I just wanted to post the following update:
1) I have not received any communication of any form from any government agency.
2) Invictus never solicited fiat from any individual (no reason for FinCEN to get involved)
3) Invictus has never run a block producing node on the BitShares network (Ripple runs their own nodes)
In the event that Invictus is fined it will not impact the future of BitShares, it will only impact my own personal financial situation. I suspect that this community would have my back and we will all move past it.
There is nothing to fear except fear itself.
Thanks for the clarification!
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
3) Invictus has never run a block producing node on the BitShares network (Ripple runs their own nodes)
But individuals have run such nodes (delegates)... does it mean the delegates are a potential target of them?
Quote from: liondani on May 07, 2015, 12:27:55 PM
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
3) Invictus has never run a block producing node on the BitShares network (Ripple runs their own nodes)
But individuals have run such nodes (delegates)... does it mean the delegates are a potential target of them?
The init* delegates have been run by DACSunLimited IIRC..
Full nodes are not of interest
Anyway, thanks for the clarification :)
Quote from: liondani on May 07, 2015, 12:27:55 PM
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
3) Invictus has never run a block producing node on the BitShares network (Ripple runs their own nodes)
But individuals have run such nodes (delegates)... does it mean the delegates are a potential target of them?
I do not believe that any individual delegate is at risk because no individual delegate has any control on their own and they were all "elected", etc.
I think it only matters to us because we are the producers of the software. This is an example of where doing too much under one company is a problem, but spreading the tasks among 100's of people becomes ok because the tasks individually are completely legal.
Wonderful
+5%
Thank you BM. Good points.
Got your back by the way. :D
Thanks for clarification!
Good points!
And yes BitSharesX was launched by DACunlimited and they were/are located in china, so guess this will also make a different from Ripple position...</wildguess>
I would like to focus on this in the conversation tomorrow if you are ok with it. This could be a teaching moment.
Quote from: bytemaster on October 28, 2014, 01:02:56 AM
Since we have not received anything I can post that we have not received anything.
:P
Don't be too optimistic about this. http://www.coindesk.com/fincen-rules-bitcoin-payment-processors-exchanges-money-transmitters/
"In a response to twin letters submitted in late 2013, the chief US money laundering and terrorist financing regulator explained that bitcoin exchanges may be money transmitters, even if they only match buyers and sellers on their platform. Further, the letters suggest this is true, even if the exchanges behave more like traditional securities or commodities exchanges, where no money is transferred between the company and any counterparty."
When they decide to enforce the rules, whatever you say is in vain. They have the final explanation of the rules they set. Whether fiat is involved or not does not matter. Whether you run the nodes or not doesn't matter either, if only they find you "facilitated" the transmission process.
Quote from: bigcat on May 07, 2015, 05:06:58 PM
Don't be too optimistic about this. http://www.coindesk.com/fincen-rules-bitcoin-payment-processors-exchanges-money-transmitters/
"In a response to twin letters submitted in late 2013, the chief US money laundering and terrorist financing regulator explained that bitcoin exchanges may be money transmitters, even if they only match buyers and sellers on their platform. Further, the letters suggest this is true, even if the exchanges behave more like traditional securities or commodities exchanges, where no money is transferred between the company and any counterparty."
When they decide to enforce the rules, whatever you say is in vain. They have the final explanation of the rules they set. Whether fiat is involved or not does not matter. Whether you run the nodes or not doesn't matter either, if only they find you "facilitated" the transmission process.
So funny that they are protecting us from the "terrorists" they create and arm with the money they steal from tax payers...oh the irony.
^ Try enforcing that overseas. From a legal standpoint, BitShares is Chinese.
Quote from: bigcat on May 07, 2015, 05:06:58 PM
"In a response to twin letters submitted in late 2013, the chief US money laundering and terrorist financing regulator explained that bitcoin exchanges may be money transmitters, even if they only match buyers and sellers on their platform. Further, the letters suggest this is true, even if the exchanges behave more like traditional securities or commodities exchanges, where no money is transferred between the company and any counterparty."
When they decide to enforce the rules, whatever you say is in vain. They have the final explanation of the rules they set. Whether fiat is involved or not does not matter. Whether you run the nodes or not doesn't matter either, if only they find you "facilitated" the transmission process.
EXACTLY!
I've got a couple of ideas that NEED to be implemented:
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,16199.msg207356.html#msg207356
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
In the event that Invictus is fined it will not impact the future of BitShares, it will only impact my own personal financial situation. I suspect that this community would have my back and we will all move past it.
There is nothing to fear except fear itself.
(http://bitscape.io/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/gotyourback.jpg)
Quote from: bigcat on May 07, 2015, 05:06:58 PM
Don't be too optimistic about this. http://www.coindesk.com/fincen-rules-bitcoin-payment-processors-exchanges-money-transmitters/
"In a response to twin letters submitted in late 2013, the chief US money laundering and terrorist financing regulator explained that bitcoin exchanges may be money transmitters, even if they only match buyers and sellers on their platform. Further, the letters suggest this is true, even if the exchanges behave more like traditional securities or commodities exchanges, where no money is transferred between the company and any counterparty."
When they decide to enforce the rules, whatever you say is in vain. They have the final explanation of the rules they set. Whether fiat is involved or not does not matter. Whether you run the nodes or not doesn't matter either, if only they find you "facilitated" the transmission process.
Interestingly there actually is NO explicit order matchin in BitShares .. if you take a look at the blockchains there are ONLY asks and bids .. no matches ... the order matchin happens in every (full) client!!! .. its part of "the protocol" .. not the blockchain :D
Quote from: bitscape on May 07, 2015, 08:05:01 PM
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
In the event that Invictus is fined it will not impact the future of BitShares, it will only impact my own personal financial situation. I suspect that this community would have my back and we will all move past it.
There is nothing to fear except fear itself.
(http://bitscape.io/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/gotyourback.jpg)
+5%
Quote from: xeroc ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ on May 07, 2015, 08:08:29 PM
Interestingly there actually is NO explicit order matchin in BitShares .. if you take a look at the blockchains there are ONLY asks and bids .. no matches ... the order matchin happens in every (full) client!!! .. its part of "the protocol" .. not the blockchain :D
8)
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:35:09 PM
This is an example of where doing too much under one company is a problem, but spreading the tasks among 100's of people becomes ok because the tasks individually are completely legal.
So we can pretend that the current code/work is a task splited equally to the 101 active delegates...
can you virtual-simulate this on github? :P (we just need a bunch of new github accounts)
Quote from: bitscape on May 07, 2015, 08:05:01 PM
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
In the event that Invictus is fined it will not impact the future of BitShares, it will only impact my own personal financial situation. I suspect that this community would have my back and we will all move past it.
There is nothing to fear except fear itself.
(http://bitscape.io/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/gotyourback.jpg)
Or more like this.... BTW doesn't this look like our 101 delegates?
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/14/149746/3073336-2882531-2126773-justice_league.jpg)
Quote from: merivercap on May 08, 2015, 12:53:22 AM
Quote from: bitscape on May 07, 2015, 08:05:01 PM
Quote from: bytemaster on May 07, 2015, 12:18:59 PM
In the event that Invictus is fined it will not impact the future of BitShares, it will only impact my own personal financial situation. I suspect that this community would have my back and we will all move past it.
There is nothing to fear except fear itself.
(http://bitscape.io/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/gotyourback.jpg%5B/imago%5D%3Cbr%20/%3E%5B/quote%5D%3Cbr%20/%3E%3Cbr%20/%3EOr%20more%20like%20this.... %20%20BTW%20doesn't%20this%20look%20like%20our%20101%20delegates?%3Cbr%20/%3E%3Cbr%20/%3E%5Bimg%5Dhttp://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/14/149746/3073336-2882531-2126773-justice_league.jpg)
Yup, there I am.
No, in the back behind the scenes. That's me. Not a Super Hero; just keeping the network running for this community. Now get out the vote won't ya!
-Fox