Quote from: cn-vote on September 03, 2019, 04:19:02 pm

Quote from: clockwork on August 31, 2019, 07:57:55 am

Thanks to lin5464 for the translation.

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In light of recent discussions about worker funding and the voting shift with refund 400k worker, and considering a down payment and commitment has been made for the sponsorship I want to make the following update and amendments to the worker budget to ensure continued funding so that the sponsorship fee will not be money down the drain.

鉴于最近对工人提案注资的讨论以及投票转移到refund 400k提案，考虑到对去中心化峰会已作出的承诺和已支付的订金，为了确保本提案能持续获得注资以及赞助费不被白白浪费掉，我想对此提案预算作出以下更新和修订。

For tax purposes, payment of the sponsorship costs was handed over to the BBF. This saves us the VAT calculated in the original worker while incurring a 5% escrow cost, bringing the total sponsorship cost to  116.5k instead of 135.5 for a saving of 19k USD.

出于税务上的考虑，赞助费用的款项已交由BBF托管。这虽然增加了5%的托管手续费，但节省了原提案中需要缴纳的增值税，此举使得赞助费从135.5k美元减少到116.5k美元，省下了19k美元。

Additionally at least 4 of the core team members who will be attending will have their travel/accommodation covered by the Core Team worker's existing conference budget for a minimum savings of another 8k USD.

此外，参加峰会的核心团队成员中至少有4人的差旅/住宿费将由核心团队现有的提案会议预算支付，最低可节省8k美元。

Furthermore I will attempt to ensure that the average per person accommodation and travel cost for the remaining 20 slots does not exceed 1.5k  for a minimum savings of 10k USD.

而且我将努力确保其余20个名额的人均住宿费和差费不超过1.5k美元，最低节省10k美元。

Finally, I will negotiate the promotional material production (video, leaflets etc.) down to 5k USD for another 2k savings and cut the unexpected expenses buffer to just 500$ for another 1k USD saved.

最后，我会协商将宣传材料的制作费用(视频、传单等)减少到5000美元以节省2000美元，并将不可预见费用削减到500美元以节省1000美元。

This brings the total MAXIMUM cost of the worker down to 160k USD which is a 20% decrease from the original plan.

这使得此提案的最高预算成本下降到16万美元，比原计划减少了20%。

I hope this will be better suited to the community and people will reevaluate their voting slates.

希望这将更符合社区的期望，愿社区成员能重新评估你们的投票。

Thank you,

谢谢！

Alex

亚历克斯

P.S. I should point out that this (like last year's) worker has NO management fee and I get NO reimbursement of any kind for planning/organising it apart from entry to the event. I'm working on it simply because I truly believe it will be beneficial to the platform.

附注:我要指出的是， (和去年一样)此提案没有管理费，除了参加活动外，我没有获得任何形式的计划/组织回扣。我之所以致力于此只是因为我真心相信这将有益于平台。

I'm very sorry, sir. Now let me officially reply to you on behalf of the cn-vote community.
Again, I apologize for replying to you so late,because our community has had a heated discussion about this worker.
Now, give you our official reply：We don't agree with the follow-up expenditure of this worker, or even oppose it.
Reason：
1：The conference had little influence.
2：Too many participants and not transparent.
3：Expenses are too high.
4：The Bishares'secondary market is too weak to withstand the crash of worker expenditure.
Considering the current price of BitShares, we would rather give up our previous expenditure than see errors occur，After all, we have evidence that previous this worker's cash-outs caused a sharp drop in  price of BitShares.
I'm sorry to see this happen, but it represents the appeal of most people in our cn-vote.

Thanks for the official response. I respect your decision but would like to answer all your points and clarify them for BitShares holders as there appears to be misinformation for this worker and thus some holders may reconsider their proxy support

1. The conference could not have had "little influence" as it hasn't actually occurred yet. It's taking place at the end of October.

As to the POSSIBLE influence it could have, I invite and beg BitShares holders to have an IN DEPTH look at the agenda and speakers of the conference over at https://www.decentralized.com/business-technology-track/#_Speakers , https://www.decentralized.com/agenda-2019/ and the rest of the site.

2. The number of participants was set by the number of slots included in the partnership package. Please remember this is a partnership and BitShares is CO-PRESENTING this conference. We are NOT simple attendees.

As such, it is expected and appropriate to have MULTIPLE key members and businesses represented. As far as transparency in the selection process is concerned, the selection has not happened yet.  The proposal itself mentions who and why was already selected prior to the proposal and the rest of the (non-speaking) attendees would be decided AFTER the speaking slots were filled. May I remind you that I am STILL waiting for a CN community selection and/or business to step up which was the original point of this thread. Yet no-one has expressed any interest to represent the CN community while I'm practically begging for someone to do so and would be cost-free to those participants.

3. I disagree to an extent. I've provided MAXIMUM limits for those costs that are not fixed but the plan is to have them cost as little as possible. Flights/accommodation/press material is at standard/expected rates (obvs flight costs will vary wildly per location). The arguably high cost is the cost of the partnership itself (essentially paying for organising it as co-presenters). Having experienced the last one, I can tell you it's a good price for the quality and size of the event. @fox and others can confirm.

What's more, due to the commitment and the funds already gathered, that cost will be paid in full if possible (it's very touch and go) as I find it highly insulting, unprofessional and a tremendous hit on BitShares reputation (which is not great to start with) to pull out of the deal. Obviously, with no additional funding and depending on the market, we might still have to pull out of the event anyway.

4. There has only been two "periods" of cashing out BTS to pay the partnership costs. All order details/logs are at the https://workers.bitshares.foundation/ site. Combined with the charts from the periods in question there is NO significant effect from those as I've specifically requested to the BBF that selling is done slowly and carefully to not affect the market.

So with all due respect, I'm sorry to say that your claim that you have evidence cashing out caused a "sharp drop" in BTS price is frankly BS.

This is a marketing opportunity, one designed to make a big splash and provide a space and platform for the rest of the crypto world to meet and interact with the BitShares community and learn more about the businesses working with BitShares and finally shaking off the "scam" accusations that have followed us for years. Hence the size of the event and the number of participants as I wanted the BitShares community to be VERY WELL represented there.

I would also like to point out that I am receiving NO FEE or payment for doing this. I am only doing it because I think it will have a positive effect ALL BTS holders will benefit from. And with >16 years work in the marketing & advertising industry I actually do know what I'm talking about.

Finally, I can understand the CN community (and especially debt-holders) concerns about BTS possibly dropping to 0 and them losing their investments so they take ANY step possible to avoid even the TINIEST movement downwards.

Just be careful that you don't turn it into a self-fulfilling prophecy with your actions.

If people of the CN community really care about BitShares, I hope you will all read what I wrote carefully and think about things as well as visit the links provided to see for yourselves. If after that some of you change your mind, please consider (temporarily) modifying your voting slate so the decentralized worker is voted back in. If you don't , keep proxying to cn-vote.

I will accept all decisions (positive and negative) as long as they're WELL INFORMED and take all aspects into account. After all this is how business decisions are made. This is not a playground.

Thank you for your time.

Alex

I'm sorry to see this happen, but it represents the appeal of most people in our cn-vote.This is the result of our democratic vote.
We just represent ourselves,We just represent cn-vote.
After all, regardless of the debate, We all want bitshares to be better.
I have explained our results.You can fight for another vote. We respect the final result.Only in this way can the fairness of BitShares be reflected.

48h passed.


@Cn-Vote

Please find a consensus on it as i still see no active communitcation.

Should there be no active progress in next 24h i will remove my vote from refund400k

I'm very sorry, sir. Now let me officially reply to you on behalf of the cn-vote community.
Again, I apologize for replying to you so late,because our community has had a heated discussion about this worker.
Now, give you our official reply：We don't agree with the follow-up expenditure of this worker, or even oppose it.
Reason：
1：The conference had little influence.
2：Too many participants and not transparent.
3：Expenses are too high.
4：The Bishares'secondary market is too weak to withstand the crash of worker expenditure.
Considering the current price of BitShares, we would rather give up our previous expenditure than see errors occur，After all, we have evidence that previous this worker's cash-outs caused a sharp drop in  price of BitShares.
We're sorry to see this happen, but winter seems to be coming. We need to spend this winter, so cut down on all unnecessary expenses.

Finally, I hope you vote for refund400k worker again. After all, winter is coming and we need to spend it together because we are the real family.