnelled to be a sharedropping token for DAC savvy supporters like PTS and AGS were.)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 25, 2014, 12:50:53 am
Apologies for the offence Mira :) The crypto-equity & currency demographic is 90%+ male and will remain predominantly male even as it expands into other key markets in the next few years. So something masculine/neutral is better than something overly feminine from a branding POV & 'Sparkle/s' is particularly feminine.

As a male, I have to say that I think sparkle is a far better name than spark. 

I am also sad that the creator of this coin apparently really hates BTS.  It wouldve been fun trying to create pony memes for it. :P

This is precisely my point,  arhag. Not trying to single you out, but how much do you want to bet it is this attitude that turned that avenue off.  I am pretty sure id make more off being sharedropped bts than on my pts/ags, but it shouldnt matter to any of us in the end if we are sharedropped on (at least as a primary concern). Yes...this was the social consensus, but let us reverse your statement and see if it sounds better.

"It would be fun to make memes for this, I hope the creator will show BTS some love too." Would be far more in line with the attitude a dev would look for when seeking a good place to sharedrop to.

 

This has a whole lot less to do with sharedropping than showing we are true believers.   We need to be a community in a box.  We are selling ourselves as a social network to bootstrap ecosystems we believe in...and devs who recognize our value.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 25, 2014, 01:18:56 am
Apologies for the offence Mira :) The crypto-equity & currency demographic is 90%+ male and will remain predominantly male even as it expands into other key markets in the next few years. So something masculine/neutral is better than something overly feminine from a branding POV & 'Sparkle/s' is particularly feminine.

As a male, I have to say that I think sparkle is a far better name than spark. 

I am also sad that the creator of this coin apparently really hates BTS.  It wouldve been fun trying to create pony memes for it. :P

Yip, your answer highlighted the only way the brand name works, as a meme/joke. Like make it really pink, sparkly with pony memes & calling their wallet a purse  :P  'Damn bro, my pink purse is all out of sparkles!'

I disagree. This does not force us in any way to constain us to a meme. We are only constrained by our own willingness to reimagine everything. 

Sure, though, we could definitely be effective approaching it that way if done right.

I personally imagine  that "the more you know" symbol:

(http://i.imgur.com/hCuLo4U.jpg)

Only with the rainbow spun around in an ascending spiral with the star in the middle, and whatever coin it is sharedropped on encased by the golden star (so people know it meets minimum requirements to be called... " powered by BitShares ").
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: mira on November 25, 2014, 01:37:20 am
Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

Good grief!   ::)   Your comment sparked me.   

I would think it's empirically obvious that feminine IS impactful.  What's your problem with feminine?  And anyway, I don't particularly like the name BitShares, but think it would be silly to get sidetracked by aesthetics instead of finding out if it were a worthwhile thing or not.

Apologies for the offence Mira :)

Thank you for the apology Empirical1.1. Please know that I wasn't offended.  I'm not easily offended, but rather quick to spark - and to sparkle  :D

Your POV about focusing on the technology/whether it would work vs. aesthetics is valid. Once the tech is out there though (& Sparkle is mostly a clone), it comes down to who can sell it the best. Which is branding and marketing.

(Donkeypongs signature revised for the brand Sparkle gives you an idea of the issue - https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=11662.msg153882#msg153882 (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=11662.msg153882#msg153882))

I see your point.  But there are other ways to visualize sparkle:  a pile of gold coins sparkle (or so I've heard).

We are only constrained by our own willingness to reimagine everything. 
+5%

I've no idea if the OP is a good idea or not.  But I am somewhat confused by the negative responses I've seen to 3rd part DAC proposals (except for TonyK2, who usually embeds suggestions for improvement in his heckling).  I thought that one of the beautiful ideas in BitShares was the idea of DACs that honor the social consensus, thereby growing the ecosystem in general and providing a marketing function for BitShares at the same time.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 25, 2014, 01:50:04 am
Quote from: mira link=topic=11662.msg154027#msg154027
We are only constrained by our own willingness to reimagine everything. 
+5%

I've no idea if the OP is a good idea or not.  But I am somewhat confused by the negative responses I've seen to 3rd part DAC proposals (except for TonyK2, who usually embeds suggestions for improvement in his heckling).  I thought that one of the beautiful ideas in BitShares was the idea of DACs that honor the social consensus, thereby growing the ecosystem in general and providing a marketing function for BitShares at the same time.

Mira, I could not have said it better myself. If we are not sharedropped on by a dev, we should be considering what we are doing wrong. In the early stages, we must all work to build as large a network effect as possible. Then we will truly be sharedrop worthy...and from that point the network effect takes hold and grows it on its own. I think most the people complaining are new, but I do from time to time see veterans here doing the same thing...which iagree, is confusing.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: arhag on November 25, 2014, 02:02:30 am
This is precisely my point,  arhag. Not trying to single you out, but how much do you want to bet it is this attitude that turned that avenue off. 

I am not sure if your comment was directed at me or Ander (the person you quoted). But I think sparkles is completely rational in not sharedropping on BTS because ultimately we are / will be competitors. Now, I also think it would be more rational of him to sharedrop on BTC rather than AGS/PTS, but let's not go there.

I am not concerned at all about the best technology winning. We don't need to have a million different clones of our technology for that to happen. It will happen naturally in due time.

What I am not at all certain about is how the value of the stake that eventually power the same new dominant technology will be distributed. Will it be to BTS, BTC, Doge, Sparkles, [insert some new meme coin that hasn't been invent yet here]? I do believe however that we are better off concentrating our efforts behind one community (and thus necessarily one cryptoasset) rather than splitting our efforts in a million different directions and inevitably competing with ourselves unnecessarily.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 25, 2014, 02:03:47 am
Apologies for the offence Mira :) The crypto-equity & currency demographic is 90%+ male and will remain predominantly male even as it expands into other key markets in the next few years. So something masculine/neutral is better than something overly feminine from a branding POV & 'Sparkle/s' is particularly feminine.

As a male, I have to say that I think sparkle is a far better name than spark. 

I am also sad that the creator of this coin apparently really hates BTS.  It wouldve been fun trying to create pony memes for it. :P

Yip, your answer highlighted the only way the brand name works, as a meme/joke. Like make it really pink, sparkly with pony memes & calling their wallet a purse  :P  'Damn bro, my pink purse is all out of sparkles!'

I disagree. This does not force us in any way to constain us to a meme. We are only constrained by our own willingness to reimagine everything. 

Sure, though, we could definitely be effective approaching it that way if done right.

I personally imagine  that "the more you know" symbol:

(http://i.imgur.com/hCuLo4U.jpg)

Only with the rainbow spun around in an ascending spiral with the star in the middle, and whatever coin it is sharedropped on encased by the golden star (so people know it meets minimum requirements to be called... " powered by BitShares ").

I like the vision :)

What would be interesting is to see what the connotation is to 'Sparkle' in China. My impression is that besides being a 90%+ male demographic too, they are also a more patriarchal, masculine society in general.

I also recently discussed BitShares a lot on bitcointalk, there's very little understanding & penetration of BitShares in the wider alt-coin market at all imo. This is an opportunity ofc but it also makes me ask where we got our earlier $80 million+ valuation from and how are we still at no.4? the answer for me, also looking at the PTS volumes since the beginning of the year is China.

Some say China was key in Bitcoin's rise to $1000 each and Litecoin's rise to a $Billion+ CAP. So for me if I think China loves it, I'm buying hand over fist, they're the lowest hanging fruit and will be the ones that take this or a BitAsset competitor to no.2 first imo.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 25, 2014, 02:17:15 am
This is precisely my point,  arhag. Not trying to single you out, but how much do you want to bet it is this attitude that turned that avenue off. 

I am not sure if your comment was directed at me or Ander (the person you quoted). But I think sparkles is completely rational in not sharedropping on BTS because ultimately we are / will be competitors. Now, I also think it would be more rational of him to sharedrop on BTC rather than AGS/PTS, but let's not go there.

I am not concerned at all about the best technology winning. We don't need to have a million different clones of our technology for that to happen. It will happen naturally in due time.

What I am not at all certain about is how the value of the stake that eventually power the same new dominant technology will be distributed. Will it be to BTS, BTC, Doge, Sparkles, [insert some new meme coin that hasn't been invent yet here]? I do believe however that we are better off concentrating our efforts behind one community (and thus necessarily one cryptoasset) rather than splitting our efforts in a million different directions and inevitably competing with ourselves unnecessarily.

Whoops! Sorry arhag :)
I think I agree with you on many fronts here...
I disagree that competing with ourselves is necessarily a bad thing.  I am of the belief that although dan came up wih somethig amazing, that is is very possible for another tech to come out that has similar strengths to dpos and maybe different weaknesses.  I think it would be silly, for instance, to think that overstock isnt paying some very smart people lots of money to develop the "bitshares killer".

We do have real competition and we need to recognize that without our protocol going viral, we risk being overshadowed by a xompetitor who reaches a bigger audience.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: xeroc on November 25, 2014, 09:18:42 am
Some of my thoughts:

- assume you want to start a own community i.e. a mailing list as Stan likes to call it
- IPOs are considered scam .. so IPO/AGS style funding is not attractive
- further assume that you want to have a non-NXT initial distribution
- what is left is a POW coin that people can mine .. or ripple/xrp

TL;DR;  let the devs start with POW in the BitShares space to gather
- their own community
- get used to the BitShares client and the source code
- accelerate adoption (at least in terms of the BitShares philosophy)

Once we got the people to objectively consider BitShares and like the ecosystem as a whole they will also be interested in learning about the grandfather BTS!

So I say:

Let it sparkle 8)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: monsterer on November 25, 2014, 11:54:24 am
Sparkle is an interesting idea. I wonder if people here realise that due to the POW nature of the thing, it is likely to have a higher coin price than BTS? At least during the pump and dump phase, anyway.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: islandking on November 25, 2014, 02:10:57 pm
I think sparkle should drop onto BTS holders as well.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 25, 2014, 02:30:00 pm
I'll share drop on to BTS if someone from the BTS community can produce a genesis.json file that is 30/30/30  AGS/PTS/BTS.   BitUSD holders should get nothing shorts should get a benefit because I want to encourage those willing to take out short positions to join Sparkle.  Include all bids/asks/etc.



Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bytemaster on November 25, 2014, 02:44:42 pm
I'll share drop on to BTS if someone from the BTS community can produce a genesis.json file that is 30/30/30  AGS/PTS/BTS.   BitUSD holders should get nothing shorts should get a benefit because I want to encourage those willing to take out short positions to join Sparkle.  Include all bids/asks/etc.

Sounds like a fair offer.   Perhaps HackFisher can help?   
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: fuzzy on November 25, 2014, 04:33:55 pm
Sparkle is an interesting idea. I wonder if people here realise that due to the POW nature of the thing, it is likely to have a higher coin price than BTS? At least during the pump and dump phase, anyway.

be very careful claiming the shares during that pump and dump.  It seems from what I am hearing that it is very dangerous to do...especially with a 3rd party dev who is unknown.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Frodo on November 25, 2014, 05:21:56 pm
Sparkle is an interesting idea. I wonder if people here realise that due to the POW nature of the thing, it is likely to have a higher coin price than BTS? At least during the pump and dump phase, anyway.

be very careful claiming the shares during that pump and dump.  It seems from what I am hearing that it is very dangerous to do...especially with a 3rd party dev who is unknown.

This should only be a problem for AGS though, as you can transfer your BTS/PTS before importing.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: carpet ride on November 25, 2014, 05:54:43 pm
I like the share drop promise, but I feel there's no way can I give over my private AGS keys to an unknown dev just for this


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bytemaster on November 25, 2014, 07:16:56 pm
I like the share drop promise, but I feel there's no way can I give over my private AGS keys to an unknown dev just for this


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Maybe this is all part of his (her?) strategy to prevent people from dumping their share drop ;)  Why do you need your keys if you can simply hodl until it builds enough trust?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: ag on November 26, 2014, 12:18:51 am
I'm still not won over by share-dropping on bts... how does sharedrop on bts help bitshares.. I don't get it. it's like, if Dell promise dell laptop to everyone with apple stocks at certain date. would apple company appreciate this strange offer.. I think it's market manipulation. as a holder of bitshares I don't appreciate unasked for share drops.

new idea: issue fixed amount user-issued-tokens per day, to bts users that send bitUSD to funding address. ags style fundraiser on bts chain. redeem these tokens for shares in DAC when it launches. here you are helping bitshares  by adopting its bitUSD making bitshares more valuable since it collateralizes more bitUSD. development funds held in bitUSD I assume need not be converted to dollars all at once, and will be destroyed gradually to pay development expense.

hmm but I guess the point is sparkes doesn't need to raise development funds.. but anyways for a DAC that does.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: islandking on November 26, 2014, 12:55:43 am
When is the planned sharedrop date?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 26, 2014, 01:54:44 am
When is the planned sharedrop date?

After the next release of BitShares with their latest features/fixes. 
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: James212 on November 26, 2014, 02:04:12 am
Sparkle is fully honoring AGS/PTS in recognition of their support and belief in many 3rd party DACs.   BitShares will not be honored because of their view of everything else as competition.   


Regards the name, Sparkle sounds quite feminine. Have you considered just 'Spark'. That sounds more masculine and impactful. Spark a fire/revolution/idea etc.

 'All you need is a Spark'

 +5%
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: islandking on November 26, 2014, 02:10:06 am
When is the planned sharedrop date?

After the next release of BitShares with their latest features/fixes.

So the allocation will be 30/30/30? AGS, PTS, BTS?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 26, 2014, 02:11:56 am
When is the planned sharedrop date?

After the next release of BitShares with their latest features/fixes.

So the allocation will be 30/30/30? AGS, PTS, BTS?

If someone can generate a genesis.json file that honors BTS.   Looking for some help here.

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 26, 2014, 02:16:22 am
Latest updates:

Simple Website: http://sparkle5.github.io/Sparkle/

Mining reward now decreases linearly over 100 years rather than halving ever 4 years, this should smooth things out.

I have run a test network with two mining nodes on it and everything appears to be working.  I am looking for some people to run public nodes.  It is setup to generate a lot of forks in the test and these forks seem to resolve themselves well. 

Still waiting on an icon/logo/splash screen but so far finding help has been difficult.   I will start work on these myself if I don't get any feedback soon.

Overall I am very happy with how this is progressing.


Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: islandking on November 26, 2014, 02:22:18 am
 +5% I would prefer the name to be Spark personally, it is much better.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 26, 2014, 02:29:50 am
+5% I would prefer the name to be Spark personally, it is much better.

Sparks are the unit, Sparkle is the system.  It keeps things separate vs all of the confusion of Bitcoin vs BTC.   BitShare vs BitShares vs bitshare vs bitshares vs BTS.

I don't want to overload the name.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 26, 2014, 03:49:48 am
+5% I would prefer the name to be Spark personally, it is much better.

Sparks are the unit, Sparkle is the system.  It keeps things separate vs all of the confusion of Bitcoin vs BTC.   BitShare vs BitShares vs bitshare vs bitshares vs BTS.

I don't want to overload the name.

I still think spark is cool for main brand name, though if the unit is called a spark that's something at least.

(http://th05.deviantart.net/fs71/200H/i/2013/178/a/4/it_only_takes_a_spark_by_ever_so_excited-d6ayngh.png)

(http://recoverymaps.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/intervention.gif)

(http://www.myhungergames.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/revolution-tee.jpg)

(http://www.sparksmg.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/spark_quote_graphic2.jpg)

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Ander on November 26, 2014, 03:52:18 am
@people who prefer the name spark:  There is already an altcoin called spark.

Theres also a bitcoin remittance business already called bitspark.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Ander on November 26, 2014, 03:56:37 am
I'm still not won over by share-dropping on bts... how does sharedrop on bts help bitshares.. I don't get it.

It helps bitshares holders because they get a piece of something that is using the bitshares code.

It helps sparkle because it gets a wider initial distribution with more people interested in the coin.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Ander on November 26, 2014, 03:58:45 am
Sparkles, thanks for deciding to allocate 30/30/30 to all three groups.  (pending the .json which hopefully Hackfisher can get for you since he allocated to all three for PLAY).

I'd better start working on some sparkle pony memes. :P

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Empirical1.1 on November 26, 2014, 04:02:22 am
@people who prefer the name spark:  There is already an altcoin called spark.

Theres also a bitcoin remittance business already called bitspark.

Well if there's an altcoin named Spark it means their units are probably called Sparks too... So I guess Sparkle will be sending 'Sparkles.'
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: House on November 26, 2014, 06:28:47 am
(http://www.houseofpereira.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/sparkle_test1.png)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: testz on November 26, 2014, 10:14:23 am
Latest updates:

Simple Website: http://sparkle5.github.io/Sparkle/
...

Sparkles, thanks for deciding to allocate 30/30/30 to all three groups.  (pending the .json which hopefully Hackfisher can get for you since he allocated to all three for PLAY).

I'd better start working on some sparkle pony memes. :P

To make things right better to announce separate snapshot date for PTS/BTS for example last block of 24 of December.
BM still in the progress of returning remaining PTS donations to the donors hopefully he will finish before snapshot: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=11289.0
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: monsterer on November 26, 2014, 10:45:22 am
I like 'Sparkles'; we could do with some femininity in cryptocurrencies!
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 26, 2014, 05:46:07 pm
I would like to show a preview of the Sparkle website:

http://thetruesparkles.wix.com/sparkle

Binaries for the test network will be released later today, but I need someone who is willing to run a seed node for me.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: xeroc on November 26, 2014, 07:47:08 pm
I would like to show a preview of the Sparkle website:

http://thetruesparkles.wix.com/sparkle

Binaries for the test network will be released later today, but I need someone who is willing to run a seed node for me.
Cool ... looks good .. but you definitly need more tech content ...
and you absolutely need an own subforum!!
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bytemaster on November 26, 2014, 08:15:42 pm
I would like to show a preview of the Sparkle website:

http://thetruesparkles.wix.com/sparkle

Binaries for the test network will be released later today, but I need someone who is willing to run a seed node for me.
Cool ... looks good .. but you definitly need more tech content ...
and you absolutely need an own subforum!!

I created a subforum for her.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 26, 2014, 09:25:46 pm
I just posted an announcement thread on BitcoinTalk.   Show it some love and help support your Sister chain.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=874406.0
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bobmaloney on November 26, 2014, 10:04:39 pm
I just posted an announcement thread on BitcoinTalk.   Show it some love and help support your Sister chain.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=874406.0

Has a snapshot date been announced yet?

If so, it should probably be added to the OP here and on the BitcoinTalk thread.

*Edit - If you haven't chosen a date yet - may I suggest New Years (seems a good time for "sparkles")  ;)
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: islandking on November 27, 2014, 09:07:27 pm
I just posted an announcement thread on BitcoinTalk.   Show it some love and help support your Sister chain.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=874406.0

Has a snapshot date been announced yet?

If so, it should probably be added to the OP here and on the BitcoinTalk thread.

*Edit - If you haven't chosen a date yet - may I suggest New Years (seems a good time for "sparkles")  ;)

I am also curious when the planned share drop date is. New Years seems like a great idea!

Does anyone know how many Sparks you get per BTS? I would assume that it is low since there will only be 100 million sparks, I think?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 27, 2014, 10:15:46 pm
I just posted an announcement thread on BitcoinTalk.   Show it some love and help support your Sister chain.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=874406.0

Has a snapshot date been announced yet?

If so, it should probably be added to the OP here and on the BitcoinTalk thread.

*Edit - If you haven't chosen a date yet - may I suggest New Years (seems a good time for "sparkles")  ;)

I am also curious when the planned share drop date is. New Years seems like a great idea!

Does anyone know how many Sparks you get per BTS? I would assume that it is low since there will only be 100 million sparks, I think?

I want this out far faster than that. 
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: arubi on November 27, 2014, 11:35:32 pm
Sorry if it's already been discussed, I skimmed through the thread and couldn't find an answer to two questions:

1. What's the algorithm used in Sparkle's POW? I get that block header hashes are sha512, but what's the algo? is it Momentum like PTS?

2. What about difficulty re-target time? How often does that happen?


Thanks.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 28, 2014, 01:11:46 am
Sorry if it's already been discussed, I skimmed through the thread and couldn't find an answer to two questions:

1. What's the algorithm used in Sparkle's POW? I get that block header hashes are sha512, but what's the algo? is it Momentum like PTS?

2. What about difficulty re-target time? How often does that happen?


Thanks.

SHA512 is the hash algorithm.   Yes, it could be optimized for ASIC but CPU can be optimized for bot nets.   Therefore SHA512 is a good GPU compromise.

Difficulty is retargeted continuously.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: arubi on November 28, 2014, 05:26:50 am

SHA512 is the hash algorithm.   Yes, it could be optimized for ASIC but CPU can be optimized for bot nets.   Therefore SHA512 is a good GPU compromise.

Difficulty is retargeted continuously.

Any source code available for miners yet?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 28, 2014, 05:59:26 pm
Where is the new PTS being discussed?  What is their forum?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: pc on November 28, 2014, 07:31:05 pm
http://pts.cubeconnex.com/index.php
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 28, 2014, 07:35:10 pm
http://pts.cubeconnex.com/index.php

Thanks
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: jamesc on November 28, 2014, 08:08:26 pm
http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=em-upload_owner&v=1gseWbIs4Yk
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 28, 2014, 08:11:39 pm
https://github.com/sparkle5/Sparkle/releases/tag/alpha.1

Download the client...  to enable mining go to console and type"

"wallet_enable_mining account_to_mine_with true"

Once you have enough connections your computer will start mining.

As Bytemaster suggested I will honor all mined blocks from the test network in the real network genesis block.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 28, 2014, 09:02:01 pm
Can someone build a windows release?
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 28, 2014, 11:01:02 pm
12 connections to the test network.  Mining is easy.  Free money.   
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Troglodactyl on November 29, 2014, 12:05:09 am
12 connections to the test network.  Mining is easy.  Free money.

I can't seem to get more than 5 connections, and difficulty is adjusting downward so I suspect I'm on a minority fork...

Code: [Select]
HEIGHT  TIMESTAMP           SIGNING DELEGATE                # TXS   SIZE    LATENCY PROCESSING TIME
===================================================================================================
665     2014-11-29T00:04:42 SPK5VCe6EBhRbZCtYkBbCpFkgohi... 0       92      0       0.000941   
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Frodo on November 29, 2014, 12:23:03 am
Looks like I'm on a fork that is even worse  :(

Code: [Select]
HEIGHT  TIMESTAMP           SIGNING DELEGATE                # TXS   SIZE    LATENCY PROCESSING TIME
===================================================================================================
621     2014-11-29T00:21:24 SPKL6JFtCBGX8uuxuTUxkWD5xbTH... 0       92      0       0.001261       
622     2014-11-29T00:22:09 SPKL6JFtCBGX8uuxuTUxkWD5xbTH... 0       92      0       0.001262       

EDIT:
Just deleted the .Sparkles folder, seems to be better now.

Code: [Select]
HEIGHT  TIMESTAMP           SIGNING DELEGATE                # TXS   SIZE    LATENCY PROCESSING TIME
===================================================================================================
819     2014-11-29T00:37:04 SPKJzo1zPeNzEZtZ8qX99HzGPQ4t... 0       92      6       0.000905       
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: toast on November 29, 2014, 12:37:30 am
I'm stuck at 263 on both machines that are mining
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 29, 2014, 12:38:55 am
I'm stuck at 263 on both machines that are mining

Did you upgrade and reindex after the latest update?

I am on block 820
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: toast on November 29, 2014, 12:39:47 am
I did right when you announced second update (alpha3). Restarting got me back in sync.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: bitder on November 29, 2014, 12:46:20 am
I'm stuck at 263 on both machines that are mining

Did you upgrade and reindex after the latest update?

I am on block 820

Looks like an invalid block at 263

Code: [Select]
>>> blockchain_list_forks
   FORKED BLOCK              FORKING BLOCK ID              SIGNING DELEGATE      TXN COUNT      SIZE           TIMESTAMP   LATENCY   VALID    IN CURRENT CHAIN
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            262
     00000239fd6da1f1bd74e03aa2e72772d3542064              Unknown Delegate              0        92 2014-11-28T22:29:12      7585     YES                 YES
     0000145d9341af5f197986ac150fde2ab6fa59d4              Unknown Delegate              0        92 2014-11-28T22:28:33      7624      NO                  NO
REASONS FOR INVALID BLOCKS
0000145d9341af5f197986ac150fde2ab6fa59d4: 10 assert_exception: Assert Exception
block_data.difficulty() > difficulty:
    {}
    th_a  chain_database.cpp:734 verify_header

    {"block_data":{"previous":"0000011cd7c99672c63fbc835b3d1f5652b53a5a","version":0,"block_num":263,"timestamp":"2014-11-28T22:28:33","transaction_digest":"c8cf12fe3180ed901a58a0697a522f1217de72d04529bd255627a4ad6164f0f0","nonce":6092,"miner":"SPK7rYgHnMKDYHxuXnN129yVceGYxGgY6yu7","reserved":"","user_transactions":[]}}
    th_a  chain_database.cpp:742 verify_header

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: sparkles on November 29, 2014, 12:59:38 am
I'm stuck at 263 on both machines that are mining

Did you upgrade and reindex after the latest update?

I am on block 820

Looks like an invalid block at 263

Code: [Select]
>>> blockchain_list_forks
   FORKED BLOCK              FORKING BLOCK ID              SIGNING DELEGATE      TXN COUNT      SIZE           TIMESTAMP   LATENCY   VALID    IN CURRENT CHAIN
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            262
     00000239fd6da1f1bd74e03aa2e72772d3542064              Unknown Delegate              0        92 2014-11-28T22:29:12      7585     YES                 YES
     0000145d9341af5f197986ac150fde2ab6fa59d4              Unknown Delegate              0        92 2014-11-28T22:28:33      7624      NO                  NO
REASONS FOR INVALID BLOCKS
0000145d9341af5f197986ac150fde2ab6fa59d4: 10 assert_exception: Assert Exception
block_data.difficulty() > difficulty:
    {}
    th_a  chain_database.cpp:734 verify_header

    {"block_data":{"previous":"0000011cd7c99672c63fbc835b3d1f5652b53a5a","version":0,"block_num":263,"timestamp":"2014-11-28T22:28:33","transaction_digest":"c8cf12fe3180ed901a58a0697a522f1217de72d04529bd255627a4ad6164f0f0","nonce":6092,"miner":"SPK7rYgHnMKDYHxuXnN129yVceGYxGgY6yu7","reserved":"","user_transactions":[]}}
    th_a  chain_database.cpp:742 verify_header


I am putting in some code to dampen the difficulty adjustment because it appears to be swinging back and forth too much.   The hard fork will happen on block 10,000 (at ~850 now).    I am also about to release a client that will mine 4x faster (multi-threaded).   


Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: mike623317 on November 29, 2014, 01:52:59 am
I think sparkle should drop onto BTS holders as well.

I agree with this.

Its an interesting idea. Cant wait to see how this pans out.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: mike623317 on November 29, 2014, 02:44:44 am
Can someone build a windows release?

Just want to say, Yes please sparkles  :D

 +5%
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: cgafeng on November 29, 2014, 03:33:34 am
erase
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: Riverhead on November 29, 2014, 04:25:56 am
I share a windows release on dropbox.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/2bqmi1i4c65fz8c/sparkle_client_alpha.4.exe?dl=0 (https://www.dropbox.com/s/2bqmi1i4c65fz8c/sparkle_client_alpha.4.exe?dl=0)

There is a .dll requirement. I'll have to download it again to get a screenshot of which one is missing. Was one I hadn't seen before.

Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: cgafeng on November 29, 2014, 04:42:26 am
I share a windows release on dropbox.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/2bqmi1i4c65fz8c/sparkle_client_alpha.4.exe?dl=0 (https://www.dropbox.com/s/2bqmi1i4c65fz8c/sparkle_client_alpha.4.exe?dl=0)

There is a .dll requirement. I'll have to download it again to get a screenshot of which one is missing. Was one I hadn't seen before.

sorry, i found it can't work on other compute, erase.
Title: Re: Sparkle - Because real money sparkles!
Post by: roselee on December 17, 2014, 09:06:55 pm
thats it ?  no to be continued ?

i guess there will be a win exe file soon?