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Messages - clayop

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76
General Discussion / Re: Why there is so little trading volume on the DEX
« on: February 09, 2016, 03:36:11 am »
Quote from: Akado on February 09, 2016, 02:38:38 am
6000 fixed or not, the point is, with one model you get to pay MT4 24x faster while at the same time providing MT4 users way lower fees than they're used to (I'm not sure about this part because I believe most would be crypto traders used to low fees maybe). I think that was his point.

I see. But according to economics 101, demand is determined by price. So 24x is not a realistic number. If we have 1000 BTS fee, he cannot recoup the cost 30x faster.
The point is, you cannot judge which fee is "killing referral" or which other is not. It also depends with demand and your business model.

77
General Discussion / Re: Why there is so little trading volume on the DEX
« on: February 09, 2016, 02:34:03 am »
Quote from: lil_jay890 on February 09, 2016, 01:53:27 am
Quote from: clayop on February 09, 2016, 01:22:21 am
Quote from: lil_jay890 on February 09, 2016, 01:12:26 am
Quote from: Bhuz on February 08, 2016, 10:04:04 pm
Quote from: lil_jay890 on February 08, 2016, 09:52:05 pm
Bottom line: There is still a fairly reasonable risk that the referral program is either removed or altered in the future.  This would have large effects on implementing mt4 in hopes of using the referral program to generate income.

For both alter or remove the referral program there would be need the shareholders approval.
Both in the case of a committee proposal trying to change some parameters, or for a deeper action involving an hardfork.

So, even if something happens on the referral program, in the end is all due to shareholders voting.
Please stop give the impression that the committee members could change things just because.

If I'm not mistaken, transfer fee's could be lowered enough to make the referral program useless.  Those fee's are controlled by the committee.  Committee members have directly expressed the desire to lower the transfer fee's to knock out the referral program because it is not popular or accepted in China.  Even BM has expressed, in mumble, an interest in lowering transfer fee's enough to make the referral program useless.

I'm not doing this just to spread fud...  Building a plugin for mt4 will be expensive.  Just the license will cost 50k-100k.  Plus probably another 50k in development time.  The referral program being left in it's current state would be absolutely critical for this to work and be profitable.  That's a lot of resources and a lot of risk to be left hanging at the whim of what seems like a fairly polarized committee.
How can you judge a certain fee level makes referral program "useless"? Do you think $10 fee per transfer is more useful for referral program?

Can you provide a number how reduced fee kills referral program?

You really wan't me to explain how lowering the transfer fee's to 1 bts kills the referall program??

Ok... say mt4 integration cost $100k.  Profit from this is based on referrals from people who create a wallet that is used in the mt4 terminal.  Right now there are approximately 100k retail trading account in the US.  Lets just say on average a trader makes 3 round trip trades a day.  Say bts captures 1% of this market.  1,000 traders making 6 trades a day = 6,000 trades.  6,000 * 1bts = $21/day... The time to pay off the 100k dollar debt to implement mt4 would take 4,761 days or 13 years.  This makes mt4 integration a non-starter as maintenance costs would probably add another 6 years onto the time it takes to get profitable.

Now lets say that the trader generates 30bts... take 80% of that (24bts) as the return for a trade.  6,000 * 24bts = $504/day.  Time to pay off the debt is 198 days.  Investors are back in the black in less than 10% of the time all while squishing spreads, adding liquidity and generating real profit for the blockchain.  The transfer fee is $0.10, substantially less than what traders currently pay.  Why have a race to 0 fee's when there is no reason to do it???
Why 6000 is fixed?

78
General Discussion / Re: Why there is so little trading volume on the DEX
« on: February 09, 2016, 01:22:21 am »
Quote from: lil_jay890 on February 09, 2016, 01:12:26 am
Quote from: Bhuz on February 08, 2016, 10:04:04 pm
Quote from: lil_jay890 on February 08, 2016, 09:52:05 pm
Bottom line: There is still a fairly reasonable risk that the referral program is either removed or altered in the future.  This would have large effects on implementing mt4 in hopes of using the referral program to generate income.

For both alter or remove the referral program there would be need the shareholders approval.
Both in the case of a committee proposal trying to change some parameters, or for a deeper action involving an hardfork.

So, even if something happens on the referral program, in the end is all due to shareholders voting.
Please stop give the impression that the committee members could change things just because.

If I'm not mistaken, transfer fee's could be lowered enough to make the referral program useless.  Those fee's are controlled by the committee.  Committee members have directly expressed the desire to lower the transfer fee's to knock out the referral program because it is not popular or accepted in China.  Even BM has expressed, in mumble, an interest in lowering transfer fee's enough to make the referral program useless.

I'm not doing this just to spread fud...  Building a plugin for mt4 will be expensive.  Just the license will cost 50k-100k.  Plus probably another 50k in development time.  The referral program being left in it's current state would be absolutely critical for this to work and be profitable.  That's a lot of resources and a lot of risk to be left hanging at the whim of what seems like a fairly polarized committee.
How can you judge a certain fee level makes referral program "useless"? Do you think $10 fee per transfer is more useful for referral program?

Can you provide a number how reduced fee kills referral program?

79
General Discussion / Re: [Poll] Which Trading Pair Do You Prefer?
« on: February 09, 2016, 12:41:19 am »
Quote from: Akado on February 09, 2016, 12:12:28 am
Using other currencies that BTS has a base is good for outsiders. We at the community might be more interested in BTS but people from the outside who are just OpenLedger clients want to trade the main, usual pairs, which makes the base currency in this case OPEN.BTC.

For new users it's way better to have OPEN.BTC with other currencies other than BTS for the simple fact that not everyone is interested in BTS, we want everyone to use the exchange, not just BTS holders.

If we don't make it attractive to the outside we won't grow. It won't be the community alone making the exchange grow, ever. New users looking to trade the main currencies in a safe way, will.

Thanks for the great input. I will keep making OPEN.BTC-BTS market and based on the poll result, will make BTS-OPEN.AAA market. Then new comers are able to convert BTC to BTS and can trade in DEX.

80
General Discussion / [Poll] Which Trading Pair Do You Prefer?
« on: February 08, 2016, 11:44:00 pm »
I'm considering to move my bot's base currency from OPEN.BTC to BTS. If you prefer BTS as a base currency, please vote for option 1. If you prefer OPEN.BTC as a base currency, vote for option 2.

81
General Discussion / Re: Why there is so little trading volume on the DEX
« on: February 08, 2016, 09:45:35 pm »
Quote from: lil_jay890 on February 08, 2016, 09:33:37 pm
Quote from: xeroc on February 08, 2016, 08:52:51 pm


Quote from: lil_jay890 on February 08, 2016, 06:59:53 pm
Too bad a lot of committee members want to destroy the referral program.
that is simply not true and you should know it better

Thanks Dad.

I didn't say all the committe members want to, but bitcrab and many of the chinese members have advocated eliminating the referral programs.
They don't actually. If they want to remove referral program, they attempted to change referral percentage. I think they want to change the structure of referral program.

82
General Discussion / Re: Will this community be surpporting BM's "zero fee" proposal to get micropayment?
« on: February 08, 2016, 06:25:02 pm »
Q1. How can we measure the network capacity?

Q2. When network is actively used and I own a small portion of BTS, how much I have to pay to transfer or order creation?

83
General Discussion / Re: Will this community be surpporting BM's "zero fee" proposal to get micropayment?
« on: February 08, 2016, 06:18:53 am »
Quote from: chryspano on February 08, 2016, 04:53:31 am
https://soundcloud.com/beyond-bitcoin-hangouts

BM speaks about this at 22:50

Thanks. Just listened the record, and found that the idea is very interesting. Looking forward to seeing more detailed proposal.

84
General Discussion / Re: Bitshares price discussion
« on: February 08, 2016, 04:21:03 am »
Quote from: Ander on February 01, 2016, 05:51:34 pm
Quote from: tonyk on January 30, 2016, 01:13:22 am
Quote from: speedy on January 30, 2016, 12:07:43 am
Quote from: Ander on January 29, 2016, 11:47:26 pm
Quote from: lil_jay890 on January 29, 2016, 07:39:05 pm
morpheus is our new Ander

I'm glad there is at least one person in the world that still believes in Bitshares' potential.

Here is something that makes me believe in BitShares - the exchange is actually growing in usage: http://cryptofresh.com/charts

The overall trend is up, and each of those peaks are higher.

You mean the asshole's "bot" is working greater each passing day?... well together of the other 'no-matching' bots?

Are the bots paying fees resulting in BTS being burned or returned to the reserve pool?  If so then it doesnt really matter whether its a bot or a person making the orders.


Successful exchanges with liquidity will attract a lot of bots.  Poloniex has tons of them, any time you put in a big order, bots will instantly move orders in front of it.

Yes they're paying. Kkachi already paid around 500~1000 (after LTM) BTS and will pay more as market grows. Durumi is under testing but is expected to work with Open.ETH.

85
Openledger / Re: No support ?
« on: February 07, 2016, 11:58:03 pm »
It seems to be down again.

86
General Discussion / Re: Things I don't like about the committee
« on: February 07, 2016, 02:56:43 pm »
Quote from: jakub on February 07, 2016, 02:50:17 pm
Please offer some understanding to people who have put their time and money on the line to build business around BitShares, not to be wiped out by a sudden change of rules.

I can tell this same statement back to you. Bitcrab also put, or maybe much more money and effort to build business on BitShares.
Ashamed is ashamed.

87
General Discussion / Re: please don't dilution for any reason at this low price
« on: February 05, 2016, 09:02:21 pm »
Alt's point maybe "not at this low price".

88
General Discussion / Re: Durumi (crane) is under testing on BTC-USD Market (smartcoins!)
« on: February 05, 2016, 08:46:49 pm »
BTC:USD best bid is now $388. More expensive than the market price :)

89
General Discussion / Durumi (crane) is under testing on BTC-USD Market (smartcoins!)
« on: February 05, 2016, 09:00:48 am »
I made another liquidity providing bot, called Durumi (crane, a bird). It's now a prototype, so there can be lots of bugs.
Please help testing Durumi. If you have bitUSD or bitBTC, you can trade them now without hassle.

Edit: Oh I just realized that I forgot very important thing. Will be back soon!Back now

90
General Discussion / Re: Let's add a small game into BitShares and have some fun!
« on: February 05, 2016, 03:20:50 am »
Quote from: abit on February 05, 2016, 12:58:18 am
Quote from: donkeypong on February 05, 2016, 12:45:18 am
I like it. The game is a gimmick, but it's fun. And if it keeps people using BitShares more frequently and for longer periods, then why not have something like this? And why not have ten different games people can play? You could even combine this with other games, such as have a faucet or bingo that hands out a random prize (more bags?) at regular intervals if someone is logged in and active.
Yup, already thought about that.

By the way, here comes some concerns:
Quote
What if an attacker make 10k accounts?
Attacker can make 1mil
He can spam the network for free
Every 24hours
shouldn't happen
Network security is always serious
There's no free service
Thanks to @clayop
My answer is: let them pay 0.1 BTS for each transfer.

Thanks for considering my opinion

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