Bitshares now has a professional PR initiative

[fuzzy]

The problem with forum is , everyone assume it's a "open communication" while in fact just a few people participate in the discussions . Developers spent their time to discuss with a few people , but the consequence is for the majority of the shareholders to handle , let alone for those don't even have time to go to the forum in the first place . So in the end , a place is supposed to be a open communication channel becomes the stage for a few people while they don't even take the discussions seriously .

Sometimes I see more effective discussions on Skype , mumble , nullstreet , etc ...

If you want what to be in the action , joint the action . No one is forbidding you to talk to the developers privately  through all kinds of channels .

I don't disagree that the forum can be disorganized at times and is not perfect regarding dissemination of ideas.  That is not the issue here.

The issue, as it appears to me, is that the plan going forward is for this "spokesman" to be a filter for all public discussion and comments made by core developers.  This is an unnecessary bottleneck and will likely do more harm than good.  It seems like a desperation move to appease a handful of large holders of Bitshares.  Honestly, if these large holders don't like the developers talking to the community in an open forum they should liquidate their holdings.  Bending to the will of these large holders and putting a leash on the developers seems to me to go against the core values of Bitshares.

Now people will begin to see why I've wanted many bitshares based chains.  It gives everyone the ability to join the ones they are most platform inclined to agree with.  It is like being able to choose what countries you want to have citizenship in based on the ideas and priciples they adhere yo.

Lol...not "yo"... *to*

[fuzzy]

The problem with forum is , everyone assume it's a "open communication".

It is open communication though, right? It is generally transparent...though easily lost.

Sometimes I see more effective discussions on Skype , mumble , nullstreet , etc ...

On this point I'm kind of lost. ..my impression was that BM would no longer be announcing anything or speaking openly with the community.

If you want what to be in the action , joint the action . No one is forbidding you to talk to the developers privately  through all kinds of channels .

I agree 100 percent here..but it does bring up the discussion  as to whether it is worth people's time to communicate on the BitShares platform or if the best form of communication is to have a majority stake in the ecosystem.

The real form of communication so far is to have the most time in the eco-system  .
Whoever gets the most time , you're the winner , and others lose simply because they don't have time to follow tons of posts .
So in the end , people always gets first hand information simply because they have time .

And it will continue to be those who have time , just by more informal approach .

And that settles , who wants first hand information , should be paying more trouble for it , like communicate with the developers privately .

Whoever wants actual and solid information , it should be provided to them in a more formal way .

Informal and formal information are not supposed to be discussed in the same place or with the same manner . But we keep ignoring that fact and leave the forum as the only formal information outlet .

This is not true though.  Many people attended or listened to the hangouts because in approximately one hour they received a boiled down version of core topics of importance to them every week.

Again I don't day this for personal reasons. ..it is simple fact.

As for expecting people to reach out directly to devs in private...I think you must be one of the lucky ones who gets responses.   Most forum members are not so lucky and it has very little to do with the devs lack of interest and far more to do with efficient communication and time management.

[btswildpig]

The problem with forum is , everyone assume it's a "open communication".

It is open communication though, right? It is generally transparent...though easily lost.

Sometimes I see more effective discussions on Skype , mumble , nullstreet , etc ...

On this point I'm kind of lost. ..my impression was that BM would no longer be announcing anything or speaking openly with the community.

If you want what to be in the action , joint the action . No one is forbidding you to talk to the developers privately  through all kinds of channels .

I agree 100 percent here..but it does bring up the discussion  as to whether it is worth people's time to communicate on the BitShares platform or if the best form of communication is to have a majority stake in the ecosystem.

The real form of communication so far is to have the most time in the eco-system  .
Whoever gets the most time , you're the winner , and others lose simply because they don't have time to follow tons of posts .
So in the end , people always gets first hand information simply because they have time .

And it will continue to be those who have time , just by more informal approach .

And that settles , who wants first hand information , should be paying more trouble for it , like communicate with the developers privately .

Whoever wants actual and solid information , it should be provided to them in a more formal way .

Informal and formal information are not supposed to be discussed in the same place or with the same manner . But we keep ignoring that fact and leave the forum as the only formal information outlet .

[wasthatawolf]

The problem with forum is , everyone assume it's a "open communication" while in fact just a few people participate in the discussions . Developers spent their time to discuss with a few people , but the consequence is for the majority of the shareholders to handle , let alone for those don't even have time to go to the forum in the first place . So in the end , a place is supposed to be a open communication channel becomes the stage for a few people while they don't even take the discussions seriously .

Sometimes I see more effective discussions on Skype , mumble , nullstreet , etc ...

If you want what to be in the action , joint the action . No one is forbidding you to talk to the developers privately  through all kinds of channels .

I don't disagree that the forum can be disorganized at times and is not perfect regarding dissemination of ideas.  That is not the issue here.

The issue, as it appears to me, is that the plan going forward is for this "spokesman" to be a filter for all public discussion and comments made by core developers.  This is an unnecessary bottleneck and will likely do more harm than good.  It seems like a desperation move to appease a handful of large holders of Bitshares.  Honestly, if these large holders don't like the developers talking to the community in an open forum they should liquidate their holdings.  Bending to the will of these large holders and putting a leash on the developers seems to me to go against the core values of Bitshares.

[fuzzy]

The problem with forum is , everyone assume it's a "open communication".

It is open communication though, right? It is generally transparent...though easily lost.

Sometimes I see more effective discussions on Skype , mumble , nullstreet , etc ...

On this point I'm kind of lost. ..my impression was that BM would no longer be announcing anything or speaking openly with the community.

If you want what to be in the action , joint the action . No one is forbidding you to talk to the developers privately  through all kinds of channels .

I agree 100 percent here..but it does bring up the discussion  as to whether it is worth people's time to communicate on the BitShares platform or if the best form of communication is to have a majority stake in the ecosystem.

[xeroc]

I think the "hard rules" were meant to show intent.  An occasional forum post about something trivial is still ok.   

For me the primary benefit of the new approach is that I can get the developers much more focused because many of them sink too much time into the forum.  This place is great and I love you all, but ultimately tending to the forum is slowing development. 

An increase in transparency by a reduction in clutter is what this represents.   It is like Where's Waldo in this forum.  Sure he is right out in public, but you may never find him.   Under the new approach we are clearing the room so everyone can easily find Waldo.

ehm .. you are not seriously asking @vikram to reduce his presence here, are you?

[btswildpig]

Sooo who's the all powerful gatekeeper of ideas?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Everyone cares for the future of this project and with the interest , time and devotion is the gatekeeper .
Are you interested ? There is place for you and other long term members .

The forum is the issue here , not the action . We can communicate ideas in a more effective way in other places, just not able to do it on the forum without damage for a long time .

It was not clear from the post (which is now removed so I can't refer back to it) that it is the forum itself that is the issue.  I can appreciate Dan's comment that people spend an inordinate amount of time on the forums but that is not what the tone of that blog post portrayed.

Everyone needs to understand that you have zero control over the market cap by trying to filter the ideas of developers.  Anyone hoping to make a quick profit will be flushed out. The open flow of communication is what drew me in to Bitshares in the first place (obviously I can't speak for everyone else but that seems to be the general sentiment).

The problem with forum is , everyone assume it's a "open communication" while in fact just a few people participate in the discussions . Developers spent their time to discuss with a few people , but the consequence is for the majority of the shareholders to handle , let alone for those don't even have time to go to the forum in the first place . So in the end , a place is supposed to be a open communication channel becomes the stage for a few people while they don't even take the discussions seriously .

Sometimes I see more effective discussions on Skype , mumble , nullstreet , etc ...

If you want what to be in the action , joint the action . No one is forbidding you to talk to the developers privately  through all kinds of channels .

[fuzzy]

Very interesting discussion going on here. It was kind of a bad time I guess for me to have a weekend with my baby for his 1st birthday...didn't keep up with the forum enough to see the blog post thread. Now I can't access the actual post so it is going to be hard to understand all the context around which this conversation is revolving.  However,  it obviously will to a degree effect hangouts,  so with my limited understanding of the situation. ..please let me help clarify how I see this.

As far as the project updates from bytemaster.   He stated that some large shareholders wanted him to stop making public statements.  I guess the way the system is constructed makes largest shareholders the most valuable,  which makes sense to a large degree.  And to be clear I am not necessarily in disagreement.

Of course this should serve as a lesson to everyone here that if they want true power in bitshares, they should first and foremost ensure they are large stakeholders before giving to causes they believe in--or should at least remain very much aware that giving directly decreases their influence.   This has honestly never been a secret though.

If people dislike the path BitShares is taking,  I would simply say "this is why AGS and PTS existed in the first place! " 1So make your own DAC, sharedrop on the people who had a grand vision of a world with many competing DACs, and compete against BitShares by being the change you want to see!

If you disagree with these actions, prove they were wrong by being open AND more successful...it is possible!

I will miss BM'S presence at hangouts,  but I know for a fact that they started out small before and will continue getting bigger.   Besides. ..imho, now the only thing BM should working on is coding.  There is a natural progression here that I see. ..and that is that bytemaster is slowly moving away from the leadership role and ceding it to other people like delegates and third party developers. This is because bitshares is growing up.

I Intend on continting to organize events for these people as they will more and more begin representing the new leadership in bitshares moving forward anyway.  I will also keep my eyes open for covering more DACS built on BitShares.

[wasthatawolf]

Sooo who's the all powerful gatekeeper of ideas?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Everyone cares for the future of this project and with the interest , time and devotion is the gatekeeper .
Are you interested ? There is place for you and other long term members .

The forum is the issue here , not the action . We can communicate ideas in a more effective way in other places, just not able to do it on the forum without damage for a long time .

It was not clear from the post (which is now removed so I can't refer back to it) that it is the forum itself that is the issue.  I can appreciate Dan's comment that people spend an inordinate amount of time on the forums but that is not what the tone of that blog post portrayed.

Everyone needs to understand that you have zero control over the market cap by trying to filter the ideas of developers.  Anyone hoping to make a quick profit will be flushed out. The open flow of communication is what drew me in to Bitshares in the first place (obviously I can't speak for everyone else but that seems to be the general sentiment).

[btswildpig]

Sooo who's the all powerful gatekeeper of ideas?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Everyone cares for the future of this project and with the interest , time and devotion is the gatekeeper .
Are you interested ? There is place for you and other long term members .

The forum is the issue here , not the action . We can communicate ideas in a more effective way in other places, just not able to do it on the forum without damage for a long time .

[BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode]

Funny how we already solved this problem with DPOS. What do you do when centralization causes bad PR? You move away from centralization. What do you do when you need some element of centralized control? You scale decentralization down to select delegates.

Each person has their own quirks - there is no use relegating PR from one man to the next. If we don't want *everyone* to know, we can still send it out to 11 people for peer review. We can do the multi-sig dance and require 6 of the 11 people to approve a given "official" statement.

thats why we have to from a global PR Team!!!!!
Not just eastern or western - GLOBALLLL!!!!!

@delulo: well said, 2nd that!

Global sound good to me. It might help us make inroads into more markets that way. We already have a diverse community that could lead an initiative like this.

[wasthatawolf]

Sooo who's the all powerful gatekeeper of ideas?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[cass]

I think the "hard rules" were meant to show intent.  An occasional forum post about something trivial is still ok.   

For me the primary benefit of the new approach is that I can get the developers much more focused because many of them sink too much time into the forum.  This place is great and I love you all, but ultimately tending to the forum is slowing development. 

An increase in transparency by a reduction in clutter is what this represents.   It is like Where's Waldo in this forum.  Sure he is right out in public, but you may never find him.   Under the new approach we are clearing the room so everyone can easily find Waldo.

well said  !! 

[btswildpig]

I think the "hard rules" were meant to show intent.  An occasional forum post about something trivial is still ok.   

For me the primary benefit of the new approach is that I can get the developers much more focused because many of them sink too much time into the forum.  This place is great and I love you all, but ultimately tending to the forum is slowing development. 

An increase in transparency by a reduction in clutter is what this represents.   It is like Where's Waldo in this forum.  Sure he is right out in public, but you may never find him.   Under the new approach we are clearing the room so everyone can easily find Waldo.

 

[bytemaster]

I think the "hard rules" were meant to show intent.  An occasional forum post about something trivial is still ok.   

For me the primary benefit of the new approach is that I can get the developers much more focused because many of them sink too much time into the forum.  This place is great and I love you all, but ultimately tending to the forum is slowing development. 

An increase in transparency by a reduction in clutter is what this represents.   It is like Where's Waldo in this forum.  Sure he is right out in public, but you may never find him.   Under the new approach we are clearing the room so everyone can easily find Waldo.