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Messages - xeroc

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361
FFS bitcrab, I thought BitShares was supposed to be decentralised.
You adjust all the parameters to suit your whale positions.
you run the open market operations (a major conflict of interest.)
you got the committee to change force settlement on BitCNY to 5%(supposedly temporarily) when all other bitassets are 1%
now you want to change MSSR for your own ends.
lets just rename it Crabshares
@JonnyB, it is a little unfair to claim he is changing anything. If at all, it is the committee that has the power to modify parameters. That includes more than just bitcrab.
In the forums, we should keep a friendly environment to proposals and learn from discussions.
@bitcrab merely proposed a change to get things started with discussions.

Have you been around here when Dan Larimer proposed to have only 7 block producers? Same thing: A controversial proposal

All of these potential changes should be considered for all bit assets.  No reason for CYN to be different, this is more confusing for users.
I need to disagree here, bitCNY has much more liquidity than any of the other assets. Disconnecting its parameters from others makes sense IMHO.



With respect to the actual proposal, I think it is worth exeperimenting with the MSSR for bitCNY (only bitCNY!) given the increased volume there (we had over 100M BTS volume there yesterday).
We've known from the beginning that eventually some bitassets will be more prominent than others, and bitCNY certainly went through the charts compared to others. It should be allowed to have
a different set of parameters *AS LONG* as we let all market participants know about those changes before they get implemented.

To the change of MSSR, I believe it makes sense for CNY which has quite some liquidity near the spread. Lowering the MSSR might bring the premium of CNY down in case of BTS price decline.
However, it also reduces the potential profits for those that shortsell into the margin calls (because their profit is less then).

The other concern I have is the use of OMO in bitCNY. I am unclear how much of the liquidity is offered by OMO and how much comes from 3rd party traders. Certainly, yesterday, the 100M volume
has not been caused by OMO. The more I think about OMO the more I believe it should be replaced by a more something that is called "community hedge fund" and allows for actual market making
to act as a regular market participant with profits for the reserves.

I believe, once we have the custom operations BSIP approved and ready on chain, we might actually be able to technically hire someone for trading and pay them for doing so. (different topic)

To conclude the discussion about MSSR, I think we should continue discussion about lowering it. I would like to see its effect on bitCNY.
However, we should learn from the lessons of raising settlement offset of 5% and make clear that we all understand when an expiriment is a success or when it failed.

That said, I would propose the following procedure:
0. let's continue discussion about how much the MSSR should be lowered
1. let's define a metric that allows us to identify if that has had any effect
2. a proposal shall be created for committee to lower it with an expiration of at least 2 weeks!
3. 3 months after the proposal has executed, the MSSR should be re-evaluated in public discussion together with the metrics of 1.
4. 2 other proposal shall be created to the committee to either approve the lower MSSR or to reset it to 10.

362
we all trust market, but in the real market the arbitrage is not always easy, if you want to do arbitrage between polo "BTS/BTC" pair and DEX "BTS/bitCNY" pair, you need to go through a long trading chain and always cost much time, so if in the referenced exchanges there are big price difference, adopt the highest is a good choice - always select the highest price make sense.

feed price do not necessarily reflect the instant market price fall, system should avoid the feed price be pulled down by sudden events in single exchanges,.that's why "the highest one" suggestion comes out.

surely there should be some "price fire wall" setting to avoid adopting unreasonable too high prices.

Let's not start "fighting the market" .. if *VOLUME SUPPORTS* a price crash, then the feed should acknoledge that fact and call for margin.

A price firewall is nuBits-style manipulation and we all know how that ended. So, either the market decides or the reserves are wasted into the markets for trying the achieve the impossible: "force a price".

363
"bitasset.feeds.count(o.publisher)" That error usually means you are trying to publish a feed for an asset where you are not allowed to publish assets.
Are you still active witness?

364
Every witness need to add the BTS trading pair of magicwallet+fee/CNC(AEX)/QC(ZB)/USDT(HUOBI,ZB,GATE,AEX) to the feed price.

I think this is were we should go.

The purpose of the volume-weighted average (in contrast to median) strategy is to let market decide the actual price.
Assuming strong arbitrage, we can say that the volume of that exchange that has the fairest valuation of BTS price also has
the highest volume. With the volume-weighted average, this would also result in a higher weight in the feed calculation at
the witnesses.

I'd say, let the market decide for a "fair" price of BTS (in CNY) and

* add DEX to price feeds
* keep CEXs in price feed
* add magic wallet to price feeds

After that, derive *volume-weighted average*.

If market decides that 1 bitCNY is worth 1.06 CNY, then the 6% premium is market driven and could be justified by the additional utilty of smartcoins - IMHO

365
Only public keys are transferred to the faucet. You can see the actual API here:
https://bitshares.eu/referral/info/api

366
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Proxy: bitcrab - make the ecosystem grow
« on: August 10, 2018, 12:09:24 pm »
mr.agsexplorer worries me more... is there any SLA how often should witnesses produce feed? 3 hours doesn't seem right for actively traded assets.
Most scripts don't actually push prices *frequently* but instead have an expiration of say 12h (the minimum frequency) and trigger republishing only if a certain percentage in price difference (From on-chain feed to locally derived feed) is reached. That reduces the burdon that is put onto the blockchain by feed operations and still is flexible.

No need to announce a price again and again if it doesn't change

367
Suggestion was not for core to use MAX of price feeds...core would still use median...suggestion was for individual pricefeeds to take the max between CEXs and DEX...
The more I think about, the more merits I can find in this approach. Still, I do not think we can weight DEX and CEX equally, we should stick with *VOLUME* and than it is no different than
considering the DEX as much an exchange as any other too, from point of view of the feed produer

368
Stakeholder Proposals / Re: Proxy: bitcrab - make the ecosystem grow
« on: August 10, 2018, 10:53:32 am »
in the recent past the CNY feeding from elmato is too low to be reasonable, unvote it temporarily.

BTS need some change on price feeding to protect the ecosystem from being attacked by shorters, suggest witnesses can feed price with the suggestion here as a reference.https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=26914.msg320692;topicseen#msg320692



Given that the blockchain derives a *median* of all the price feeds available, a single feed that is below by 100% is as irrelevant as if it was below only 5%.
Unvoting is unecessary IMHO, but the feed should be fixed asap

369
BBF mustn't be the only choice, and also shouldn't be.
No one seeks to have only one centralized escrow. It is merely one (afaik the only one) that offers auditable bitUSD worker escrow and is the voted spokesperson, aka has the BTS holders trust.

Has BLCKCHND introduced themselves as an escrow? You can also consider asking trusted members of the community.
This!

370
General Discussion / Re: review the drastic fall
« on: August 10, 2018, 09:59:11 am »
We don't need to protect your asset.Start selling your BTS to lower your CR and there will be no problem anymore instead of looking for conspiracy theory of attackers waiting to harm your Collateral
Can you please act more like an adult and refrain from attaching people personally? Thank you!

Furthermore, I appreciate that @bitcrab describes what is going on in his perspective, even though people may disagree with his conclusions.
There are forces in play that seem to have sufficient liquidity to place with BTS valuation, and that is not the first time.

As a committee member, I (and bitcrab) need to make sure that the core value proposition of bitassets is kept and we follow different
procedures to achieve that. Bitcrab seems to be more experimental friendly than others and I like that he can freely discuss those in
the forums. Personal attacks are inacceptable - no matter what!

Other than that, conflicting interests are only natural and they should be address, but this thread was to discuss consequences of trades as
they happend in the past and learn from them.

371
But, price feeds are supposed to be volumen weighted.

An alternative solution to 'raising' the price would be to use a moving average for the price feeds so that CEX markets can recover and that would have less of an impact on the feed price.

That would on the one hand side result in the feed price having more inertia and behave more sluggish, and on the other hand result in margin calls to be triggered "later".
This way, temporary dips in the CEX markets would not result in the feed price moving as much. However, margin calls are then also coming later, but then would come more
heavy to the price feeds.

Either way, I still think we should rather make feed prices reflect the price of BTS more fairly than to artifically tune it to our liking.
One way of doing so would be to have BTS listed on more exchanges and do our best to increase volumen on *any exchange* (including the DEX). The internal trading price could be fed back (volume weighted) into the price feed calculation as well.

Again, the big question to ask ourselves is "what is a fair price". And I do not think that there is an easy answer to that. we can only try make it more obvious what the "market thinks" a "fair price" would be.

IMHO

372
Interesting - for sure.
Also sure (at least to me) is that price feeds need to grow and be taken more seriously as markets mature. Witnesses need to take their responsibility serious and keep up with market price.

We had quite some discussion also with @alt/@bazozi about what a "fair" price for CNY/USD/BTS actually is and I do not think it is possible to come to a *single* price that reflects the BTS price
properly taking into account all the markets and market sentiments in different countries. That is why markets require arbitrators - yet some markets have an offset even on centralized exchanges.

We need to start discussing whether bitCNY is supposed to be worth 1CNY given that it is a digital representative that can be spend easily around the globe, that comes with a 'benefit' over regular fiat CNY (same for USD etc...)
Additionaly, I refrain from acting *quickly* out of markets behaving unexpected. The movements in the last days, shouldn't be take as arguments to modify the smart coin parameters (feeds).
There is a much bigger picture to bitCNY and that is long-term predictability.

Those that sold their BTS on CEX to buy from margin calls on another exchange (DEX) is *business as usual*. Could have well been caused by arbitrators instead of feed producers.

That said, I am not totally against experimentation - but I would rather see small steps and proper discussion before implementation.
Do we understand all the implications of "raising" the price "artificially"?

373
This week I also added Bitshares integration to EOSIO/demux-js. You can find out more information on Demux here.
Extraordinary!

374
Probably off topic, but a cool idea would be a UI toolkit for integrating the entire BTS DEX into CEX websites, rather than limiting themselves to single tokens they could offer direct access to the BTS DEX. Probably not realistic though?  :-\
This is what `bexi` is all about
https://github.com/blockchainbv/bexi

375
General Discussion / Re: BitShares TESTNET Feature Release 2.0.20180803
« on: August 04, 2018, 11:55:53 am »
M..M..M..M..M..M..Monster Release

+5%

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