I also see you said I will get 2.5x the BTS XT than before... what is BTS XT... this is the first time I am reading about this now... I thought I was getting BitSharesX... you say 2.5x someone else says 1.3x someone else says 1.1x all messages posted within 24 hours... did they change name of the new currency already?!

3.33/1.3 = 2.5

As for BTSXT https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php?topic=2940.0  See, you didn't really go through hundreds of posts
[/quote]

I have read thousands of messages... how many hours can I spend trying to make heads or tails of ALL these changes and variations and spinoffs they make...

I started with PTS, it was supposed to become whatever the final name was... BitsharesX... now its XT and then 3 other things only linked to that

if you can't mine BTX... what is the sense of even having it?!?! why not just remove the middle man there and spinoff the other DACs onto PTS instead of adding this 50/50 split among PTS AGS... it makes no logical sense... except I see they want more angelshare investing in it... so they just want to do another round of money grabbing on top of this round that still has well over 100 days of "donations" to complete...

someone directed me to a link... http://invictus-innovations.com/social-consensus/

so reading all that (which I have posted below) it says PTS shareholders will get 10% of all DACs in one point, which means AGS shareholders get nothing for some DACs... then below that it says there will be an even PTS 10% and AGS 10% for DACs built upon this OTHER platform... so PTS they are saying should get 10% no matter if it was assisted with AGS money or not, and AGS only gets 10% if it comes from that funding support... but have AGS shareholders been clearly informed they will only receive shares if the DAC was created on this "BCSL" platform? or are they under the impression they will get shares of everything too? I have so many more questions than I began with...


====================== website copy and paste below ==================


Statement of Social Consensus

Google defines a Social Contract as “an implicit agreement among the members of a society to cooperate for social benefits.” Another term that means the same thing is Social Consensus.  We use the terms interchangeably, but prefer Consensus because it is simply more accurate.   It also emphasizes the two-way nature of the consensus.   It is beyond our control to prevent a copycat from forking our open source code in a way that fails to honor this consensus.  It is up to the market to reject this, or not.

BitShares PTS (a.k.a "proto-shares") is a digital currency just like Bitcoin.  The difference is that PTS is backed by something of more tangible value - the future potential of an entire new  industry of Decentralized Autonomous Companies (DACs),  The PTS Social Consensus simply states that holders of PTS will give preference to DACs that initialize their internal money supplies proportionally to the current distribution of the PTS currency.  Savvy DAC developers do this to gain the rapid support of PTS holders who represent the overwhelming majority of knowledgable early adopters of DAC-backed currencies.  It is thus a more targeted give-away than the typical mining-based lottery system used by most crypto-currencies.  It targets established early adopters who can help get the new DAC adopted quickly.

Our first formal statement of the PTS Social Consensus was that we would support only DACs that honor BitShares PTS.  This was first published in our October newsletter and again in our forum on Nov 3, prior to genesis on Nov 5, 2013:

At a DAC’s pre-published launch time, the DAC’s genesis block shall be initialized
to precisely match the current unspent outputs of its corresponding PTS blockchain.

A week later we informally generalized this to at least 10% of all DACs we support. 

All chains shall be derived from PTS,
with a 1:1 mapping and 10% of the ultimate money supply of that chain.

The 10% requirement is a minimum, since any number greater than that also satisfies the consensus.  The 1:1 mapping and 10% minimum together set an upper limit on the number of shares a DAC may allocate.  If only 1.5M PTS exist at DAC release, then 15M is the derived upper limit to number of shares for that DAC.  Developers may equivalently exercise the right to scale the share count to the needs of each DAC while preserving percentages for all stakeholders.

In this document, we are formally endorsing an integrated BitShares Social Consensus for PTS, AGS and all derived BitShares DACs. This consensus is further defined in the BitShares Consensus Software License (BCSL).  We also clean up the language to better comply with the laws of our jurisdiction. To that end, Invictus will only endorse, support and promote DACs that meet all of the following applicable consensus requirements:

For all third party DACs:

Allocate at least 10% of its internal money supply to PTS holders at genesis.

For DACs built on the BCSL platform provided through AGS donations:

Allocate at least 10% of its internal money supply to PTS holders at genesis.
Allocate at least 10% of its internal money supply to AGS holders at genesis.
Allocate the last 80% at the discretion of each DAC developer.

We endorse 50-50 for the first BitShares DAC to equally honor mining-lottery and patron-donor schools of thought. 

For the first BitShares DAC:

Allocate 50% of its internal money supply to PTS holders at genesis.
Allocate 50% of its internal money supply to AGS holders at genesis.

The total internal money supply shall be scaled to 4 million shares, equally divided between the two schools.

This makes all of BitShares early supporters “official BitShares distributors” for those who arrive later!
We can't think of a more fair and decentralized way to make shares of the money supply available to them.

We hope you agree.

Specifications for the last 80% of other future DACs will vary with developer according to their business model and marketing strategies and shall be specified prior to their genesis.   Until they are defined formally on this page, all forum discussion is for the purpose of reaching consensus, and any sharing of current thinking there does not constitute a commitment to any specific course of action.

A formal statement of legal terms and conditions may be found here.

[quote author=Darkbane link=topic=3099.
There may be some 3rd party DACs which may decide honour PTS but not AGS.

You get more of BTSX - 2,5x time in fact; but not the future ones since AGS is going to keep generating after 28th February. Remember, by future DACs, I mean entirely different DACs. All the BTSX chains which are going to be released will follow the initial BTS XT and so, yes, AGS is much better.

See you just gave me misinformation and speculation in the forums showing my point that there is no one place to get clear and concise information... because on the website it says the information below... however when reading forums I read messages from people who seem to be moderators which to my understanding would mean they are employees or knowledge people, and they even say one time they can't force a DAC to honor this, and then this information says that DACs will have to follow this... then its called a donation, then a share, then an earnings... you see where I am coming from with my frustration... they don't even seem to know what it is some days... and with it clearly having changed, they needed to go remove those threads, or modify all the messages stating what it is... this is why one central location for information is critical... the word "should" below means maybe it will maybe it won't... then it goes on to say that it will "require" them to... so is it maybe, maybe not, or required... I don't know!

(you can't tell me I am investing in a cow and then I show up and two chickens are before me... I wanted the cow in your advertisement)


At least 10% of the BitShares should be allocated to holders of BitShares PTS.
At least 10% of the BitShares should be allocated to holders of BitShares AGS.
The remaining BitShares should be customized to the needs of each BitShares chain.

This emerging social consensus and resulting network effect will be further reinforced by the Social Consensus Software License which will require each derivative software product to initialize its blockchain according to this consensus.

There may be some 3rd party DACs which may decide honour PTS but not AGS.

You get more of BTSX - 2,5x time in fact; but not the future ones since AGS is going to keep generating after 28th February. Remember, by future DACs, I mean entirely different DACs. All the BTSX chains which are going to be released will follow the initial BTS XT and so, yes, AGS is much better.

so essentially... all my PTS could be worthless (as a hold in theory) for future DACs because they won't be forced to honor what they said they would have to honor... they can just pick and choose with the honor system and I have no clear future understanding and will again have to go through this process of guess what they'll do or not do and change and not change every other day???

I mean getting started I was told, PTS would get you shares in everything, then I see AGS now gets half the shares, then I see AGS was cheaper to get than PTS, then I see future DACs may or may not honor PTS or AGS or both or one or who knows what they will do... how can anyone trust in something that has no rules or clear path... the path has changed week to week! and all my informations comes from rumors and maybes from folks in a forum!

I finally saw they planned to launch an official website on march 21st... should that not be the FIRST thing they do BEFORE they decide to do all the rest... I can't even get updates and clear information on their current website... all speculations and maybes from strangers in a forum and I have no clue who is a developer or not... SO FRUSTRATING.

Quote from: Darkbane on February 22, 2014, 06:28:37 pm

This all leaves me completely and utterly confused... if I keep my PTS, will I continue to get shares of every future DAC? or is that only for AGS holders now?

AGS and PTS are on par in this regard, though you can't sell AGS with the tradeoff being you get a lot more BTSX from AGS.

So basically if your whole purpose of PTS was to make and hold, for returns on future DAC's... its actually pointless to keep PTS and you might as well get AGS since you get more of every future DAC?

it also could be already existing server farm that is currently (temporary?) switching to PTS due to the 28th February event.

It seems like the february 28th event is now march 15th about... they've hinted at this in other threads on this forum... so who knows when it'll really hit, they just said the ides of march has significance to them...

looks like they are saying the snapshot will be taken february 28th for march 15th... I wish they would start posting clear information as they are just releasing so much information without clarity... AGS is already making me fume after they said PTS was the way in... so many changes how do you follow them.

It wouldn't take $250k to reach 1mill cpm. I estimated it at ~$150k. But his activity is very suspicious, its like it took him a day or so to set up his rigs with the correct configs and then boom just throw them all at the pool at once.

Well I'm estimating total costs... video cards alone assuming a 280X $400 for 3500cpm would take 300+ cards... thats 120k there plus tax and delivery... start throwing in all the additional support hardware, the facilities to cram all that into, the upgraded power requirements and electrical facilities alone would cost a lot of money... you can't do that in a home without massive upgrades to industrial power... so it makes more sense they are using an industrial facility wired for that much power... massive industrial cooling for 100,000 watts... knowing what its taken for datacenters I have helped with, its well into a quarter million...

thats why I think its just suspicious activity that is most likely some funny business going on with cpu stealing from thousands of computers... maybe I'm wrong, but you just don't see many people with over 300 video cards, most likely well beyond that using earlier models if it was someone who was building up... but hey maybe I am wrong and someone really has spent money on all that... but its illogical they would suddenly appear here in such small  fragments earlier, and then explode recently.

The monster below recently started mining on the pool, this guy has to have over 1mill c/m.

"Pra7CmiuQKR1wnTS4Ps8KfG4bpA1kzse4B": 3.6886357952192643

http://mypts.eu.org/?a=Pra7CmiuQKR1wnTS4Ps8KfG4bpA1kzse4B

yes this is clearly not an individual person who has been doing this for long... looking at the track record from the website they clearly have an explosion in computing power they did not have before... I'm wondering if this is one of those botnets that people talk about hijacking pools with their stolen computing power...

assuming it was GPU power, it does come out to over 1 million cpm, and the dollar in hardware required would be close to a quarter million dollars... now if its using CPU power that number well more than doubles in cost... something about it just absolutely stinks...

in a one hour period on the 21st the computing power jumps almost 15x what it was using before... in just an 8 hour period they made almost $1000 in coins... something is fishy...