Author Topic: Reducing Bitshares Supply : A different approach  (Read 11269 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
The shapeshift like system is ready for Bitshares  and works directly from the wallet.
Nxt is currently live too.
We don't intend to retain ownership of the product, so in case there is sufficient interest in a crowdfund - am happy to put the project live and burn/issue dividends from the project.

Regards

so this is between and within both bts and nxt? so i can trade bts assets for nxt ones and vice versa?  awesome :)

Theoretically, yes.
We've had the system ready since early December but .. noone really cared.
I am more focused on gamebet.gg as of now. The MVP went live and we should ideally be taking bets by the end of the month.
I am open to synergies / complete acquisition of the product by the community etc but right now my focus is our core gaming projects.
I reached out to CCEDK and a few other individuals who could indeed take over the 3 tier exchange suite we have ready but so far talks have not gone anywhere.

Offline fuzzy

The shapeshift like system is ready for Bitshares  and works directly from the wallet.
Nxt is currently live too.
We don't intend to retain ownership of the product, so in case there is sufficient interest in a crowdfund - am happy to put the project live and burn/issue dividends from the project.

Regards

so this is between and within both bts and nxt? so i can trade bts assets for nxt ones and vice versa?  awesome :)
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
The shapeshift like system is ready for Bitshares  and works directly from the wallet.
Nxt is currently live too.
We don't intend to retain ownership of the product, so in case there is sufficient interest in a crowdfund - am happy to put the project live and burn/issue dividends from the project.

Regards

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
We are in the works of porting things to Bitshares and (hopefully) setting up a shapeshift like system for the Bitshares community over the weekend.
Will post updates as we make progress.

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
Would like to know what you decided after you meet everyone with similar projects.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
Hey guys,

As keen as we are in collaboration and joint effort, given the current scenario it looks increasingly difficult.
We'd reached out to CCEDK, but Ronny has been busy and openledger.info's API is not yet available.
We spoke to Monsterer from Meta-Exchange who suggested we set up nodes and link it to meta exchange.
I'll be talking to another private party that is interested in the exchange business later today.

In case you guys want to share possible routes we could take to create stronger synergies, please post them here and I'll be happy to talk with the respective exchange managers to see if we can make it happen.

Given the fact that worker proposals arent active and putting them into action will take atleast a month, I think a UIA / crowdfunder route will be a lot more effective solution.
I am open to suggestions on this front too.

I'll be online for the next 4-8 hours.
Please ping me if you are interested in suggesting changes to our approach.

Regards

Can anyone confirm/deny that worker proposals are not active? I heard this from somewhere...just dont remember where atm.  Id love to be 100% certain.

Yes, we have been pretty confused about this too.
I would love to hear from someone knowledgeable on this.

Offline fuzzy

Hey guys,

As keen as we are in collaboration and joint effort, given the current scenario it looks increasingly difficult.
We'd reached out to CCEDK, but Ronny has been busy and openledger.info's API is not yet available.
We spoke to Monsterer from Meta-Exchange who suggested we set up nodes and link it to meta exchange.
I'll be talking to another private party that is interested in the exchange business later today.

In case you guys want to share possible routes we could take to create stronger synergies, please post them here and I'll be happy to talk with the respective exchange managers to see if we can make it happen.

Given the fact that worker proposals arent active and putting them into action will take atleast a month, I think a UIA / crowdfunder route will be a lot more effective solution.
I am open to suggestions on this front too.

I'll be online for the next 4-8 hours.
Please ping me if you are interested in suggesting changes to our approach.

Regards

Can anyone confirm/deny that worker proposals are not active? I heard this from somewhere...just dont remember where atm.  Id love to be 100% certain. 
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
Hey guys,

As keen as we are in collaboration and joint effort, given the current scenario it looks increasingly difficult.
We'd reached out to CCEDK, but Ronny has been busy and openledger.info's API is not yet available.
We spoke to Monsterer from Meta-Exchange who suggested we set up nodes and link it to meta exchange.
I'll be talking to another private party that is interested in the exchange business later today.

In case you guys want to share possible routes we could take to create stronger synergies, please post them here and I'll be happy to talk with the respective exchange managers to see if we can make it happen.

Given the fact that worker proposals arent active and putting them into action will take atleast a month, I think a UIA / crowdfunder route will be a lot more effective solution.
I am open to suggestions on this front too.

I'll be online for the next 4-8 hours.
Please ping me if you are interested in suggesting changes to our approach.

Regards

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
I've reached out to a number of exchange owners for a join collaboration and will be chalking things out in the days to come..Appreciate the input folks.

Cool that's what we need. And that doesn't mean you can follow your own path in the future. But you just have better chances working together than separately. Then once things have picked up, we have more volume, etc, everyone can proceed with their own projects
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline jamesc

Another poll option? Yes with serious collaboration with community exchanges..

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
I've reached out to a number of exchange owners for a join collaboration and will be chalking things out in the days to come..Appreciate the input folks.

Offline fuzzy

I don't think seraphim is blowing anything out of proportion.  Not to mention, he is correct about the centralized exchange.  What do we need another centralized exchange for?  The solution needs to be decentralized.  Actually, I would point out that a worker proposal is not appropriate for ANY exchange (that's what the referral program is for).  Plus we already have an exchange UI built into the wallet (albeit not a very usable one at the moment).  But adding decentralized storage seems completely appropriate for a worker proposal.  And that's the killer app for us.  Imagine people can send their BTC, for example, to OpenLedger and trade it on shared order books without any worry about the safety of their funds?  What are we waiting for?

It would also be actually backed by the tokens sent in AND would have the black swan and goxxing protection that bitshares brings to the table.  I sincerely hope that they all find a way to work together--and this also includes blocktrades (sorry @dannotestein for missing you on that one).  What I'm beginning to see is this huge competitive phase that seems to be bringing many people here to do the same thing...and they are ALL brilliant and capable people.  The issue to me is that we are so early in the game that I think they should all work on a common project, and if they want to branch out later once it is a success and they all have made a mint off of it becoming successful, then they could all part ways and compete with each other if they so choose to...

I sincerely hope you guys consider it and all think about working together.  I mean imagine if all these exchanges combined resources....we would have something so damned amazing it would require the best cryptos in the world combining forces to compete with it.  Considering that the other cryptos will likely be unable rally and create competition with such an epic exchange....I think it would win and maybe even become the go-to exchange over time for ALL of crypto.  Just imagine for one moment if this happened.  We would have something far bigger than Gox or any of the other large exchanges could accomplish. 
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline tbone

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 632
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: tbone2
I don't think seraphim is blowing anything out of proportion.  Not to mention, he is correct about the centralized exchange.  What do we need another centralized exchange for?  The solution needs to be decentralized.  Actually, I would point out that a worker proposal is not appropriate for ANY exchange (that's what the referral program is for).  Plus we already have an exchange UI built into the wallet (albeit not a very usable one at the moment).  But adding decentralized storage seems completely appropriate for a worker proposal.  And that's the killer app for us.  Imagine people can send their BTC, for example, to OpenLedger and trade it on shared order books without any worry about the safety of their funds?  What are we waiting for?

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
You really don't need to blow things out of proportion seraphim. All I really said is lets focus on the core topic at hand. We are always up for synergy and collaboration. Apologies if I offended you.

Regards
« Last Edit: October 22, 2015, 02:50:53 pm by Freebieservers »

Offline seraphim

Okay, I added the burning to the description, and created a worker proposal thread.
If that can't be paid, I'm in full support of this basic solution. But I used to know this as a community that thinks big, let's get that spirit back!

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19351

If you want my honest opinion, I think freebie, yourself, data, ccedk and metaexchange should really consider working together.  How that can be done seems like something you would all be best to work at...but this early in the game it doesn't make sense to me for this much competition. 

To me...thinking big means thinking of all these people wanting to make their own exchange should pool their resources for the good of BitShares.  I mean...why not?

Yep, freebie, seraphim and metaexchsnge seem simiçar projects. Competition is good but with such limited resources its not a good idea to spread them like that. You should at least talk with each other and try to do something in collective, which could even have more potential. I dont know how far everyone is willing to go on working together, but you have more chsnces of pulling that off if you do it together in a single proposal than many proposals. It also seems a mpre solid idea.

I was rather upset when I found this thread yesterday. Fuzzy told me 2 weeks ago that I'd definitely need to talk to freebie about the dx, and while I was still waiting for his (and others') feedback this thread popped up.
The dx project should be a community effort, and everything I wrote was set up for discussion. Now a simple statement in this thread, which was clearly born out of the idea I laid out, that what's suggested as an own project could easily be implemented in the collaborative project is considered a thread highjacking. Should I continue with the misleading board and title of this thread now?

Never mind. By the looks of it the dx project cannot be financed anyway, and if someone thinks yet-another-centralized one will be able to attract a meaningful amount of traders this may be an option.
I've been through exactly that though, and definitely won't go that same path again. Either we do it right and can finance it, or it's in vain from the beginning.
Meet you on STEEM

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
Okay, I added the burning to the description, and created a worker proposal thread.
If that can't be paid, I'm in full support of this basic solution. But I used to know this as a community that thinks big, let's get that spirit back!

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19351

If you want my honest opinion, I think freebie, yourself, data, ccedk and metaexchange should really consider working together.  How that can be done seems like something you would all be best to work at...but this early in the game it doesn't make sense to me for this much competition. 

To me...thinking big means thinking of all these people wanting to make their own exchange should pool their resources for the good of BitShares.  I mean...why not?

Yep, freebie, seraphim and metaexchsnge seem simiçar projects. Competition is good but with such limited resources its not a good idea to spread them like that. You should at least talk with each other and try to do something in collective, which could even have more potential. I dont know how far everyone is willing to go on working together, but you have more chsnces of pulling that off if you do it together in a single proposal than many proposals. It also seems a mpre solid idea.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline fuzzy

Would the exchange burn more total fees if it used the full fee togo toward 50% freebieserver profit 50% referrer payout? What I mean is that the internet marketers could bring more transactions to your exchange and the net effect could be more coins burned than would have been without paying referrers.  Maybe I missed something... didnt get through the whole thread before posting .. [emoji1]

The referral fees were not brought into the equation frim my understanding.  I thought they would be charging trading fees and using that as the income.
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline carpet ride

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 544
    • View Profile
Would the exchange burn more total fees if it used the full fee togo toward 50% freebieserver profit 50% referrer payout? What I mean is that the internet marketers could bring more transactions to your exchange and the net effect could be more coins burned than would have been without paying referrers.  Maybe I missed something... didnt get through the whole thread before posting .. [emoji1]
All opinions are my own. Anything said on this forum does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation between myself and anyone else.
Check out my blog: http://CertainAssets.com
Buy the ticket, take the ride.

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
Also guys, I would appreciate it if you could either post here or pm me how much you are willing to back this with as individuals so we know what we are looking at. The polls have been strong indicators so far and a few individuals have shown private interest in backing this.

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
Okay, I added the burning to the description, and created a worker proposal thread.
If that can't be paid, I'm in full support of this basic solution. But I used to know this as a community that thinks big, let's get that spirit back!

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19351
Don't appreciate having my thread jacked :)

@Akado @Fuzzy and for anyone else that's watching .
Me and the team are in extensive discussions within ourselves and with a number of individuals.
Depending on what is the best route to take, we'll either go with a worker proposal or UIA.
By the looks of it, a UIA will be far "quicker" to issue and garner funds, but am open to discussions on the same.

Regards

Offline fuzzy

Okay, I added the burning to the description, and created a worker proposal thread.
If that can't be paid, I'm in full support of this basic solution. But I used to know this as a community that thinks big, let's get that spirit back!

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19351

If you want my honest opinion, I think freebie, yourself, data, ccedk and metaexchange should really consider working together.  How that can be done seems like something you would all be best to work at...but this early in the game it doesn't make sense to me for this much competition. 

To me...thinking big means thinking of all these people wanting to make their own exchange should pool their resources for the good of BitShares.  I mean...why not?
« Last Edit: October 22, 2015, 02:11:03 am by fuzzy »
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline seraphim

Okay, I added the burning to the description, and created a worker proposal thread.
If that can't be paid, I'm in full support of this basic solution. But I used to know this as a community that thinks big, let's get that spirit back!

https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19351
Meet you on STEEM

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
Are those percentages until investors get 75BTC back? Or are you going for a worker proposal?

Sounds like this is a PERFECT use of a worker proposal.  Then the risk and reward are completely balanced...

I agree it makes sense, plus, I don't see people donating 75btc atm and paying ppl back would just take a lot of time. That way we can get a bigger burning percentage and freebi can also get a bigger percentage for themselves, everyone is happy and it's less work, no need to go through the donation phase and it's usual mess phase.

I think they should make a new thread, give multiple percentage options they are happy with and let people choose. Then go ahead and make the worker proposal

personally in 100% agreement.  To me our community should definitely be focusing on projects like this that give back to the community in such a direct way. 

I mean think about it...it is a perfect way to approach worker proposals.  The way this is structured makes a lot of sense...because asking for a worker proposal essentially keeps those funds from being taken out of circulation.  But with this plan, it benefits freebie but also evens that initial redirection out later.  This is because later the % of profits taken away from fees will inturn be taken out of circulation. 

It shouldn't take much time for it to become a net positive in terms of deflating the supply...at which point freebie has the exchange built and can make money--but the community benefits more over time than they ended up having to give.  It is a win-win...the only kind of relationship to have if you ask me.

less verbose explanation:

It  is a money printing perpetuum mobile...build in 3 weeks or less mind you...

or at least that is the promise we are served right now.

PS
@seraphim as well.

They corrected that. from what I understood, 3 weeks for a metaexchange kind of exchange, then undetermined amount of time to decentralize it or move and trade alts on BTS chain

a 3 week period would leave any man sceptical. /phrasing
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline tonyk

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3308
    • View Profile
Are those percentages until investors get 75BTC back? Or are you going for a worker proposal?

Sounds like this is a PERFECT use of a worker proposal.  Then the risk and reward are completely balanced...

I agree it makes sense, plus, I don't see people donating 75btc atm and paying ppl back would just take a lot of time. That way we can get a bigger burning percentage and freebi can also get a bigger percentage for themselves, everyone is happy and it's less work, no need to go through the donation phase and it's usual mess phase.

I think they should make a new thread, give multiple percentage options they are happy with and let people choose. Then go ahead and make the worker proposal

personally in 100% agreement.  To me our community should definitely be focusing on projects like this that give back to the community in such a direct way. 

I mean think about it...it is a perfect way to approach worker proposals.  The way this is structured makes a lot of sense...because asking for a worker proposal essentially keeps those funds from being taken out of circulation.  But with this plan, it benefits freebie but also evens that initial redirection out later.  This is because later the % of profits taken away from fees will inturn be taken out of circulation. 

It shouldn't take much time for it to become a net positive in terms of deflating the supply...at which point freebie has the exchange built and can make money--but the community benefits more over time than they ended up having to give.  It is a win-win...the only kind of relationship to have if you ask me.

less verbose explanation:

It  is a money printing perpetuum mobile...build in 3 weeks or less mind you...

or at least that is the promise we are served right now.

PS
@seraphim as well.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 11:48:41 pm by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline seraphim

Uhm, wait a second.
I announced the decentralized exchange a month ago, and the feedback was devastatingly low. I'm still working out the idea from time to time, but it didn't seem like the community is really interested in the crypto gateway, so it's nothing but a small maybe to me for now.

Are you guys saying all it needs for you to get interested is a possibility of it burning fees? That'd be pretty easy to add to the voting.

Or is it that nobody cares what kind of services will be created at the moment, as long as it's something influencing the supply? How sustainable is that approach in your opinion?
Meet you on STEEM

Offline fuzzy

Are those percentages until investors get 75BTC back? Or are you going for a worker proposal?

Sounds like this is a PERFECT use of a worker proposal.  Then the risk and reward are completely balanced...

I agree it makes sense, plus, I don't see people donating 75btc atm and paying ppl back would just take a lot of time. That way we can get a bigger burning percentage and freebi can also get a bigger percentage for themselves, everyone is happy and it's less work, no need to go through the donation phase and it's usual mess phase.

I think they should make a new thread, give multiple percentage options they are happy with and let people choose. Then go ahead and make the worker proposal

personally in 100% agreement.  To me our community should definitely be focusing on projects like this that give back to the community in such a direct way. 

I mean think about it...it is a perfect way to approach worker proposals.  The way this is structured makes a lot of sense...because asking for a worker proposal essentially keeps those funds from being taken out of circulation.  But with this plan, it benefits freebie but also evens that initial redirection out later.  This is because later the % of profits taken away from fees will inturn be taken out of circulation. 

It shouldn't take much time for it to become a net positive in terms of deflating the supply...at which point freebie has the exchange built and can make money--but the community benefits more over time than they ended up having to give.  It is a win-win...the only kind of relationship to have if you ask me. 


« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 11:28:25 pm by fuzzy »
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
Are those percentages until investors get 75BTC back? Or are you going for a worker proposal?

Sounds like this is a PERFECT use of a worker proposal.  Then the risk and reward are completely balanced...

I agree it makes sense, plus, I don't see people donating 75btc atm and paying ppl back would just take a lot of time. That way we can get a bigger burning percentage and freebi can also get a bigger percentage for themselves, everyone is happy and it's less work, no need to go through the donation phase and it's usual mess phase.

I think they should make a new thread, give multiple percentage options they are happy with and let people choose. Then go ahead and make the worker proposal
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline fuzzy

Are those percentages until investors get 75BTC back? Or are you going for a worker proposal?

Sounds like this is a PERFECT use of a worker proposal.  Then the risk and reward are completely balanced...
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
Are those percentages until investors get 75BTC back? Or are you going for a worker proposal?
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
If this thread is meant to be a sales pitch directed to BTS holders to raise 75 BTC, something very important is missing.
So far I've learned that your are very passionate about what your doing and I've been told about the technical details of your concept.

But as a potential investor I still don't know what I will get in return for funding your project.
Burning 50% of your fees is good for BTS as a whole but what is the deal for the investor?

That's the problem. If we only have fee burning, the ones who didn't help will also benefit. That's why I suggest paying back to whoever gave donations. Till they have their money back they receive a higher percentage of the profits because of the risk they took. Once they are paid back, this percentage lowers and freebie can get themselves more profit or burn more bitshares or whatever they want to do. People who donated can still continue to get some part of the profits but obviously a lower amount now since they got their money back. So:

People donate 75BTC
x% of profits are to pay back.
y% will be burn
z% will be kept by freebies as profit
with x>y>z

After people get their 75BTC back:
x% are paid as dividends
y% will be burn
z% will be kept by freebies as profit

with y >= x and y>=z. Z and X are to be discussed between investors and Freebieservers, however keep in mind any income from the referral system is already included in these profits Freebie pretend to share with the community so they won't be able to take full advantage of that.
In my opinion, after the 75BTC are paid back, as long as profits burnt are >=50% or higher, everyone from the community will be pleased. Does this seem a big amount? I dont think so since I strongly believe it will take quite a while for the 75BTC to be paid back. That leaves the other 50% to be shared between freebies and investors. This is just a suggestion though. I also understand freebies will take the same amount of time to be paid decently as the BTS community will take to have a higher percentage of profits being burnt so that will probably leave investors with the smaller piece of the pie. However, I dont think that would be ungrateful because not only would this bring in volume to BitShares but it would burn more fees and attrack more people. Everyone wins.

unless it was built by funding from a worker proposal :)


Okay so here's my suggested split

10 percent for burning
50 percent for investors
40 percent for  fs.

The team will work towards delivering the product in a three weeks time frame.  Difference being, our product would be co owned by the community and we'll retain secondary roles of management

Given how current businesses don't work towards transparency and proving of liquidity at all times we strife to be different through making it verifiable via the blockchain.  We will be sending dividends on a three hour basis with the collected fees from tx fees on the platform leaving little wait times for dividend issuance. In addition, the accounting of the platform will be x

If we are to do this , our best choice is a UIA, by the looks of it.

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado

unless it was built by funding from a worker proposal :)

Yep, already mentioned on my first post in this thread. That would be ~5M BTS at current prices they would be asking for. It's up to the community to decide if that's worth it. Long term, assuming it works out, yeah, it's worth it. Guess long term supporters would vote this in, but short term ones wouldn't (or maybe they wouldnt even care)
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline fuzzy

If this thread is meant to be a sales pitch directed to BTS holders to raise 75 BTC, something very important is missing.
So far I've learned that your are very passionate about what your doing and I've been told about the technical details of your concept.

But as a potential investor I still don't know what I will get in return for funding your project.
Burning 50% of your fees is good for BTS as a whole but what is the deal for the investor?

That's the problem. If we only have fee burning, the ones who didn't help will also benefit. That's why I suggest paying back to whoever gave donations. Till they have their money back they receive a higher percentage of the profits because of the risk they took. Once they are paid back, this percentage lowers and freebie can get themselves more profit or burn more bitshares or whatever they want to do. People who donated can still continue to get some part of the profits but obviously a lower amount now since they got their money back. So:

People donate 75BTC
x% of profits are to pay back.
y% will be burn
z% will be kept by freebies as profit
with x>y>z

After people get their 75BTC back:
x% are paid as dividends
y% will be burn
z% will be kept by freebies as profit

with y >= x and y>=z. Z and X are to be discussed between investors and Freebieservers, however keep in mind any income from the referral system is already included in these profits Freebie pretend to share with the community so they won't be able to take full advantage of that.
In my opinion, after the 75BTC are paid back, as long as profits burnt are >=50% or higher, everyone from the community will be pleased. Does this seem a big amount? I dont think so since I strongly believe it will take quite a while for the 75BTC to be paid back. That leaves the other 50% to be shared between freebies and investors. This is just a suggestion though. I also understand freebies will take the same amount of time to be paid decently as the BTS community will take to have a higher percentage of profits being burnt so that will probably leave investors with the smaller piece of the pie. However, I dont think that would be ungrateful because not only would this bring in volume to BitShares but it would burn more fees and attrack more people. Everyone wins.

unless it was built by funding from a worker proposal :)
« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 06:22:37 pm by fuzzy »
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
If this thread is meant to be a sales pitch directed to BTS holders to raise 75 BTC, something very important is missing.
So far I've learned that your are very passionate about what your doing and I've been told about the technical details of your concept.

But as a potential investor I still don't know what I will get in return for funding your project.
Burning 50% of your fees is good for BTS as a whole but what is the deal for the investor?

That's the problem. If we only have fee burning, the ones who didn't help will also benefit. That's why I suggest paying back to whoever gave donations. Till they have their money back they receive a higher percentage of the profits because of the risk they took. Once they are paid back, this percentage lowers and freebie can get themselves more profit or burn more bitshares or whatever they want to do. People who donated can still continue to get some part of the profits but obviously a lower amount now since they got their money back. So:

People donate 75BTC
x% of profits are to pay back.
y% will be burn
z% will be kept by freebies as profit
with x>y>z

After people get their 75BTC back:
x% are paid as dividends
y% will be burn
z% will be kept by freebies as profit

with y >= x and y>=z. Z and X are to be discussed between investors and Freebieservers, however keep in mind any income from the referral system is already included in these profits Freebie pretend to share with the community so they won't be able to take full advantage of that.
In my opinion, after the 75BTC are paid back, as long as profits burnt are >=50% or higher, everyone from the community will be pleased. Does this seem a big amount? I dont think so since I strongly believe it will take quite a while for the 75BTC to be paid back. That leaves the other 50% to be shared between freebies and investors. This is just a suggestion though. I also understand freebies will take the same amount of time to be paid decently as the BTS community will take to have a higher percentage of profits being burnt so that will probably leave investors with the smaller piece of the pie. However, I dont think that would be ungrateful because not only would this bring in volume to BitShares but it would burn more fees and attrack more people. Everyone wins.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

jakub

  • Guest
If this thread is meant to be a sales pitch directed to BTS holders to raise 75 BTC, something very important is missing.
So far I've learned that your are very passionate about what your doing and I've been told about the technical details of your concept.

But as a potential investor I still don't know what I will get in return for funding your project.
Burning 50% of your fees is good for BTS as a whole but what is the deal for the investor?

Offline MJK

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 65
    • View Profile
I like the idea very much but would like to read your full proposal please.
I think i would support this, but defer until i read more.

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
Hi, I'm the CTO of Freebie, LLC and one of the development team members.

I normally stay away from this stuff... the spotlight is not where I like to be, my spelling and grammar is horrid and I don't take criticism well.

So now that we have gotten the obvious facts about me out of the way, let me say that I did not write the post above.  This project is not my idea, but it does have my backing.

About two years ago now I founded Freebie as a humble game server company, a friend and I gave it an honest shot with our paychecks and it fizzled out and failed... one day I was browsing hacking forums and I met this guy who was offering 'unlimited servers' for a partnership... this was a guy in India who had connections to some influential server companies (aws, ibm) and got me grants to run my company with literally no investment, just a promise of partnership...

Time goes on, and the grants ware off, no one gets free stuff forever right? so were stuck with a problem...
how do we fund and monetize a platform at the same time?
so this guy I met, there's something particularly special about him, I found... Among his many eccentricity's (and really hot blooded attitude) I found he has a passion... His passion was this crypto currency that I knew existed and understood some of the implications there of, but what i found truly magical was the way he saw this stuff,

He instantly recognized it for what it was, not just money, but a solution to many world problems, a fix for the corruption and greed that has ruined his own country, and many others.
You know, I'm not exactly a humble person, I like to think i know it all, but every day i look into this persons mind and I find new concepts and new ideas for changing the world that i never thought was possible...and you know a funny thing is that the vast majority of them are based around helping people (for a profit) and changing technology for the better.

so why am i telling you all this? isn't this a post about an exchange? who the heck is this kuro guy?
well you see the person who I've spent this time discussing goes under the guise of something I created,
every day he wears the name freebie servers (sometimes not for the better)

What I see too often, in this, and many other crypto currency communities is that the people with money are less interested in helping people and changing technology than they are
in making solid returns - I don't blame anyone for this, no one, in the end, is a true altruist. but that being said even those who don't bother a claim on such nonsense tend to stick with ideas that are 'sexy' and to me, this means repeating the same content over and over again in the name of healthy competition...

Too often do we see people with great marking skills get thrown tons of money and burn it away on nothing, while people with true game changing technology and skills get left in the dust.

In the end this has been going on for the better part of 4 years in crypto currencies and only now is technology like bitshares starting to emerge and discuss things like 'decentralized exchanges' as a possibility, and when it does come up in discussion, the natural reaction and backlash of most people is that its either impossible or too big of a task to undertake.

Freebie is a team of people dedicated to profit, change, mass adoption and cutting edge technology... each of us has our own story for how crypto has reached across the borders of this planet
and changed our lives... I don't know what you, reader, have for an economic situation, but I am not from a well off family, I grew up in Detroit, I work very hard for every satoshi I earn.

THAT is what sets us apart... we aren't casually into crypto, we don't do this in between our real lives, this is literally our lives - it reaches out across borders and allows us all to live a life of true freedom.

Freebie IS Crypto, Freebie IS the concept of Bitshares made reality.

Too much? too tacky? sorry, this is literally my first post in all of crypto... I told you I don't like the spotlight, but sometimes you guys frustrate me so much just watching it all play out, and watching this game of politics get played while nothing actually happens...

I hope that my ranting and our technical breakdown is enough for you to understand where we are coming from, and I will go silent once again to let freebie respond to your questions about the data.

Hope my words reached at least some people, thanks for your time.

-Kuro

Am usually the talkative one, but this guy has me silenced today.

Offline monsterer

For the majority of alts, they’ll all end up all using the same driver (the same as the bitcoin driver) since their RPC api is identical. There are however a few currencies that require individual connection classes (i.e. NXT, BTS, ETH to name a few).

All in all, this doesn’t take long, it just requires a bit of research on the alts you intend on setting up and their apis. The tedious task is setting up the daemons for each coin, but we’re going to not focus on the time that takes because we’re focused on the coding aspect of it.

You're talking about creating another metaexchange. Instead of trying to fund the creation of a competitor, why not work with us?

Shoot me a pm.
My opinions do not represent those of metaexchange unless explicitly stated.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline kuro112

Hi, I'm the CTO of Freebie, LLC and one of the development team members.

I normally stay away from this stuff... the spotlight is not where I like to be, my spelling and grammar is horrid and I don't take criticism well.

So now that we have gotten the obvious facts about me out of the way, let me say that I did not write the post above.  This project is not my idea, but it does have my backing.

About two years ago now I founded Freebie as a humble game server company, a friend and I gave it an honest shot with our paychecks and it fizzled out and failed... one day I was browsing hacking forums and I met this guy who was offering 'unlimited servers' for a partnership... this was a guy in India who had connections to some influential server companies (aws, ibm) and got me grants to run my company with literally no investment, just a promise of partnership...

Time goes on, and the grants ware off, no one gets free stuff forever right? so were stuck with a problem...
how do we fund and monetize a platform at the same time?
so this guy I met, there's something particularly special about him, I found... Among his many eccentricity's (and really hot blooded attitude) I found he has a passion... His passion was this crypto currency that I knew existed and understood some of the implications there of, but what i found truly magical was the way he saw this stuff,

He instantly recognized it for what it was, not just money, but a solution to many world problems, a fix for the corruption and greed that has ruined his own country, and many others.
You know, I'm not exactly a humble person, I like to think i know it all, but every day i look into this persons mind and I find new concepts and new ideas for changing the world that i never thought was possible...and you know a funny thing is that the vast majority of them are based around helping people (for a profit) and changing technology for the better.

so why am i telling you all this? isn't this a post about an exchange? who the heck is this kuro guy?
well you see the person who I've spent this time discussing goes under the guise of something I created,
every day he wears the name freebie servers (sometimes not for the better)

What I see too often, in this, and many other crypto currency communities is that the people with money are less interested in helping people and changing technology than they are
in making solid returns - I don't blame anyone for this, no one, in the end, is a true altruist. but that being said even those who don't bother a claim on such nonsense tend to stick with ideas that are 'sexy' and to me, this means repeating the same content over and over again in the name of healthy competition...

Too often do we see people with great marking skills get thrown tons of money and burn it away on nothing, while people with true game changing technology and skills get left in the dust.

In the end this has been going on for the better part of 4 years in crypto currencies and only now is technology like bitshares starting to emerge and discuss things like 'decentralized exchanges' as a possibility, and when it does come up in discussion, the natural reaction and backlash of most people is that its either impossible or too big of a task to undertake.

Freebie is a team of people dedicated to profit, change, mass adoption and cutting edge technology... each of us has our own story for how crypto has reached across the borders of this planet
and changed our lives... I don't know what you, reader, have for an economic situation, but I am not from a well off family, I grew up in Detroit, I work very hard for every satoshi I earn.

THAT is what sets us apart... we aren't casually into crypto, we don't do this in between our real lives, this is literally our lives - it reaches out across borders and allows us all to live a life of true freedom.

Freebie IS Crypto, Freebie IS the concept of Bitshares made reality.

Too much? too tacky? sorry, this is literally my first post in all of crypto... I told you I don't like the spotlight, but sometimes you guys frustrate me so much just watching it all play out, and watching this game of politics get played while nothing actually happens...

I hope that my ranting and our technical breakdown is enough for you to understand where we are coming from, and I will go silent once again to let freebie respond to your questions about the data.

Hope my words reached at least some people, thanks for your time.

-Kuro
« Last Edit: October 21, 2015, 09:22:29 am by kuro112 »
CTO @ Freebie, LLC

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
I need to owe up to something. Stating a "completely decentralized exchange for alts" in 3 weeks time, was a mistake on my behalf.
What I meant however was for bitshares pairs and assets. Again, because this can be done with the 2.0 API already.

We could possibly create a centralized exchange, but that kind of beats the purpose of what I wanted it to do.
Here is what my dev had to say.

Let’s use https://bittrex.com/ as our point of reference and ignore the idea of needing to create a public api as they’ve done.

Before we can get implementing the bid/ask system, first we must address depositing funds. We need to create a system for each currency we intend on supporting that has some basic features: creating a new address (so we can associate it with the user), querying the balance on an address, and sending funds. A abstract driver might look something like this:

public abstract class BaseRpcConnection
{
    public abstract decimal QueryBalance(string account);
    public abstract void Send(string account, string address);
    public abstract string CreateAddress();
    public abstract void Shift(string account, string master);
}

For the majority of alts, they’ll all end up all using the same driver (the same as the bitcoin driver) since their RPC api is identical. There are however a few currencies that require individual connection classes (i.e. NXT, BTS, ETH to name a few).

All in all, this doesn’t take long, it just requires a bit of research on the alts you intend on setting up and their apis. The tedious task is setting up the daemons for each coin, but we’re going to not focus on the time that takes because we’re focused on the coding aspect of it.

Somewhere in your database, you would store the information as such:
   username : string
   password : string
   rpcUrl : string

We could store port, but for some systems such as nxt, their end point isn’t simply the port but contains “/nxt” so it’s easier to store the rpc url.

Now when a user creates a wallet we simple need to do something like RpcConnection.Create(coinName) and then call invoke the instance member CreateAddress. There should be a background worker than scans users accounts for deposits and uses instance member Shift to move the funds to a central account (note: with Bittrex, the reason they use a memo field for NXT, BTS, etc. is because there is no internal shift or off-blockchain transaction like there is with the BTC daemon, so they make you deposit with a memo or message to avoid the transaction fee of shifting funds so it all ends up on one account).

Once funds are received, update the internal ledger (database) of how much funds they own within our system. Likewise, if they withdraw you deduct this amount from the internal ledger. Worthy of noting is handling balances with database locks to prevent concurrency exploitations.

Ok great, we can now accept funds (that obviously didn’t take too long…) the next step is being able to list ask/bid transactions. Pretty straight forward, an order looks something like this in the database:
   id : int
   buy : boolean    (if false then sell)
   quantity : decimal
   rate : decimal
   pair : string   (i.e. BTC-LTC)

if you wanted to be more “efficient” you could take the Cryptsy approach and use numeric representations for currencies, but since it’s likely there’s like less than 1000 pairs, this is a minor optimization for loss of easy readability.

Matching bid/ask pairs and then executing orders isn’t hard, I don’t think this is really worth going into depth about explaining… literally this could be assigned as a first year computer science project.

And then boom, at this point you have a very basic exchange. Time consumption really begins to be exhausted when you want to implement supplementary features (i.e. market tracking so that you can plot the time based data on a graph.. people today seem to sure love those candle sticks) for open/close plotting (ask/bids). Another more obvious supplementary feature would be a public api.

Difficulties with decentralization:

So going back to the principal of it all, an exchange has two aspects. Storing (and executing) the asks/bids, and storing the funds. Storing the funds is the biggest problem with decentralizing an exchange, whereas the ask/bid information is simply arbitrary data that exists on a blockchain.

The reason storing funds is so complex is because this needs to be done in a way that doesn’t involve using the alt coin daemons (it would be unreasonable to have a user running all the daemons the exchange supports) but still needs to be able to verify their balances (even if a user dumps their wallet clone on the block chain, they could still spend after an ask/bid was listed).

In Conclusion:

So it’s obvious that creating a centralized exchange can be done within this timeline but a decentralized exchange is a whole different story. To say the least, if initially we start with a centralized exchange, we then end up with a working model for a decentralized platform once we’ve developed a blockchain technology that tackles the problems listed below (i.e. once we’ve created the api for the decentralized ledger/exchange, it’s only a matter of plugging it into our exchange website in place of the centralized order books and balances).

Other challenges in creating a decentralized platform involves using a cross-platform language (i.e. Java, Python, Node.js) but I’d like to heavily place emphasis on any of these languages (as well as even C/C++) are fine to use and the decision is literally up to preference and what’s easier for the person creating the distributed platform.

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline fuzzy

I still have a Hard time believing you could pull this in 3 weeks. Why do you think you can manage that in such a short amount of time while otther projects take much longer? That May help some People choose to support you if you give a reasonable answer.

If you can get investors outside of bitshares to get in and fund this, sure that 50/50 seems good, however i assume most People would come from wiithon our ecosystem, therefore i propose to split profits in the following way:

A % Will be used to pay back orogonal investors, this should be a reasonably high percentage, anytjing from 33 to 50%
A % Will be burn
A % Will be kept by you as a profit though this Will probably be a smaller % than you expect

Of course if you pull the next big altcoin exchange that competes with pólos volumes im sure People could reconsider percdntages and give you a bigger cut, bit achieving that isnt easy!

Other solution would be to this through a worker proposal.

I love the idea of having an rxchsnge.competing with polo and others running on top of bitshares, i would love to support something like that and having the platfofm built in a month would be awesome, really awesome, the rest would be a matter of marketing and pleasing users which im positive you could achieve, but building the platform in 3 weeks seems.too good to be True.. Maybe if you could explian us how you plan to do that could hrlp ease some minds.

I lile the idea itself and would support it, but im strugglong with the 3 weeks

Got many spelling erros but im on myphone, hope its understandable

This is a solid point. Looking forward to hearing freebieservers answers on this.
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline Akado

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2752
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: akado
I still have a Hard time believing you could pull this in 3 weeks. Why do you think you can manage that in such a short amount of time while otther projects take much longer? That May help some People choose to support you if you give a reasonable answer.

If you can get investors outside of bitshares to get in and fund this, sure that 50/50 seems good, however i assume most People would come from wiithon our ecosystem, therefore i propose to split profits in the following way:

A % Will be used to pay back orogonal investors, this should be a reasonably high percentage, anytjing from 33 to 50%
A % Will be burn
A % Will be kept by you as a profit though this Will probably be a smaller % than you expect

Of course if you pull the next big altcoin exchange that competes with pólos volumes im sure People could reconsider percdntages and give you a bigger cut, bit achieving that isnt easy!

Other solution would be to this through a worker proposal.

I love the idea of having an rxchsnge.competing with polo and others running on top of bitshares, i would love to support something like that and having the platfofm built in a month would be awesome, really awesome, the rest would be a matter of marketing and pleasing users which im positive you could achieve, but building the platform in 3 weeks seems.too good to be True.. Maybe if you could explian us how you plan to do that could hrlp ease some minds.

I lile the idea itself and would support it, but im strugglong with the 3 weeks

Got many spelling erros but im on myphone, hope its understandable
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline luckybit

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2921
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: Luckybit
The issue is it has to be publicly verifiable that the burn will take place. This means it must be set not by you, but by some sort of smart contract or procedure. If the process can be verified and cannot be reversed, then I will support it. Make the pledge, enforce it with a smart contract.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline luckybit

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2921
    • View Profile
  • BitShares: Luckybit
Hey guys,

Lead biz dev of freebieservers.com here.
First off, really appreciate the feedback you gave on the ultra thread.
Knowing what people need, and don't require in a timely fashion helps us improvise ourselves as a company and create solutions that actually matter.
One of the problems people here have been mentioning is the short pace at which coins are burned.
I've been thinking a fair amount about the evolution of the ecosystem here at Bitshares and wondering what would be an alternative solution to go about doing this.

One of the most beautiful things to come out of the community here is the means to create a decentralized exchange with complete transparency.
While CCEDK has done a great job, we believe Bitshares is in a great place where it can use more exchanges and we believe we can create a unique user experience
Instead of linking to financial services and bringing in fiat, we intend to create a simple platform for the safe and transparent exchange of altcoins and UIA's .
The entire platform will be decentralized and tokens verified by the blockchain , leading to very few single points of failures.

Now, so far , the concept is basic.
What I intend to do different however is, pledge a certain part of the tx fees and revenue of this venture towards burning coins.
Assuming we get enough support to do this and go ahead and build it, we'll be willing to pledge 50 percent of all revenue into burning bts
In terms of ownership, our holding company will maintain and retain ownership but we would be happy to let go of a larger chunk in case people want to back us through PE deals.


Think about it : We could burn a couple bitcoin's worth Bitshares every day. With decreasing supply of Bitshares, the value of existing coins would increase, leading to a win solution for everyone.
Alternatively, we could simply choose to issue x amount of the profits as a dividend, but I simply believe we can do better service to the community by taking this route.

We are looking to raise a total of 75 Btc to make this happen and will take a 3 week time period to put the platform live.
Thoughts guys?

Do vote on the poll

As many people know, for long term holders burning is much better than dividends. As many people know, I'm very much in favor of burning and always have been since burning was first mentioned.

We should promote ideas which increase the burn rate as much as possible. The burn rate increasing is equal to saying that this financial enterprise and others who take similar pledges are going to pay back the dilution loan by burning the excess BTS which was created.

https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

jakub

  • Guest
Instead of linking to financial services and bringing in fiat, we intend to create a simple platform for the safe and transparent exchange of altcoins and UIA's .
The entire platform will be decentralized and tokens verified by the blockchain , leading to very few single points of failures.

It  might be a stupid question, but I just want to make sure I understand it correctly: you intend to build your platform on top of BTS and when you mention the blockchain you mean the BTS blockchain, correct?

We are looking to raise a total of 75 Btc to make this happen and will take a 3 week time period to put the platform live.

You intend to issue UIA and raise 75 BTC, build your platform and then burn 50 percent of all revenues, right?
If I'm a BTS holder, what is my motivation to buy your UIA as I could just refrain and count on other BTS holders to enter your deal, but still benefit from the burning?
Am I missing something?

Offline monsterer

We are looking to raise a total of 75 Btc to make this happen and will take a 3 week time period to put the platform live.

There is literally no way any team anywhere in the world can bring a truly decentralised product to market in 3 weeks. That timescale is laughably small. You're looking at more like 1 year upwards, depending on the level of decentralisation you aim to achieve.

You can probably knock together a simple altcoin transaction processing daemon and get bitshares API to issue UIAs in a couple of months, but it won't be decentralised. For example metaexchange liquidity partners runs as nodes in different locations around the world, but we are not decentralised, just distributed. The private keys still belong to us. Decentralised means private keys belong to only your customers.
My opinions do not represent those of metaexchange unless explicitly stated.
https://metaexchange.info | Bitcoin<->Altcoin exchange | Instant | Safe | Low spreads

Offline fav

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4278
  • No Pain, No Gain
    • View Profile
    • Follow Me!
  • BitShares: fav
just issue the UIA and see how it goes. :)

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
Take 80% of the fees (burn 20%) and when you reach 100 BTC (yep, not 75 BTC!)
then make the transition to 50:50 as your initial plan was....

PS  I am serious, People are tired to fund projects that never deliver what they are promise.If you are confident for your product you have nothing to fear! The  soonest you deliver the sooner you will get your profit's.
PS2 And then yes, I believe it will be successful and will find big support (traders) ...
PS3 You can make the transition even after you reach 150-200 BTC...
     

We have increasing interest from people here to see an actual product that works.
Although we have had hiccups on some of our new projects (EsportS) we've delivered  on most promises and are confident we can make this happen.
If I see a bit more interest, I'll issue a UIA .

We need about 50 BTC to get started - so I think , it will be best to follow the model you've suggested and make the transition as more and more people use it. 

Offline liondani

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3737
  • Inch by inch, play by play
    • View Profile
    • My detailed info
  • BitShares: liondani
  • GitHub: liondani
Take 80% of the fees (burn 20%) and when you reach 100 BTC (yep, not 75 BTC!)
then make the transition to 50:50 as your initial plan was....

PS  I am serious, People are tired to fund projects that never deliver what they are promise.If you are confident for your product you have nothing to fear! The  soonest you deliver the sooner you will get your profit's.
PS2 And then yes, I believe it will be successful and will find big support (traders) ...
PS3 You can make the transition even after you reach 150-200 BTC...
     

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile

Offline tonyk

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3308
    • View Profile
Hey guys,

Lead biz dev of freebieservers.com here.
First off, really appreciate the feedback you gave on the ultra thread.
Knowing what people need, and don't require in a timely fashion helps us improvise ourselves as a company and create solutions that actually matter.
One of the problems people here have been mentioning is the short pace at which coins are burned.
I've been thinking a fair amount about the evolution of the ecosystem here at Bitshares and wondering what would be an alternative solution to go about doing this.

One of the most beautiful things to come out of the community here is the means to create a decentralized exchange with complete transparency.
While CCEDK has done a great job, we believe Bitshares is in a great place where it can use more exchanges and we believe we can create a unique user experience
Instead of linking to financial services and bringing in fiat, we intend to create a simple platform for the safe and transparent exchange of altcoins and UIA's .
The entire platform will be decentralized and tokens verified by the blockchain , leading to very few single points of failures.

Now, so far , the concept is basic.
What I intend to do different however is, pledge a certain part of the tx fees and revenue of this venture towards burning coins.
Assuming we get enough support to do this and go ahead and build it, we'll be willing to pledge 50 percent of all revenue into burning bts
In terms of ownership, our holding company will maintain and retain ownership but we would be happy to let go of a larger chunk in case people want to back us through PE deals.


Think about it : We could burn a couple bitcoin's worth Bitshares every day. With decreasing supply of Bitshares, the value of existing coins would increase, leading to a win solution for everyone.
Alternatively, we could simply choose to issue x amount of the profits as a dividend, but I simply believe we can do better service to the community by taking this route.

We are looking to raise a total of 75 Btc to make this happen and will take a 3 week time period to put the platform live.
Thoughts guys?

Do vote on the poll

I literally love all the things you guys have done.  All my research about you on the NXT forums has shown me amazing work and a reputation that is second to none bro. 

You guys also represent a respectible chunk of NXTs value...so you and your team coming here to build for the worlds fastest blockchain shows me a change in the winds.

I personally will back (pretty much) anything you and your brilliant fellas work on.  I voted for the dividends because i think we need a means of both burning (bts currently is very deflationary) AND putting a stream of cashflow into bts holders pockets...

I literally love all the things you guys have done.  All my research about you on the NXT forums has shown me amazing work and a reputation that is second to none bro. 

You guys also represent a respectible chunk of NXTs value...so you and your team coming here to build for the worlds fastest blockchain shows me a change in the winds.

I personally will back (pretty much) anything you and your brilliant fellas work on.  I voted for the dividends because i think we need a means of both burning (bts currently is very deflationary) AND putting a stream of cashflow into bts holders pockets...

Indeed,
The nxt community has had a crucial role in us being whatever we are and their contributions have helped us grow to whatever we are.
Our next project - Fs E:Sports is 80 percent done and we are close to launch with a proper legal framework around it - was listed on the Nxt asset exchange for primary backing and we'll probably list there post launch. The asset was taken down momentarily though, due to legal issues and other involvements prolonging launch time.
We are extremely happy and proud of our involvement with their MMO : Lyth. It has been an honor working with their team so far
More info here : https://nxtforum.org/lith-the-nxt-mmo/lyth-development-announcement-(alpha-spoilers-inside!)/msg197059/#msg197059


We have been involved with nxt's major exchange (Nxthaus) and we believe we can deliver on this if given a chance.
We don't really intend to hold back on profit and hence the 50 percent dividend  issuance for backers.
If there's sufficient interest, I just might issue a UIA later today.

Blatant
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
I literally love all the things you guys have done.  All my research about you on the NXT forums has shown me amazing work and a reputation that is second to none bro. 

You guys also represent a respectible chunk of NXTs value...so you and your team coming here to build for the worlds fastest blockchain shows me a change in the winds.

I personally will back (pretty much) anything you and your brilliant fellas work on.  I voted for the dividends because i think we need a means of both burning (bts currently is very deflationary) AND putting a stream of cashflow into bts holders pockets...

Indeed,
The nxt community has had a crucial role in us being whatever we are and their contributions have helped us grow to whatever we are.
Our next project - Fs E:Sports is 80 percent done and we are close to launch with a proper legal framework around it - was listed on the Nxt asset exchange for primary backing and we'll probably list there post launch. The asset was taken down momentarily though, due to legal issues and other involvements prolonging launch time.
We are extremely happy and proud of our involvement with their MMO : Lyth. It has been an honor working with their team so far
More info here : https://nxtforum.org/lith-the-nxt-mmo/lyth-development-announcement-(alpha-spoilers-inside!)/msg197059/#msg197059


We have been involved with nxt's major exchange (Nxthaus) and we believe we can deliver on this if given a chance.
We don't really intend to hold back on profit and hence the 50 percent dividend  issuance for backers.
If there's sufficient interest, I just might issue a UIA later today.

Offline fuzzy

I literally love all the things you guys have done.  All my research about you on the NXT forums has shown me amazing work and a reputation that is second to none bro. 

You guys also represent a respectible chunk of NXTs value...so you and your team coming here to build for the worlds fastest blockchain shows me a change in the winds.

I personally will back (pretty much) anything you and your brilliant fellas work on.  I voted for the dividends because i think we need a means of both burning (bts currently is very deflationary) AND putting a stream of cashflow into bts holders pockets...
« Last Edit: October 20, 2015, 05:39:58 am by fuzzy »
WhaleShares==DKP; BitShares is our Community! 
ShareBits and WhaleShares = Love :D

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
There have been lots of exchanges offering lots of services.
If we were to do this, we intend to solve just one problem : Smooth exchanging, with complete transparency and liquidity proven at all times in a decentralized fashion. 

I don't know what people would back more (burning or dividends) - but depending on what people want we might make that choice if we find appropriate backing.

Offline CoinHoarder

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 660
  • In Cryptocoins I Trust
    • View Profile
I think any company that gives back to the community by burning fees or paying stakeholders dividends is something most people would support. Due to the anonymity features of BTS it may be best to burn the fees as far as making the process transparent.
https://www.decentralized.tech/ -> Market Data, Portfolios, Information, Links, Reviews, Forums, Blogs, Etc.
https://www.cryptohun.ch/ -> Tradable Blockchain Asset PvP Card Game

Offline Xypher

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 304
    • View Profile
Hey guys,

Lead biz dev of freebieservers.com here.
First off, really appreciate the feedback you gave on the ultra thread.
Knowing what people need, and don't require in a timely fashion helps us improvise ourselves as a company and create solutions that actually matter.
One of the problems people here have been mentioning is the short pace at which coins are burned.
I've been thinking a fair amount about the evolution of the ecosystem here at Bitshares and wondering what would be an alternative solution to go about doing this.

One of the most beautiful things to come out of the community here is the means to create a decentralized exchange with complete transparency.
While CCEDK has done a great job, we believe Bitshares is in a great place where it can use more exchanges and we believe we can create a unique user experience
Instead of linking to financial services and bringing in fiat, we intend to create a simple platform for the safe and transparent exchange of altcoins and UIA's .
The entire platform will be decentralized and tokens verified by the blockchain , leading to very few single points of failures.

Now, so far , the concept is basic.
What I intend to do different however is, pledge a certain part of the tx fees and revenue of this venture towards burning coins.
Assuming we get enough support to do this and go ahead and build it, we'll be willing to pledge 50 percent of all revenue into burning bts
In terms of ownership, our holding company will maintain and retain ownership but we would be happy to let go of a larger chunk in case people want to back us through PE deals.


Think about it : We could burn a couple bitcoin's worth Bitshares every day. With decreasing supply of Bitshares, the value of existing coins would increase, leading to a win solution for everyone.
Alternatively, we could simply choose to issue x amount of the profits as a dividend, but I simply believe we can do better service to the community by taking this route.

We are looking to raise a total of 75 Btc to make this happen and will take a 3 week time period to put the platform live.
Thoughts guys?

Do vote on the poll