Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - Darkbane

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
1
BitShares PTS / Re: Price
« on: March 03, 2014, 02:28:45 am »
Quote
Well I do not intend to offend you, but I think you need to learn more about investing and market reactions in supply/demand... we were all informed for several weeks there would be a snapshot taken on february 28th... so by setting such a deadline for the reward of BTS, there will be a natural increase in demand as people want to be apart of that, and naturally once the snapshot is taken, there is no longer a reason for them to hold on to PTS with this method of investing... so they immediately started selling off before demand dropped and prices as well dropped with it...

I believed that people would want to keep their PTS as this supposed to be an asset that will give you dividends in future DACs. It is not like I3 promissed something and didn't deliver, lied or did something wrong to affect the price so dramatically. This was like when Baidu stopped to accept BTCs or Gox bankrupted...I think that in a more liquid and mature market this wouldn't happen. In contrast, the demand for PTS should have increased since I3 who is behind did everything correctly. But this didn't happen. People are speculating too much all the time and this is no good.In the past investors would keep their stocks for 7 years. Nowdays, nobody keep their investment more than 7 months and in cryptocurrencies time is much much lesser.

Bitcoin millionaires are millionaires because they believed in Bitcoin and were not selling their BTCs. I though that this should have happened with PTS, but unfortunatelly I was wrong...

Other than that I agree with all your reasoning. Unfortunatelly I know nothing about mining and I definitelly have a lot to learn about cryptocurrencies. I am strangling to understand as much as possible but it is really difficult for an average investor with no much IT knowledge to follow up. You guys are able to see and analyse valuable data and information that most people can't. I will get there eventually...After all if you don't pay you don't learn...

well people have less reason to keep their PTS currently, as there is no market driven data that would lend more value to it... supply and demand... this happens ALL the time in the stock market...

people buy and sell stocks constantly based upon future outlooks... if stocks traded for what the company was worth today, as in, they would be 30x less expensive to purchase... but folks are betting on the future and where the company will go... today right now, invictus has no announcement as to when the next DAC will come out... for an invester that means your money, is sitting there not "working" for you at the moment... its in limbo... you would make more profit putting it in other places that are creating an increased value... the value has already been realized with PTS today...

now when invictus announces, hey guys we're taking a snapshot onnnnn lets make up a date of July 4th... investors will want to get ahead of that, some sooner, some later, depending where their money is working for them today and generating more or less revenue for them... those getting little return someplace else, will be likely to buy in early to maximize their returns since their money is doing little for them now... those making good gains someplace else will come to the game late as they are already making profits... this is the natural rise and fall of all markets...

in a good year the orange crop has so many oranges, and not enough demand the price goes down per orange... in a bad year, people still want orange juice, but there are less oranges on the trees, so demand rises and prices do as well... so we all know when growing season is, and during growing season we can see how the crops are turning out and speculate on final results... this is like the buildup before the harvest... now after the harvest, there are no oranges on the trees... so prices drop or rise as we're already on to next years crops and speculations, but in the meantime, does it make sense to hold on to them... well that depends on a few things... did the value of orange shares drop so much, its worth the risk to hold on to them for next years crop, or did you profit so much from the orange shares it makes sense to sell them, because its unlikely for the next 6 months the number will be any higher?

I'm trying to think of a good way to explain it, and since I'm having orange juice right now, thats the best...

P.S. this is also more complex because the value has been split among two different shares now... PTS and BTS... so one may over time hold more value than the other... only time will tell how each is developed upon...

2
BitShares PTS / Re: Price
« on: March 03, 2014, 02:15:20 am »
Just curious, would it be legal for me to issue a security like "This certificate is worth $100 if toast chooses option A, and $50 if toast chooses option B. Toast will just decide whatever he feels like on date XX."? Would it be legal for me to trade this?

well this is so generic of a question its not possible to answer it but with more questions really...

if you're saying toast could issue a security, without a fixed price on the date its issued, I would say no because that violates securities rules to modify the terms of the security issued after... because you've already assigned it a value of $100 or $50 ahead of time when you chose which option... so you can't retract after issued and redefine the price... market conditions and demand can redefine its value higher or lower, but you can't change it after issued...

now if you're doing what they do for say an IPO, and underwriters solicit investors ahead of the issuance date, today they could be offered $100 or $50 like you suggest, but the day its issued it has a fixed price when its issued date a month later lets say (a completely different price than $100 or $50)... now in some places the group registered to solicit can accept money ahead of time before a final price is issued, however depending on the scenario several things can occur that would result in a complete refund, a partial refund, extra shares issued to them, or a combination of... in some instances they issue a pre-market price which people will buy rights to purchase ahead of issuance, and then once the issuance date is reached that price may be higher or lower than the speculated price when bought...

there are so many various scenarios that could apply...

but I think if your question is, can I issue something today, then next week declare it has no value... no...

3
BitShares AGS / Re: Bitshares AGS and new DACs
« on: March 03, 2014, 01:56:38 am »
Now that the deadline has passed for purchasing PTS/AGS to get Bitshares X, I'm wondering if it is advantageous to acquire AGS or PTS for the upcoming releases?

For Bitshares X, AGS gave you more Bitshares per unit than PTS. Will this be the same with upcoming releases? In short, I'm wondering what the best bang for my buck is.

Thanks.

Let's assume that DAC will be released after 140 days when 1 AGS will be equal to 1 PTS.
Today you can exchange your 1 PTS for 1.7-2.0 AGS it's a good deal?

but lets say invictus wants to jump PTS prices and announces they will give 20% to PTS and 10% to AGS... now PTS is better. ;) speculate!

4
General Discussion / Re: Legality of Prediction Markets and Dacs
« on: March 03, 2014, 01:50:44 am »
What happens when the government realizes that bitshares x exist as an unregulated futures market? I feel like the logical response is to condemn and criminalize the exchange of bitshares. I don't think the government realizes that this is where the bitcoin technology is going. They still think that bitcoin is merely a currency. While I realize the potential merits of prediction markets, the simple fact is that they are not legal.

well nothing is stopping future laws... however currently, the feds have declared they see this as commodity trading... now like as I have been pointing out there is a whole host of new legal concerns due to the ways of things being done and could be construed as something more than a commodity... like AGS not being able to be traded, its no longer a tradeable commodity, its an actual share in my eyes as of now...

nothing stops the government from seizing things when they find applicable law for a situation... the seizure of thousands tens of thousands of bitcoins over the last years has demonstrated that... they've shutdown the silkroad exchange in combination with another country acting together through criminal treaties... we're lucky the feds do not consider it a currency, or we could have a whole host of other issues for the community... so being a commodity is a good thing as this point...

5
General Discussion / Re: Legality of AGS & PTS
« on: March 03, 2014, 01:30:45 am »
I for one am all for hearing what Darkbane has to say. Let's keep it in one thread though.
Until someone from i3 gets back to us with more specific info this conversation can't really make progress, unless darkbane has specific advice of some kind besides "get a lawyer"

The challenge we have is that anything we say can and will be used against us ;)   Even speculating on what the laws may be or how to phrase things. 

I encourage Darkbane to contact us directly to resolve any issue without confusing the issue due to his incomplete knowledge of our situation.

well this is interesting... I just noticed I guess I started this thread... even though I did not... if you want to force me to reply to only one forum, then why not send me a personal message... I only stumbled across this one as I was randomly clicking through the dozens of forums and threads and discovered a legal topic recently created...

I can't contact you directly because the invictus website online lists a generic email address and single phone number... if you have an office extension or direct email address and want to go back and forth with me on concerns... or how about this next conference coming up, will you be available at it? well I think I read about another conference, I'm not sure there are so many places for information posted they often cross eachother and that one might already be over with...

P.S. onceuponatime... I do take offense to you saying I hijack threads... I am directly responding to people posting information and quote what they had said, and my reply directly does have bearing on the subject they mentioned in some form... so its not a hijack to sell a video card, its directly responding to their information with my information related to it in some way...

having questions and wanting answers is never wrong... seeking knowledge is never wrong... trying to impact the community in a way that I feel protects and strengthens the community is never wrong... otherwise they would not have addressed my primary concern about "donations, patrons, etc etc" and simplified it to one legal term that now gives them a bearing going forward with less legal liabilities... THAT IS GOOD FOR OUR COMMUNITY....

6
BitShares PTS / Re: Price
« on: March 03, 2014, 01:15:27 am »
I don't want to complain about the huge price drop, since I am still a believer and support I3.

This is not a price drop. PTS is just trading ex-dividend. BTSX are the dividend.

this is not accurate exactly... there is an estimated drop in value as things even out between the two... however the speculation is 1 BTS will be worth $12 since 1 PTS is worth $6 which would then equal the $18 it was before the big sell off after the 28th... this all remains to be seen yet... and nobody can confirm or deny it really... we just don't know...

I would be tickled pink if it holds true and we keep a realized $18 value between the two... however I think its unrealistic yet... until there is demand for BTS through the creation of released DACs and a reason to give it value, until then I think it will actually be lower than people estimate... supply and demand drive price, we can only hope there is enough inflated demand prior to things being released to really drive it...

however me speculating is that the value will not rise as dramatic as people think... those who wanted BTS were perfectly capable of buying PTS before the snapshot in order to get some... so the demand for BTS I think will be less than PTS was as the demand has already been met for BTS... hence why we hope for the $12/$6 split between the two... but I honestly think BTS will open lower once trading starts, as most folks will want to sell in the beginning, since those who wanted to buy BTS have already done so by acquiring the PTS before the 28th, and sold shortly after... so I predict it will be short of this $18 combined valuation... there will be less demand for BTS than supply initially...

hopefully I'm wrong, usually I'm not...

7
BitShares PTS / Re: Price
« on: March 03, 2014, 01:06:08 am »
I don't want to complain about the huge price drop, since I am still a believer and support I3.

But... I am a long term investor and I am following from the beggining and I didn't see that happening...I thought that there would be some price stability in the price of PTS and not such a huge drop. If I3 knew that this was going to happen, for example if I3 sold PTS like crazy after the snapshot, I think that some advice or warning should have been sent to people who are following from the start in order to protect our shareholdings by selling also and then re-bying low now.

At this point I feel that even since I am here from the beggining I didn't make any profit and later investors coming in now have almost the same advantages as my self. Sure I will get XTS where others won't but with this drop in price I could have cashed some profits and then re-invest. Or do we expect the price to go even lower than that?

I believe that if I3 wants to keep the investors investing in them should send us some opinions, advices or signals of what they think is going to follow. An email like the nice reports that we receive from time to time would have been nice. Not everyone here read the reddit articles...

And I don't think that this would fall under inside information, but rather just an advice for the preservation of the purchase power of the initial investors. Every company sends reports to their clients and to their investors with opinions and advices. They ofcourse writte a disclaimer but they do send out warnings and reports. 

Anyway, I don't want to complain anymore..I should have known better and I should have probably foresee that this would happen...It is just ennoying and makes me think to be more carefull in the future. Every time that there is a new release and the snapshot is taken everyone is going to sell like crazy...This in my opinion creates an instability and uncertainty to people who want to be long term investors..

I appologise in advance if I offended anyone.This is not my intention.It is a free market and everyone is responsible for his actions!

Well I do not intend to offend you, but I think you need to learn more about investing and market reactions in supply/demand... we were all informed for several weeks there would be a snapshot taken on february 28th... so by setting such a deadline for the reward of BTS, there will be a natural increase in demand as people want to be apart of that, and naturally once the snapshot is taken, there is no longer a reason for them to hold on to PTS with this method of investing... so they immediately started selling off before demand dropped and prices as well dropped with it...

if you were mining PTS you would have seen a HUGE increase in the number of miners and equipment pointed at PTS in the weeks before the snapshot as people jumped on the bandwagon to get in time for the snapshot... the difficulty per share doubled in an extremely short period as a result... and now that the snapshot is over, the number of miners have run off to other coins as there is no immediate need to hold on to PTS...

now when invictus announcers there will be another snapshot coming up, you will most likely see another increase and then dropoff again after because of the style of information needed to be collected... they don't need the people to be holding the PTS after they take the picture so to speak, its locked in and done...

invictus can not give out investing advice to people when to buy or sell (legally it would be horrible to do), as they also are speculating on what the market will do... and could be held liable for giving out investing advice without being registered to do so... each state in america has different laws regulating people who give out financial advice in an official form, they would be held to a different standard in most states than us in the forum speculating... insider information is a whole different ball of wax, if they used knowledge the public did not posses, like lets say they did not announce when the snapshot was going to be, and bought up all the PTS they could ahead of that, and then announced it, that would be insider trading and manipulating the market since it was not made public knowledge and they traded ahead of time for an advantage...

8
BitShares AGS / Re: AGS to BTC estimated conversion
« on: March 03, 2014, 12:55:32 am »
It depends heavily one when you donate.
http://www1.agsexplorer.com/

Ah, I can use that to calculate how much the AGS I hold are worth that day. Good point, thanks

However, that just shows me the buy price, I want the sell price. So maybe a better question for me to ask is where can I get an exchange rate for BTSXT/BTC. I have a copy of the BTS genesis block to calculate how much BTS XT I have

it does not exist yet so there is no way to tell how the market will react on an exchange... it could be $1000 it could be $0.01 and we won't know until exchanges have added it, people have access to it, and folks start trading...

9
BitShares AGS / Re: 1 AGS worth more than 1 PTS
« on: March 03, 2014, 12:48:36 am »



Knowledge
The Ultimate Proof of Work



so does your knowledge support insider trading by employees, or does your knowledge say insider trading is bad?

10
BitShares AGS / Re: 1 AGS worth more than 1 PTS
« on: March 03, 2014, 12:38:59 am »
Bytemaster... my point being... invictus claims this is all for the community and not the company... so if they are making a statement, why not back it with action...

I don't think it's unreasonable for them to acknowledge this is a potential huge conflict of interest... and to put a rule in place for employee behavior... maybe the day of or 72 hours after are not the right amounts for time... but I think there should be some buffer from people directly involved in the company... or an equal footing for those who aren't sitting around the office and know when the company is about to put out notice of a new DAC or other news that will directly impact the price...

this would seem logical and reasonable, maybe people can signup for some email announcements listing, that when company news is announced, all parties will receive and email within roughly the same time depending where they are on the list and how fast things get processed, but within minutes reasonably... then those who choose to can signup to receive company announcements and all receive the same opportunity... versus lost in the forums, website that isn't done yet, or finding out once prices double... then once all are given the same notice, employees can act 1 hour after? I don't know the time but the need to separate employee's from manipulating the market is important to the community...

if word ever got out an employee was doing this, how long do you think people would continue to support this whole project? then the community would fail because of the actions of someone who was not held to some conditions due to their ability to access information ahead of time... I think quite a lot of damage would occur if people saw employees or the company buying thousands of PTS before announcements and selling after it went up... thats damaging to us all...



While I am sure you have good intentions here, but I believe your logic is being clouded by a misplaced since of fairness.  Your premise is that *some* people are more entitled to profits and than others.  Namely, that profits belong to the lucky and not to the knowledgeable.  That having knowledge is 'unfair' and that not having knowledge and earning unexpected profits or losses is fair and virtuous.   In my opinion what is unfair is having a market where any information is being withheld from the price.   A ban on insider trading is thus a form of market manipulation and is grossly unfair to everyone. 

We are the most open development team you will find, perhaps to a fault.   Anyone can follow our code and commits and/or try the code out for themselves and know exactly where we are and make their own estimate on when things will be ready for release and how buggy it will be.  Anyone who is following us also knows that snapshots cannot be 'botched'  AND that ultimately we have no say over which snapshot the market accepts.    If we said... sorry guys, we meant March 28th... then the market would punish us dramatically and honor the 28th snapshot anyway while rejecting everything we say.

There are no victims of insider trading except those who were making the same bet AS the insider and were forced to buy at a slightly higher or slightly lower price.    These individuals will make slightly less profit from their dumb luck than they would have without the insider trading.   

Anyone with a buy and hold mentality is entirely unaffected by insider trading.

there is nothing illogical of wanting a "for the community" based company to set rules that ultimately will benefit the community...

do you honestly believe there is NO difference between an employee of invictus, and anyone else on the internet? do you honestly believe that having knowledge of the timing of announcements and deadlines the company sets internally, is not EXTREMELY advantageous compared to anyone else simply speculating without those firm dates or announcements in mind?

speculation is one thing, but having direct knowledge that will impact the community is another...

if my former employer allowed me to trade company stocks with the knowledge I had on a daily basis, I would have owned the company... however we were all forbidden due to company policy and US LAW not to trade based upon that information UNTIL IT WAS MADE PUBLIC in accepted ways... it wasn't simply post a message buried in a forum someplace... it was post it on the front of the website, it was post it to our subscribed emailers, it was release announcements to various media organizations and if they choose to run with it or bury it, we had upheld our end of what was required...

so the way you are arguing this...

am I to understand, the official invictus position, will be to allow employees and the company to buy/sell PTS prior to making public announcements (that they know will affect the value of PTS greatly in a short period), and then inform the public after they have bought/sold all they wanted to... and then buy/sell later after they've influenced demand??? is that the official stance of your company... because I would love to have that answered officially...

my sense of entitlement is that we should ALL fairly have the same opportunity... however sometimes its prudent to restrict those from the inside to certain restrictions those on the outside are not exposed to... like I said, the time frame I suggested is just that a suggestion, the goal however is equality and fairness... not insider trading advantages to any...

P.S. the insider is NOT making the "same bet" as the outsider, because as you acknowledge the insider was able to get the better price as a result of having the information prior to the public being made aware...  and buy and hold investors ARE impacted by insider trading as the long-term outcome of insider trading is usually a collapsed company as people lose trust and remove their positions in it... leaving the long-term investor impacted as a result of employee actions... so both types of traders are impacted...


11
BitShares AGS / Re: 1 AGS worth more than 1 PTS
« on: March 02, 2014, 06:44:55 pm »
Bytemaster... my point being... invictus claims this is all for the community and not the company... so if they are making a statement, why not back it with action...

I don't think it's unreasonable for them to acknowledge this is a potential huge conflict of interest... and to put a rule in place for employee behavior... maybe the day of or 72 hours after are not the right amounts for time... but I think there should be some buffer from people directly involved in the company... or an equal footing for those who aren't sitting around the office and know when the company is about to put out notice of a new DAC or other news that will directly impact the price...

this would seem logical and reasonable, maybe people can signup for some email announcements listing, that when company news is announced, all parties will receive and email within roughly the same time depending where they are on the list and how fast things get processed, but within minutes reasonably... then those who choose to can signup to receive company announcements and all receive the same opportunity... versus lost in the forums, website that isn't done yet, or finding out once prices double... then once all are given the same notice, employees can act 1 hour after? I don't know the time but the need to separate employee's from manipulating the market is important to the community...

if word ever got out an employee was doing this, how long do you think people would continue to support this whole project? then the community would fail because of the actions of someone who was not held to some conditions due to their ability to access information ahead of time... I think quite a lot of damage would occur if people saw employees or the company buying thousands of PTS before announcements and selling after it went up... thats damaging to us all...

imagine if we ALL sat around the same table, and we ALL heard invictus announce that on february 28th they will take a snapshot of the chain and will base their reward of BTS on that... we'd all have immediately gone and bought PTS since we KNEW it was about to run up quick as people scrambled to get in while they could... and shortly after invictus made the announcement, what happened to the price of PTS, it went on a steady steady rise... (almost 3x where it is today)

now imagine only employees heard that information first, and only employees bought ahead of the curve at the lowest possible price... who would you say was taking advantage of the situation? the employee who is supposed to be doing this all for the community, or the community? with great power comes great responsibility... just asking for the right use of that power, not unreasonable at all...

now imagine all this happens on every future DAC, the employee with knowledge before its made public gets a 3x return on their purchase... thats not speculating... thats insider trading...

what if, like recommended by Stan I believe, we did not hold on to PTS until march 2nd, just in case something went wrong with the snapshot... and employees knew something went wrong, and before the community did, they went out and bought PTS today for $6 each, and then after they were all done buying what they could, the company announced it would have to take another snapshot in 3 days... well now there will be a made dash to scramble up PTS as quickly as possible and once it doubles or triples again, the employees sell off and cash in... using knowledge unfairly only they had access to at the time of purchase... not unreasonable for a request of some limits in place for them...

12
BitShares AGS / Re: 1 AGS worth more than 1 PTS
« on: March 01, 2014, 05:21:05 pm »
Darkbane...  you have made your points and like you said past actions simply are what they are. 

We are focused on fixing any mistakes made as rapidly as possible and working with some of the best lawyers in the field to put things on solid footing.

and as part of the community I would appreciate some steps also being made to handle other concerns... such as a public decree stating invictus and its employees/shareholders will not purchase pts/ags before and/or 72 hours after they make announcements on DAC's or other information that may affect value of of it... I think its only fair to expect them to not use information only they are privy to for making good buys early before its released to the general public... I think something like this would go along way in a social consensus...  people underestimate your ability to use that information and get in before we're able to get in... and since invictus claims this is for the community and not for their for-profit business, that would calm a lot of speculation since we can track blocks and see who transfer what, albeit with some ability to hide transactions in unknown ID's... (not to mention insider trading laws as this is slowly being transformed into currency on the bitsharesX description page, and subject to FTC rules at that point by transitioning it into currency, despite the fact when used in other forms its simple a commodity)

otherwise using "donated" money to build up hype to raise awareness, to buy in before you do such, could make us all quite vulnerable since we're not sitting there listening to the plan of attack so to speak... so malicious things could occur which is why the company needs to divorce itself from investing in its own products, assuming these products are for the community and not for invictus... invictus said it would publish all transactions, so I assume this includes purchasing PTS, since they said they would not use any money to purchase AGS?

I acknowledge the website has recently changed to I assume handle issues raised, so while I think this is a good start, if they plan to become a true non-profit (if they choose) that will be a huge step, but until then I think having a single announcement source off the main website page, along with a statement the company and employees will not trade on information released prior or after for a period of time would go a long way... its just a huge conflict of interest to be trading in it at all...

13
BitShares AGS / Re: 1 AGS worth more than 1 PTS
« on: March 01, 2014, 05:14:07 am »
what would be the worst case / consequences in this respect (legal issues developing in a negative way)?

the worst case scenario is someone files a lawsuit against them for fraud, misrepresentation, or legal claim to assets of the company because of how this whole scenario has been handled... then all the "donations" from AGS/PTS people become part of the lawsuit and awarded as a judgement to those who sued (well whats left of it)... all it takes is one disgruntled person willing to take a step with a lawyer hungry enough to realize, they've got millions, and the lawyer will profit millions... thats generally all it takes, they can paint a picture of how "its different", however legally the court system follows printed law, not "how it should be" law... and that is what worries me... instead of getting things in order, they intend to jump in feet first and hope they don't hit a rock in the water... money has a way of putting blinders on people...

best case scenario, things go well and everything comes true...

reality of it, will probably be a mix of these two...

the big question being, how much of each and who loses more...

Worst case here: Uncle Sam (or one of his lawyers) seizes the Angel fund. Then we are there where Counterparty is now. AGS just becomes proof-of-burn - which seems to work just as well :)

Isn't the Angel Fund held in PTS and BTC? Hopefully mostly in cold storage? How is Uncle Anybody going to seize anything?

to answer your question about how can anyone seize anything...

http://www.fbi.gov/newyork/press-releases/2013/manhattan-u.s.-attorney-announces-seizure-of-additional-28-million-worth-of-bitcoins-belonging-to-ross-william-ulbricht-alleged-owner-and-operator-of-silk-road-website

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/internet/10635359/Drugs-guns-and-assassination-Silk-Road-successor-Utopia-shut-down-by-police.html

the US government seized control of millions of accounts and dollars... or has everyone forgotten this back from early 2013... there are dozens of more examples as criminals move, so does the justice department... they've sized bitcoins from many people... including this guy below trying to sue to get them back before they sell the seized asset... (and its not just america, its every government around the nation seizing them)

http://www.coindesk.com/silk-road-seller-sues-stop-government-sale/

now this is not to imply PTS/AGS have a drug problem... I'm just showing its extremely easy to seize bitcoins... so they can be taken away and sold off by the government...

I think you are over reacting a bit. The government isn't as powerful as you imply that it is. The thing with cryptocurrencies and cryptoequities is that if you take the proper precautions to protect your cryptowealth it is virtually impossible for them to seize anything. We can all learn something from SilkRoad and that is that if you don't take the proper precautions the government can in theory confiscate your cryptowealth.

However, what if your cryptowealth was not stored on your computer at home? What if someone created a DAC whose sole purpose is to ensure the security of your cryptowealth? What if your private key for your millions in cryptowealth were stored somewhere in cyberspace that only YOU knew about? This isn't like stacks of hundred dollar bills that require large amounts of energy and space to move and hide. You can literally store millions of dollars worth of cryptowealth in a few megabytes worth of data.

As far as the legal aspect goes have you forgotten that government derives its power from the consent of the governed, at least that is the way it should be. Technological innovation and the adoption of technology is exponential in nature and governments are way to slow and inefficient to do anything to stop it or slow it down. Do you think that the new class of millionaires and billionaires that this technology creates will simply not put up a fight? I believe that the adoption of this cryptocurrency and cryptoequity technology will be faster than anything that has been done before. Think about this, it took Facebook about 10 years to reach 1 Billion users or roughly half of the internet users online worldwide as of today and the vast majority of people don't use Facebook to make money as Facebook is the one that makes money from our information. Now, here we will have a technology whose fundamental purpose is profit. I think that the whole crypocurrency/cryptoequity industry will reach 1 Billion users faster than Facebook did simply because there will be a little bit of profit for everybody out there.

Believe me these people with a vested interest to protect their cryptowealth will do everything in their power to protect themselves including using their fortunes to change the law and so what used to be illegal will then be legal.

I think you're over estimating the power of a couple percent of americans doing this... and the other 95% who are not... as well as the legal foundation all laws are built on already has a regulatory process to cover many actions invictus has already done as a business in america... they've already changed the rules of the game mid-stream... they've used verbiage thats greatly opened them up to legal action... its good to see you are optimistic and think things can magically be shielded... however they can't undo the changes they've made and the wording used while making it... thats the whole issue! that alone puts everything in jeopardy and you can't erase it...

they SHOULD have been a non-profit legally registered from day ONE... they SHOULD have had VERY clear and concise methods on every step of the way... remember there was no AGS not too long ago, they changed that whole model... now change itself is not bad, but when they've made obligations through their own words and modify that, they can be held accountable for it... then the mixing of words over what AGS even is, adds more doors opened in other aspects... and this is without ANY new legislation being passed in dozens of states, this is just current laws on the books on how a business must operate, and every one of the 50 states has variations in what companies must do to comply... and clearly they have admitted in not so many words, they should have done things different...

now making a comparison to silkroad I will admit is a different scenario... one was intentional fraud obviously being commited by them... this would be unintentional and just a sheer lack of business knowledge to comply with regulations in all 50 states... however that does not excuse the possible penalties imposed by the state, or individuals who seek compensation... and they have made very clear mistakes... which can not be undone... which puts this whole grand social experiment at risk... which is our money... we deserve to be protected and they should take the proper steps... however their focis is pushing this as hard and fast as they can software wise, while ignoring the glaring red legal matters as a backburner issue they'll worry about if it arises... thats a horrendous business decision that could cost all of us at no fault of our own, everything we've done...

its not unreasonable to expect them to take as much care in legal protection as they would about say software security... without legal matters addressed, nothing else will matter how good it is because it will come to an end... and all this promised backing disappears in a heartbeat... which is a great cost to us...

14
It has come to the attention of some people following the blockchain that PTS being sent to the AGS fund is finding its way back to the fund.   This happens when ever we pay someone (bounty, salary, etc) who then decides to take the proceeds and give back.   After we pay out to a 3rd party the PTS received no longer belongs to the fund and the owners are free to sell, trade, or give as they so desire. 

I want to clarify this for people who hear complaints or rumors that we are behaving in an unethical manner. 

I heard some rumors that the Chinese were concerned about how much we were spending on refrigeration (err.. Cold Storage).  Those viewing the ledger will probably notice that we have moved the funds to many separate addresses.   These funds are being kept secure and beyond the reach of any hacker.   We have upgraded our security precautions to avoid any catastrophic loss of funds.



 


Bytemaster based on how you have been transparent and engaged with the community I personally trust you as I'm sure the rest of the community does as well. The fact that you have looked for a win win outcome for everyone involved including yourselves helps out as well. Thanks  8)

At any rate, do you feel confident that your security precautions will protect against government confiscation for any reason?

I have considered all threats including that one.  It is sad that 'in the name of protecting investors' governments are likely to steal their money and never return it while at the same time acting to prevent individuals from delivering.   The irony is lost on the government.

the irony is you guys are still using words like "investor" when clearly we are not investors according to the company... we're donators... or patrons... or in a competition... according to invictus NONE of this money belongs to us, so we couldn't possibly be investors... yet the water keeps being muddied with the terminology... the ONLY reason the government is going to seize assets is if laws were broken and the government is seizing it to cease further violations and attempt to refund to these "investors" you keep mentioning but claiming are not... THAT is where the tragedy comes in...

15
BitShares PTS / Re: fast AMD OpenCL PTS miner released
« on: February 25, 2014, 05:20:34 am »
NaN do you have plans to release more optimized miner for PTS, if yes when it can happen? :)
Is there possibility to add temperature, fan % and voltages for the GPUs in the miner?

Regards

+1 because voltage regulation is a serious lack in linux AMD drivers and we all know that cards don't need that much volotage to run... even OC... Thanks a lot :)

http://sourceforge.net/projects/amdovdrvctrl/?source=navbar

allows you to change voltage unless your card is factory locked in which case the BIOS will have to be edited?

Tried but it says that some functions are not supported by either your hardware, the Catalyst driver or the ADL. List of problems: failed to get fan speed infos and Overdrive parameters. Which makes no sense since OD is activated because both cards (r9 290) are OC and works perfectly. Fan speed is also manually adjusted by command. Didn't manage to get the info if the last available version supports r9 cards or Catalyst 14.1 beta for linux... Any idea?

I personally don't know, I run windows, I was just trying to give you an option heh... I'm not sure the 290 series can have the voltage changed without directly accessing the BIOS, and I'm not sure anyone has made a good utility for the 290 series yet (I've seen people ask like crazy but never a good answer)... the 280 and below are cake to modify the BIOS if locked...

Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8