BitShares Forum
Main => General Discussion => Topic started by: jwalker99 on June 08, 2017, 11:44:09 pm
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Surely someone can beat poloniex, frugal as they are, with the loan rates as they are now. Is it possible to deposit bitcoin into the bitshares platform -- short bitshares -- and exit, without holding bitshares? If this is possible, there is a very large market for bitshares, if not, how can it make a splash?
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Hi,
No you can't
You can short any Smartcoin. by borrow it and then sell it in the market.
So you can short BTC GOLD USD HERO and more...
BTW: where can I find full list on smartcoins.
http://cryptofresh.com/assets (http://cryptofresh.com/assets) main assets page show some of the smartcoins as UIA !
You need to enter to the assets page to see that is not UIA
for example:
http://cryptofresh.com/a/HERO (http://cryptofresh.com/a/HERO)
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If you find some witness (how many?) that willing to publish feed on a new Smartcoin "ShortBTS".
ShortBTS price reflect the value in BTS of:
-1 * BTS price in USA at 1-Jun-2017 (date of isse) / BTS price in USA today
It may be possible.
You borrow ShortBTS sell then, and buy BitUSD.
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But then you'd had to find people willing to short ShortBTS into existence, using real BTS as collateral... why would they do that when simply holding BTS results in bigger gains when BTS goes up, and less risk when BTS goes down?
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But then you'd had to find people willing to short ShortBTS into existence, using real BTS as collateral... why would they do that when simply holding BTS results in bigger gains when BTS goes up, and less risk when BTS goes down?
But wouldn't shorting ShortBTS with BTS as collateral basically double your exposure to BTS? If BTS goes up, ShortBTS goes down. By shorting ShortBTS, I'm betting that BTS is going to go up. If BTS goes up, then so does my collateral, and I additionally get to buy back the ShortBTS at a lower price.
Right?
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But then you'd had to find people willing to short ShortBTS into existence, using real BTS as collateral... why would they do that when simply holding BTS results in bigger gains when BTS goes up, and less risk when BTS goes down?
But wouldn't shorting ShortBTS with BTS as collateral basically double your exposure to BTS? If BTS goes up, ShortBTS goes down. By shorting ShortBTS, I'm betting that BTS is going to go up. If BTS goes up, then so does my collateral, and I additionally get to buy back the ShortBTS at a lower price.
Right?
You're totally right. This indeed would be an interesting calculated bitasset.
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It wouldn't exactly double, though. It would increase your exposure by a maximum of how many ShortBTS you shorted.
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Niice.
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I remember a long time ago I used to trade "short" ETFs on the stock market, and there's a problem with them- they continually diminish in value over time due to how the math works out. Check this out:
http://monevator.com/short-etf-maths/
I'm not sure if this is an issue here, but we should make sure that it's not.
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I remember a long time ago I used to trade "short" ETFs on the stock market, and there's a problem with them- they continually diminish in value over time due to how the math works out. Check this out:
http://monevator.com/short-etf-maths/
I'm not sure if this is an issue here, but we should make sure that it's not.
Yeah, I remember reading about that somewhere too. I thought it was because of management costs, but the article you linked is saying it's a fundamental mathematical thing... Makes sense, I think. I wonder if the price feeds could be adjusted to accomodate for that? Short ETFs are tuned to deliver inverse daily returns, but maybe you could tune it instead to deliver inverse returns on a longer timescale.
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There could be a mechanism to slowly replenish the ShortBTS price to a maximum price to compensate for the gradual scale-down. We would need to engineer this very carefully though.
It reminds me a bit of signal processing, correcting DC offset of a sound wave:
http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/dc_offset.html
Except, this would have a variable "DC offset" and it would need to adjust it malleably.