Author Topic: Openledger Referral Program UP! Time to make money!  (Read 13641 times)

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Offline gn1

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If I buy my lifetime membership at "DACPLAY", am I still able to use that lifetime member username to refer new users via "openledger"?

As far as I know it should. The lifetime membership and the account is registered on the blockchain. When you refer someone your lifetime account will be listed as the lifetime referrer for that account and that information will be stored at the blockchain level.

this. your status will change anyways on the blockchain with the uprgade.

edit: check fav membership status to see how a lifetime member looks like on chain

I have upgraded to lifetime member on DACPLAY, then referred one account via DACPLAY and one account via OpenLedger. In membership page, I see that I can get 40% for DACPLAY and 60% for OpenLedger. So, this shows that I can get more referral fees if I refer someone via OpenLedger. Anyways, the test result shows that I can refer people to register on OpenLedger even if I have upgraded to lifetime member on DACPLAY.

One problem I am facing now is that there is no way for me to track the referral status properly. The referral status only shows on the DACPLAY membership page, but it only tracks the DACPLAY referral. If I import the wallet that contains the lifetime member account on OpenLedger, the referral status link is not showing on the membership page. Is there a proper/easy way to track the number of people I have referred successfully?
I'm a BitShares enthusiast in Japan, spreading BitShares daily to the Japanese people through https://genxnotes.com. Help us grow bitJPY together, so that bitUSD/bitJPY market pair will become the most popular market worldwide! Imagine what kind of world it will become when we execute this.

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Offline yvv

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What happens if I buy lifetime membership for account which I never use and refer my another account which I use for trade? Does this mean that I pay fees to myself?

Offline luckybit

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What use case do you want to support, an exchange or a currency?
Exchange!

I totally agree wit BM. If we can charge the "network fee" of 0.1~0.15% on traders, referrers will get much more money.
BitShares first should be the trader's heaven, no counterparty risks, decent trading speed (1~3sec), honest orderbook, and lower fees (slightly maybe).
If our system is attractive, bots and traders will come and generate money.

Looking forward to reading the worker proposal!

It's much more complicated than that. Without the bond market and prediction market, or margin trading, what is the liquidity supposed to come from? Traders need loans to keep trading. There has to be profit taking from somewhere.

The referral market is a great idea and I support any plans to expand or continue the growth of it, but it's not enough. We need a loan market. People who for example make money from the referrals might benefit form margin trading. Other people who make money from referrals might want a place to park their wealth and might decide loaning for a safe 1-5% in interest is best. Another person might launch a UIA of a decentralized market fund and let everyone who holds it collect dividends.

We need as many different opportunities for profit making as we can generate. We then need to advertise the opportunities to take a profit. If the UI/UX is sufficient, and the profit opportunities are ubiquitous, there will be an endless supply of profit takers and then Bitshares will be flooded with liquidity.

Profit opportunity acts as the bait which attracts everyone to Bitshares. If there isn't any known way to make a profit we will not do much trading. Right now it's too hard to use the interface or to make a profit. I'm unable to figure Bitshares 2.0 out well enough to know how to take a profit and it seems most everyone is losing money trying to trade right now.

There aren't any blogs set up to show people how to trade. How do you expect to attract traders when you don't have a network of blogs showing people your trading schemes and spreadsheets examining how much money you made? There isn't even a troll box so people who are making money can discuss it while they are making money.

As a result, it looks like Bitshares isn't being used at all. If anyone is using it to make money they seem to prefer to keep everything a secret. Keeping it a secret is not going to market the platform. The way to market the platform is to bring profit making opportunities to regular people.

Prediction markets, bond markets, margin trading, referral markets, crowd funding, and as soon as legal, equity crowd funding. Do that and you'll have plenty of advertising not coming from the forum, but from people launching crowd fund campaigns on the Bitshares platform, or from people making lots of money trading on the Bitshares platform, the sort of people who make a living trading on the Bitshares platform are the best possible marketing to professional traders. Show it's possible to be a professional trader and you'll attract more people who want to be professional traders.

I am about 90% sure the worker proposal includes margin trading. ...prediction market just needs a gui.

The priority of the community should be to get margin trading and prediction markets into Bitshares 2.0 as quickly as possible. If you want to see the share price go back up, if you want to have an easier time marketing Bitshares, add these two features. Fund the worker proposals ASAP.

The GUI for the prediction market can be done simultaneously with adding margin trading. The loan interface in addition should also allow people to borrow to buy UIAs. This way if there is a crowd fund situation a person could take a loan to buy as much as they can during the crowd fund, effectively giving them a sort of margin capability for that as well.

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Offline tonyk

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What use case do you want to support, an exchange or a currency?
Exchange!

I totally agree wit BM. If we can charge the "network fee" of 0.1~0.15% on traders, referrers will get much more money.
BitShares first should be the trader's heaven, no counterparty risks, decent trading speed (1~3sec), honest orderbook, and lower fees (slightly maybe).
If our system is attractive, bots and traders will come and generate money.

Looking forward to reading the worker proposal!

It's much more complicated than that. Without the bond market and prediction market, or margin trading, what is the liquidity supposed to come from? Traders need loans to keep trading. There has to be profit taking from somewhere.

The referral market is a great idea and I support any plans to expand or continue the growth of it, but it's not enough. We need a loan market. People who for example make money from the referrals might benefit form margin trading. Other people who make money from referrals might want a place to park their wealth and might decide loaning for a safe 1-5% in interest is best. Another person might launch a UIA of a decentralized market fund and let everyone who holds it collect dividends.

We need as many different opportunities for profit making as we can generate. We then need to advertise the opportunities to take a profit. If the UI/UX is sufficient, and the profit opportunities are ubiquitous, there will be an endless supply of profit takers and then Bitshares will be flooded with liquidity.

Profit opportunity acts as the bait which attracts everyone to Bitshares. If there isn't any known way to make a profit we will not do much trading. Right now it's too hard to use the interface or to make a profit. I'm unable to figure Bitshares 2.0 out well enough to know how to take a profit and it seems most everyone is losing money trying to trade right now.

There aren't any blogs set up to show people how to trade. How do you expect to attract traders when you don't have a network of blogs showing people your trading schemes and spreadsheets examining how much money you made? There isn't even a troll box so people who are making money can discuss it while they are making money.

As a result, it looks like Bitshares isn't being used at all. If anyone is using it to make money they seem to prefer to keep everything a secret. Keeping it a secret is not going to market the platform. The way to market the platform is to bring profit making opportunities to regular people.

Prediction markets, bond markets, margin trading, referral markets, crowd funding, and as soon as legal, equity crowd funding. Do that and you'll have plenty of advertising not coming from the forum, but from people launching crowd fund campaigns on the Bitshares platform, or from people making lots of money trading on the Bitshares platform, the sort of people who make a living trading on the Bitshares platform are the best possible marketing to professional traders. Show it's possible to be a professional trader and you'll attract more people who want to be professional traders.

I am about 90% sure the worker proposal includes margin trading. ...prediction market just needs a gui.
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

Offline luckybit

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What is the use case of Bitshares for average user at moment? Buy and Hold. Buy and Hold doesn't generate a lot of fees which doesn't generate alot of income for referrers.There is anything for them to use it for yet. The only thing for the average user to do is refer other users. What is the average user using bitshares for at the moment?. The infrastructure is still being built. Currently there is use case for traders. They have  an immediate use for Bitshares. They can trade between other assets/uia and use bitusd to hedge. Traders are the immediate customer for Bitshares. They will generate the most fees for referrers. Until an average user can buy groceries or pay bills with bitusd they wont be generating fees because they wont be transferring BitAssets anyway.

 +5%, referral programme has limited value atm

The referral program won't work without a product to sell.

The core product is BitAssets, but without a credible plan for liquidity/incentives for market makers it will be very slow going to attract regular customers.

If you're struggling to artificially create BitAsset liquidity then you have to look at introducing other key sellable products that will bring  users in and who will slowly create that liquidity over time. But paying more people to promote BTS but with nothing users want to buy when they get here is not the answer imo. 


We can see from the recent LTC and BTC pyramid ponzi schemes that when people are incentivised to promote crypto related products they can quickly go viral.

So combine a legitimate referral programme with an innovative and useful crypto product  & you do have the recipe for great results.

I think the referral program is the most attractive and valuable feature of Bitshares at the moment. The main reason people use any exchange or get involved with Bitcoin is to make money. One way or another it's about making money.

If you're offering products and or services for Bitcoin it's because you would like to acquire Bitcoin. If you're mining Bitcoin it's because you would like to acquire Bitcoin. You would not care to acquire Bitcoin if Bitcoin were not worth significant USD/fiat.

People trade to make money, people market and evangelize to make money.  Bitshares is the first and so far only network which has no barrier to entry in profit making. With Bitcoin you can't get paid to evangalize and if you can't mine it with your CPU anymore you cannot say the barrier to entry is low anymore. You don't have a lot of simple easy ways to earn Bitcoins which is why it's slow to catch on.

On the other hand if Bitshares is something anyone can earn with time and effort it will spread like a wild fire. Traders who make a profit on an exchange tend to keep trading on that exchange. So if there are many opportunities for profit on an exchange they might favor that exchange by giving their liquidity to it. Nice GUI and features do help, but ultimately it's just either a profit making activity or not. If traders are on the losing end of the trade then the ecosystem has to profit them with ways to earn enough BTS to keep trading.

The bond market is probably the best way to create a strong ecosystem for traders. Anyone can loan and earn interest. The interest could then be used as part of their personal trading fund. So the main issue Bitshares seems to be having is lack of a closed loop economy.

Programmers and the inner circle of witnesses make plenty of money in the current economy, but these are too few people to properly bring Bitshares to the masses. A prediction market would allow the masses to make money, and when they make money they can evolve into traders. Minebitshares was supposed to be a way to bring the masses in because the masses typically earn money from mining and then trade what they earn. Prediction markets would be even better than mining if it were to catch on, and winners could go and trade.
What is the use case of Bitshares for average user at moment? Buy and Hold. Buy and Hold doesn't generate a lot of fees which doesn't generate alot of income for referrers.There is anything for them to use it for yet. The only thing for the average user to do is refer other users. What is the average user using bitshares for at the moment?. The infrastructure is still being built. Currently there is use case for traders. They have  an immediate use for Bitshares. They can trade between other assets/uia and use bitusd to hedge. Traders are the immediate customer for Bitshares. They will generate the most fees for referrers. Until an average user can buy groceries or pay bills with bitusd they wont be generating fees because they wont be transferring BitAssets anyway.

This is exactly it. The average user needs an entry point into the Bitshares economy. EarnBitShares, MineBitShares, Prediction Market, Bond Market, Crowd Funding, and whatever else. The current community is going to have to take advantage of UIAs and private assets to create the age of opportunity for new entrants. A new person seeing Bitshares for the first time should be overwhelmed with all the ways people are making money off the blockchain and it should look like easy money.

Bitcoin looked like easy money at first. Anyone could just download the client, mine, and start generating money. When it was GPU mining, even after Bitcoin mining had died down, there was a long period from 2013-2014 where anyone with a GPU or CPU could mine and there were coins along the way like Primecoin, Protoshares, and many many others, where people were able to earn hundreds or thousands of dollars a month, and then they could trade with it.

So the money from trading which grew Poloneix and similar centralized exchanges came from the mining culture which backed it.  Because Bitshares has no mining culture, it will require that a new culture form in order to allow people to work within the ecosystem. We cannot tell people to work a day job and then buy Bitshares to trade on the exchange because that isn't how professional traders do things and isn't the culture. They will probably not buy lifetime accounts unless they somehow earned the money to buy those accounts from the Bitshares ecosystem.

It becomes easy to sell lifetime accounts to people who already make money from Bitshares prediction markets for example.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2015, 11:51:34 pm by luckybit »
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Offline luckybit

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What use case do you want to support, an exchange or a currency?
Exchange!

I totally agree wit BM. If we can charge the "network fee" of 0.1~0.15% on traders, referrers will get much more money.
BitShares first should be the trader's heaven, no counterparty risks, decent trading speed (1~3sec), honest orderbook, and lower fees (slightly maybe).
If our system is attractive, bots and traders will come and generate money.

Looking forward to reading the worker proposal!

It's much more complicated than that. Without the bond market and prediction market, or margin trading, what is the liquidity supposed to come from? Traders need loans to keep trading. There has to be profit taking from somewhere.

The referral market is a great idea and I support any plans to expand or continue the growth of it, but it's not enough. We need a loan market. People who for example make money from the referrals might benefit form margin trading. Other people who make money from referrals might want a place to park their wealth and might decide loaning for a safe 1-5% in interest is best. Another person might launch a UIA of a decentralized market fund and let everyone who holds it collect dividends.

We need as many different opportunities for profit making as we can generate. We then need to advertise the opportunities to take a profit. If the UI/UX is sufficient, and the profit opportunities are ubiquitous, there will be an endless supply of profit takers and then Bitshares will be flooded with liquidity.

Profit opportunity acts as the bait which attracts everyone to Bitshares. If there isn't any known way to make a profit we will not do much trading. Right now it's too hard to use the interface or to make a profit. I'm unable to figure Bitshares 2.0 out well enough to know how to take a profit and it seems most everyone is losing money trying to trade right now.

There aren't any blogs set up to show people how to trade. How do you expect to attract traders when you don't have a network of blogs showing people your trading schemes and spreadsheets examining how much money you made? There isn't even a troll box so people who are making money can discuss it while they are making money.

As a result, it looks like Bitshares isn't being used at all. If anyone is using it to make money they seem to prefer to keep everything a secret. Keeping it a secret is not going to market the platform. The way to market the platform is to bring profit making opportunities to regular people.

Prediction markets, bond markets, margin trading, referral markets, crowd funding, and as soon as legal, equity crowd funding. Do that and you'll have plenty of advertising not coming from the forum, but from people launching crowd fund campaigns on the Bitshares platform, or from people making lots of money trading on the Bitshares platform, the sort of people who make a living trading on the Bitshares platform are the best possible marketing to professional traders. Show it's possible to be a professional trader and you'll attract more people who want to be professional traders.

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Offline Empirical1.2

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What is the use case of Bitshares for average user at moment? Buy and Hold. Buy and Hold doesn't generate a lot of fees which doesn't generate alot of income for referrers.There is anything for them to use it for yet. The only thing for the average user to do is refer other users. What is the average user using bitshares for at the moment?. The infrastructure is still being built. Currently there is use case for traders. They have  an immediate use for Bitshares. They can trade between other assets/uia and use bitusd to hedge. Traders are the immediate customer for Bitshares. They will generate the most fees for referrers. Until an average user can buy groceries or pay bills with bitusd they wont be generating fees because they wont be transferring BitAssets anyway.

 +5%, referral programme has limited value atm

The referral program won't work without a product to sell.

The core product is BitAssets, but without a credible plan for liquidity/incentives for market makers it will be very slow going to attract regular customers.

If you're struggling to artificially create BitAsset liquidity then you have to look at introducing other key sellable products that will bring  users in and who will slowly create that liquidity over time. But paying more people to promote BTS but with nothing users want to buy when they get here is not the answer imo. 


We can see from the recent LTC and BTC pyramid ponzi schemes that when people are incentivised to promote crypto related products they can quickly go viral.

So combine a legitimate referral programme with an innovative and useful crypto product  & you do have the recipe for great results.

« Last Edit: November 06, 2015, 11:24:54 pm by Empirical1.2 »
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Offline Pheonike

What is the use case of Bitshares for average user at moment? Buy and Hold. Buy and Hold doesn't generate a lot of fees which doesn't generate alot of income for referrers.There is anything for them to use it for yet. The only thing for the average user to do is refer other users. What is the average user using bitshares for at the moment?. The infrastructure is still being built. Currently there is use case for traders. They have  an immediate use for Bitshares. They can trade between other assets/uia and use bitusd to hedge. Traders are the immediate customer for Bitshares. They will generate the most fees for referrers. Until an average user can buy groceries or pay bills with bitusd they wont be generating fees because they wont be transferring BitAssets anyway.

Offline clayop

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so you guys are fine with charging traders $5k for a lifetime membership yet you get teary eyed for a $0.15 tx fee? interesting.

Don't put different things on the same line. $0.15 fee is charged on each transaction, and $5k fee is related to trading volume.
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Offline tonyk

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For your fun, I made a simple spreasheet for LTM price calculation

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/139sx5ozo3KY7FzF0SeI9q6XFcaAPqejkL0ErNaMyKHk/edit?usp=sharing

we will be in a bit of trouble with this number when we hit all day-traders on the face of the earth as LM... but on the other hand 50K/mo. is a bit on the low side.

The other problem is I was paying $0.75 a trade when I was into options trading; I have to check again but I do not think my memory is failing me on that issue. It was several years ago. I would expect the prices to be lower if anything since then.

[edit] OK correction 0.25 to 0.75 per contract not per trade.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2015, 10:50:50 pm by tonyk »
Lack of arbitrage is the problem, isn't it. And this 'should' solves it.

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so you guys are fine with charging traders $5k for a lifetime membership yet you get teary eyed for a $0.15 tx fee? interesting.
I'm hoping that number is way off. 

Offline fav

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so you guys are fine with charging traders $5k for a lifetime membership yet you get teary eyed for a $0.15 tx fee? interesting.

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Also the regular users become day traders. Bitcoin miners became day traders. Referral markets could take their profits and then be day traders as a second job.


If thats true, even partially.  Thats good news for referrers.  If regular users turn into traders, and traders is where the money is, thats golden.

I suspect a great deal of operations a bitshares user might make, will probably involve the market in some way.  I'm sure the bond and prediction markets will also have referral fees and whatever else we come up with. 

It was suggested elsewhere and I like the idea of transfers being a baseline service as cheap as possible and the incentive for LTM is all the other myriad of things you can do with a BitShare.

I'm eager to read the details, and at least initially not too worried about any potential negative to referral prospects.