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Messages - merivercap

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646
General Discussion / Re: BitShares Worldwide - Meetup.com
« on: February 25, 2015, 09:59:26 pm »
Hey guys, I think you get to organize 3 meetup groups under one membership plan so just to save on costs, whoever is already organizing a meetup group can seed two other meetups in another location.

647
General Discussion / Re: San Francisco Bay Area
« on: February 25, 2015, 09:53:09 pm »
Would a template to organize meetups be helpful to you?

I'm working on such document as we speak.

For example, making a demo of one of our mobile wallet and give away bitusd, make people trade among one another and then buy a coffee at the coffee shop where you hold the meetup.

You can then by back the bitusd from the coffee shop if he doesn't want to keep it or tell him to turn it into BTS if he wants to profit from the future of BitShares.

Great way to convert business and users simultaneously.

I'm sure it will be helpful especially when we reach out to the mainstream public, but I think targeted outreach to influencers and early adopter communities may need a lot of customization.   I think your demo will still be great though. 

I was planning to reach out to Bitcoin users first and need to find the most compelling approach.  I think the most immediate use case is Bitcoiners no longer need to exchange with fiat ever again and can remain in the cryptoworld without counterparty risk while still being able to spend dollars.  Anyways a Bitshares 101 for Bitcoiners meetup would be good...

I can create a bitShares Bay Area meetup.  Usually Meetup.com allows organizers to have 3 meetup groups for the monthly membership fee so if you are someone you know is running only one meetup group and can spare one that person can set up a San Francisco Bay Area bitShares meetup and I can co-organize.   Anyways let me know.  Thanks. 

648
> Biggest misconceptions or obstacles needed to overcome for adoption of BTS?

That's easy: It's the people
Reason: People don't understand the advantages of a decentralized exchange with market pegged assets .. not yet ..
Can you remember 2009 when the bitcoin paper was published and no one cared?

But what specifically about the people?  Bitcoin is difficult to understand.  Money is also difficult to understand.  bitUSD I suspect is easier to understand...  ELI5 is important.  I changed the title a bit and I think your comment on the other thread fits here better.

for me the biggest thing is that you can own (a percentage) of the system by holding BTS (NOTES or whatever the base asset is) ..

You can actually telly your friends:
- I own a bank
- I own a stock exchange
- I own a forex
- I own a music industry :)
- I own a gambling industry :)
 ....

I think that is a compelling way to describe it.  On one hand it may be overwhelming to describe all those various systems and maybe better to select the few industries that interests someone the most..... on the other hand I can imagine an infomercial/sales pitch that will go through that whole laundry list of DACs... bank, stock exchange.. foreign exchange.. etc.. and ending with 'You can have the whole shebang for a limited time of $9.99 per share..... hurry before this offer ends...!'...

649
I like the idea that bitUSD can help Bitcoin & altcoin miners... it's useful for altcoin traders/investors/speculators... as well as forex traders.. eGold was really popular as a payment system, but I never really used it before... I figure bitGold can be used the same way so it may be good to follow a similar path to adoption... what else?

BTW I think the brand 'bitUSD and bitGold' is huge... really a distinctive advantage...

650
Just curious what you guys think.. maybe from the mainstream perspective and the Bitcoiner perspective....

651
General Discussion / Re: Least volatile measure of value. What could it be?
« on: February 25, 2015, 01:10:40 am »

The human population. This could be represented as a coin which has a value of the total amount of humans on record. It should go up or down in predictable ways.

Or perhaps the formula for the total amount of storage space of the Internet itself. The value will increase each year at a predictable rate.

Or electricity usage. Make an asset around electricity demand and you'll get something extremely stable but which always increases.

I would say since we don't have electricoin we'll have to invent some energy assets. The other stuff would be too experimental.

I always liked the idea of using human population for any free coin distribution or inflation rate,  but I wonder how accurate the numbers are.. I guess estimates are probably good enough...

652
General Discussion / Re: Least volatile measure of value. What could it be?
« on: February 24, 2015, 10:53:13 pm »
Thanks for your kind words! This post is actually a bit outdated as I (and the Bitsapphire team) have simplified and extended the system considerably.

The IOUs would be based on a specific delivery of XYZ good or service correct?   This is the same model for the DigitalCoin &  Ripple system.  Your personal trust network or supply chain can better evaluate your 'credit rating'.  The supply and demand of the specific IOUs as well as the risk is decentralized/distributed.  The major failure in modern banking is that bad debt is centralized and effectively collectivized by government bailouts, guarantees, and money printing.  Hence collective public debt grows to unmanageable levels beyond the level that would represent productive credits, and eventually can lead to currency collapse.

The IOU represents the debt of the issuer in terms of an external unit of account (which in our model is the Perpetual Coin). It does not represent any good, service, hour, or anything of that sort that currently is in use with LETS.

Ripple has an in-build commodity money (XRP) which cannot function as a stable unit of account. It is the same as Bitcoin in this regard, or any commodity money. Our proposal creates a stable unit of account similar to bitAssets, but which track an internal ratio rather than some arbitrary commodity or basket of commodities. Rather, it tracks all goods and services on the market.

One of the major modifications to the system we've made so far is that the bitAsset (i.e. the perpetual coin) is not created as a CFD, but rather through simple contracted collateralization. In our current model any percentage of collateralization can happen. We calculated that at about 300% collateralization (all based on IOUs, nothing else) is the maximum statictically significant security that can be had.

We have also been able to form a very new and I think elegant definition of money and credit:
"Credit is a time-delayed split barter contract. Money is credit without counterparty risk." It's that simple really.

Interesting.  Look forward to seeing how it works. 
Yeah from what I recall XRP is the intermediary asset without counterparty risk between user-issued IOUs that have counterparty risk so it seems to have a somewhat similar function, but your perpetual coin idea doesn't involve IOUs of anything specific like dollars/gold/time...  Interesting.  Just like Bitcoin & Bitshares and other blockchains can be seen as a global ledger or DACs that can satisfy subjective value theory/Mises regression theorem because it is a piece of something tangible (ie. ledger or company) I can see how  a perpetual coin DAC can be similar, but wouldn't the value depend on how useful it is and wouldn't adoption increase value just like Bitcoin/Bitshares and wouldn't that make value unstable? What makes Bitshares much easier to value is because it can be seen a stream of dividend payments from transaction fees.

I like your elegant definition of money.  I like simple and it does make sense when using 'credit' & 'exchange' as the main reference point.  The 'store of value/commodity/asset' aspect that is typically associated with 'money' can be put in a different category because that is not necessary for exchange whereas the narrow definition you have confines the definition to the 'exchange' aspect of money.  A broader definition may include the 'wealth/asset/store of a value' aspect of money.   If you build a boat and I build a house and we exchange the net 'wealth' in the world is increased by a boat + house and so wealth is not a zero-sum game (in case you include Mother Earth than it is zero-sum..lol).... Exchange & credit and a narrow definition of money is a zero-sum game.  Anyways...fun to think about.  Look forward to your progress. 

653
General Discussion / Re: San Francisco Bay Area
« on: February 24, 2015, 09:26:46 am »
Thanks rgcrypto!  Will let you know.  Waiting until there are a few people on this board in our area so we can collaborate & co-organize. 

654
General Discussion / Re: San Francisco Bay Area
« on: February 21, 2015, 08:37:56 pm »
South Bay here.

Sent from my Cap'n Crunch whistle.

Good to connect.  We should set up a get-together when we have enough people responding to this thread...  do you go to local Bitcoin meetups in your area?   Isn't there a monthly one at the Plug & Play Tech Center?

655
General Discussion / Re: Least volatile measure of value. What could it be?
« on: February 21, 2015, 01:14:07 pm »
Cob, I see you're thinking about our Houston discussion :)

For others you can catch up on some stuff here http://stableproductivemoney.wordpress.com/2009/03/18/properties-of-token-money/, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyWfUqEyIZc

Without reiterating everything, bitAssets are capable of tracking the relative value of a data feed. The best data feed would be internal to the DAC so no data manipulation can happen. The most stable crypto assets to back up and collateralize bitAssets would be IOUs which represent something real which is redeemable. IOUs are better capable to create a much more stable bitAsset because people trade the undelrying value of the IOU rather than a commodity-token such as BTS or BTC. The problem with IOUs is of course that both collataralizing tokens on both ends of the bitAsset can completely default, effectively creating inflation for the bitAsset in question. 

Everybody is capable of providing value to the market through production (Riegel's idea: "We're all fountains of wealth") by extending our own credit and backing it up with future production at the future's exchange rate. You effectively get a dual currency system, exactly how money is noted in a ledger anyway: a Debit currency and a Credit currency. Those IOUs would be redeemable for your productive capacity. 

Great read.  I followed your posts after your comment about game theory results of credit money vs. commodity money from your Moonstone wallet thread. 

Yes. Money does not create wealth.  We all create wealth through our productive capacity.   


By using your're IOU as the collateral for one side of the bitAsset you can create somebody else's IOU's as collateral for the bitAsset's other side. This way you create a bitAsset without practical counterparty risk which everybody accepts at par and which can be used for universal pricing and path finding across the value network (very similar to Ripple's XRP being the path-finding mechanism between gateways, but in this case it's a stable bitAsset with flexible money supply rather than a commodity token).

I am a follower of the Ripple/Stellar community precisely for the credit money characteristics (social credit) and LETS (local exchange trading system).  The Ripple/Stellar system allows user generated IOUs in the same way you describe and XRP/STR is representative of the potentially stable 'bitAsset' intermediary without counterparty risk unless I'm missing something.  FYI:  I'm not a fan of the distribution mechanism of XRP, but am a fan of the tech.  Stellar has a much better distribution mechanism, but not entirely sold on the organizational structure.  Much prefer a DPOS/DAC model rather than a for-profit or non-profit corporation for issuing XRPs/STRs.  I would have probably given away 90% of the coins for free and kept 10% + inflation for development. 

Could this somehow fit in with the BitShares UIA model or do you need a separate bitCredit system? 

Furthermore the counterparty collateralizing your IOU takes on risk but also reaps the benefits by having more buying power with you. So your collateralizers, or in other words -lenders- would in most cases be your immediate supply-chain (or market makers, i.e. Credit Rating Agency). Your "credit limit" would be equal to the total demand for your IOU (or in other words total demand for your future production), however the more IOUs you issue the more interest your supply chain will require from you for their larger risk. Hence you get a very liquid and true market-based credit market and access to cash flow. 

The perfect bitAsset would be, as stated above, and internal price feed. If a lot of producers use this IOU system (as a kickstaerter it needs a minimum viable market, or in other words minimum viable liquidity) then you can use the point where the average total supply and demand curve of all IOUs in circulation meet as the univeral pathfinding point. In theory that point would be by definition perfectly stable as it mathematically represents the abstraction of all supply and demand of all relative values in the system. As such the -price- of money (i.e. Unit of Account) is not just decoupled from money itself as with bitAssets, it goes much further than that, it becomes a *universal non-cumulative* value unit. 

The IOUs would be based on a specific delivery of XYZ good or service correct?   This is the same model for the DigitalCoin &  Ripple system.  Your personal trust network or supply chain can better evaluate your 'credit rating'.  The supply and demand of the specific IOUs as well as the risk is decentralized/distributed.  The major failure in modern banking is that bad debt is centralized and effectively collectivized by government bailouts, guarantees, and money printing.  Hence collective public debt grows to unmanageable levels beyond the level that would represent productive credits, and eventually can lead to currency collapse.

BTW after many years of study, my revelations of modern money mechanics via Austrian economics & money-as-debt literature were confirmed with the following Bank of England quarterly reports:
http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publications/Documents/quarterlybulletin/2014/qb14q101.pdf
http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publications/Documents/quarterlybulletin/2014/qb14q1prereleasemoneycreation.pdf

After so many years of secrecy.... the BofE just spilled the beans on how modern banking works, and most economic professors don't understand this and it's not taught in most academic institutions.  Essentially banks create money out of thin air via lending.  They do not practice fractional reserve banking in the way most people think.  Banks do not lend their reserves nor is there any money multiplier effect.  All they do is create bank notes that represent the credit of people just as you described above with IOUs.  However credit evaluation & credit money creation is not distributed and favors large financial institutions & governments & corporations and overtime can lead to systemic currency collapse when the default risk of the entire system becomes too high.   It seems one efficiency with modern banking is that they don't have to deal with multiple IOUs.  Everyone's IOUs are treated as equal and so no one has to deal with IOUs of fish vs IOUs of getting a hair cut.  They all use the same bank notes.  That may be why fiat 'credit money' can seem relatively stable and is similarly why a liquid credit money like US Federal Reserve notes may tend towards the stability of a *universal non-cumulative* value unit you described.  However according to Mises regression theorem and subjective theory of value it seems you need a starting point of value whether it's a 'dollar' in 'grains' of silver or 'ozs' of gold.  The US Federal Reserve note initially had gold backing as a starting reference point so without that I don't believe you ever could have a relevant unit of account. 

Fascinatingly this special and unique bitAsset (I'm calling it Perpetual Coin (PC) for now) by definition has no counterparty risk as a whole, but statistically a certain percentage of it's underlying IOUs will default on both ends of the contract, as such it is as inflationary as the total failure rate of both ends of the bitAsset of the producers. However, because this is a DAC we can make sure that the price feed of the PC always matches the internal price point by including demurrage equal to this failure rate, effectively we're introducing entropy into the system which always matches the entropy of the underlying value market, something which never existed before. This way we stabilized PC as a Unit of Acocunt as a point in time, but not as a store of value. That's the next step. 

Great stuff!  Yes.  Essentially the default risk of the entire system can be used as a price feed to stabilize the unit of account. 

Due to demurrage PC holders who want to store their value will want to invest their PC as a loan to above average producers. They in tern give you their PC IOUs for a future date, in which case you have again counterparty risk which at average should be smaller or equal to the demurrage/entropy rate of the PC as all these factors are in theory counter-cyclical and self-stabilizing to one another.

As such we have effectively splt money into its 3 core functions:
  • Medium of Exchange - Producer IOU
  • Unit of Account - Perpetual Coin (bitAsset)
  • Store of Value - P2P Credit Perpetual Coin

I've got to write this down more clearly somewhere.

Again great read.  I like how you summarized the core functions.   I think a lot of it is consistent with social credit/LETs systems, but I like the added dimension of using a DAC to account for demurrage.  Have you had further thoughts on this?  I've really been interested in distributed social credit money systems as well. 

656
General Discussion / San Francisco Bay Area
« on: February 19, 2015, 11:44:36 pm »
Is anyone around here?  It would be nice to have a monthly meetup or at least stay connected here locally.  Thanks.

657
Technical Support / Re: Account registration faucet for new users!
« on: February 19, 2015, 07:08:12 pm »
The blockchain says you registered 6 days ago:
Code: [Select]
delegate (locked) >>> blockchain_get_account merivercap
Name: merivercap
Registered: 2015-02-11T08:52:30
Last Updated: 6 days ago
Owner Key: BTS87UZaR1bYcDZ93K551tbtfafDUp7CPe2TEkHwKheihMPRc2njb
Active Key History:
- BTS84sh13WEmKCY7U71hYauBxMSXL9EYN833yL5yd44GJWpPiEb6A, last used 6 days ago

Seems your wallet is not synced


Thanks it works now!  Yes the wallet wasn't synced so I left my computer on overnight to download the blockchain. 

Anyways.  Everything is good now. 

658
General Discussion / Re: Operation DarkNet
« on: February 19, 2015, 05:55:52 am »
Operation Darkmarket: +5%

659
Will the light wallet have 2FA?  I always feel more secure holding digital money with 2FA compared to doing online banking at a traditional bank. 

660
Hey all,
Around the 18:40 to 19:15 mark Dan discusses having a Craigslist for bitUSD and I think I can help here.  I started up a company called Peerhub and it's a place for people to connect to buy & sell anything with each other just like Craigslist/Ebay/Etsy.  It's extremely easy to use.  I'd be happy for people in the community to use Peerhub as a place to exchange bitUSD with fiat! 

A little about me.  I'm an anarchist/libertarian/Austrian so philosophically I couldn't be more aligned.  I'm totally impressed with everything about this ecosystem from UIAs to DACs to DPOS so I'm in ...and I want to help.  Thank you Dan and the developers for the great work and innovations!  I've followed Bitcoin from the sidelines from mid-2012 and also followed the Ripple/Stellar system, but Bitshares is my favorite platform right now after diving in deeper this past week.

Anyways the main  focus with Peerhub is to go after mainstream users (not crypto users) and we're still iterating on marketing outreach, but cryptocurrencies are the future and I'd rather integrate with this technology sooner than later, especially with bitUSD (and eventually bitGold!)   Let me know what you all think and hope you guys consider using Peerhub as a gateway to connect with locals to trade bitUSD.   I know I'm looking to buy and sell some BTS and bitUSD here locally.  I'll be spreading the word as well about Bitshares in general too..... thanks! 

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