关于ags，我有一个疑问：当初说pts是bts的先发，后面90%的bts还会以挖矿产生，记账系统也通过挖矿实现。现在bts计划改成pts+ags，以后pts挖光以后（应该发生在2014吧），bts记账如何实现？

这也是最大风险之处， 矿工维护系统的安全，90%的BTS支付给矿工的安全费用，在新的记账机制没有出来之前，砍掉了安全支出。  最近想了很多方法
倘若BTS 只是3I 的过渡产品的话， 如果BTS 不是很成功，3I可以继续开发DAC，要记住只有BTS 才是 50%PTS，50% AGS,  其他DAC 都是 10%PTS  10%AGS，

不过没有风险就么有机遇，双刃剑

Quote from: vj.xiang on January 02, 2014, 05:22:41 am

Quote from: Amazon on January 01, 2014, 06:40:58 pm

Quote from: vj.xiang on January 01, 2014, 05:49:39 pm

本人认为AGS这种行为非常恶劣！首先大家要知道这种所谓以捐赠形式获得ags，就是变相的圈钱。亲王以偷换概念的形式误导大众（说是捐赠，但是融资），姑且不说他是否有利益相关，但这样有违从事金融行业的身份。ags并不是通过挖掘产生，是3i通过发行产生。ags与pts拥有相近的权益，ags也像pts已经分配到DAC的权益和bts的资产，也就说开发团队不再参与市场公平竞争，自己独自发行原本属于大众的dac权益和bts资产！本来pts是大众通过精力和成本开挖出来的，但是3i自己认为原来的利益不够，变相圈了钱并损害了其他市场玩家的利益。如果按照与pts目前价格相等的市值，ags也就是市值2亿多人民币！！！而且这部分的利益完全由开发团队3i与利益相关者共享。而且开发团队3i可以通过重复投资的方式（借投资ags的钱再买ags）来控制ags的价格！

AGS所获得的捐赠全部会用于DAC的开发，3I不会保留其中的一分钱，BTC地址和PTS地址的所有收入和支出都有帐目表，圈钱的话哪有自己不留一点钱的？发行AGS唯一的目的不是为了给开发团队更多的收入，而是鼓励社区里每一个人的参与，用AGS的捐赠鼓励开发团队之外的每一个人有能力的人开发出更多的DAC，因为开发团队毕竟人力精力有限。如果如你所说变相圈钱损害了其他玩家的利益，为什么PTS的价格在AGS宣布后会增长？

关于重复投资，AGS的支出是公开的，接受每个人的查账。如果公司要获得更多的股份，直接保留一部分AGS或者根本不发布PTS是不是能获得更多的利益呢？如果连这点信任都没有，又为何要相信PTS和BTS等一系列的承诺呢？

我认为你偷梁换柱的想法十分严重。首先我要说明的是pts价格不能说明开发团队3i是否损害其他玩家的利益，毕竟价格的涨跌因素很多，价格操纵，信息披露等等，没有因果关系，所有不要再次误导其他玩家。第二，因为3i公司需要圈钱，竟然把恶劣的手段已偷换概念的形式委婉地表达出来：说是捐赠的形式，但是实际上类似于增发！学过金融，玩过股票的人都知道，股票上一般增发需要股份啊，3i公司怎么做？把原本属于市场玩家的权益以偷梁换柱地形式变成自己的！pts本来就是类似于股权证明的东西，你所拥有的pts就是代表你将来拥有dac和bts的权益！但是3i公司觉得在自己的游戏规则下所挖出的pts不够，于是就把原来属于pts玩家dac和bts的权益来分配给ags！ags是3i公司自己发行出来的啊！！也就是说这部分dac和bts的权益从玩家变成3i公司自己的了！！！可悲地是市场玩家还蒙在鼓里，一点都不知情！说好听一点是抢，难听点就是偷！这种损害股东的行为在公安系统里面是刑事罪！需要判刑的！

另外3i公司通过ags融到的钱当然是要说要投入开发中，难道是说拿到的钱一部分拿来去夜店去买豪车吗？当然不会！但是我估算ags产生大概2亿多人民币，当年中本聪开发btc都没那么花钱！更别说开发google，facebook，ebay了！不是很可疑吗？3i公司拿来套现很容易啊，通过这部分钱再找下家把部分股权卖掉！手上已经有2亿多的现金，估值能起码10亿吧。但是大家别忘了，这2亿多哪里来？是最先通过窃取pts玩家的权益来的！！

你才误导大众呢。

1. 不经pts股东进行分布式决策，通过该方案，3i无权也无力擅自决定稀释股权。
2. 挖矿是通过算力入股，获得原股东通过稀释，支付出的股权。现在是靠资助开发获得。所以你获得股权的方案一直没变，那就是对(D. A.) Corporation 做贡献，并且严格按比例。甚至连“开采”的方法上，也是按照严格模拟挖矿来的。
3. "学过金融，玩过股票的人都知道，股票上一般增发需要股份啊"  后半句语句都荒诞，前半句更似蓄意煽动。“把原本属于市场玩家的权益”，这句也不像话，“市场玩家”？“原本属于”？你这不是偷换概念，你是根本不成逻辑。"以偷梁换柱地形式变成自己的" 在钱换股这件事情上，股的所有权，很明确。钱的所有钱，也是持股者。使用权，归3i。但3i有义务汇报每笔钱的用途。
4. 是啊，开发搜索引擎不要钱啊，开发btc也不要时间啊，甚至连知识也不用啊。什么也不用也能造啊。哈哈。真好。即使要用钱，一元和一万元都是钱，没啥区别呀。多好。
5. 3I 有没有跑路风险？我同意你的话，有。这和你把钱或长期或临时地放进不被现有法律法规仔细规制限制行为的交易网站是一样的，只是因为目前没有更好的办法。那为什么还有那多么人投？别人都傻？别人不懂博弈论？他们是不相信3i傻到跑路。
6. 所以，是谁最终决定的稀释股权？当然是DAC股东。只不过这个DAC叫PTS。那3i太狡猾，DAC股东太傻，通过了一个错误的提案？如果，如果，万一，真那样的话，在DAC世界，能说服51%股权的人，就能为所欲为。这也是游戏规则。

你很怀疑 3i 的动机。我很怀疑你的动机。

对其他不评论，只评论第二条，矿工不是算力入股， 矿工是通过算力来保障网络的安全而获得报酬的， 挖矿所得是报酬， 如果3I公司真能弄种算法出来，既不通过挖矿又能保证网络安全的话，那AGS是非常有价值的，但现在披露的算法来说，应该是看不到，让我们拭目以待吧。。

PTS权益未变，只是后期没有矿工什么事了。3I融资在1亿左右，用于开发是好事。用2亿PTS投资一亿资产的公司要比投资几百万资产的公司风险小。

本质就是, BTS 中90%需要矿工挖矿得到的,   90%BTS是支付给矿工, 作为矿工维护系统安全的报酬, 现在3I公司把用于安全支出的费用,全部归到自己名下,  3I是不是想长期维护BTS,是一个值得警惕的陷阱,
倘若BTS将来不成功, 3I转入下一个DAC的开发,   而其他DAC的开发 无论是 PTS还是AGS只有10%的权益,    这个是值得大家警惕的.

We are preparing to launch the Alpha client for Keyhotee.  This client will allow you to create your Profile and identities.  Once you have created your Identity within the Keyhotee client you will send us your public key (copied from Keyhotee) and we will integrate that into the genesis block for your ID.

This public key will also allow you to claim the Angel Shares we have awarded all Keyhotee Founders.   

More details regarding this process will be posted here and on our website in the days ahead.  Once we have all public keys we can launch the genesis block.

you konw many people store their PTS on exchange platform ,   do we need to send the PTS to personnal wallet from exchange platform.  for this keyhotee luanch?

  join in

Quote from: WaPTS on December 03, 2013, 02:41:32 pm

Quote from: bytemaster on December 02, 2013, 09:59:05 pm

Quote from: freeworld on December 02, 2013, 09:42:16 pm

I don't believe it's fair to say that BTC has a 10% yearly inflation.  The total supply is 21 million coins that's what Satoshi decided.

If Satoshi released all 21 million coins right away (or at least within the first year), then we would have 0% inflation since the cap has been reached.  What difference does it make if the 21 million units are released gradually or all at once (besides the fact that releasing all at once would be terrible).

If I make another btc clone and flood the market with 21 million coins, is it even fair to say that my coin has zero inflation and BTC has 10% inflation?

Your right, BTC has 12% yearly inflation      

All that matters is potential 'coins in circulation'.  Every time a new coin is mined someone has financial incentive to sell to cover the cost of mining and this selling pressure devalues the coin.  Imagine what would happen to BTC price if miners were not dumping on the market?

I don`t understand why you say there is inflation in BTC,  BTC is coin other than the shares of all BTC,  10000 BTC only can buy pizza  four years ago ,but now 1BTC maybe can buy 100 pizza or more , it is deflation.
if the inflation you say is ?
1BTC is 1/2,000,000 of all BTC ( when the acount of created BTC is 2,000,000 )  ,1BTC is 1/12,000,000 of all BTC ( when the acount of created BTC is 12,000,000 now)

You are not understanding what inflation is. Inflation is just the increase in money supply. Period.
Because Bitcoin is still mined, it is inflationary. It will cease to inflate at some point, but not right now.
What you really mean is that Bitcoin increases its VALUE at a much higher rate that its inflation.
So you should separate the concepts of value and inflation, they are not the same.

maybe we have different concepts of inflation ,

I am really looking for attacks on my pos system


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can we develop a system to avoid the 51% attack totally , I have some thinking , in democratic society, one person have  larger  power and he only have one vote,  a node have larger power of hash ,it is only mean  he have the larger capacity for mining,  not the larger power of main chain,
we can think as following
1. one node cannot find two continuous bolck
2. the difficulty of every node is different,  for example if the node not find the bolck in 10min , the difficulty is same as the normal  difficulty, but if the node can one bolck in 10 min the difficulty become the 2*normal difficulty ,  if find 3 bolck in 10min ,the difficulty become the 4*normal difficulty , and so on ,   if we need to 6 bolck confirm , though a man have 51% power of hash , he also cannot carry out 51% attack.

A 5870 runs at 420 cpm so a 7950 should run at around 700-800 cpm i guess, which turns a 4 gpu 7950 rig into a 2800-3200 cpm beast beating every "high end" cpu out there easily.

You need 9 32 core c3 amazon instances to get that number, running at roughly 4.5$ per hour, a quad 7950 rig draws around 1.2 KW -> even in sucky Germany lousy 30 Cent per hour. Around the world even below 10.

Come again why this is good? This makes PTS more profitable than LTC and you don't want big farms to switch...this might push out cpus pretty quickly, making it a bit more specialised.

yes I think we should have GPU miner , because service adminer can use the company service miner PTS for free , and it is a big harm for PTS , so we should have GPU miner as noon as posibble