BitShares Forum
Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: puppies on November 03, 2015, 05:55:06 am
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Wow. That was a shitty day for bitshares.
Lift your head look around. You're still alive. If you are like me then you are a bit poorer for it. If you are not then fuck you I don't really want to hear about it. (just kidding feel free to gloat. We always need reminders of how trashy people act.)
Like many of you I feel as if I was just kicked in the nuts. over and over again. I feel as if I live in the quiet little hamlet of BitShares, and the evil dragon Margin of Polo has lain waste to my kinsmen. Burned many alive. Scared many others away to live in the wastes. Forgetting why they ever called BitShares home. There were some just here for coin. I wont miss them. There were however some that understood that neither profit nor wealth could ever be completely measured in dollars nor even btc. That attempting to measure your profit or wealth in the symbol of your enslavement only makes you more of a slave. If any of those have been scared away they will be missed. Even the ones I think are assholes. The potential loss of human capital is far more concerning than that hideous to watch drop in price.
I think its important to put shitty days behind you. If you don't then you tend towards having a shitty now. I would much rather have a shitty yesterday than a shitty now.
Anyways just the thoughts a 35 year old man that answers to the forum name puppies. I understand if that doesn't increase your confidence in my opinion.
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I have absolutely no idea what the hell you're talking about, but sorry you're having a tough time puppies.
Tomorrow is another day that has the potential to be better. How bad can it be for a newlywed? Think of your wife, that oughta put some spring in your step!
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Well said puppies, hopefully we'll bounce back quickly.
@thom BTS just got slaughtered over on polo, price is down like 50% since yesterday..
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Well said puppies, hopefully we'll bounce back quickly.
@Thom BTS just got slaughtered over on polo, price is down like 50% since yesterday..
I C. Yeah that is a bummer. This keeps up I'll have to start shutting down seeds.
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Short term swings don't matter if you believe we're going much higher. It's just some trader cashing out and making the chart guys think they're seeing Mt. Everest or the Marianna Trench. Forest for the trees; I don't even bother checking CMC most days. This volatility will get sorted out soon and we'll get some wider adoption, then begin a slow and steady increase that we can sustain. Until then, the movements are just noise.
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Short term swings don't matter if you believe we're going much higher. It's just some trader cashing out and making the chart guys think they're seeing Mt. Everest or the Marianna Trench. Forest for the trees; I don't even bother checking CMC most days. This volatility will get sorted out soon and we'll get some wider adoption, then begin a slow and steady increase that we can sustain. Until then, the movements are just noise.
Quiet down and pass the koolaid. I'm feeling parched!
As you can see I don't pay too much attention to the price. I tend to more as VPS fees come due. With the total monthly BTS pay down around 41K, it's about half the USD BM targeted, gross pay before expenses.
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The feeling I have is that BTS is like on a seesaw with BTC , and speculators keep switching sides. Call me anything you like but this looks like a good sign to me.
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Wow. That was a shitty day for bitshares.
Lift your head look around. You're still alive. If you are like me then you are a bit poorer for it. If you are not then fuck you I don't really want to hear about it. (just kidding feel free to gloat. We always need reminders of how trashy people act.)
Like many of you I feel as if I was just kicked in the nuts. over and over again. I feel as if I live in the quiet little hamlet of BitShares, and the evil dragon Margin of Polo has lain waste to my kinsmen. Burned many alive. Scared many others away to live in the wastes. Forgetting why they ever called BitShares home. There were some just here for coin. I wont miss them. There were however some that understood that neither profit nor wealth could ever be completely measured in dollars nor even btc. That attempting to measure your profit or wealth in the symbol of your enslavement only makes you more of a slave. If any of those have been scared away they will be missed. Even the ones I think are assholes. The potential loss of human capital is far more concerning than that hideous to watch drop in price.
I think its important to put shitty days behind you. If you don't then you tend towards having a shitty now. I would much rather have a shitty yesterday than a shitty now.
Anyways just the thoughts a 35 year old man that answers to the forum name puppies. I understand if that doesn't increase your confidence in my opinion.
I hear you Puppies.....but the occasional slamming reminds you just how robust those fun-berries actually are! The human capital you mention, represented by those minds that are awake to the reality of the world in which we live, will not be so easily dissuaded. In fact, i feel certain that the BitShares community can only grow as more and more people who were searching for a genuine alternative to the system that is destroying their environment, freedom and future....eventually find us. I can speak only for myself but i am not here by chance, I haven't stayed for profit. The idea of BitShares gave a home to my deep and implacable conviction that we can do better and that the collateral cost of the current system is absolutely, insanely, monstrous. As long as BitShares represents the highest standards of governance and ideology, supported by unfettered innovation, collaboration and economic sense.......this is the only place to be. I feel sure so many feel something similar. I look forward to the day that the BitShares price is the result of a deep market within the DEX on the back of massive utility based demand.
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kudos to anyone with the balls to buy this blood bath
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kudos to anyone with the balls to buy this blood bath
Where is @Ander when we need him?
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(http://www.comicconartists.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Morpheus-We-Are-Still-Here-300x128.jpeg)
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kudos to anyone with the balls to buy this blood bath
seriously??
Kudos to those that were holding and buying since the initial pumps of c$80 mil and still haven't sold even if they lost most of them in margin trading long, or any other way they try to support bts..
If I had sold when I should have done looooong time ago and had any money left I would be buying like crazy now..Those buying in this blood now have no kudos..just common sense...
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it is a bad day , this the price we pay for stupid （high fee) , I had warned a weeks ago.
but I did not sell one bts ,I am waiting for changing , -%5%
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This is the price we pay not only for high fees but also for hypes from the Devs for a release that still has bugs, is not user friendly, we have to re-imagine everything if we want to trade with leverage in the new system, rules to trade and how you get margin called are not explained properly and keep changing, no marketing, nanocards and other services promised months ago, not a single whale is supporting bitshares and the small people with few funds just lost everything..
I think re instating the confidence in bts will take another couple of years..It is so depressing.. I am just sad...
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Until we offer some real margin trading, the DEX will be a joke to traders and never pickup. All that volume on Polo should have been on the DEX if we had are sh*t together.
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The reason why this really sucks is because bitcoin is rising so strongly... It makes us feel like idiots because we tried to be the smartest guys in the room and pick an alternative currency because we thought we had an inside track.
When I told my friends and family that I was investing in bitcoin, they thought I was an idiot destined to lose all my money. I didn't tell them I invested in bitshares, since they don't know the difference. All they know is it is some digital money.
Now they see bitcoin rising like an absolute monster while getting tons of media attention. They go to me "Wow! you invest in the bitcoins right? You must be doing awesome! Tell me more about these things!"
Little do they know that I actually bought into some other thing not bitcoin... A thing similar but not the same that has lost tremendous value since I bought it. So here we are. We were right on the story that crypto would become immensely valuable, but somehow we managed to go broke in the process...That is the ultimate kick in the nuts!
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The reason why this really sucks is because bitcoin is rising so strongly... It makes us feel like idiots because we tried to be the smartest guys in the room and pick an alternative currency because we thought we had an inside track.
When I told my friends and family that I was investing in bitcoin, they thought I was an idiot destined to lose all my money. I didn't tell them I invested in bitshares, since they don't know the difference. All they know is it is some digital money.
Now they see bitcoin rising like an absolute monster while getting tons of media attention. They go to me "Wow! you invest in the bitcoins right? You must be doing awesome! Tell me more about these things!"
Little do they know that I actually bought into some other thing not bitcoin... A thing similar but not the same that has lost tremendous value since I bought it. So here we are. We were right on the story that crypto would become immensely valuable, but somehow we managed to go broke in the process...That is the ultimate kick in the nuts!
lol..I face exactly the same situation.. but i mean exactly..people think i am suddnly rich and in reality i am broke..lol..
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The reason why this really sucks is because bitcoin is rising so strongly... It makes us feel like idiots because we tried to be the smartest guys in the room and pick an alternative currency because we thought we had an inside track.
When I told my friends and family that I was investing in bitcoin, they thought I was an idiot destined to lose all my money. I didn't tell them I invested in bitshares, since they don't know the difference. All they know is it is some digital money.
Now they see bitcoin rising like an absolute monster while getting tons of media attention. They go to me "Wow! you invest in the bitcoins right? You must be doing awesome! Tell me more about these things!"
Little do they know that I actually bought into some other thing not bitcoin... A thing similar but not the same that has lost tremendous value since I bought it. So here we are. We were right on the story that crypto would become immensely valuable, but somehow we managed to go broke in the process...That is the ultimate kick in the nuts!
I am happy to see you burned.hahahhaa.
sb.
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This is the price we pay not only for high fees but also for hypes from the Devs for a release that still has bugs, is not user friendly, we have to re-imagine everything if we want to trade with leverage in the new system, rules to trade and how you get margin called are not explained properly and keep changing, no marketing, nanocards and other services promised months ago, not a single whale is supporting bitshares and the small people with few funds just lost everything..
I think re instating the confidence in bts will take another couple of years..It is so depressing.. I am just sad...
It was hard to hear, but in the recent interview Adam said exactly that. That basically the GUI is not user friendly, not polished and that Bitshares never quite gets finished before being put out there. I agree that hopefully some decent developer is going to build a great gui and get all the referrals, but as of today its simply not polished enough and its hard to hear.
On the other side, we have a great backend. Even Adam admitted thats its the best out there. That's perfect news. He wants to integrate it with his platform and from what i see on the forum, hes not sure how to do it and is kind of giving up.
I know we have limited resources, but it does reinforce this perception that we cant quite bring home the bacon with a polished, easy to use, easy to understand product. All our attention should be on the front end so that it works in all browsers, have an app in the AppStore and the GUI is as polished as poloniex. I love BMs teaser in the mumble and thats what he's good at. But i really wish we had a equally good front end built.
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"BitShares, the best DEX that no one can use"
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The reason why this really sucks is because bitcoin is rising so strongly... It makes us feel like idiots because we tried to be the smartest guys in the room and pick an alternative currency because we thought we had an inside track.
When I told my friends and family that I was investing in bitcoin, they thought I was an idiot destined to lose all my money. I didn't tell them I invested in bitshares, since they don't know the difference. All they know is it is some digital money.
Now they see bitcoin rising like an absolute monster while getting tons of media attention. They go to me "Wow! you invest in the bitcoins right? You must be doing awesome! Tell me more about these things!"
Little do they know that I actually bought into some other thing not bitcoin... A thing similar but not the same that has lost tremendous value since I bought it. So here we are. We were right on the story that crypto would become immensely valuable, but somehow we managed to go broke in the process...That is the ultimate kick in the nuts!
I am happy to see you burned.hahahhaa.
sb.
It's good to see that you can be happy about someting :)
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This is the price we pay not only for high fees but also for hypes from the Devs for a release that still has bugs, is not user friendly, we have to re-imagine everything if we want to trade with leverage in the new system, rules to trade and how you get margin called are not explained properly and keep changing, no marketing, nanocards and other services promised months ago, not a single whale is supporting bitshares and the small people with few funds just lost everything..
I think re instating the confidence in bts will take another couple of years..It is so depressing.. I am just sad...
It was hard to hear, but in the recent interview Adam said exactly that. That basically the GUI is not user friendly, not polished and that Bitshares never quite gets finished before being put out there. I agree that hopefully some decent developer is going to build a great gui and get all the referrals, but as of today its simply not polished enough and its hard to hear.
On the other side, we have a great backend. Even Adam admitted thats its the best out there. That's perfect news. He wants to integrate it with his platform and from what i see on the forum, hes not sure how to do it and is kind of giving up.
I know we have limited resources, but it does reinforce this perception that we cant quite bring home the bacon with a polished, easy to use, easy to understand product. All our attention should be on the front end so that it works in all browsers, have an app in the AppStore and the GUI is as polished as poloniex. I love BMs teaser in the mumble and thats what he's good at. But i really wish we had a equally good front end built.
We have the substance....now we need a massive dose of style! ;D
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Im not gonna lie. This consistently low price is depressing.
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did anybody got his game together to create a new wallet for bitshares? Get a team of 3-4 people, create the design and get some VC funding. There is so much money in Fintech! Do not say directly its for Bitshares.. I have seen www.number26.de with 50.000 new users in 4 months and www.cashcloud.com rised + $1 million EUR for a simple new bank interface, why not us?
I meet Sven Donhuysen (Founder of cashcloud) on a conference in Switzerland today and i will contact him again to look for synergies to add Bitshares as an additional technology. I think we need to be more public about the great technology we have with BitShares and what it can deliver to us all.
I think it is time for us now to step up again and to reach out. Don´t let BitShares stay an underdog for dreamers!
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did anybody got his game together to create a new wallet for bitshares? Get a team of 3-4 people, create the design and get some VC funding. There is so much money in Fintech! Do not say directly its for Bitshares.. I have seen www.number26.de with 50.000 new users in 4 months and www.cashcloud.com rised + $1 million EUR for a simple new bank interface, why not us?
I meet Sven Donhuysen (Founder of cashcloud) on a conference in Switzerland today and i will contact him again to look for synergies to add Bitshares as an additional technology. I think we need to be more public about the great technology we have with BitShares and what it can deliver to us all.
I think it is time for us now to step up again and to reach out. Don´t let BitShares stay an underdog for dreamers!
BitSapphire is doing the Moonstone wallet.
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did anybody got his game together to create a new wallet for bitshares? Get a team of 3-4 people, create the design and get some VC funding. There is so much money in Fintech! Do not say directly its for Bitshares.. I have seen www.number26.de with 50.000 new users in 4 months and www.cashcloud.com rised + $1 million EUR for a simple new bank interface, why not us?
I meet Sven Donhuysen (Founder of cashcloud) on a conference in Switzerland today and i will contact him again to look for synergies to add Bitshares as an additional technology. I think we need to be more public about the great technology we have with BitShares and what it can deliver to us all.
I think it is time for us now to step up again and to reach out. Don´t let BitShares stay an underdog for dreamers!
I believe Datasecuritynodes new thing is creating a wallet as well.
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These are good news and i am looking forward to their first design pitches. Moonstone looks still far away from launch. Any updated dates here?
How far the developments for an fiat on-ramp in USA? Is anybody on that right now?
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These are good news and i am looking forward to their first design pitches. Moonstone looks still far away from launch. Any updated dates here?
How far the developments for an fiat on-ramp in USA? Is anybody on that right now?
Moonstone owes a lot of people a lot of money here
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These are good news and i am looking forward to their first design pitches. Moonstone looks still far away from launch. Any updated dates here?
How far the developments for an fiat on-ramp in USA? Is anybody on that right now?
Moonstone owes a lot of people a lot of money here
I talked with one of their members a few weeks and what I've been told is it should be around ~2 months, but imo we should expect a bit more because there are always unexpected delays.
If it does, it has now a chance of paying it back faster. The better UI they build, the more costumers they will get, the more they will benefit from the referral program and the faster they can pay back and keep a good image. So I guess it's in their best interest to build the best wallet possible.
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Im not gonna lie. This consistently low price is depressing.
I really don't think the price will instantly or magically increase. If it does, be suspicious of manipulative whales. What we all need to do is hit the ground and promote the hell out of this thing, fueling some greater adoption, and get the momentum rolling to where businesses and customers WANT to use BitShares for various functions. Then we will see the kind of sustainable growth that has been so elusive in BitShares (or crypto in general). It won't happen this week or next month. But in a few months or a year or two, our efforts should be rewarded.
Get on it, people. Promoting BitShares is a 'part-time job' now for all of us. Imagine working at Google (or insert your favorite startup success story here) when they first got started with the promise that your options might be worth a great deal more someday. And that your technology could make the world a much better place. We can make it happen.
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i also find that once the price drop it will keep low for a long time.
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I really don't think the price will instantly or magically increase. If it does, be suspicious of manipulative whales. What we all need to do is hit the ground and promote the hell out of this thing, fueling some greater adoption, and get the momentum rolling to where businesses and customers WANT to use BitShares for various functions. Then we will see the kind of sustainable growth that has been so elusive in BitShares (or crypto in general). It won't happen this week or next month. But in a few months or a year or two, our efforts should be rewarded.
Get on it, people. Promoting BitShares is a 'part-time job' now for all of us. Imagine working at Google (or insert your favorite startup success story here) when they first got started with the promise that your options might be worth a great deal more someday. And that your technology could make the world a much better place. We can make it happen.
^^ +5% What @donkeypong said!
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Price feeds in openledger are very biased. Why is that?
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Price feeds in openledger are very biased. Why is that?
I think it has to do with whether that witness is using a weighted approach to price, and what sources are being used. Not sure though.
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How do I promote bitshares? Do I walk into a bar and say "You should use bitshares because (I have no idea what to say here)". Same thing with other merchants and business's. How can they use this? Why would they use this instead or along with bitcoin?
What kind of company needs bitshares? Honestly the only companies I can see using bitshares are companies like draft kings and fan duel. Maybe companies that sell those gambling machines that are in bars could use them some how too.
I just got a bill today from my credit card company... I bought bitcoin with it from circle. Not only did I have to pay a credit card fee charged by circle, but I found out they charged it as a cash advance which cost $10 per transaction. Both circle and citi told me to pound sand when i complained. Frankly it is insanely expensive to get involved it crypto, a product which brags about being cheap to move money around!
Sorry about the rant... crypto can be just so frustrating
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How do I promote bitshares? Do I walk into a bar and say "You should use bitshares because (I have no idea what to say here)". Same thing with other merchants and business's. How can they use this? Why would they use this instead or along with bitcoin?
I don't think you can promote BTS as money. They are not money. They are shares in the company, as the docs says. These tokens are used as money, but only for some applications.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal. Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I try and promote this as "Why save in USD in your Bank of America account when you can save diversified in Gold, Silver, Oil, USD etc with BitShares" or "Are you concerned about your currency being devalued or bail-ins? Try crypto and bank on yourself."
I think its a mistake to get too political. Look how poorly the libertarians do in elections these days. For some reason people dont care about liberty so much as what they think they're entitled to. The US is becoming a police state yet no one protested after snowdon's revelations, but they sure did in Berlin, Germany. Not in DC though.
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Im not gonna lie. This consistently low price is depressing.
I really don't think the price will instantly or magically increase. If it does, be suspicious of manipulative whales. What we all need to do is hit the ground and promote the hell out of this thing, fueling some greater adoption, and get the momentum rolling to where businesses and customers WANT to use BitShares for various functions. Then we will see the kind of sustainable growth that has been so elusive in BitShares (or crypto in general). It won't happen this week or next month. But in a few months or a year or two, our efforts should be rewarded.
Get on it, people. Promoting BitShares is a 'part-time job' now for all of us. Imagine working at Google (or insert your favorite startup success story here) when they first got started with the promise that your options might be worth a great deal more someday. And that your technology could make the world a much better place. We can make it happen.
Customers and merchants don't care about Bitshares. The market for Bitshares are people who want to speculate or loan or park their money and collect some kind of yield or interest.
There isn't another decentralized exchange where people can do that. There are plenty of coins competing to get merchants and customers. If you can store your earnings in gold or silver that is something nothing else can offer right now.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal. Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I try and promote this as "Why save in USD in your Bank of America account when you can save diversified in Gold, Silver, Oil, USD etc with BitShares" or "Are you concerned about your currency being devalued or bail-ins? Try crypto and bank on yourself."
I think its a mistake to get too political. Look how poorly the libertarians do in elections these days. For some reason people dont care about liberty so much as what they think they're entitled to. The US is becoming a police state yet no one protested after snowdon's revelations, but they sure did in Berlin, Germany. Not in DC though.
I agree. At the same time Bitshares has to just work, and the bond market feature is missing which is perhaps more important to mass adoption than any other.
BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
A lot of people don't know what freedom is, and only half of Americans own stocks. Maybe focus on the half of Americans who don't own any stocks. Most Americans don't own any equity and you don't really have to appeal to ideology other than to look at the demographics that dont own and show them an easy way to acquire equity.
Maybe gamers for example who spend all day getting some digital item can now own digital property and acquire real wealth. This is an opportunity that never existed before for gamers or for people of the millennial demographic.
Focusing on politics is a mistake because a lot of young people aren't political or they just don't like politics. People see politics are involved and often run away from it because a lot of people don't want to have to deal with what comes along with politics, the risk of their lives being destroyed, the risk of upsetting the status quo. I think politics really limit the potential of any project when it's put into the branding of the project and it is why Bitcoin is replaced by Blockchain.
The reasoning being that most Americans aren't anarchists. Most Americans misunderstand what anarchist means, they don't have to be libertarians, they could be mainstream independents, or Bernie Sanders supporters, and still use an app if it's in their self interest. Why not appeal to self interest?
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal. Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I try and promote this as "Why save in USD in your Bank of America account when you can save diversified in Gold, Silver, Oil, USD etc with BitShares" or "Are you concerned about your currency being devalued or bail-ins? Try crypto and bank on yourself."
I think its a mistake to get too political. Look how poorly the libertarians do in elections these days. For some reason people dont care about liberty so much as what they think they're entitled to. The US is becoming a police state yet no one protested after snowdon's revelations, but they sure did in Berlin, Germany. Not in DC though.
Problem is if BTS is only useful when centralized exchanges go down, we are screwed... I'm going to value toilet paper and bullets a lot more than btc, bts, dollars, euro's or yuan.
There has got to be a better reason than that to own bitshares
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Well the good news is we're global, not just within the US. The Chinese are behind the bitcoin rise according to zerohedge. They could but bitBTC or bitgold with us. The question is, why aren't they?
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Easy, let's bring equity ownership to the masses. Everyone can own some equity using Bitshares.
There is no centralized institution encouraging equity ownership for the masses. Crowd funding is just becoming legal and it's perfect timing for Bitshares 2.0 which was just released. Why not jump on it?
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Well the good news is we're global, not just within the US. The Chinese are behind the bitcoin rise according to zerohedge. They could but bitBTC or bitgold with us. The question is, why aren't they?
Bring equity ownership to the GLOBAL MASSES.
Asia, Europe, Africa, America. Everyone can own a piece of something.
Equity crowd funding!
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Im not gonna lie. This consistently low price is depressing.
I really don't think the price will instantly or magically increase. If it does, be suspicious of manipulative whales. What we all need to do is hit the ground and promote the hell out of this thing, fueling some greater adoption, and get the momentum rolling to where businesses and customers WANT to use BitShares for various functions. Then we will see the kind of sustainable growth that has been so elusive in BitShares (or crypto in general). It won't happen this week or next month. But in a few months or a year or two, our efforts should be rewarded.
Get on it, people. Promoting BitShares is a 'part-time job' now for all of us. Imagine working at Google (or insert your favorite startup success story here) when they first got started with the promise that your options might be worth a great deal more someday. And that your technology could make the world a much better place. We can make it happen.
Customers and merchants don't care about Bitshares. The market for Bitshares are people who want to speculate or loan or park their money and collect some kind of yield or interest.
There isn't another decentralized exchange where people can do that. There are plenty of coins competing to get merchants and customers. If you can store your earnings in gold or silver that is something nothing else can offer right now.
Good point:
The market for Bitshares are people who want to speculate or loan or park their money and collect some kind of yield or interest.
Speculators buy bitshares. They do not value bts as highly as we think they should, though it is the second most traded coin at poloniex. Right now speculators value btc above the alts because it bitcoin is the backbone and rosetta stone for all other blockchains. Speculators know that when dollars and yuan flow into the digital economy, they will do through bitcoin. The broad decline in alt coin prices suggest that speculators are selling their alt coins to capitalize on bitcoin's latest assent. When bitcoin settles down, speculators will exhale, and value will flow back into the alts with a vengeance.
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Im not gonna lie. This consistently low price is depressing.
I really don't think the price will instantly or magically increase. If it does, be suspicious of manipulative whales. What we all need to do is hit the ground and promote the hell out of this thing, fueling some greater adoption, and get the momentum rolling to where businesses and customers WANT to use BitShares for various functions. Then we will see the kind of sustainable growth that has been so elusive in BitShares (or crypto in general). It won't happen this week or next month. But in a few months or a year or two, our efforts should be rewarded.
Get on it, people. Promoting BitShares is a 'part-time job' now for all of us. Imagine working at Google (or insert your favorite startup success story here) when they first got started with the promise that your options might be worth a great deal more someday. And that your technology could make the world a much better place. We can make it happen.
Customers and merchants don't care about Bitshares. The market for Bitshares are people who want to speculate or loan or park their money and collect some kind of yield or interest.
There isn't another decentralized exchange where people can do that. There are plenty of coins competing to get merchants and customers. If you can store your earnings in gold or silver that is something nothing else can offer right now.
Good point:
The market for Bitshares are people who want to speculate or loan or park their money and collect some kind of yield or interest.
Speculators buy bitshares. They do not value bts as highly as we think they should, though it is the second most traded coin at poloniex. Right now speculators value btc above the alts because it bitcoin is the backbone and rosetta stone for all other blockchains. Speculators know that when dollars and yuan flow into the digital economy, they will do through bitcoin. The broad decline in alt coin prices suggest that speculators are selling their alt coins to capitalize on bitcoin's latest assent. When bitcoin settles down, speculators will exhale, and value will flow back into the alts with a vengeance.
I agree with this. I've seen it happen many times before but this only tends to happen after the price of Bitcoin passes a certain psychological pressure point. When Bitcoin is seen as "too expensive" then people start looking for other crypto. Usually they look to Litecoin, then Litecoin eventually is seen as expensive, so they might look to Ethereum, and down the line, until they reach other coins.
This rally is different from the previous ones though. The previous rallies had centralized exchanges, limited ability to get capital in and out, etc. The current rally has institutional investment which can shift in and out, and these investors only care about Bitcoin and do not care at all about the other technologies yet.
This would mean the people investing might not be smart enough about it like the previous more tech oriented generations of investors. The new generation might only see Bitcoin because of the Bitcoin ETF and similar, and might not be able to figure out how to put a few billion dollars into Bitshares.
For Bitshares to be successful Bitcoin would have to go to an ATH and stay there for quite a while so that people have enough time to absorb the different technologies. When Bitcoin reached $1000 a lot of people did start to learn about Mastercoin, Counterparty, Bitshares and other altcoins despite the fact that Bitcoiners at the time would call them all shitcoins.
It's probably only a matter of time before millions of new people come into the space and that is what will boost the Bitshares price because most of them will come from Bitcoin to diversify.
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When bitcoin settles down, speculators will exhale, and value will flow back into the alts with a vengeance.
Yep. But if your own predictions are right (25x expected climb) it is a long way to go before seeing it...and at something like 800/25 ~ 32 or so satoshi per BTS.
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How do I promote bitshares? Do I walk into a bar and say "You should use bitshares because (I have no idea what to say here)". Same thing with other merchants and business's. How can they use this? Why would they use this instead or along with bitcoin?
For me it's quite simple. There are two distinct customer groups:
(1) online merchants - they need to be attracted by financial reasons: we have no charge-backs and we are significantly cheaper - due to the referral program having BTS as a system for receiving payments can mean a net income rather than 2% cost (as is the case with legacy systems).
(2) online consumers - they will come to BTS for lifestyle reasons, financial reasons won't work here because if you spend less than $5 / month for transaction fees you are not price sensitive.
This is what BM points out and I fully agree with it:
BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal. Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I try and promote this as "Why save in USD in your Bank of America account when you can save diversified in Gold, Silver, Oil, USD etc with BitShares" or "Are you concerned about your currency being devalued or bail-ins? Try crypto and bank on yourself."
I think its a mistake to get too political. Look how poorly the libertarians do in elections these days. For some reason people dont care about liberty so much as what they think they're entitled to. The US is becoming a police state yet no one protested after snowdon's revelations, but they sure did in Berlin, Germany. Not in DC though.
I agree. At the same time Bitshares has to just work, and the bond market feature is missing which is perhaps more important to mass adoption than any other.
BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
A lot of people don't know what freedom is, and only half of Americans own stocks. Maybe focus on the half of Americans who don't own any stocks. Most Americans don't own any equity and you don't really have to appeal to ideology other than to look at the demographics that dont own and show them an easy way to acquire equity.
Maybe gamers for example who spend all day getting some digital item can now own digital property and acquire real wealth. This is an opportunity that never existed before for gamers or for people of the millennial demographic.
Focusing on politics is a mistake because a lot of young people aren't political or they just don't like politics. People see politics are involved and often run away from it because a lot of people don't want to have to deal with what comes along with politics, the risk of their lives being destroyed, the risk of upsetting the status quo. I think politics really limit the potential of any project when it's put into the branding of the project and it is why Bitcoin is replaced by Blockchain.
The reasoning being that most Americans aren't anarchists. Most Americans misunderstand what anarchist means, they don't have to be libertarians, they could be mainstream independents, or Bernie Sanders supporters, and still use an app if it's in their self interest. Why not appeal to self interest?
Yes it's definitely slower than most would like, as with any real change to the status quo, but for the first time in history the tools are within reach.
As far as I'm concerned, BitShares is like a gift from beyond for any community which has ever dreamed of creating a local currency, or has wished for a way to leverage their collective economic power, e.g., co-ops.
However, even if you've spent your whole life fighting for economic justice you could be forgiven for not noticing that there is a viable solution just within reach. A new paradigm technology such as the Graphene Toolkit is not immediately identifiable as a solution since it is literally unprecedented, even within the crypto space.
Within the United States alone the grocery co-op movement transacts billions of dollars annually, and is itself a tiny fraction of a much larger international co-op movement which is in the trillions. This is a group of people which absolutely see eye to eye on the principles which animate BitShares. Measuring the Size and Scope of the Cooperative Economy (http://www.un.org/esa/socdev/documents/2014/coopsegm/grace.pdf)
Is there incentive to provide access to a network which facilitates interconnected micro economies of member benefits / rewards points / gift cards / equity, to benefit participating merchants and clients alike?
Moving beyond the institutions themselves to the communities of which they are comprised; you can see a huge swath of people, of every political persuasion, who identify with some pretty basic ideas. We're not trying to win elections, we're going to change the way elections are run, the whole conversation is changing. Let's not just sell 'stocks' or BitAssets, we should be selling access to the goods, the party, and freedom. As Timothy Leary famously said, "When we say party, we mean party and celebration, the old party's just no fun."
There are large swaths of people whose consciousness, and economic interests are already aligned with what BitShares represents.
The tech exists, and the toolkit is steadily evolving through the hard work of a passionate and dedicated team.
We're just beginning to push out into all manner of synergistic projects, together as a community.
Our skill in finding ways to reach, and collaborate with the right people, to grow and improve the BitShares ecosystem, is a test of perseverance and imagination at this point.
The future called, and it wants a legacy adapter... let's do this.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I'll have to disagree here. While think freedom is really important, I'll have to accept the fact that most people don't care about it.
Of course Bitshares has to be "freedom compatible", otherwise it won't be useful and wont' revolutionize anything. But using freedom as a main marketing point is just waste of time.
Freedom lovers are a tiny group, and most of them are already using bitcoin, and especially right now when the BTC is rocketing, they are not interested in questioning the foundations of Bitcoin and analyze how bad it actually is (in the long run).
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I'll have to disagree here. While think freedom is really important, I'll have to accept the fact that most people don't care about it.
Of course Bitshares has to be "freedom compatible", otherwise it won't be useful and wont' revolutionize anything. But using freedom as a main marketing point is just waste of time.
Freedom lovers are a tiny group, and most of them are already using bitcoin, and especially right now when the BTC is rocketing, they are not interested in questioning the foundations of Bitcoin and analyze how bad it actually is (in the long run).
So I am a normal guy with a bank account, debit card and a PayPal account.
And I use my PayPal account (or my debit card) 2-3 times a month to pay for the stuff I buy online and it looks like a free service for me.
(It looks like this because the fess are hidden from me and even if I'm smart and I know that ultimately I pay for the fees - as they are just factored in the price of the product I'm buying - I don't really care because altogether the fees cost me less than $3 per month)
If we skip the freedom part - what's the big deal for me to convince me to dump PayPal (or debit card) and start using bitUSD / bitEUR / bitCNY instead?
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I'll have to disagree here. While think freedom is really important, I'll have to accept the fact that most people don't care about it.
Of course Bitshares has to be "freedom compatible", otherwise it won't be useful and wont' revolutionize anything. But using freedom as a main marketing point is just waste of time.
Freedom lovers are a tiny group, and most of them are already using bitcoin, and especially right now when the BTC is rocketing, they are not interested in questioning the foundations of Bitcoin and analyze how bad it actually is (in the long run).
So I am a normal guy with a bank account, debit card and a PayPal account.
And I use my PayPal (or a debit card) account 2-3 times a month to pay for the stuff I buy online and it looks like a free service for me.
(It looks like this because the fess are hidden from me and even if I'm smart and I know that ultimately I pay for the fees - as they are just factored in the price of the product I'm buying - I don't really care because altogether the fees cost me less than $3 per month)
If we skip the freedom part - what's the big deal for me to convince me to dump PayPal (or debit card) and start using bitUSD / bitEUR / bitCNY instead?
merchants. they pay less fees overall for smartcoins and can earn via referral program = they can offer discounts.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I'll have to disagree here. While think freedom is really important, I'll have to accept the fact that most people don't care about it.
Of course Bitshares has to be "freedom compatible", otherwise it won't be useful and wont' revolutionize anything. But using freedom as a main marketing point is just waste of time.
Freedom lovers are a tiny group, and most of them are already using bitcoin, and especially right now when the BTC is rocketing, they are not interested in questioning the foundations of Bitcoin and analyze how bad it actually is (in the long run).
So I am a normal guy with a bank account, debit card and a PayPal account.
And I use my PayPal (or a debit card) account 2-3 times a month to pay for the stuff I buy online and it looks like a free service for me.
(It looks like this because the fess are hidden from me and even if I'm smart and I know that ultimately I pay for the fees - as they are just factored in the price of the product I'm buying - I don't really care because altogether the fees cost me less than $3 per month)
If we skip the freedom part - what's the big deal for me to convince me to dump PayPal (or debit card) and start using bitUSD / bitEUR / bitCNY instead?
merchants. they pay less fees overall for smartcoins and can earn via referral program = they can offer discounts.
Yes, I agree. For merchants it is a big deal.
But for me, the consumer, only the freedom part is the big deal.
And that is not bad news. If only 3-5% of online consumers do care about freedom - we are in a big business. Much bigger than bitcoin is now.
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Yes, I agree. For merchants it is a big deal.
But for me, the consumer, only the freedom part is the big deal.
And that is not bad news. If only 3-5% of online consumers do care about freedom - we are in a big business. Much bigger than bitcoin is now.
I agree, the freedom part is important.
but for me as consumer it's far more interesting to save 5-10% on a product.
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but for me as consumer it's far more interesting to save 5-10% on a product.
You won't save this much, no merchant will ever give you this much discount for paying with SmartCoin.
You could though earn this 5-10% if you keep doing what you are doing already - selling the freedom concept to new users via the referral program.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I'll have to disagree here. While think freedom is really important, I'll have to accept the fact that most people don't care about it.
Of course Bitshares has to be "freedom compatible", otherwise it won't be useful and wont' revolutionize anything. But using freedom as a main marketing point is just waste of time.
Freedom lovers are a tiny group, and most of them are already using bitcoin, and especially right now when the BTC is rocketing, they are not interested in questioning the foundations of Bitcoin and analyze how bad it actually is (in the long run).
So I am a normal guy with a bank account, debit card and a PayPal account.
And I use my PayPal account (or my debit card) 2-3 times a month to pay for the stuff I buy online and it looks like a free service for me.
(It looks like this because the fess are hidden from me and even if I'm smart and I know that ultimately I pay for the fees - as they are just factored in the price of the product I'm buying - I don't really care because altogether the fees cost me less than $3 per month)
If we skip the freedom part - what's the big deal for me to convince me to dump PayPal (or debit card) and start using bitUSD / bitEUR / bitCNY instead?
The Bitcoin price is going to become distorted at some point -- maybe sooner rather than later...
like the London (UK) and New York residential housing markets that are the "depositories" of copious amounts of "hot money"
that need laundering and a safe haven...
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-02/bitcoin-more-doubles-2015-lows-chinese-ignore-easing-capital-controls
"... however if a few hundred million Chinese decide that the time has come to use bitcoin as the capital controls
bypassing currency of choice, and decide to invest even a tiny fraction of the $22 trillion in Chinese deposits in bitcoin
(whose total market cap at last check was just over $3 billion), sit back and watch as we witness the second coming of the
bitcoin bubble..."
But is this really a reliable launching pad upon which to build a foundation for a renaissance of the Bitcoin ecosphere?
If so, by definition it would be counter to the decentralization ethos and effectively become a potential single point of
failure..
I think BitShares just needs to make ONE feature/aspect/use case that grabs the attention of the mainstream and they
will discover the rest of the benefits themselves...
e,g Can you imagine for example if a company provided an option to its employees to have a percentage of their
paycheck direct deposited into a basket of bitAssets, instead of just a checking account or 401(k)
or Pension funds not having to rely on such "venerable" institutions as JPMorgan Chase, Goldman Sachs etc...or worse, end up like the employees of Enron..(at retirement age)
If BitShares could demonstrate a real world practical demonstration to show how organizations & situations like this
for example
http://ouroregon.org/millions-in-management-fees-mean-lower-returns-on-investments-and-bigger-paydays-for-banks/
can use what BitShares has to offer....Many other people, institutions, media, academia, businesses, students, etc. will discover all the other BitShares features, benefits and technology....
and the BTS market price will never look back..
Just the thoughts of an average Joe..
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There are tons of Bitcoin whales who have more BTC than our total marketcap. If they decide to put a small portion of their portfolio into BitShares we'll be soaring, and this is only more so the higher Bitcoin goes.
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How do I promote bitshares? Do I walk into a bar and say "You should use bitshares because (I have no idea what to say here)". Same thing with other merchants and business's. How can they use this? Why would they use this instead or along with bitcoin?
For me it's quite simple. There are two distinct customer groups:
(1) online merchants - they need to be attracted by financial reasons: we have no charge-backs and we are significantly cheaper - due to the referral program having BTS as a system for receiving payments can mean a net income rather than 2% cost (as is the case with legacy systems).
(2) online consumers - they will come to BTS for lifestyle reasons, financial reasons won't work here because if you spend less than $5 / month for transaction fees you are not price sensitive.
This is what BM points out and I fully agree with it:
BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Start using phrases like "financial independence". Most people understand and desire to be financially independent. Using vague words like "freedom" isn't going to work so well in marketing.
Bitshares can help people become financially independent if it is designed right. If it doesn't help people to become financially independent then it will not have many use cases and will be hard to market.
The referral program, the potential for yield, dividends, interest, all which could be compounded, the potential for equity crowd funding, that is how you bring equity ownership to the masses and the "freedom" of being financially independent as an end result of it.
Appealing to merchants and customers is the wrong way to go about it. Merchants don't need to be directly appealed to because they'll adopt it if enough people ask them to, and customers don't really matter if they don't have the goal of joining the Bitshares economy and intention of becoming financially independent.
So why not promote the memes of financial independence, in a non-ideological way, from a pure mathematics, numbers, economics kind of way. To promote the ability of the saver to save, to promote the ability of the investor to invest, and to allow participants to generate life long passive income streams as a result, streams which can compound over time as the Bitshares supply decreases and the price increases.
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Yes, I agree. For merchants it is a big deal.
But for me, the consumer, only the freedom part is the big deal.
And that is not bad news. If only 3-5% of online consumers do care about freedom - we are in a big business. Much bigger than bitcoin is now.
I agree, the freedom part is important.
but for me as consumer it's far more interesting to save 5-10% on a product.
You're not interested in equity crowd funding? In achieving financial independence for yourself and your family?
If you cannot sustain yourself without employment then you're not financially independent. If you're able to get a few thousand $ a month from the blockchain then you're financially independent. Bitshares is the one blockchain which can offer this as a feature, the feature is the ability to achieve financial independence indirectly, not through features of Bitshares or the Bitshares price rise, but through holding the proper portfolio of UIAs, private assets, smart coins, bonds, etc, or by being a referrer, a witness, etc.
As you see, the people who work hard, or who work smart, or who invest wisely, can have a chance to achieve the new American dream of financial independence facilitated by blockchain technology. Bitshares should be marketed to people who want to be digital nomads, who want financial independence, who want to work directly for a blockchain.
Avoid politics, avoid vague words like freedom, avoid dividing people by talking about libertarian ideals, or crypto-anarchism, or Bytemasters master plan. People want to achieve similar goals, we all have similar dreams, but we all come from different backgrounds, different ideological outlooks, different philosophy on life, and we should avoid that which can divide people in marketing and put only what can bring people together.
Financial independence is something every reasonable person should want and we just have to show reasonable people how they can achieve financial independence through Bitshares, with some examples of people who are working at achieving it. Maybe someone should set up blogs showing how they invest through Bitshares and share their success. This way you market Bitshares to the people who want financial independence but who never thought it was possible to achieve through blockchains.
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Yes, I agree. For merchants it is a big deal.
But for me, the consumer, only the freedom part is the big deal.
And that is not bad news. If only 3-5% of online consumers do care about freedom - we are in a big business. Much bigger than bitcoin is now.
I agree, the freedom part is important.
but for me as consumer it's far more interesting to save 5-10% on a product.
5-10% annual yield is the best marketing Bitshares 2.0 can have. Find some Bitasset which is giving 5-10% annual yield or interest and Bitshares will become trivially easy to market at that point. Simply set up a blog showing step by step how you're gaining 5-10% in annual yield through Bitshares in a way which is of low risk and suddenly millions of dollars will flow into Bitshares.
Asset producers, and people planning to start businesses, you should consider going the route of equity crowd funding. Think about how you can actually use Bitshares in the launch of your new business, and how you can distribute equity to the Bitshares community so that you promote the success of Bitshares.
Decentralized equity crowd funding is as big as Open Bazaar. Bitshares 2.0 has the technical capability to issue legally recognized equity crowd funding opportunities. Tokens can be put out as UIAs, which can then later be redeemed for actual shares in companies. That bridge feature is big and important enough that you could bring billions of dollars into Bitshares just through that.
In times of adversity the community should pull itself together by distributing greater stakes. Shared stake is a mechanism which can pull people together through shared self interest. Keep the current community from splitting or members from leaving by offering enough perks and enough equity that their dreams of financial independence outweigh the fear of missing out on the rise of Bitcoin, some stock, or some altcoin.
Bitshares makes it trivially easy to interconnect a community through equity stake. Use the power of Bitshares and do not sell your stash so quickly because you could regret it as the people who sold their Bitcoins probably regret it.
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5-10% yield possible through Bond markets? How much does polonieux offer?
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5-10% yield possible through Bond markets? How much does polonieux offer?
Sometimes yield can be as high as 12% a year in some markets so it's a matter of letting people offer yield, and offer UIAs which offer the kinds of yields, dividends and other attractors which bring people in. I don't know if polonieux offers any yield at all but if Bitshares has yield then it can attract liquidity.
Bees are attracted to flower pollen. The best advertisement is successful investors.
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So Bond markets is our answer?
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So Bond markets is our answer?
Part of it. UIAs could do it right now without the bond market though. What stops a UIA from paying dividends?
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Speaking of equity crowd funding... check out this article. Everything just got a whole lot easier in the United States. All we have to do is have the SEC's portals use bitshares as the back end and we are golden.
http://venturebeat.com/2015/11/02/the-secs-new-685-page-crowdfunding-rules-what-you-need-to-know/?mc_cid=088b36d774&mc_eid=e6fb7875f5
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The reason why this really sucks is because bitcoin is rising so strongly... It makes us feel like idiots because we tried to be the smartest guys in the room and pick an alternative currency because we thought we had an inside track.
When I told my friends and family that I was investing in bitcoin, they thought I was an idiot destined to lose all my money. I didn't tell them I invested in bitshares, since they don't know the difference. All they know is it is some digital money.
Now they see bitcoin rising like an absolute monster while getting tons of media attention. They go to me "Wow! you invest in the bitcoins right? You must be doing awesome! Tell me more about these things!"
Little do they know that I actually bought into some other thing not bitcoin... A thing similar but not the same that has lost tremendous value since I bought it. So here we are. We were right on the story that crypto would become immensely valuable, but somehow we managed to go broke in the process...That is the ultimate kick in the nuts!
I am happy to see you burned.hahahhaa.
sb.
It's good to see that you can be happy about someting :)
You guys are really happy.
:P :P :P
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Freedom lovers are a tiny group, and most of them are already using bitcoin, and especially right now when the BTC is rocketing, they are not interested in questioning the foundations of Bitcoin and analyze how bad it actually is (in the long run).
Lol. Do you honestly think Bitcoin has a monopoly on freedom lovers? Whatever you define 'freedom lovers' as I have no idea, but i guarantee that libertarians and anarchists comprise a radically small percentage of the global 'freedom lover' population.
Think how many trillions of dollars are floating around between people who still have no idea what crypto is.
You do realize the global economy has virtually no idea that crypro even exists right? It's not even a blip.
There's quite a bubble here, and it's not an economic one, It's a crypto-fintech thought bubble.
You can sell freedom in a lot of different packages to a lot of different people... Watch any commercial on TV, they are selling freedom in one form or another. That beer commercial with the summer sun and the pickup trucks? Freedom lovers. That coca-cola commercial? Sexy freedom lovers. Let's expand our definitions, and our potential audience. We mustn't fall prey to operating within the same narrow confines which created this mess to begin with. YNTTBP!
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Part of it. UIAs could do it right now without the bond market though. What stops a UIA from paying dividends?
[/quote]
Transaction fees. Thats why we went for buy back instead of dividends.
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So Bond markets is our answer?
Part of it. UIAs could do it right now without the bond market though. What stops a UIA from paying dividends?
Nothing. What stops a UIA from not even looking like a UIA and paying 'rewards points' to customers?
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Can somebody issue an asset which is pegged to BTS such that we could short it when the price plummet next time?
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Yes, I agree. For merchants it is a big deal.
But for me, the consumer, only the freedom part is the big deal.
And that is not bad news. If only 3-5% of online consumers do care about freedom - we are in a big business. Much bigger than bitcoin is now.
I agree, the freedom part is important.
but for me as consumer it's far more interesting to save 5-10% on a product.
You're not interested in equity crowd funding? In achieving financial independence for yourself and your family?
If you cannot sustain yourself without employment then you're not financially independent. If you're able to get a few thousand $ a month from the blockchain then you're financially independent. Bitshares is the one blockchain which can offer this as a feature, the feature is the ability to achieve financial independence indirectly, not through features of Bitshares or the Bitshares price rise, but through holding the proper portfolio of UIAs, private assets, smart coins, bonds, etc, or by being a referrer, a witness, etc.
As you see, the people who work hard, or who work smart, or who invest wisely, can have a chance to achieve the new American dream of financial independence facilitated by blockchain technology. Bitshares should be marketed to people who want to be digital nomads, who want financial independence, who want to work directly for a blockchain.
Avoid politics, avoid vague words like freedom, avoid dividing people by talking about libertarian ideals, or crypto-anarchism, or Bytemasters master plan. People want to achieve similar goals, we all have similar dreams, but we all come from different backgrounds, different ideological outlooks, different philosophy on life, and we should avoid that which can divide people in marketing and put only what can bring people together.
Financial independence is something every reasonable person should want and we just have to show reasonable people how they can achieve financial independence through Bitshares, with some examples of people who are working at achieving it. Maybe someone should set up blogs showing how they invest through Bitshares and share their success. This way you market Bitshares to the people who want financial independence but who never thought it was possible to achieve through blockchains.
Wow... rant well stated! +5%
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Part of it. UIAs could do it right now without the bond market though. What stops a UIA from paying dividends?
Transaction fees. Thats why we went for buy back instead of dividends.
[/quote]
Becoming a security is what stops it I thought. Then becoming subject to all kinds of regulatory issues. Transaction fees might be an issue also.
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Yes, I agree. For merchants it is a big deal.
But for me, the consumer, only the freedom part is the big deal.
And that is not bad news. If only 3-5% of online consumers do care about freedom - we are in a big business. Much bigger than bitcoin is now.
I agree, the freedom part is important.
but for me as consumer it's far more interesting to save 5-10% on a product.
You're not interested in equity crowd funding? In achieving financial independence for yourself and your family?
If you cannot sustain yourself without employment then you're not financially independent. If you're able to get a few thousand $ a month from the blockchain then you're financially independent. Bitshares is the one blockchain which can offer this as a feature, the feature is the ability to achieve financial independence indirectly, not through features of Bitshares or the Bitshares price rise, but through holding the proper portfolio of UIAs, private assets, smart coins, bonds, etc, or by being a referrer, a witness, etc.
As you see, the people who work hard, or who work smart, or who invest wisely, can have a chance to achieve the new American dream of financial independence facilitated by blockchain technology. Bitshares should be marketed to people who want to be digital nomads, who want financial independence, who want to work directly for a blockchain.
Avoid politics, avoid vague words like freedom, avoid dividing people by talking about libertarian ideals, or crypto-anarchism, or Bytemasters master plan. People want to achieve similar goals, we all have similar dreams, but we all come from different backgrounds, different ideological outlooks, different philosophy on life, and we should avoid that which can divide people in marketing and put only what can bring people together.
Financial independence is something every reasonable person should want and we just have to show reasonable people how they can achieve financial independence through Bitshares, with some examples of people who are working at achieving it. Maybe someone should set up blogs showing how they invest through Bitshares and share their success. This way you market Bitshares to the people who want financial independence but who never thought it was possible to achieve through blockchains.
Wow... rant well stated! +5%
I completely agree with BCL and luckybit. That was articulated very well, and I will think about it the next time I'm inclined to spout off with my philosophical perspective. As usual luckybit, you make me think! +5%
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5-10% annual yield is the best marketing Bitshares 2.0 can have. Find some Bitasset which is giving 5-10% annual yield or interest and Bitshares will become trivially easy to market at that point. Simply set up a blog showing step by step how you're gaining 5-10% in annual yield through Bitshares in a way which is of low risk and suddenly millions of dollars will flow into Bitshares.
+5% +5% +5%
Best incentive for people to hold bitAssets. People go wherever there's free money.
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BTS needs to be promoted as a tool of freedom that it is. It needs to develop its own mini economy of people that are passionate about a common goal.
Unfortunately, growing a community in such a manner is much slower than most would like.
I'll have to disagree here. While think freedom is really important, I'll have to accept the fact that most people don't care about it.
Of course Bitshares has to be "freedom compatible", otherwise it won't be useful and wont' revolutionize anything. But using freedom as a main marketing point is just waste of time.
Freedom lovers are a tiny group, and most of them are already using bitcoin, and especially right now when the BTC is rocketing, they are not interested in questioning the foundations of Bitcoin and analyze how bad it actually is (in the long run).
+5% +5%.
"Freedom" , a great goal, but a very very bad marketing ploy. Bitshares needs a heavy weight marketing team at the level of our great heavy weight dev team.
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Transaction fees. Thats why we went for buy back instead of dividends.
Buyback still is fine but if transactions fees are an issue then how will the bond market work?
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So Bond markets is our answer?
Part of it. UIAs could do it right now without the bond market though. What stops a UIA from paying dividends?
Nothing. What stops a UIA from not even looking like a UIA and paying 'rewards points' to customers?
And that is what we need. People want financial independence. Freedom is a vague concept while financial independence is practical, you can touch it, it is quantifiable, it's real.
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Part of it. UIAs could do it right now without the bond market though. What stops a UIA from paying dividends?
Transaction fees. Thats why we went for buy back instead of dividends.
Becoming a security is what stops it I thought. Then becoming subject to all kinds of regulatory issues. Transaction fees might be an issue also.
The laws just changed on that. It's now a possible route to follow the new legislation and become a security. It's also tax free in Europe so it's actually a good time and legally the landscape is now in favor of securities on Bitshares.
While I'm not a lawyer and don't know all the paperwork, I know it is now possible to start down that path. Equity crowd funding is now realistic. Although in the case of Metaexchange it might not actually be desirable because that is an all crypto exchange.
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19607.0.html
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Part of it. UIAs could do it right now without the bond market though. What stops a UIA from paying dividends?
Transaction fees. Thats why we went for buy back instead of dividends.
Becoming a security is what stops it I thought. Then becoming subject to all kinds of regulatory issues. Transaction fees might be an issue also.
The laws just changed on that. It's now a possible route to follow the new legislation and become a security. It's also tax free in Europe so it's actually a good time and legally the landscape is now in favor of securities on Bitshares.
While I'm not a lawyer and don't know all the paperwork, I know it is now possible to start down that path. Equity crowd funding is now realistic. Although in the case of Metaexchange it might not actually be desirable because that is an all crypto exchange.
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19607.0.html
While the barrier has been lowered, you are still looking at approx $10k in legal work and there is still the need to be compliant. I was having a conversation today about crowdfunding with the blockchain today with investors... they know all about this and just want to see if anybody out there is actually doing this and is compliant. I only know of gemspace.net... but there isn't anything public to indicate how it is going with that.