BitShares Forum

Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: monsterer on April 21, 2015, 06:58:26 pm

Title: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: monsterer on April 21, 2015, 06:58:26 pm
Hi guys,

I wanted to brainstorm refund addresses in metaexchange. As it stands bitcoin transactions are refunded if necessary and sent back to where they came from. This is fine mostly, except when users withdraw from an exchange or hosted wallet of some kind where they don't own the addresses they send from.

We could add a 'refund address' parameter to metaexchange to fix this problem, but it can be gamed because we store and associate data with the bitshares account name (deposit address, and soon price and expiry time). An attacker could simply run through all bitshares account names on the site adding their own bitcoin address as the refund address for each account.

You might suggest that we don't store refund address in the DB, making them single use. The problem with that is people often store their metaexchange deposit addresses in their wallet and don't even use the site at all when they want to convert funds (which is entirely within our design spec).

I'd love to hear if anyone has an alternative to address this problem? :)

Cheers, Paul.

Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: Shentist on April 21, 2015, 07:07:05 pm
we can just use a BitShares transaction to "register" your funding address to an account

1. I want to use my BitShares Account "Shentist" so i send a small BTS transfer to metaexchange with my Bitcoin address

done :D
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: xeroc on April 21, 2015, 07:18:55 pm
And you can sign that message with the active/owner key
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: monsterer on April 21, 2015, 07:23:17 pm
we can just use a BitShares transaction to "register" your funding address to an account

1. I want to use my BitShares Account "Shentist" so i send a small BTS transfer to metaexchange with my Bitcoin address

done :D

I had considered something like this, but I wanted to keep it simple(er) if possible :)

edit: actually, the more I think about it, we can make this easy for users with an auto generated bitshares URL... Ok, great! :)
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: speedy on April 21, 2015, 08:36:07 pm
Paul, Im not sure why I want a refund address feature. I used Metaexchange and was happy.

Wouldnt it be a much more useful to help the web-wallet guys integrate Metaexchange behind the scenes into a new Deposit/Withdraw page on the web wallet?

An easy deposit system is the most urgent thing that the web wallet is lacking right now. Its just not as integrated as a regular altcoin exchange.
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: speedy on April 21, 2015, 08:45:20 pm
Look what happens when I click the Deposit page on Bter.com, we need a page like this in the web-wallet:

(http://i.imgur.com/7uEBZdA.png)

Bter generated a BTC deposit address its user. Metaexchange's API could generate a deposit address for the web-wallet user, and he wouldnt even have to know hes using Metaexchange.

Im sure everything Im saying is obvious but its good to refresh where our priorities should be.
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: Shentist on April 21, 2015, 08:51:20 pm
Look what happens when I click the Deposit page on Bter.com, we need a page like this in the web-wallet:

(http://i.imgur.com/7uEBZdA.png)

Bter generated a BTC deposit address its user. Metaexchange's API could generate a deposit address for the web-wallet user, and he wouldnt even have to know hes using Metaexchange.

Im sure everything Im saying is obvious but its good to refresh where our priorities should be.

hi speedy,

we already wanted it, but it is not on us, to get it into the wallets. We agreed with moonstone and limewallet to do it, and it seems the core devs will start as well to get us and blocktrades integrated.
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: speedy on April 21, 2015, 08:53:23 pm
Cool, the core devs are thinking 2 steps ahead as usual ;D
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: Pheonike on April 21, 2015, 08:54:50 pm

How about a bitcoin mixing service.
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: Akado on April 21, 2015, 09:05:20 pm

How about a bitcoin mixing service.

I thought that was illegal under some jurisdictions, though it could certainly attract a great number of bitcoin users and even open the door for bitAssets into the deep web, however I think that's an approach some don't agree with.
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: mf-tzo on April 22, 2015, 06:44:45 am
I am interested about this since I am planning to send some BTC from bitstamp and I know some others friends are going to do the same. Will this be a problem? In case of a problem we can always pm you and you look at this right? For us if we download the whole bitcoin wallet it will take at least 3 days to synch...We are all in BTS for quite some time now...
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: monsterer on April 22, 2015, 08:41:38 am
I am interested about this since I am planning to send some BTC from bitstamp and I know some others friends are going to do the same. Will this be a problem? In case of a problem we can always pm you and you look at this right? For us if we download the whole bitcoin wallet it will take at least 3 days to synch...We are all in BTS for quite some time now...

Be careful if you do this - if you send over the maximum transaction size, the transaction will get refunded to bitstamp, not to you.

I am planning to implement a proper refund address setting as per shentist's sugguestion, but for now, please take care when you send :)
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: fav on April 22, 2015, 08:48:57 am
I'd like to see an optional option to associate a bts id with a fixed bitcoin adr for deposit / refund
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: monsterer on April 22, 2015, 08:55:52 am
I'd like to see an optional option to associate a bts id with a fixed bitcoin adr for deposit / refund

I don't think this is possible for deposit, but it certainly is for refund. For deposit, the address is unique to your market requirements, so we can identify you as a trader.
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: joele on April 22, 2015, 09:25:25 am
If there is BTC refund, transfer small amount to customer Bitshares account with memo that they have BTC refund and a short URL that redirect to How To Refund page in your website.
The How to Refund page explain how to send small amount to your Bitshares account with Bitcoin address in the memo, and with example.

or compress the message in the memo on how to get the refund.
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: mf-tzo on April 22, 2015, 09:29:13 am
I am interested about this since I am planning to send some BTC from bitstamp and I know some others friends are going to do the same. Will this be a problem? In case of a problem we can always pm you and you look at this right? For us if we download the whole bitcoin wallet it will take at least 3 days to synch...We are all in BTS for quite some time now...

Be careful if you do this - if you send over the maximum transaction size, the transaction will get refunded to bitstamp, not to you.

I am planning to implement a proper refund address setting as per shentist's sugguestion, but for now, please take care when you send :)

Thanks Paul. But if I send always lower amounts than the max amounts shown i.e. 0.1 BTC less everytime there shouldn't be a problem with any refund right? And if for some reason something happens I could always contact you and we can fix this right?
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: joele on April 22, 2015, 09:37:02 am
I am interested about this since I am planning to send some BTC from bitstamp and I know some others friends are going to do the same. Will this be a problem? In case of a problem we can always pm you and you look at this right? For us if we download the whole bitcoin wallet it will take at least 3 days to synch...We are all in BTS for quite some time now...

Be careful if you do this - if you send over the maximum transaction size, the transaction will get refunded to bitstamp, not to you.

I am planning to implement a proper refund address setting as per shentist's sugguestion, but for now, please take care when you send :)

Thanks Paul. But if I send always lower amounts than the max amounts shown i.e. 0.1 BTC less everytime there shouldn't be a problem with any refund right? And if for some reason something happens I could always contact you and we can fix this right?

It will be troublesome, contacting exchanger and verifying addresses to the max manually, exchanger will hate you for this. :D
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: monsterer on April 22, 2015, 09:39:34 am
Thanks Paul. But if I send always lower amounts than the max amounts shown i.e. 0.1 BTC less everytime there shouldn't be a problem with any refund right? And if for some reason something happens I could always contact you and we can fix this right?

As long as nothing else goes wrong, you should be ok :)
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: Shentist on April 22, 2015, 06:37:41 pm
we could also something do like this:

if we can only execute a part, the rest will get a limit order with an possible execution at the same price the first part got transfered.

The user can only cancel this order through his BitShares account
Title: Re: Brainstorming - metaexchange feature
Post by: monsterer on April 22, 2015, 07:58:34 pm
we could also something do like this:

if we can only execute a part, the rest will get a limit order with an possible execution at the same price the first part got transfered.

The user can only cancel this order through his BitShares account

That would work for the bitshares side, but for bitcoin, it's more difficult because there is no way to prove ownership of the orders.

I think your original idea of setting a refund address by transaction memo is the best way :)