Quote from: fuzzy on January 16, 2015, 03:37:31 am

I want all cryptos to uplift humanity and we are all walking this path together, learning and evolving in hopes of trying to make the Is it safe to say by this point that we could have a hangout with Jordan and Bytemaster to have a grown up, rational conversation about this?
world a better place overall for those here now and those in the future.  In light of this I think it would be valuable for all of us to consider having a hangout specifically on this topic where both viewpoints can be clearly and fairly represented. 

I would personally love to see this next hangout be one wherein Jordan visits our mumble server and brings any and all community members who would like to participate in an open discussion.  There is no reason why Nubits/NuShares couldn't find a way to fix these problems if in fact we come to a consensus that they are valid.

Please consider it.

NO!!! Absolutely not!

There is no point in BM arguing about a tone of nonsense every time some knucklehead comes around with his stupid ideas...

Hell, I can do a good enough job of arguing it Jordan... if you let me do so of course... I mean, if you decide that I am no longer the only person speaking on mumble worth cutting each time I open my mouth....

Quote from: JordanLee on January 16, 2015, 02:50:59 am

Quote from: Ander on January 16, 2015, 01:55:07 am

Saying that NuBits is like fractional reserve banking is a much better comparison than calling it a Ponzi.

I created a detailed post examining whether the notion of fractional reserve has any meaning within the Nu network eight hours ago. In short, because Nu is designed for zero counterparty risk and zero reserves, there can be no fractional reserve. There is, however, the related notion of a ratio of assets to liabilities:

https://discuss.nubits.com/t/regarding-reserves-and-fractional-reserve/1126

I hope you don't think it is inappropriate to post a link to our forum here, but where you are interested in fractional reserve in the context of NuBits right now, and where I just wrote about that, it seems appropriate to bring it to your attention.

Fist off I screamed for 1/2 hour before starting to write this...

You and all the rest must realize that if 20% reserves is 80% Ponzi, your system with 0% reserves  is 100% Ponzi...
Nu is designed for zero counterparty risk - Yes, there is 0% counterparty risk  ...as the buyer has assumed 100% of the risk buying something backed by 0% value...
NuBits is not Ponzi...Nubits is a self appointed federal reserve that issues non-interest bearing bonds of a self appointed organization

In short if fractional reserve banking is 75-80-90% insolvent, the fed is 100% insolvent... but they at least have some power to claim themselves worth it... It is 'no-interest bearing bond/obligation of the government'...Nubits on the other hand is also 100% insolvent/100% no value backing it and only have the words of the totally lost and clueless  'JordanLee' to  collateralize Nubits value... And by definition:

' A NuBit is no obligation bearing instrument [no interest including], aka promise for nothing by nobody and/or [JordanLee???]'

[/end rant]

We will know they are in trouble when they start offering interest to park.

I didn't understand any of the equations Nubits used, I can only do A+B=C. But it seemed they gave both systems a similar failure risk, even though BitUSD is a heavily collateralised system and theirs has very little collateral and relies on a parking premium to incentivise demand. I expect their system will collapse with a significant rise in interest rates, because that signifies a significant fall in demand to the market and only then, do you have to worry about how much interest they can afford to pay and for how long they'll do it before giving up if the system is getting away from them.

Ok I understand what your thought process was now, but yes, I want all of those people to go to a decentralized exchange. It is not confusing. People understand what exchanges are. It's fine.

It's worse to try to split up one brand into five brands and get brand recognition for all of them. Be one thing and let people hear and fined out about that, it's much more powerful. I'm sure you've seen all the conversations about the network effect on these forums.

Maybe in the future, once you've reached high adoption/critical mass, you can branch out. No one starts out like that. We've had all of these conversations before, it's like half the reason we did the merger. A good example is Facebook. They started as Facebook, then added in messaging, then eventually branched out "Messenger" as its own separate app. That wouldn't have worked if they tried to get it going on its own in parallel with the original Facebook. Same thing with Google and all of its brands.

In the long term we definitely need to break up each part. In the beginning we should focus all our efforts on a single selling point, the excellent decentralized exchange.

Quote from: Akado on January 15, 2015, 03:11:05 pm

My only problem with this is that because of the merger and now marketing 5 different business will have people think BitShares got divided again. At least it will probably get most people who aren't up to date confused again.

This is an internal idea, not something we would be trumpeting. Its not even a clear demarcation, more like refocus activities to push specific products rather than tell the folks 'Buy BitShares! the digital Onion!'

For instance, BitUSD is coming up with its own website. In future I hope we would get an wallet which only has BitUSD on the front and we would like to promote it without talking about the scaling of 101 delegates and what not. The only way any customer would know that its part of BitShares is a small *powered by BitShares logo.

Quote from: merlin0113 on January 15, 2015, 05:41:03 am

Quote from: bytemaster on January 15, 2015, 12:14:51 am

http://bytemaster.bitshares.org/article/2015/01/14/A-New-Perspective-on-NuBits/

I couldn't resist one last blog post because I didn't want the "Ponzi Post" to be the last post for a while.  After discussions on this forum I have adopted a new view on NuBits that is much more friendly and will make a better top post and hopefully repair some damage the last post may have created.

In any event, I did get some coding done today and will do more tomorrow.

Your talent on coding and writing is stunning. We need both.