BitShares Forum
Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: JonnyB on January 21, 2016, 12:09:53 am
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Forced settlement is an essential function of smartcoins it is a function that gives guaranteed liquidity at feed price for sellers.
at 23:56pm UTC 20th jan a bts account named BRENTALLSOP had over 10k bitusd force settled at feed price.
I had a buy order for 10k in bitusd at just over feed price. Why didn't our orders match?
If they had matched , BRENTALLSOP would have got a better price. 10k of bitusd wouldn't have been destoyed, loads of creators of bitusd wouldn't have just had their position liquidated. And I would have got some cheap bitusd.
the exchange engine needs to be updated so orders like this will get matched in the future.
(http://i.imgur.com/gwU4PFb.png)
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
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Brent has been around for a long time... I'm guessing he was in at much higher levels and is just cutting his losses. Really too bad as he was pretty active too...
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
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Brent has been around for a long time... I'm guessing he was in at much higher levels and is just cutting his losses. Really too bad as he was pretty active too...
You understand that by settling bitusd you are actually buying. so brent was actually purchasing $10k worth of bts.
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
my order price of 322 is still there and you can see on the blockchain that it was there at 12:56 when the feed price was lower
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
my order price of 322 is still there and you can see on the blockchain that it was there at 12:56 when the feed price was lower
He settled about 24h ago.
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
my order price of 322 is still there and you can see on the blockchain that it was there at 12:56 when the feed price was lower
He settled about 24h ago.
He requested settlement 24hrs ago yes but the settlement occurred an hour ago. look at his account it says order filled at 321
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
my order price of 322 is still there and you can see on the blockchain that it was there at 12:56 when the feed price was lower
He settled about 24h ago.
He requested settlement 24hrs ago yes but the settlement occurred an hour ago. look at his account it says order filled at 321
You may misunderstand about settlement. It has no relationship with buy orders.
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
my order price of 322 is still there and you can see on the blockchain that it was there at 12:56 when the feed price was lower
He settled about 24h ago.
He requested settlement 24hrs ago yes but the settlement occurred an hour ago. look at his account it says order filled at 321
You may misunderstand about settlement. It has no relationship with buy orders.
I understand settlement well.
His order to force settle was filled at 23:56 24hrs after he requested settlement.
It is equivalent to a bts buy order which you know will execute in 24hrs at feed price with guaranteed liquidity.
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
my order price of 322 is still there and you can see on the blockchain that it was there at 12:56 when the feed price was lower
He settled about 24h ago.
He requested settlement 24hrs ago yes but the settlement occurred an hour ago. look at his account it says order filled at 321
You may misunderstand about settlement. It has no relationship with buy orders.
I understand settlement well.
His order to force settle was filled at 23:56 24hrs after he requested settlement.
It is equivalent to a bts buy order which you know will execute in 24hrs at feed price with guaranteed liquidity.
It buys BTS collateral of lowest shorts, not BTS on the orderbook.
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It settles $10k short positions from the bottom collateral level. Buy orders never be matched.
Well there is no reason it shouldn't it shouldn't take any buy ordrers that are above the feed price first is there?
As far as I saw, there were no orders over the feed price when he settled bitUSD.
my order price of 322 is still there and you can see on the blockchain that it was there at 12:56 when the feed price was lower
He settled about 24h ago.
He requested settlement 24hrs ago yes but the settlement occurred an hour ago. look at his account it says order filled at 321
You may misunderstand about settlement. It has no relationship with buy orders.
I understand settlement well.
His order to force settle was filled at 23:56 24hrs after he requested settlement.
It is equivalent to a bts buy order which you know will execute in 24hrs at feed price with guaranteed liquidity.
It buys BTS collateral of lowest shorts, not BTS on the orderbook.
If you create smartcoin it is not always a short. it is only a short if you sell your newly created smartcoin.
when a smartcoin is force settled it takes the equivalent value in bts from the the lowest collateralised smartcoin and returns the remaining bts collateral to the smartcoin creator.
This is how it currently works and I understand it. What I am saying is that the system should check for any buy orders that are higher than the feed price first before taking collateral from the smartcoin creators. This way everyone wins.
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It buys BTS collateral of lowest shorts, not BTS on the orderbook.
Is there any reason why the system should not check the order book first, and if there are better offers than settlement price, take them first, then go buy lowest collateral? It would really seem to be a good deal for everybody.
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Yeah, Brent's been in BitShares since before me. He was trying to get us all to go in on his consensus work, remember? Glad he's still trading.
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It buys BTS collateral of lowest shorts, not BTS on the orderbook.
Is there any reason why the system should not check the order book first, and if there are better offers than settlement price, take them first, then go buy lowest collateral? It would really seem to be a good deal for everybody.
If I'm not mistaken I believe this is how orders were matched in BitShares 1. I don't recall the rationale for the change ATM.
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Brent has been around for a long time... I'm guessing he was in at much higher levels and is just cutting his losses. Really too bad as he was pretty active too...
You understand that by settling bitusd you are actually buying. so brent was actually purchasing $10k worth of bts.
Judging by his previous transfers, over 11 million bts sent to poloniexwallet, he is leaving bitshares. I know he was the main jpy bitasset holder so it's not surprising to see a big usd position. I'm guessing these 3.2 million shares he just received are going to poloniex very shortly.
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if i understand it correct it was "forced settled" and not margin called?
force settle means someone sells his USD for the feedprice and the least collaterized has to buy this sell order. so it is logic that your order will not be matched, because
the order has already a seller and a buyer.
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if i understand it correct it was "forced settled" and not margin called?
force settle means someone sells his USD for the feedprice and the least collaterized has to buy this sell order. so it is logic that your order will not be matched, because
the order has already a seller and a buyer.
Yes this was allsop using a settle order to convert USD he was holding into BTS at the feed price. Like you say this will not match buy orders on the orderbook because that's how it was designed. I saw that happen a few days ago as well where someone settled ~0.3 BTC and got a far worse price than what they'd gotten for just selling on the open market.
Perhaps making the settle order walk the orderbook until it hits the feed price is too complicated to implement, but there's definitely a case for having it do that rather than simply ignoring the orderbook.
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It buys BTS collateral of lowest shorts, not BTS on the orderbook.
Is there any reason why the system should not check the order book first, and if there are better offers than settlement price, take them first, then go buy lowest collateral? It would really seem to be a good deal for everybody.
The reason is no fund provided for develop this change, and/or no enough priority.
If you create smartcoin it is not always a short. it is only a short if you sell your newly created smartcoin.
when a smartcoin is force settled it takes the equivalent value in bts from the the lowest collateralised smartcoin and returns the remaining bts collateral to the smartcoin creator.
This is how it currently works and I understand it. What I am saying is that the system should check for any buy orders that are higher than the feed price first before taking collateral from the smartcoin creators. This way everyone wins.
Next time you can just borrow some USD first and keep you collateral ratio low, then sit there until your position are settled. No difference except that you'll get an even better deal.
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if i understand it correct it was "forced settled" and not margin called?
force settle means someone sells his USD for the feedprice and the least collaterized has to buy this sell order. so it is logic that your order will not be matched, because
the order has already a seller and a buyer.
Yes this was allsop using a settle order to convert USD he was holding into BTS at the feed price. Like you say this will not match buy orders on the orderbook because that's how it was designed. I saw that happen a few days ago as well where someone settled ~0.3 BTC and got a far worse price than what they'd gotten for just selling on the open market.
Perhaps making the settle order walk the orderbook until it hits the feed price is too complicated to implement, but there's definitely a case for having it do that rather than simply ignoring the orderbook.
Walking the order book up to a given price is a feature that is already there .. people not using it is their own fault ..
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no, force settle shouldn't used usually
we don't need give the force settle order the best price.
In fact we should ask for a compensate from the force settle, give the compensate to shorters.
don't waste any time to develop this.
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no, force settle shouldn't used usually
we don't need give the force settle order the best price.
In fact we should ask for a compensate from the force settle, give the compensate to shorters.
don't waste any time to develop this.
This!!
If we hadn't advertise bitUSD to be redemable for AT LEAST $1 .. I would even recommend to let settlement pay 1% for settlements .. anyway .. that opportunity is gone now
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no, force settle shouldn't used usually
we don't need give the force settle order the best price.
In fact we should ask for a compensate from the force settle, give the compensate to shorters.
don't waste any time to develop this.
you wouldn't have to compensate the shorters if buy orders were used first because the smartcoins wouldn't have been destroyed/extinguished
if liquidity and volume is one of our biggest problems sure this would make sense because it stops the destruction of smartcoins?