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Messages - mindphlux

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61
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Better organisation
« on: November 19, 2015, 11:27:27 am »
Very good idea.

62
Stakeholder Proposals / Better organisation
« on: November 19, 2015, 08:25:23 am »
For the future, I would suggest for any parameter that we want to change:

1) first internal discussion to see if a specific parameter change would have 50% +1 approval
2) make a poll for each parameter change and see community reacton
3) make the actual proposal, 7 days in advance

We need much better communication!

63
General Discussion / Re: First Organized Mutually Agreed Proposal
« on: November 19, 2015, 07:50:57 am »
I think the current 1.10.15 proposal is a good compromise. It doesn't solve all the problems, but it is a start.

Lowering the account creation fee back to 95BTS like it was originally voted by the community is a good thing.
Many (asian) people want to lower the transaction fee to <5 BTS, and the (western) crowd is against it because it hurts the referral program. Lowering it by 25% is a compromise.
Fav has encountered problems with not receiving lifetime upgrade referral fees, so we're setting the scale to 1 in an attempt to fix exactly that issue.

I agree communication could have been better.

I have voted for this proposal.

Other than that, I hope that these commitee proposals will slow down a bit in the future, it felt rushed this time. The proposal was created within an hour and was bugged. Someone from the team needs to announce these changes before hand to the community and get feedback. The thing is that not everyone can be pleased and people will ALWAYS disagree.

64
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Commitee: mindphlux
« on: November 16, 2015, 07:30:50 am »
I support a account creation fee of 95BTS, a transfer fee of 40BTS (maybe 30-35 tops, if it needs to be lowered), and a low place order fee, but a high order fill fee (like outlined in BM's proposal)

66
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Tokenly Merchant Ecosystem Worker Proposal
« on: November 12, 2015, 06:17:34 am »
I see that you're estimating a hourly wage of $30, I doubt you'll find a coder willing to work at that rate.

67
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Worker Proposal Review
« on: November 10, 2015, 06:08:15 pm »
This is PURELY a cosmetic change.  The minimum transfer would be fee + 1 satoshi and the merchant would only see a gain of 1 satoshi.  From the user's perspective they paid the merchant $0.20, but the merchant only pocketed $0.01.  In no case can one user drain funds from another by spamming.

So it's really the user paying the fee, but it's not displayed as a fee. the merchant just gets $0.20 less in this example. Right?

From a referral program's perspective, it's still the normal user that counts, right? User is paying (hidden) fee to merchant, referral gets 80% of that hidden fee. Correct?

68
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Worker Proposal Review
« on: November 10, 2015, 05:20:15 pm »

looks like its around 170k a year which puts the hourly at just above 80$ per hour...


Here, in Germany, I charge $90-$100 per hour for contracting work, and this seems pretty similiar to what BM is proposing. Keep in mind they're specialized in this field and experts. Hiring experts with lots of work experience usually comes with a markup.

You're too cheap if you're charging $60 per hour. Way too cheap.

69
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Worker Proposal Review
« on: November 10, 2015, 04:10:28 pm »
and dump to the poor market?
NO!!!!!

I think this can be prevented with a vested fee schedule. @bytemaster @BunkerChain Labs can you please comment on how you are going to prevent to further damage the thin BTS market by dumping 21M BTS?

70
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Worker Proposal Review
« on: November 10, 2015, 04:04:50 pm »
The proposal reads specifically:

Quote
Because this is a matter of appearance, transfer fees will be adjusted to be paid by the receiver of the funds, rather than the sender.

This would indicate the sender pays nothing and the receiver pays the fee. The discount is for RECEIVING transactions then, not SENDING transactions, if I may interpret that.

71
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Worker Proposal Review
« on: November 10, 2015, 03:49:17 pm »
What is the discount for trading for a lifetime member?

80% discount on all trading fees and 80% discount on receiving transactions.

72
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Worker Proposal Review
« on: November 10, 2015, 03:44:24 pm »
and what is the incentive for a regular user to go lifetime?

Receive a discount on receiving transactions and receive a discount for trading.
There's no incentive for the normal user to go lifetime, but there is a HUGE incentive for the merchant to go lifetime, I would guess that more than 50% of all merchants would appreciate a 2-3 cent fee instead of 10+ cents for a $80 one-time fee. Huge opportunity IMHO.

73
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Worker Proposal Review
« on: November 10, 2015, 03:35:35 pm »
Please specifiy if I'm correct understanding this:

The document states:

Quote
Specifically, some businesses building on top of BitShares as a payment network (rather than exchange) depend upon transfer fees to generate their revenue.   Because this is a matter of appearance, transfer fees will be adjusted to be paid by the receiver of the funds, rather than the sender.  This means merchants will see the fees (which will be much less than credit cards) but users will not.

This is a very important aspect. Does this mean that the users have free transactions now, and the registrar and referrer must essentially enroll merchants to get a decent profit, instead of just using users. The profit a wallet provider/referral makes is directly proportional to the amount of merchants enrolled.

Did I understand this correctly?

74
@carpet ride
How do you get merchants to begin with?

You only get merchants if you have some users.

How do you get users?

Only if you have network effect.

How do you get network effect?

By creating an effective referral program. An effective referral program will attract marketers and wallets that live from the referral fee. If you remove that from the equation, how do you gain network effect? A referral program on 2% of the traders will not have as much transaction as on 100% of the users, I presume.

75

I think traders will make up 70-80% of users for bitshares.  The exchange is what gives bts value, and it needs to be tailored for traders.  There really isn't a reason for Joe sixpack to use bts just for moving money around.

Yes, there is. He can hold USD, EUR, GBP without counterparty risk and use it like paypal with compatible merchants. Those merchants save fees and thus can offer discounts. He can even refer users to his wallet provider and gets a profit cut. He can also buy GOLD or SILVER within the same wallet and store his wealth inside BTS.

It's still a long stretch, but this is where we want to be heading.

If you cut the transfer fee, none of this will happen, and BTS will remain to be suited to traders only, and not Joe sixpack. Reducing fees is always possible, raising them in the future to have a sustainble referral program for normal users is a big PR disaster, and should be avoided at all costs.

EDIT:
No transfer fee - no incentive for wallet providers to open shop, and nobody refers joe sixpack users then, and thus no merchants too since there is no userbase. No need to have a referral program then too, since the product has no users except traders. No users = NO NETWORK EFFECT!

Reduce the transfer fee if you must, but do not reduce it to 0, you kill the the merchants, the normal users and the wallet providers with that. There must be incentive to use the referral program for transfers for a functioning eco-system.

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