BitShares Forum
Main => Stakeholder Proposals => Topic started by: Thul3 on June 20, 2020, 12:25:00 am
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BAIP8(https://github.com/bitshares/baips/blob/master/baip-0008.md) is a new drafted proposal that consist reduce of bitcny price threshold from 0.22 cny to 0.154 cny
Now 2 poll workers have been created:
1.14.264 Poll-BAIP8-Implement new threshold for bitcny at 0.154CNY
1.14.265 Poll-BAIP8-Do Not Implement new threshold for bitcny
According to BAIP procedure definition, the BAIP8 will be considered approved while below 3 criteria are met:
1.worker 1.14.264 get more voting power than 1.14.265 worker.
2.worker 1.14.264 get more voting power than BAIP-Threshold Worker 1.14.236.
3.Both No.1 & 2 above last for three consecutive days.
BAIP: 0008 Title: Reduce of price threshold by 30% for bitcny Authors: b-dex Status: Accepted Type: Consensus Created: 2020-06-20
Abstract
The purpose of this proposal is to get bitcny full pegg back and make bitshares dex back attractive to traders
Specification
Bitcny and Bitusd has been put a price feed threshold to stop the negative effects of price manipulations on CEX.
Since then volume and interrest on trading on these both bitassets have sunk dramaticly.
To get back interest for the bitcny there is an opportunity to get the pegg back by reducing the threshold by 30%.
Currently all debtors who are shorting bitcny have a CR of 2.6 or higher.
This means reducing the threshold by 30% their CR will fall to 1.8.
There will be no margin calls and noone is going to lose a single BTS.
This way bitcny gets back its full value and the market gets attractive again to be used for trading.
BitUSD has currently not the opportunity because their CR is way lower than at bitcny debtors.
Operation
3 days after getting the BAIP proposal approved all witnesses change at 10 pm UCT time the price feed threshold for bitcny from
0.22 bitcny/bts to 0.154 bitcny/bts.
Please vote according to your opinion.
BAIP8(https://github.com/bitshares/baips/blob/master/baip-0008.md)
(https://i.imgur.com/MMNXPBM.jpg)
Please note the 2 debtors under CR of 2.6 also have enough BTS to increase their CR to above 2.6 but are currently so low fighting between each other to catch the force settlements.
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P.S reducing bitcny threshold by 30% will reduce peoples CR from 2.6+ to 1.8+ .
Also reducing bitcny threshold by 30% will set the threshold at 0.154 bitcny or $0.0217 which at current price on CEX means that bitcny would have its pegg fully restored.
Since new threshold price would be at 0.154 bitcny and current real price is arround 0.17 cny it means the CR as of today would only fall from 2.6+ to 1.98+
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Great. I'll back you up
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一个愿意思考的老外，但是中国社区不会同意的，除了我。
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一个愿意思考的老外，但是中国社区不会同意的，除了我。
CN-VOTE不能代表中国社区，中国社区的名声不能让他们毁了。
But why still retain the threshold，not to remove it thoroughly? even BAIP2 is not so good, but with it any price threshold can't hold up.
and i think BAIP/BSIP threshold(as they didn't get the approve) is not suitable, we can use WPS vote system(get fully day pay) as temporary passing criteria.
这个投票阈值有问题，因为这个投票阈值设计就没有经过BTS持有人投票通过过……极易被操控。
所以前期所有的BAIP/BSIP投票都应当重新审视，而且需要重新设计一套阈值机制来保证投票系统不被作弊操控与保证最低投票率。
而且现在喂价已经从见证人身上剥离了，迄今为止没有落地方案，都在靠爱发电，理事会很容易就可以操控喂价机制。
总而言之的话:
1.不采用现在的BAIP/BSIP阈值设计(因为它们没有投票生效过)，临时采用WPS足额工资制作为通过标准;
2.喂价回归见证人; 这个是后话了。喂价剥离也没有经过bts持有人投票同意。
1.I suggest don't use BAIP/BSIP threshold(as they didn't get the approve), we can use WPS vote system(get fully day pay) as temporary passing criteria.
2.Restore the feed price to Wittness after this vote.
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It could be doable if force-settlement is disabled or force-settlement parameters are adjusted significantly at the same time, otherwise it will be gamed.
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It could be doable if force-settlement is disabled or force-settlement parameters are adjusted significantly at the same time, otherwise it will be gamed.
That's a detail which should be no problem to be included.
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一个愿意思考的老外，但是中国社区不会同意的，除了我。
:D我同意降低或者解锁
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Support!
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Dear community. I recommend that each of you vote against reducing the bitCNY feed to 0.154. Please go to the voting menu and check the box "Do not implement new threshold for bitcny". Voters for the reducing the bitCNY feed are slaves of the central exchanges. These are enemies of bitshares and independence of dex. Please note if your proxy voted for reducing the bitCNY feed - delete it from your proxy
Pay particular attention to the Committee Member "b-dex" - Never vote for him as a member of the committee, and if you have already voted, delete your vote and vote for the "bitcrab". bitcrab votes against reducing the bitCNY feed.
Never vote for him as your proxy - if you have already voted, delete your vote.
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At the same time, I propose to increase Force Settlement Delay to 48 hours. The risk of changing prices during this period may somewhat stop the tendency to use this feature frequently and get people to buy straight from the market.
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At the same time, I propose to increase Force Settlement Delay to 48 hours. The risk of changing prices during this period may somewhat stop the tendency to use this feature frequently and get people to buy straight from the market.
Increase force-settlement offset to 5% or more higher is the suitable way, increase Force Settlement Delay to 48 hours can't change anything, there have some trading skills in Force Settlement, offset is the main factor, time is not so important.
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do not support this, it will hurt a big group one more time.
to optimize the system, firstly need to find a chance to lower the USD threshold to be equal to that of CNY.
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do not support this, it will hurt a big group one more time.
to optimize the system, firstly need to find a chance to lower the USD threshold to be equal to that of CNY.
hurt who？show your data！
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At the same time, I propose to increase Force Settlement Delay to 48 hours. The risk of changing prices during this period may somewhat stop the tendency to use this feature frequently and get people to buy straight from the market.
Increase force-settlement offset to 5% or more higher is the suitable way, increase Force Settlement Delay to 48 hours can't change anything, there have some trading skills in Force Settlement, offset is the main factor, time is not so important.
we already had force-settlement offset at 5% level, don't you remember?
the result was that the bitCNY price fell by 5% and nothing more.
increasing the delay from 24h to 48h increases the risk. It may just be more profitable to buy at the current market price.
And if there is not enough BTS in DEX, you can always buy some from CEX
Only force settlement that exists in the world is in Steem / Hive and lasts 3.5 days. Experience teaches that maybe 24h is not enough.
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At the same time, I propose to increase Force Settlement Delay to 48 hours. The risk of changing prices during this period may somewhat stop the tendency to use this feature frequently and get people to buy straight from the market.
Increase force-settlement offset to 5% or more higher is the suitable way, increase Force Settlement Delay to 48 hours can't change anything, there have some trading skills in Force Settlement, offset is the main factor, time is not so important.
we already had force-settlement offset at 5% level, don't you remember?
the result was that the bitCNY price fell by 5% and nothing more.
increasing the delay from 24h to 48h increases the risk. It may just be more profitable to buy at the current market price.
And if there is not enough BTS in DEX, you can always buy some from CEX
Only force settlement that exists in the world is in Steem / Hive and lasts 3.5 days. Experience teaches that maybe 24h is not enough.
There didn't have any big problems in the force settlement at 5%, the price of bitcny didn't fall to 5% in the real feed price, the market also can't maintain so high discount, this is the truth in the past time, and didn't get negative feedback from the market and traders.
The higher offset will cause higher discount can't hold up, as the makerdao didn't have the force settlement, the most of stablecoins didn't have it, ok, only bts and stemmit have it，but seems they all failed...
If the settlement price is not suitable, i can settlement myself, so time is not so important, 2% offset? i can accept this loss.
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All supporters of pro-BSIP76 related WP are scammers, fact.
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
How about raising the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts？if you make this proposal，i will support you to raise the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts！That's a very exciting thing!
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
How about raising the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts？if you make this proposal，i will support you to raise the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts！That's a very exciting thing!
You misunderstood me. I do not want to increase the feed price of the bitCNY. I want to leave it at the same level - 0.22 BTS/bitCNY. The BAIP threshold is just value, which now amounts to about 500 million votes, which must be overcome in order for the reduce the bitCNY price feed to be accepted.
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
How about raising the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts？if you make this proposal，i will support you to raise the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts！That's a very exciting thing!
You misunderstood me. I do not want to increase the feed price of the bitCNY. I want to leave it at the same level - 0.22 BTS/bitCNY. The BAIP threshold is just value, which now amounts to about 500 million votes, which must be overcome in order for the reduce the bitCNY price feed to be accepted.
You want to keep scamming bitasset holders and keeping bitassets with no trust ?
That's why you want to pay dividend so people will start using again a broken token ?
Why did people left bitassets where you try them to get back with a dividend ?
You think people are so dumb to take broken bitassets in exchange for a small dividend putting their money into CN-Votes hand ?
Great joke
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
How about raising the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts？if you make this proposal，i will support you to raise the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts！That's a very exciting thing!
You misunderstood me. I do not want to increase the feed price of the bitCNY. I want to leave it at the same level - 0.22 BTS/bitCNY. The BAIP threshold is just value, which now amounts to about 500 million votes, which must be overcome in order for the reduce the bitCNY price feed to be accepted.
You want to keep scamming bitasset holders and keeping bitassets with no trust ?
That's why you want to pay dividend so people will start using again a broken token ?
Why did people left bitassets where you try them to get back with a dividend ?
You think people are so dumb to take broken bitassets in exchange for a small dividend putting their money into CN-Votes hand ?
Great joke
bit assets are not broken - feed price on CEX are fake.
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
How about raising the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts？if you make this proposal，i will support you to raise the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts！That's a very exciting thing!
You misunderstood me. I do not want to increase the feed price of the bitCNY. I want to leave it at the same level - 0.22 BTS/bitCNY. The BAIP threshold is just value, which now amounts to about 500 million votes, which must be overcome in order for the reduce the bitCNY price feed to be accepted.
You want to keep scamming bitasset holders and keeping bitassets with no trust ?
That's why you want to pay dividend so people will start using again a broken token ?
Why did people left bitassets where you try them to get back with a dividend ?
You think people are so dumb to take broken bitassets in exchange for a small dividend putting their money into CN-Votes hand ?
Great joke
bit assets are not broken - feed price on CEX are fake.
Ok if CEX prices are fake and feed price are not broken are you going to send me $0.0345 per BTS in USDT when i will send you BTS ?
I can use USDT to pay my bills.
Please also contact magicwallet for having fake price because i'm pretty sure they exchange bitcny to real cny not based on feed price but on cex price.
Tell them they are scammers and evil to bitshares because they don't use our price feed /ironie off
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
How about raising the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts？if you make this proposal，i will support you to raise the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts！That's a very exciting thing!
You misunderstood me. I do not want to increase the feed price of the bitCNY. I want to leave it at the same level - 0.22 BTS/bitCNY. The BAIP threshold is just value, which now amounts to about 500 million votes, which must be overcome in order for the reduce the bitCNY price feed to be accepted.
You want to keep scamming bitasset holders and keeping bitassets with no trust ?
That's why you want to pay dividend so people will start using again a broken token ?
Why did people left bitassets where you try them to get back with a dividend ?
You think people are so dumb to take broken bitassets in exchange for a small dividend putting their money into CN-Votes hand ?
Great joke
bit assets are not broken - feed price on CEX are fake.
Ok if CEX prices are fake and feed price are not broken are you going to send me $0.0345 per BTS in USDT when i will send you BTS ?
I can use USDT to pay my bills.
Please also contact magicwallet for having fake price because i'm pretty sure they exchange bitcny to real cny not based on feed price but on cex price.
Tell them they are scammers and evil to bitshares because they don't use our price feed /ironie off
I can not object to you, because the majority is on your side. Majority are mistaken and go the way that the CEX will show him. And this road to hell
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Now you accept a decline feed to 0.154. After a while, CEX will draw prices even lower and you will accept another reduction in the bitCNY feed. And then, by the same logic, one more and one more. This dependence on fictitious CEX prices leads to dependence on the CEX.
I am going to spend my time and write to each account that has a margin position in bitCNY, vote for raising the BAIP threshold, and set as proxy the account that votes against this initiative to reduce the bitCNY feed. I do not want to watch how CEX takes my money by killing bitshares as its direct competitor.
How about raising the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts？if you make this proposal，i will support you to raise the BAIP threshold to 10.0 bitcny/bts！That's a very exciting thing!
You misunderstood me. I do not want to increase the feed price of the bitCNY. I want to leave it at the same level - 0.22 BTS/bitCNY. The BAIP threshold is just value, which now amounts to about 500 million votes, which must be overcome in order for the reduce the bitCNY price feed to be accepted.
You want to keep scamming bitasset holders and keeping bitassets with no trust ?
That's why you want to pay dividend so people will start using again a broken token ?
Why did people left bitassets where you try them to get back with a dividend ?
You think people are so dumb to take broken bitassets in exchange for a small dividend putting their money into CN-Votes hand ?
Great joke
bit assets are not broken - feed price on CEX are fake.
Ok if CEX prices are fake and feed price are not broken are you going to send me $0.0345 per BTS in USDT when i will send you BTS ?
I can use USDT to pay my bills.
Please also contact magicwallet for having fake price because i'm pretty sure they exchange bitcny to real cny not based on feed price but on cex price.
Tell them they are scammers and evil to bitshares because they don't use our price feed /ironie off
I can not object to you, because the majority is on your side. Majority are mistaken and go the way that the CEX will show him. And this road to hell
How come majority of chinese traders left to cex ?
I see today
GDEX.BTC 2.2k bts volume
GDEX.EOS 12k bts volume
GDEX.ETH 120 bts volume
Not even having a total of 20k bts volume !
So where are your chinese traders ?At Cex ?Because there they can normaly trade without fake price feeds,without risking to lose holding in stable coins and because there is a market ,without BAIP2 which makes force settlements for stablecoins a gamble ?
Cn-Vote and bitcrab totaly destroyed the trading mechanism on bitshares.
But i'm open to hear where the traders are because i can't see them.All i see is bigger CEX wallets and a group destroying bitshares because of their ignorancy even unable to unvote a dead witness because of their pride thinking they know everything better.
Do you remember the promise of BSIP76 ?It is only temporarly to save mainly chinese community to not get rekkt because of price manipulations.
As always that promise has been broken and you are together with bitcrab planing to have it permanent.He even suggested some time ago to increase threshold together with BTS price.
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do not support this, it will hurt a big group one more time.
to optimize the system, firstly need to find a chance to lower the USD threshold to be equal to that of CNY.
Based on that comment we are going to hurt bitusd debt holders when lowering price feed of CNY.
Could you please explain how this would happen without touching the price feed of bitusd.
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do not support this, it will hurt a big group one more time.
to optimize the system, firstly need to find a chance to lower the USD threshold to be equal to that of CNY.
Based on that comment we are going to hurt bitusd debt holders when lowering price feed of CNY.
Could you please explain how this would happen without touching the price feed of bitusd.
currently the USD/CNY market rate is about 7.06(maybe not exactly, but should be close).
at that rate, 0.22CNY=0.031USD.
the 2 threshold should be equal or as close as possible. but now the USD threshold is 0.0345, as initially the 2 thresholds are set unequal due to some special concerns.
I said "lower the USD threshold", clearly said that it will definitely touch the price feed of bitUSD, the problem is to find a good chance to minimize the secondary hurting.
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@Thul3
I sincere advice you didn't need to make great efforts to fight for BTS again and again, you can return you vote to alt， let cn-vote/beos/alt/bitcrab/abit decide the future of BTS and what they want BTS to become，they can spend the money as they like，they can do whatever as they want to do.
The BTS already lost its spirit long time ago, fighting for it is a waste of time.
Sincere advice, it's not worth it!
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do not support this, it will hurt a big group one more time.
to optimize the system, firstly need to find a chance to lower the USD threshold to be equal to that of CNY.
I now changed my idea, I'd like to support this kind of proposal.
I have expected that BTS price can be up 0.22CNY without much difficulty. so bitCNY can return to peg naturally, but what happened is not what I expected.
Now although bitCNY has big supply, but it's more like a game.
reducing threshold from 0.22 to 0.154 will hurt debt position owners, but maybe this is not avoidable, and is better than continuing the offpeg.
we have hurt bitCNY holders for the future of BTS, can't we hurt debt position owners for the same?
actually I don't think it's easy to get enough voting power that support this, maybe it's better to do the same for bitUSD?
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Account "options-wallet" will no longer support bitcrab
minus 2 million votes of course not much , but still
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maybe we need to consider another kind of road to reach the target, say, reduce the threshold at 2% every week, then the threshold will be 0.15CNY 4 months later, and minimize the hurt to the debt position owners as well.
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Or I can to propose another way
No one step back
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do not support this, it will hurt a big group one more time.
to optimize the system, firstly need to find a chance to lower the USD threshold to be equal to that of CNY.
I now changed my idea, I'd like to support this kind of proposal.
I have expected that BTS price can be up 0.22CNY without much difficulty. so bitCNY can return to peg naturally, but what happened is not what I expected.
Now although bitCNY has big supply, but it's more like a game.
reducing threshold from 0.22 to 0.154 will hurt debt position owners, but maybe this is not avoidable, and is better than continuing the offpeg.
we have hurt bitCNY holders for the future of BTS, can't we hurt debt position owners for the same?
actually I don't think it's easy to get enough voting power that support this, maybe it's better to do the same for bitUSD?
Finally after we drop out of top 100 you realize that scamming BTS, bitUSD & bitCNY holders and degrading the BSIP/BAIP/Voting processes has been extremely damaging to Bitshares, great!
The answer isn't to double down on scamming via BSIP76. End the fraudulent bitasset pegs.
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I give a advice to recover the feed prices of bitusd:
Set the temporary feed price= X*0.0345 +Y*（bts/bitusd price of DEX + CEX price）
X+Y=1
Increase Y 1%/day
bts/bitusd price of DEX<=0.0345
If the temporary feed price<=1.01*CEX price, recover the feed price;
If the CALL PRICE of first margin position<=CEX price, recover the feed price;
If the CEX price>=0.0345, recover the feed price;
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Feed the real bitcny price. There is no alternative solution.
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Feed the real bitcny price. There is no alternative solution.
Where was Abit or BEOS or co ?
Can't see them.They didn't needed cn-vote to get it fixed