In other words, if you need to register a pile of accounts, register them now before the hard fork because the cost is going up 5x!

Hey Music team,

My brother has a folk music duo (they're called Smith House; their first album/EP "The Raw and Rich" is available on iTunes) that he's been playing with for a couple years, and he's looking to raise funds to record a second album. He could start recording soon, and he's been asking me about how to do some kind of crypto-currency crowdfunding. Obviously, the best platform for this is BitShares Music; the only problem is that it doesn't exist yet.

So I wanted to throw out the possibility that we could raise funds by pre-selling artistcoins. We only need a few thousand dollars; to make the accounting easy we'd want to do the fundraiser exclusively in BitUSD.

I'd launch the funding campaign this week, but my only concern is that we'd be bumping into US securities regulations: we are soliciting donations with this promise to award artistcoins at some future date. Anybody have any ideas how we could go about this legally without waiting for the launch of Peertracks?

From an insider's point of view, the more shares are given to PTS, the better. From an outsider's point of view, having empty projects with no added value (CinniDev hasn't even tried to argue of what the added value of TimeBank could be...) just make us look silly.

Come on, we are in the adult business world, and it cannot work like that, we have to evaluate the value of things. Otherwise, we could also all join the dogeparty

We're in this weird intersection between what you call the "adult business world" and the cryptocurrency world. In Crypto, good projects get forked, with or without permission. Since BitShares is open-source, people are going to create copy-paste versions in which they make tiny parameter tweaks, and essentially add no value. There's nothing we can do about that.

So you have this one fact where we are going to get forked. We have no choice about that fact; it's here to stay. Since we're guaranteed to get forked, would you rather the copy-paste projects distribute to PTS or not? Would you actually prefer that they not distribute, for the sake of saving face in your so-called "adult business world?"

So basically it would be a sport pool (whichever sport) where you put *dynamic* bets -meaning you can change your "bets" along the way by buying or selling a team asset, and the value of that bet change depending on the valuation of each team, or what the people think the odds are-

Wow, that's interesting!!

You could hold and hope your team win, or trade actively for each game along the way...

But what happens with the assets of each team when the season is done? Would something like the PTS dump after a snapshot would happen, so holding too long on a winning team wouldn't be that good since everybody gets out when the season is done?

I've thought about this some. They ran a World Cup betting pool (Germany really came through for me!) over on NHZ and it got me thinking that you could probably do sports betting pools almost totally autonomously, probably even without feeds (though you'd need to put some thought into preventing manipulation).

So suppose we've got two teams: the Satoshis and the Larimers, and they're competing for the championship. I could go into the Sports Betting DAC and create a betting pool for this championship, which would be composed of two assets: SATOSHI and LARIMER. Unlike an ordinary asset creation, the DAC controls 100% of the shares of these assets, and puts them up for sale on the open market. Bettors come in and buy shares of either SATOSHI or LARIMER, and the DAC puts all the bets in a common pool. If the Larimers win, the DAC pays out the pool proportionally to holders of the LARIMER asset, and since the game is over, all SATOSHIs and LARIMERs vanish because we don't need them any more.

Here is the fun part: The more shares people purchase, the higher the price of the next share goes. There is a lot of design leeway here; I have no idea what the best price growth curve would look like. Would buying a LARIMER increase the price of a SATOSHI? (I think not, but haven't thought through it all the way). Should the price increase be linear? superlinear? Should it have a time-varying component? All good questions. The upshot of letting shares increase in price over time is that there should be a mad rush at the beginning to buy shares since people know they will get more expensive as time goes on.

I said above that this shouldn't require a feed: The trick to this is you never close betting. Betting stays open throughout the game and even afterwards. How will the DAC know which team won? Well, if people bought more LARIMERs than SATOSHIs, then the Larimers must have won. If the pool is large enough, it would take a huge whale to buy so many of the "wrong" team asset that the DAC would conclude it had won. You'd have to design some clever way for the DAC to "know" that it should shut the pool down and make payouts; maybe you could measure average market activity and make payouts when the moving average share transaction volume has dropped below some threshold.

Quote from: biophil on October 10, 2014, 02:37:15 pm

Can I make a simple suggestion: Avoid the words "graph" and "edge" in any public marketing materials. If you must use the words under the hood, so be it.

Here's the problem:

A graph theorist (or probably any computer scientist) hears "graph" and thinks "network."
A normal person (even a well-educated one outside of a couple specific fields) hears "graph" and thinks "chart of data." Calling it a graph will actually mislead most people.

Edge is even worse: A graph theorist hears "edge" and thinks "connection between network nodes."
A normal person hears "edge" and thinks something like "boundary;" such as "the part of my kitchen table where I shouldn't set my drinks." Or even worse, they think "the sharp part of a knife." Calling it an edge will make most people immediately and utterly confused, because in the vernacular, "edge" means something totally different than what you want it to mean.

You are setting up a massive language barrier if you use the word "edge," because it doesn't have any intuitive connection in most peoples' minds to network links.

I'm guessing you call it Key Graph because you think the word "net" is over-used; I'll give you that. But please please please use a word like "link" or "connection" or "keynnection" or anything but "edge."

Meh.. I agree we could use "connection" instead of "edge", but even facebook has a product called "social graph" which is very much public-facing.

I'm not totally opposed to "graph," but you must agree that "edge" is wildly confusing for anybody but you and your CMU friends.

I think "link" wouldn't be bad.

Has anybody made some kind of best-practices manual for claiming stakes in new DACs? There are a couple no-brainer things one could do, such as moving your PTS to a new address after every snapshot (and certainly before importing PTS keys), keeping your AGS donation wallets locked at all times (i.e., never use those wallets for BTC or PTS transactions), etc. Has anybody already written up such guidelines?

Oh, another thing: immediately after importing AGS, move your newly-claimed shares to a completely different wallet.dat file; that way your AGS key is not permanently in your LTS wallet.dat file.

Quote from: CinniCoin on October 03, 2014, 11:23:38 pm

Cinni DPOS snapshot on October 14, 2014, 5:00:00 PM UTC

Note: I'm pretty sure this snapshot doesn't include PTS/AGS; this is merely the snapshot to upgrade Cinni to DPOS. Correct? There will be some future snapshot for the TimeBank DAC.