BitShares Forum
Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: bitcrab on November 04, 2015, 03:22:01 pm
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Polo is crazy with leverage trading , the price often change drastically. if their price weight too much in the price feed, the feed price will always move up and down drastically. this is the shorters' nightmare, this had happened in the last 2 days. so in order to make the feed price move more smoothly, I think we should reduce the weight of polo price in price feed and later design some "fusing" mechanism.
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poloniex has the largest volume of bts exchange at the moment and hence the right weigtage. What is needed is for btc38 and yunbi to start operating bts2 and the weight will rebalance.
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(http://i13.tietuku.com/4455e93be945c147.png)
This iS crazy.wtf,who is dumping!!!??why!!!
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That sounds like a terrible idea... Excluding the biggest market just because it behaves in a way you don't want sounds just like what chinese central planners do with their stock market. All it does is cover up problems.
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That sounds like a terrible idea... Excluding the biggest market just because it behaves in a way you don't want sounds just like what chinese central planners do with their stock market. All it does is cover up problems.
not only you like free market, but free market do not exclude reasonable rules.
for an exchange, not only the volume, but also the depth, and also whether there are margin trading need to be considered to decide the weitage.
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As I know almost 2/3 trade on Polo comes from margin trade, the price actually is not a real price, it's a premium price whatever higher or lower, I agree to reduce the weight of polo price.
feed price is very important to our system, we need to take it seriously.
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(http://i13.tietuku.com/4455e93be945c147.png)
This iS crazy.wtf,who is dumping!!!??why!!!
BTC38 price is incorrect. They haven't upgraded to 2.0, so people can't deposit and sell.
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the risk is exist polo can't pay for their debt.
Imagine people borrow 100m BTS selled(reserved by BTC), when BTS price pump, or BTC price dump,
they can't pay for the debt.
so I think we have good reasons to reduce polo's weight.
of course we have good reason to reduce BTC38's weight because of they have not upgrade to 2.0.
so I have set both of their weight to 0.5.
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Once we have several BTS exchanges, the poloniex effect will be reduced. So don't worry about this for now.
Witnesses are responsible to provide "accurate" price feeds, not "just" price feeds
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Imagine people borrow 100m BTS selled(reserved by BTC)
The fact exists that any user CAN buy those BTS at THAT offered PRICE in polo, and be able to transfer the bought bts to their wallets means that THAT PRICE is REAL. The risk undertaken by the margin-users (and bore by them) has no bearing on the feed's bts volume-weighted price.
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Imagine people borrow 100m BTS selled(reserved by BTC)
The fact exsits that any user CAN buy those BTS at THAT offered PRICE in polo, and be able to transfer the bought bts to their wallets means that THAT PRICE is REAL. The risk undertaken by the margin-users (and bore by them) has no bearing on the feed's bts volume-weighted price.
Agree with cube. The BTS on polo can be bought and transferred anywhere and it is the dominant price. If it is excluded, the system will be gamed and BTS will be crushed.
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(http://i13.tietuku.com/4455e93be945c147.png)
This iS crazy.wtf,who is dumping!!!??why!!!
BTC38 price is incorrect. They haven't upgraded to 2.0, so people can't deposit and sell.
Yet 400BTC volume, lulz
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Imagine people borrow 100m BTS selled(reserved by BTC)
The fact exsits that any user CAN buy those BTS at THAT offered PRICE in polo, and be able to transfer the bought bts to their wallets means that THAT PRICE is REAL. The risk undertaken by the margin-users (and bore by them) has no bearing on the feed's bts volume-weighted price.
Agree with cube. The BTS on polo can be bought and transferred anywhere and it is the dominant price. If it is excluded, the system will be gamed and BTS will be crushed.
not exclude, just reduce the weight. I don't know if you played a margin trade, personally I never trust a margin price. don't tell me this is the real price, it's obsolutely not. btc38 price is not the real price as well due to the 2.0 upgrade is not complete.
and currenlty the Polo have totally over 0.23 billion BTS and BTC38 have over 0.35 billion BTS, they both have larger number users, that's why I agree with alt these 2 exchange fifty-fifty.
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Once we have several BTS exchanges, the poloniex effect will be reduced. So don't worry about this for now.
Witnesses are responsible to provide "accurate" price feeds, not "just" price feeds
I hope the price of BTS is 500$ :P :P :P
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Imagine people borrow 100m BTS selled(reserved by BTC)
The fact exists that any user CAN buy those BTS at THAT offered PRICE in polo, and be able to transfer the bought bts to their wallets means that THAT PRICE is REAL. The risk undertaken by the margin-users (and bore by them) has no bearing on the feed's bts volume-weighted price.
I mean the risk exist, you can buy BTS buy can't withdraw.
there are 200M BTS in polo's wallet, all user's balance sum is also 200M if nobody borrow.
when people borrow 100M BTS, all user's balance sum is 300M.
you think you can withdraw your BTS because not all users reallize the risk.
but of couse we should consider the risk in when feed price.
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consider polo exchange bts with a 3 times lever, I think part of bts trading is lever trading
so maybe reduce weight by 50%
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Imagine people borrow 100m BTS selled(reserved by BTC)
The fact exsits that any user CAN buy those BTS at THAT offered PRICE in polo, and be able to transfer the bought bts to their wallets means that THAT PRICE is REAL. The risk undertaken by the margin-users (and bore by them) has no bearing on the feed's bts volume-weighted price.
Agree with cube. The BTS on polo can be bought and transferred anywhere and it is the dominant price. If it is excluded, the system will be gamed and BTS will be crushed.
not exclude, just reduce the weight. I don't know if you played a margin trade, personally I never trust a margin price. don't tell me this is the real price, it's obsolutely not. btc38 price is not the real price as well due to the 2.0 upgrade is not complete.
and currenlty the Polo have totally over 0.23 billion BTS and BTC38 have over 0.35 billion BTS, they both have larger number users, that's why I agree with alt these 2 exchange fifty-fifty.
Margin trading is the real price... It's real bts loaned out backed by collateral. If you don't believe in margin price then you probably don't believe the sp 500 at 2100 is correct. Or the euro yen dollar Bitcoin oil corn or soybeans. All of that is based heavily on margin. No one would be talking about this if bts was screaming higher on margin. Margin is a fact of life in the markets, ignoring it will make you go broke.
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and currenlty the Polo have totally over 0.23 billion BTS and BTC38 have over 0.35 billion BTS, they both have larger number users, that's why I agree with alt these 2 exchange fifty-fifty.
BTC38 has disabled withdrawal and deposit of bts. For all you know, they may never enable it in the forseable future. Do we give any price weightage to an exchange that disallows deposit and withdrawal?
I mean the risk exist, you can buy BTS buy can't withdraw.
there are 200M BTS in polo's wallet, all user's balance sum is also 200M if nobody borrow.
when people borrow 100M BTS, all user's balance sum is 300M.
you think you can withdraw your BTS because not all users reallize the risk.
but of couse we should consider the risk in when feed price.
We can speculate that all users could withdraw their total 200M (or 300M) bts and we can speculate that all users could not withdrawal all their bts. The fact is Poloniex allows anyone to deposit/withdraw their bts to/from their wallets RIGHT NOW. Witnesses are not in the business of speculating whether users could or could not withdraw their bts in the future. Speculation has no place in determining the feed price volume weightage.
Margin trading is the real price... It's real bts loaned out backed by collateral. If you don't believe in margin price then you probably don't believe the sp 500 at 2100 is correct. Or the euro yen dollar Bitcoin oil corn or soybeans. All of that is based heavily on margin. No one would be talking about this if bts was screaming higher on margin. Margin is a fact of life in the markets, ignoring it will make you go broke.
You are right. Margin trading exists in real-world currency trading. The USD fiat that we hold has its price influenced by the currency margin trading markets.