Author Topic: Find the difference  (Read 3508 times)

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Offline joele

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Find the difference
« on: August 21, 2015, 01:30:26 am »
Find the difference


chryspano

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2015, 02:50:17 am »

Offline roadscape

Re: Find the difference
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2015, 02:54:25 am »
Find the difference

Did you get a new haircut? :-[
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Offline canucklehead

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2015, 04:13:39 am »
I looked for over an hour, and still couldn't find Waldo.  :(

Offline BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode

Re: Find the difference
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2015, 06:01:06 am »
BitShares now #5 spot in volume?

Is that the difference?

Volume has been climbing the last few days while the price is being driven down.. someone is about to make a killing.
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Offline xeroc

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2015, 06:04:22 am »
Next time I see it the other way round I should open a counter-thread :D
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Offline Empirical1.2

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2015, 11:31:46 am »
Imagine if the founder of Microsoft left when it was still a struggling start-up, taking all the talent with him to form another company and then told Microsoft shareholders that they would now only receive a free windows license and if they wanted any further work done by Bill Gates or the talent that they would have to pay market rates. How much would Microsoft be worth in that scenario?

(Especially if Microsoft couldn't afford to pay market rates because it was still a struggling start-up and also paying off an expensive merger from just 9 months prior that it had largely engaged in to retain it's founder.)

I'm quite invested in BitShares at the moment & perhaps the above couldn't be avoided, but it is quite a punt because the above does make it a less valuable & more risky proposition. 
« Last Edit: August 21, 2015, 11:34:16 am by Empirical1.2 »
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Offline lil_jay890

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2015, 11:50:50 am »
 Here's a question. Why should bts even be valued at 10 million?  What gives it that value? It has no real world use and is actually pretty damn expensive and difficult to obtain.  Can anyone tell me why it should be worth 100 million or 1 billion? Why is that number more representative of Bitshares?  A small uranium company named ur-energy has a valuation of around 100 million used. They produce uranium and sell it much higher than the spot market due to long term contracts.  It owns a ton of land with lots of natural recourses under the ground.  The also have a large mining facility with lots of new equipment. Why should Bitshares be valued as much as this company when all it has is 6 coders not much real world use?

Offline Empirical1.2

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2015, 12:02:09 pm »
Here's a question. Why should bts even be valued at 10 million?  What gives it that value? It has no real world use and is actually pretty damn expensive and difficult to obtain.  Can anyone tell me why it should be worth 100 million or 1 billion? Why is that number more representative of Bitshares?  A small uranium company named ur-energy has a valuation of around 100 million used. They produce uranium and sell it much higher than the spot market due to long term contracts.  It owns a ton of land with lots of natural recourses under the ground.  The also have a large mining facility with lots of new equipment. Why should Bitshares be valued as much as this company when all it has is 6 coders not much real world use?

Speculative future potential.

If you believe there will be a demand for decentralised dollars or other crypto-back derivatives & the new BitAssets system combined with Graphene are the best option and that the referral programme will do a good job of marketing it to potential customers then there will be high future demand for BitShares which will increase the shares value.

The maintenance cost for witnesses and code updating is actually fairly low once the major additions like bond markets, prediction markets, UIAS and other are in place. So once there is a large pool of BitAssets and customers, income from transaction fees could potentially exceed expenses delivering a direct return to shareholders.

« Last Edit: August 21, 2015, 12:16:43 pm by Empirical1.2 »
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Offline luckybit

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2015, 06:07:41 am »
Here's a question. Why should bts even be valued at 10 million?  What gives it that value? It has no real world use and is actually pretty damn expensive and difficult to obtain.  Can anyone tell me why it should be worth 100 million or 1 billion? Why is that number more representative of Bitshares?  A small uranium company named ur-energy has a valuation of around 100 million used. They produce uranium and sell it much higher than the spot market due to long term contracts.  It owns a ton of land with lots of natural recourses under the ground.  The also have a large mining facility with lots of new equipment. Why should Bitshares be valued as much as this company when all it has is 6 coders not much real world use?
If we look at Facebook then each user is worth around $114, in 2013 it was $98 so the price is rising. Facebook is an advertising company so it knows exactly how much each user can be worth.

Bitshares is a bit different but the same fundamentals apply. The difference is that Bitshares is a DAC so the operating expenses vs the utility is where you can find efficiency.

Bitshares will be profitable depending on it's cash flow which means you have to look at the volume it is able to attract. The technology of Bitshares 2.0 is being designed to be able to handle the volume of the NASDAQ.

Bitshares 2.0 is a lot like what Ripple tried to be, but is better designed, state of the art, scaleable. Bitshares 2.0 can do what Ripple does, but it can also do what what most of the Bitcoin exchanges are doing. When you look at what Bitshares 2.0 offers compared to what else is out there, there is no better alternative to choose from.

Ethereum can do a lot of things but it cannot replicate the behavior of NASDAQ, it cannot allow us to trade actual shares yet. Bitshares on the other hand does allow for that, and with the right smart contract or extensions it should be able to allow for Forex or whatever else.

Litecoin at it's peak had a market cap of 700 million. Bitshares 1.0 could have had a market cap of $1 billion. Bitshares 2.0 due to it's performance capabilities, if it lives up to the hype, can easily have a market cap in the tens of billions provided that the community rallies and builds an industry around the blockchain.

In my opinion what holds Bitcoin back is the fact that the Bitcoin community does not offer an olive branch to regulators. The Bitcoin price spiked up in 2013 after the green light was given by regulators. In the end the more regulator friendly your blockchain is, the easier it will be to attract high net worth and institutional investors into your space. Bitcoin is currently hurting itself because it's not willing to offer anything to satisfy regulators, so if Bitshares 2.0 is designed so that it can form relationships with banks, with regulated capital, then the regulated dollars can flow into it.

Regulated dollars represent the vast majority of the investors. They don't want unregulated anonymous exchanges. They want regulated, government authorized, bank integrated, "prestigious"  exchanges. In my opinion if Bitshares ups it's prestige and does a better job at marketing to regulated entities, prestigious institutions, risk adverse individuals who don't care about Bitcoin or privacy, then the volume will flow in and Bitshares 2.0 will become profitable.

Bitshares 2.0 should not and will not change it's design to suit regulated capital, but it should at least be compatible for future integration into regulated society. It's really the only reason Ripple is even talked about, it's the relationships with banks. Bitshares 2.x needs relationships with Forex, it needs an ability to integrate into the FIX protocol. It needs to highlight the fact that Bitshares 2.x is trying to be a semi-regulated exchange platform.

Because the market is going to be so competitive it is unlikely that Bitshares will end up with an 8 trillion+ market cap anytime soon, but it could easily end up in the tens or hundreds of billions. Bitcoin itself with all of it's flaws could end up in the hundreds of billions, and in the big scheme of things, hundreds of billions isn't a whole lot for the industry Bitshares is disrupting.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/ge
orgeanders/2013/11/07/a-twitter-user-is-worth-110-facebooks-98-linkedins-93/
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Offline luckybit

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2015, 06:14:03 am »
Bitshares 2.0 if it forms bank relationships, and the community grows similar to the growth of Bitcoin, due to the technology it offers it can do well.

Main issue with Bitshares is liquidity, and in order to increase liquidity you need regulated capital to flow in. To get that you need to follow industry standards where necessary, as Coinbase is currently doing, or the Bitcoin ETFs are doing.

Some areas exist where Bitshares 2.0 can improve of course. Bitshares 2.0 needs more companies set up around it, so that VC capital can flow in to help build the ecosystem. There is also a need to provide better trading interfaces which have stock analysis built into it so people can learn about a stock, see the latest news and realtime analysis of the market, and this has to be professionally done. When people make a trade they need a lot more information than the current interface provides and they need it in real time.

Have a look at the Robinhood app to see what I mean.

https://www.robinhood.com/
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Offline BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode

Re: Find the difference
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2015, 06:53:13 am »
I can tell you from just my own experience there is real interest in BitShares by investors. Bitcoin showed them what could be done, but a lot of them know that its time for the next wave.

Regardless of our terrible market cap we continue to place #5 in volume... even over Dogie. I maintain this is all being done by big money to drive profits over the next few months in a big way. The price is being forced down. Take a look at the market cap today of all cryptos.. you can't spot any difference.. they are all going down.

You keep your eyes to the ground in front of you you never see what's coming up on the horizon.

 +5% to  luckybit and Empirical1.2 for your awesome insights.

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Offline Ander

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2015, 07:16:42 am »
I can tell you from just my own experience there is real interest in BitShares by investors. Bitcoin showed them what could be done, but a lot of them know that its time for the next wave.

If these supposed investors are interested then why dont they buy?  What are they waiting for?
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Offline BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode

Re: Find the difference
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2015, 07:38:42 am »
I can tell you from just my own experience there is real interest in BitShares by investors. Bitcoin showed them what could be done, but a lot of them know that its time for the next wave.

If these supposed investors are interested then why dont they buy?  What are they waiting for?

They want to put their money into businesses that build on BitShares. Holding shares, especially as they are now, is not a compelling story. For example, a new debit card backed by a decentralized network with capacity twice that of visa/mc with gateway being secured by a nuclear bunker data center.. thats sexy. It doesn't put money into BTS, it puts it into businesses that will bring utility to BTS. That's a story you want to share. The BitShares story by itself isn't where the focus is.. its the businesses that will build on 2.0 that matters. CNX understands this.. heck they are one of the stories now. :)

The only time I see investors starting to look at BTS as a place to put their money is when they see things like what I just mentioned where transactions will be powered by BTS that will give it its value.

I see things from a utility place though.. as I have stated many times before.. I am no trader. :)
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Offline liondani

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Re: Find the difference
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2015, 07:49:06 am »
If you believe there will be a demand for decentralised dollars or other crypto-back derivatives & the new BitAssets system combined with Graphene are the best option and that the referral programme will do a good job of marketing it to potential customers then there will be high future demand for BitShares which will increase the shares value.

What if the market decides/choose Ethereum to make this? (even if they have a worst solution compared to BTS bitAssets)

PS Microsoft Windows was not the best operating system back in time...  They "made it" cause they used better "marketing" methods.... (they have let the public to have illegal copy’s the first years....)