IMO, its best to start centralized, see the viability and market interest, then go for decentralized.
So many crypto-projects scream decentralized from day one, spend thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours in product development and turn up with a product that ends up either being shit or used by nobody.
The lean model guys. Cut the fat!

Quote from: Freebieservers on December 13, 2015, 02:01:38 pm

If there is a Bitshares Dice system, we'd be keen on developing it.
Will talk with Kuro and hybrid about the possibilities of hacking together a basic system.

Disclosure : We have been in the works for a betting system focused on gamers for months now and are at the verge of launching it.

Regards

  Cool

Doing this on Bitshares is advantageous because of

1. Lower confirmation times
2. Transparency.

This is one of the projects that can truly show the power of Bitshares and increase the market cap, but am not sure if we'll be able to attract sufficient users overnight. Bitcoin has a much larger user base in comparison with Bitshares so its a quick to access market.

The way I see it,

1. A user sends Bitcoin to our electron-io system (new ui and cross exchange coming soon)
2. Gets bitshares in the betting system
3. Places bets
4. Either takes winning or losses in Bitshares or can get it exchanged instantaneously from electrons.io

Beautiful user case that brings both users and profitability.

Regards

Quote from: fav on December 13, 2015, 01:18:13 pm

Quote from: bitacer on December 13, 2015, 01:16:41 pm

Quote from: fav on December 13, 2015, 01:11:52 pm

Quote from: bitacer on December 13, 2015, 01:09:47 pm

Quote from: fav on December 12, 2015, 09:42:04 am

I think the bot is running stable and testing should be over soon.

Is there any tutorial showing how to setup sharebits, I would like to know :
1- Whats a security code, what daoes it do and how do get it ?
2- How do I connect it witm my forum account?
3- Is ıt possıble to withdraw the same funds previously deposited into the account.

that's easy!

go to sharebits.io
click the robot to sign in
use your forum name

in order to withdraw, you need a security code that's messaged to your forum name and is proof that you're actually using sharebits.

I attached my forum name to my twitter sign-in, so you won't need a bot message for example

thats the thing I dont get security message

you mean you don't receive the security code?

@Freebieservers

thats correct I dont

Very weird.
I saw a similar experience here
https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19852.msg265455.html#msg265455

@hybridd  can you please help bitacer out?

Regards

Why don't the two of you take this to some place personal ?
Noone cares really.
This only makes you guys look bad in the eyes of a prospective user?

I understand where both sides are coming - thanks to the experience I had with killakem, but we came to a conclusion post taking discussions private.
Instead of "competing" blogs- you could possibly find synergies and collaborate.

Sorry for stepping in.
This is ...none of my business.
But its sad to see two very interesting members of the forum spend their time like this.


Regards

Quote from: Freebieservers on December 13, 2015, 08:08:14 am

Yea so?
Just because there's a poll doesn't mean it has to happen.

At least one is not over-dramatising. Consider this as an indicator to change the design.

Yes.
Having that said, I believe the matter could be presented in a  better fashion.
Reaching out to the team and discussing a way to settle this would have been a lot more smarter in my opinion.
We had always maintained that the posts by the bot will be removed as the project grows and spam has been in our view since early on.
When people work 24/7 in building communities they tend to take things very personally.
People say "Sorry, nothing personal, its just business", but some of the members I know here are so engrossed in business, sometimes, anything against one's business, becomes absolutely personal. I experienced this in the past so I know what it feels like.

If all of us just got on counterstrike servers and decided to kill each other every time we got stressed, I think decision making would have been a lot more easier and fun. Recommended Fuzzy too - to go play some CS for a bit.  Maybe we could do a CS session instead of the mumble session some day.

I see some good inputs from the members here and am glad to see that the thread has gone from an all out offensive to a collaborative effort to fix things.

Sometimes, being in biz dev in crypto..feels a lot like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-hUV9yhqgY

... but it does come up with some ingenious solutions.

Yea so?
Just because there's a poll doesn't mean it has to happen.

Disclaimer : The following is my (personal ) thought on the bot, and am not speaking as a representative of Freebieservers in this post. My stances could/would change, depending on the varying perspectives and insights I attain.



I'd first envisioned the bot to be a system of transfer of value. A means for individuals or companies to disperse tokens of value to the masses in an easy and intuitive fashion. In case you compare the bot with other systems the team ensured the redemption and delivery process was cut to the bare basics with no unwanted additions around it. Even when building the bot, kuro, hybridd and fuzzy did an incredibly amazing job of ensuring the community was heavily involved in testing and shipping the first iteration of the product. What am trying to state is, the system was built, for the people, by the people and intended to be a system of transfer of value from day 1.

However, where communities are involved, unintended consequences often emerge. The user cases for the bot in this forum is hilarious and sad at the same time. It is "fun" to see people tip but am yet to see the economic implications of the same. Imagine, facebook had posts everywhere saying "You have been tipped 1 Like, go here to redeem it" , "You have been tipped  3 shares, go here to access it". It would look ugly. The system allows individuals to do certain things, but I believe the system was built to be a system of value transfer and not of tokens with no value inbuilt. That said, any token can be of value if individuals are purchasing / trading them. Due to the same, it is imminent that these tokens being made have substance beneath them - and individuals put in effort to show people why the tokens are of value. If all you want to say is "LOL" - then hey, why not have a better forum that allows you to express it without having to depend on a system of value transfer ?

Personally, I see the bot as an incredibly amazing system of value transfer. Just today I was hiring from a forum of gamers for a project and we had 25 applicants come in, and I sent out some bts as a form of  appreciating their interest. The bot permits me to create n number of links and send it. Imagine how amazing this will be for e-mail campaigns where we could integrate the links into the e-mails and "potential" customers could just click on the link and redeem access tokens to a newly released service ? How about dropping in the share url to a message you send to a vc ?  As a matter of fact, once the overhaul of electrons.io is out, I'll probably be demoing the simplicity of the system. Users will be able to
>Redeem bts with the click of a link
>Exchange bts to btc with a single transfer
These are functions that are as normal as breathing. Product design and user experiences have broken down to the bare minimum to make sense to the average joe on the internet.

I believe, the bot should stay on the forum, but I also see that it is emerging to be a form of spam. Increasingly, trolls have used it to make their point.
Power is a crazy thing to give to everyone, and yet it is what makes communities like these what it is. Its what adds essence to democracy.  It would be good to see a decrease in the misuse of the bot. However, I would like to emphasise on the fact that the bot is an incredible tool when it comes to empowering individuals to share their tokens of value within the community. Due to the same, this discussion shouldn't end with "yes, bot good" , "no, bot bad". Its got to evolve into "Yes, bot is good, but how do we ensure its used for good" . That would probably evolve this discussion into something along the lines of gun control, but if you truly want to see change, we'll need to tackle the tough questions.


I believe, great products cannot be run on the lines of democracy. Every ass in the world has an opinion and it is not possible to value all of them. However, great products also run upon the opinions and inputs of users. Therefore, I request each one of you to suggest changes we can make and we can work in a constructive fashion towards improving what we have here.

Quote from: Freebieservers on July 04, 2015, 03:33:31 am

Forums have been at the crux of how we share information and conduct discussions for over 2 decades now. From the beginning,its been a simple platform that allows basic functions : sharing text, sending PM’s and occasionally uploading media content. However, with the arrival of blockchain, one would expect the system to evolve. To somehow be able to transfer value on the blockchain, maybe login with a wallet id and engage in business and discussions while being able to access the wallet right through the forum. However, in spite of all the progress we’ve made in the crypto-sphere over the years, we are yet to see how the blockchain and forums can be brought together.

User experiences are dispersed across exchanges,wallets and a laundry list of services. Why is it that forums have to be so mundane when they can be redeveloped to bring together the best of both worlds ? Why is it that plugins have to be developed to be able to tip a user whose posts actually helped you ? Probably because no one attempted to combine the blockchain and a forum in an intuitive manner.

The way discussions are held in the community today is completely decentralized. Ideas are dispersed across skype chats, slack discussions and the deepweb. Who knows what kind of treasure trove is lost on a daily basis between the piles of chat logs. This also creates a system where people have to run through multiple systems to keep on with what’s going on in the industry. The new system will be a central home-base of sorts that allows users to keep a check on the progress of projects, and socialize at the same time.


ULTRA is our attempt to bring a change to that. We believe, it is possible to bring the blockchain and a forum together and create a sustainable business around it. We believe, it is about damn time, someone took a system that is over 2 decades old and made it appealing enough to the masses.


The key aspect to successfully combining multiple communities that in themselves are successful due to micro niches and other factors, is to integrate the features that draw the users without sacrificing the experience for something completely unique and foreign, to this end the data structure can not take place entirely on the blockchain, it will have to function much like a centralized forum system with chat logs and other functions being passed between database servers for failover, that being said - user information such as identity could be placed on the blockchain so even outside of the system, it can be accessed.

Privacy is an aspect that draws all users to congregate in more secure systems, to that end the goal of this system will be to make everything from chats, to personal information optional and stored in an encrypted manner such as that the administrators can not access it without permission from the user.  Private groups and direct messages will naturally never be stored, and integrated voice features will use an encrypted method.

Core features

Hybrid Logins

We believe it is time we combined user names with blockchain identities. The core login aspect would be made on the blockchain. In order to login to a system, a user will be made to login to his wallet, thereby giving him instant access to his funds in the system. The money will be stored on the blockchain, with the servers having zero access to funds. This would work as an open authorization on the blockchain.



Tipping

The function would allow users to tip those creating threads of valuable information, thereby creating incentive for users to post content with depth and quality. In the current model of the forum, connecting an external tipping service has become impossible due to outdated systems. We believe a tipping system can be connected right onto the forum, with the ability to see the statistics of amount tipped, received and other details right on the forum without need for external services.




Moderation techniques

Communities could be moderated by means of moderators that are voted into power in real time using the nxt vote feature. This could also be used to upvote and downvote threads in real time, thereby creating a user regulated system that allows for the propagation of information that appeals to the end user and  helps avoid spam of unnecessary services by miscreants. 




Social integration

The new forum will be targeted at the new stream of users that come searching about Nxt as some of the core projects explode. The concern is to make an intuitive interface for people to explore what nxt offers in an easy to access fashion. The idea is to make them feel accommodated as they come searching about us. While there will be traditional forms of login and a method to access the forum with the wallet , there will also be something along the lines of a “hybrid” login. This feature allows a user to combine the wallet id, with his social id.  The possibilities of what this could offer to the forum are countless. Imagine being able to tip directly to someone’s twitter account from the forum. Thereby ushering in a new age of virality to the community.


Current systems suffer from several key problems, such as the restriction of information due to lack of knowledge, for example a user may be too intimidated to pursue knowledge about NXT due to supernet being somewhat tough to access and understand. ULTRA is, among other things, an attempt to break down the intimidating barriers and large requirements of knowledge that come with using crypto-currency, while simultaneously allowing the advanced users to have a central location to connect and explore projects and niche communities that otherwise would be separated by an immense gulf of required understanding and expertise.

Other possible areas this system could expand to could include freelance and smart contract systems, to allow linking crypto developers together and let them start, crowdfund, manage and promote projects all in the same place. Current forums and chat systems make this process extremely impersonal, no one can decide on a contract or what project management suite to use, which svn or git service to use, the problems are endless when connecting professionals with entrepreneurs who need them.

It’s important to remember the reason users connect; information. To this end, one of the main goals of ULTRA will be to organize users into their respective niches, suggesting connections that allow them to expand their social horizon and explore opportunities they had not considered. the creation of groups, subgroups, teams, committees and all sorts of other groups should be allowed and enabled through the system to enhance a user's ability to congregate, explore and decide things together. 

Once past the primary development phase, a mobile application will need to be made, and a heavy campaign should be made to bring other crypto communities onto ULTRA - there should be no reason why the majority of the features can not be used with other blockchains, though some clearly will not work, NXT should always be the central blockchain we use for storing data and secure information. Ideally, a user could come in and manage their bitcoin wallet, tip with bitcoins and earn bitcoins for posting on a forum or participating in a group chat, all because they chose the option bitcoin instead of NXT.

ULTRA should look to expand its offerings on every front and partner with every possible technology driven market niche, things like allowing users to pay for a lyft car with their ULTRA wallet or sign a contract with the ULTRA app should be not only possible but easily integrated into our daily world once adoption is mainstream, the possibilities for ULTRA as both an identity verification system and payment processor are endless because of the trustless environment.

As development expands, ULTRA could be made to take over the roles of many market, advertising, social and business functions to allow a central location for people to meet and discuss, not just about one currency or one niche, but all of them in any array of subject - we envision a system that has the power of facebook with the privacy you have always dreamed of and the powerful features from every system you have ever used, ULTRA aims the first place you look for all the important information that makes your world go round.
Other possible features:


Portfolio management

Users could have their account listing and their portfolio displayed in real time. Users could also look up at the portfolio held by other members of the community in real time, adding more transparency to the ecosystem.


Asset Exchange

We believe it is time we quit with the asset exchange  listing on external sites or wallets. Why not have asset listings and transactions made right within the forum ? If asset listings could be made right from the forum then the need for an external login would be removed thereby adding to the user experience. Think of what secureae offers right within the forum itself.


DB Decentralization

Given the high amount of downtime faced by services like BCT it becomes incredibly important for users to be able to access the forum in a secure fashion even if one or two fo the servers goes down. By basing the service on the cloud and using dns failover and db synchronization techniques a high level of uptime could be maintained. while the server will still be in a central location, security will be managed by cloud services and failover can ensure that users never truly see the system down.




Just some of the things, I think we should evolve into.
Am happy getting this dev’ed through a fund raiser or something.

Hey guys,

Been bouncing the concept at Nxt forum.
Wanted to know what bitshares guys thought of this.
I am not sure something similiar is being built for Bitshares.


P.s - Am only bouncing a concept here, checking if there's sufficient interest.

Sharing a concept I'd posted way back.
Been doing some research on digital governance.
Happy to chip in.

Regards