1000 BTS fee to update an asset?!

[btstip]

Hey Tuck Fheman, your tips have been queued to get sent to...

• roadscape: 100 TIPSHARES

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Source: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19787.msg256303/topicseen.html#msg256303

Created by hybridd

[Tuck Fheman]

#btstip roadscape 100 TIPSHARES

[btstip]

Hey Tuck Fheman, your tips have been queued to get sent to...

• svk: 10000 TIPSHARES

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Source: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19787.msg256226/topicseen.html#msg256226

Created by hybridd

[Tuck Fheman]

#btstip svk 10000 TIPSHARES

[Tuck Fheman]

Here's a little issue I've come across playing around, which I assume is tied to the precision being set to "2".

If I try to change the Market Fee % to 0.001 the result is a hung client at this screen and the only way to get out is to end the task in Windows.



So is there a way to edit the precision after creation?  The fee to transfer TIPSHARES is still far more than we'd like them to be.

[Tuck Fheman]

A picture is worth a thousand words:



Edit: Oh and I checked, TIPSHARES has precision 2 so only 2 decimals are allowed/possible.

Hmmm, I do not have Base Asset in this lightwallet client. I guess I need to wait for the new one to be linked on Github.

OK, I see what to do now. Things are just worded a little differently in the older version from 10 days ago. I think I have it figured out now thank you very much!

Also note, oddly enough I can now issue the asset properly after updating those fields.

[svk]

@Tuck Fheman   Thank you, sir!


@svk - The GUI is misleading, it says "Approximate fee: 20 BTS" when you create it, it turns out it is 5000 BTS...slightly different number

Oops, that would be the update fee, I copied some code from the update component and guess I overwrote the fee calculation!

[tonyk]

@Tuck Fheman   Thank you, sir!


@svk - The GUI is misleading, it says "Approximate fee: 20 BTS" when you create it, it turns out it is 5000 BTS...slightly different number

[svk]

No you're not screwed don't worry. The easiest way to set the CORE exchange rate is to use integers, or at least numbers larger than 1. So if you want 0.01 TIPSHARES/BTS, set BTS to 100 and TIPSHARES to 1.

I can't seem to get the desired results no matter what I enter, but at this point I'm assuming this is a display bug or the CER field has a bug that will not allow me to enter more than 2 decimal places (pretty sure we set 4 digits upon creation which was the default, I could be wrong).


and


Maybe I should word what I'm trying to do this way, if I want to make it 4 BTS / 1 TIPSHARES what do I enter in the CER field?

A picture is worth a thousand words:



Edit: Oh and I checked, TIPSHARES has precision 2 so only 2 decimals are allowed/possible.

[Tuck Fheman]

No you're not screwed don't worry. The easiest way to set the CORE exchange rate is to use integers, or at least numbers larger than 1. So if you want 0.01 TIPSHARES/BTS, set BTS to 100 and TIPSHARES to 1.

I can't seem to get the desired results no matter what I enter, but at this point I'm assuming this is a display bug or the CER field has a bug that will not allow me to enter more than 2 decimal places (pretty sure we set 4 digits upon creation which was the default, I could be wrong).


and


Maybe I should word what I'm trying to do this way, if I want to make it 4 BTS / 1 TIPSHARES what do I enter in the CER field?

[Tuck Fheman]

Can you hit - "Create Asset" for me, when you have time, to see if they indeed disappear for new asset creation. Thanks.

lightwallet

[svk]

You should have all possible flags in Permissions. Once enabled there you can set them in flags also

OK are Quote Asset Amount and Base Asset Amount fields supposed to be there, when I am creating the asset?

No, it gets set to 1/1 and once created you can update it. I'm not sure it's possible on creation as we don't yet have an asset ID,  I'll look into it though.

[tonyk]

You should have all possible flags in Permissions. Once enabled there you can set them in flags also

OK are Quote Asset Amount and Base Asset Amount fields supposed to be there, when I am creating the asset?

[svk]

You should have all possible flags in Permissions. Once enabled there you can set them in flags also

[tonyk]

No you're not screwed don't worry. The easiest way to set the CORE exchange rate is to use integers, or at least numbers larger than 1. So if you want 0.01 TIPSHARES/BTS, set BTS to 100 and TIPSHARES to 1.

@tonyk I'm not sure what you're referring to, but if you're missing permissions and flags its because they were not enabled upon creation and you cannot enable them afterwards.

I am at the point of creating the asset. Should I see those fields Tuck sees? Are they appear only once the asset do exist?
and from your answer - How I make sure I do not miss permission [when creating in the GUI -OpenLedger]?

[svk]

No you're not screwed don't worry. The easiest way to set the CORE exchange rate is to use integers, or at least numbers larger than 1. So if you want 0.01 TIPSHARES/BTS, set BTS to 100 and TIPSHARES to 1.

@tonyk I'm not sure what you're referring to, but if you're missing permissions and flags its because they were not enabled upon creation and you cannot enable them afterwards.

[tonyk]

I am not even close to seeing that many fields...and I am on OL with IE  and Chrome.

Once again - do I have to create the UIA first, in order to see them?

I think so man. I don't remember seeing them until the ability to edit these settings were put into the new lightwallet.

Thanks man!

Can you hit - "Create Asset" for me, when you have time, to see if they indeed disappear for new asset creation. Thanks.

[Tuck Fheman]

You're using an old version, there was an update yesterday that changed that page quite a lot. Try refreshing if you're using openledger, or download the new client if not.

Aww damn. I checked the repository before I went to bed, it must have been uploaded afterwards. OK will grab the new one and check it out.

Ninja edit : The latest version on GitHub is the one I'm using. It was uploaded 10 days ago. "BitShares 2.0.151111"

Or am I on the wrong page? ... https://github.com/bitshares/bitshares-2/releases

Also, you cannot enter more decimals than the precision of your asset, which was set on creation.

DOH! So there's no way to change this after creation?

Also, tony's image from OL shows the flags you can set, but those are not present in the latest lightwallet.

Ninja edit #2: If I set CER to 0.001 it accepts that setting but only displays 0.00 (mentioned above), however if I try to update the asset clicking the UPDATE button does nothing. If I set it to 0.01 it will allow me to update. So I'm going to assume that has to do with what you stated previously, when we created the asset we must have set the precision to 0.00 (two decimal places) which is causing this, is that correct? If the precision is un-editable after creation I guess we're kind of screwed and this asset is useless(?).

Thanks for all the help!!!

[Tuck Fheman]

I am not even close to seeing that many fields...and I am on OL with IE  and Chrome.

Once again - do I have to create the UIA first, in order to see them?

I think so man. I don't remember seeing them until the ability to edit these settings were put into the new lightwallet.

[tonyk]

I am not even close to seeing that many fields...and I am on OL with IE  and Chrome.

Once again - do I have to create the UIA first, in order to see them?

[svk]

Quote & base amounts set the Core Exchange Rate, which determines the fees. Try 1 TIPS : 4 BTS.

For example if an xfer costs 40 BTS and the CER is 4 BTS/TIPS, then the xfer fee can be paid with either 40 BTS or 10 TIPS.

Assuming the market value of 1 TIPS is around 4 BTS:
If you want to make money off transfers, set the CER lower than market value (e.g. 1 BTS/TIP). You'll make profit off the fee pool.
If you want to subsidize transfers, set the CER above market value (e.g. 40 BTS/TIP). You'll have to refill the fee pool more often.

Thanks! I'm still not clear on what all that means or rather how to accomplish it in the GUI, but this stuff is not my strong point in life. 

You also need to enable the flag for Charge Market Fee, looks to me like it's set to off right now.

Your current core exchange rate is 1000 TIPSHARES/BTS, so I guess the fee pool conversion will charge 40,000 TIPSHARES  for a transfer.

Where do I "enable the flag"?

Here's what the settings are now that are yielding undesirable results.



Swapping to TIPSHARES/BTS (which I didn't notice before I could do) made this a little clearer.

*BUG*  ?
However please note that the Quote Asset Amount field will only allow 3 digits to be entered. It's seems to be registering the fact that I've entered a 4th digit (but does not allow more than that), but the 4th digit is not displayed in the GUI. In the image below I have entered 0.001, but it's only displaying 0.00 and I can't bring it below 100/1 TIPSHARES/BTS.

You're using an old version, there was an update yesterday that changed that page quite a lot. Try refreshing if you're using openledger, or download the new client if not.

BTW the price is now 20 BTS to update an asset. Also, you cannot enter more decimals than the precision of your asset, which was set on creation.

[Tuck Fheman]

Quote & base amounts set the Core Exchange Rate, which determines the fees. Try 1 TIPS : 4 BTS.

For example if an xfer costs 40 BTS and the CER is 4 BTS/TIPS, then the xfer fee can be paid with either 40 BTS or 10 TIPS.

Assuming the market value of 1 TIPS is around 4 BTS:
If you want to make money off transfers, set the CER lower than market value (e.g. 1 BTS/TIP). You'll make profit off the fee pool.
If you want to subsidize transfers, set the CER above market value (e.g. 40 BTS/TIP). You'll have to refill the fee pool more often.

Thanks! I'm still not clear on what all that means or rather how to accomplish it in the GUI, but this stuff is not my strong point in life. 

You also need to enable the flag for Charge Market Fee, looks to me like it's set to off right now.

Your current core exchange rate is 1000 TIPSHARES/BTS, so I guess the fee pool conversion will charge 40,000 TIPSHARES  for a transfer.

Where do I "enable the flag"?

Here's what the settings are now that are yielding undesirable results.



Swapping to TIPSHARES/BTS (which I didn't notice before I could do) made this a little clearer.

*BUG*  ?
However please note that the Quote Asset Amount field will only allow 3 digits to be entered. It's seems to be registering the fact that I've entered a 4th digit (but does not allow more than that), but the 4th digit is not displayed in the GUI. In the image below I have entered 0.001, but it's only displaying 0.00 and I can't bring it below 100/1 TIPSHARES/BTS.

[tonyk]

Is the GUI supporting some random parts of UIA controls and settings?

I see no "Max Market Fee" and or "Core Exchange Rate"/"CER"

I know it is a work in progress. Just confirming that I do not to first create the asset, to be able to see those  things?

[svk]

I edited the Market Fee % of the UIA to 0.01%.

When I try to send some it's charging a fee of over 42,000 of the UIA.

I set the Max Market Fee to 10.

How do I make the UIA only charge around 1 of the UIA with a max of 10 to transfer?

Another question is what do the Quote Asset Amount and Base Asset Amount fields do?

Thanks!

You also need to enable the flag for Charge Market Fee, looks to me like it's set to off right now.

Your current core exchange rate is 1000 TIPSHARES/BTS, so I guess the fee pool conversion will charge 40,000 TIPSHARES  for a transfer.

[roadscape]

I edited the Market Fee % of the UIA to 0.01%.

When I try to send some it's charging a fee of over 42,000 of the UIA.

I set the Max Market Fee to 10.

How do I make the UIA only charge around 1 of the UIA with a max of 10 to transfer?

Another question is what do the Quote Asset Amount and Base Asset Amount fields do?

Thanks!

Quote & base amounts set the Core Exchange Rate, which determines the fees. Try 1 TIPS : 4 BTS.

For example if an xfer costs 40 BTS and the CER is 4 BTS/TIPS, then the xfer fee can be paid with either 40 BTS or 10 TIPS.

Assuming the market value of 1 TIPS is around 4 BTS:
If you want to make money off transfers, set the CER lower than market value (e.g. 1 BTS/TIP). You'll make profit off the fee pool.
If you want to subsidize transfers, set the CER above market value (e.g. 40 BTS/TIP). You'll have to refill the fee pool more often.

[Tuck Fheman]

I edited the Market Fee % of the UIA to 0.01%.

When I try to send some it's charging a fee of over 42,000 of the UIA.

I set the Max Market Fee to 10.

How do I make the UIA only charge around 1 of the UIA with a max of 10 to transfer?

Another question is what do the Quote Asset Amount and Base Asset Amount fields do?

Thanks!

[Tuck Fheman]

Did you pay the "typing fee" upfront?

It was feature available on blockchain level only...but now svk screwed a potential great revenue stream for BTS.

PS
I think if you pay the "typing fee", the long name creation fee - this a fee for creating non-premium names cause they tend to be longer than the more expensive premium names, and the transaction size fee you will have no problems. Well definitely in more cases than not.

https://youtu.be/d2nM55ko_ys

[tonyk]

I finished that part but now a new issue has cropped up. When I click "Issue Asset" it will only allow me to enter certain letters in the "Issue to" field. I can enter "tu" but cannot go any further with "c". But if I put an "e" it will take it (not that I want to lol) and then it just stops letting me enter any more letters. Is this a bug?

Did you pay the "typing fee" upfront?

It was feature available on blockchain level only...but now svk screwed a potential great revenue stream for BTS.

PS
I think if you pay the "typing fee", the long name creation fee - this a fee for creating non-premium names cause they tend to be longer than the more expensive premium names, and the transaction size fee you will have no problems. Well definitely in more cases than not.

[Tuck Fheman]

I finished that part but now a new issue has cropped up. When I click "Issue Asset" it will only allow me to enter certain letters in the "Issue to" field. I can enter "tu" but cannot go any further with "c". But if I put an "e" it will take it (not that I want to lol) and then it just stops letting me enter any more letters. Is this a bug?

Yep looks like you found a bug, I'll have a look.

Fixed here: https://github.com/cryptonomex/graphene-ui/commit/7a7240ec4cafe772b81caa3e7a668b2eb4c7ede6

I've asked Valentine if he can do another update today to push this fix, we'll see.

Cool thanks!

[svk]

I finished that part but now a new issue has cropped up. When I click "Issue Asset" it will only allow me to enter certain letters in the "Issue to" field. I can enter "tu" but cannot go any further with "c". But if I put an "e" it will take it (not that I want to lol) and then it just stops letting me enter any more letters. Is this a bug?

Yep looks like you found a bug, I'll have a look.

Fixed here: https://github.com/cryptonomex/graphene-ui/commit/7a7240ec4cafe772b81caa3e7a668b2eb4c7ede6

I've asked Valentine if he can do another update today to push this fix, we'll see.

[svk]

I finished that part but now a new issue has cropped up. When I click "Issue Asset" it will only allow me to enter certain letters in the "Issue to" field. I can enter "tu" but cannot go any further with "c". But if I put an "e" it will take it (not that I want to lol) and then it just stops letting me enter any more letters. Is this a bug?

Yep looks like you found a bug, I'll have a look.

[Tuck Fheman]

I finished that part but now a new issue has cropped up. When I click "Issue Asset" it will only allow me to enter certain letters in the "Issue to" field. I can enter "tu" but cannot go any further with "c". But if I put an "e" it will take it (not that I want to lol) and then it just stops letting me enter any more letters. Is this a bug?

[Tuck Fheman]

Tuck, in the root{} object you're seeing the *raw* integers- these do not have decimal points.

If the precision of an asset is 2 and the max supply is 1, then internally the max supply is stored as 100.
So 'precision' really just determines where the decimal place goes... but internally these are whole numbers.
The GUI will eventually hide all this.. for now, this raw data is useful if you know how to interpret it

When it comes to percents, they are also represented as integers internally, with a "precision" of 2.
100% => 10,000
0.01% => 1
0.001% => invalid

Thank you! As soon as I fix this and don't have to pay 40,000 of my UIA to tip you I will be tipping you!

[roadscape]

I'm really confused. I tried to alter our UIA to the following :

400,000,000 Max Supply  : Result 40,000,000,000 Max Supply
.01 % Market Fee : Result 1% Market Fee
10 Max Market Fee : Result 1000 Max Market Fee

What am I doing wrong?

Tuck, in the root{} object you're seeing the *raw* integers- these do not have decimal points.

If the precision of an asset is 2 and the max supply is 1, then internally the max supply is stored as 100.
So 'precision' really just determines where the decimal place goes... but internally these are whole numbers.
The GUI will eventually hide all this.. for now, this raw data is useful if you know how to interpret it

When it comes to percents, they are also represented as integers internally, with a "precision" of 2.
100% => 10,000
0.01% => 1
0.001% => invalid

[Tuck Fheman]

I'm really confused. I tried to alter our UIA to the following :

400,000,000 Max Supply  : Result 40,000,000,000 Max Supply
.01 % Market Fee : Result 1% Market Fee
10 Max Market Fee : Result 1000 Max Market Fee

What am I doing wrong?

[abit]

Eitehr the fee table on cryptofresh is incorrect or the blockchain fees are not what I intended.

Things like canceling a withdraw permission should be free, while creating should be more expensive.  There are many cases where it looks like the labels on the operations are wrong.

Hmm.. https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19877.msg255312.html#msg255312
Documents are badly needed.

[xeroc]

Hint: https://github.com/cryptonomex/graphene-ui/blob/master/dl/src/chain/chain_types.coffee#L50

[bytemaster]

Eitehr the fee table on cryptofresh is incorrect or the blockchain fees are not what I intended.

Things like canceling a withdraw permission should be free, while creating should be more expensive.  There are many cases where it looks like the labels on the operations are wrong.

[Tuck Fheman]

UIA update fee has been reduced to 20 BTS
http://cryptofresh.com/fees

Excellent thanks!  Now we need to figure out what all of these editable fields do.

[roadscape]

How often do u "modify" your UIA and what costs 1000BTS to change?

So far we haven't touched it while we wait for the fee to be lowered and we try to get an answer to what is what in the UIA's modifiable fields. The UIA appears to charge 1000 BTS to make any change at all.

UIA update fee has been reduced to 20 BTS
http://cryptofresh.com/fees

[Tuck Fheman]

How often do u "modify" your UIA and what costs 1000BTS to change?

So far we haven't touched it while we wait for the fee to be lowered and we try to get an answer to what is what in the UIA's modifiable fields. The UIA appears to charge 1000 BTS to make any change at all.

[Tuck Fheman]

We can lower it.

Thank you!!!!

[bytemaster]

We can lower it.

[Tuck Fheman]

 

So I take it there are very few of us issuing UIA's, hence the lack of "OMG da fees!" in this thread as there are in the "muh trade fees are too high!" threads.

I'll keep bumping this thread until this is addressed because 1000 BTS to make a simple edit to a UIA is way more ridiculous than 10/40 BTS to make a trade.

When I factor in that there is little to no help when creating/editing a UIA which means I may/probably need to edit more than once after I figure out what I just edited and what it did to my UIA ... I get a little miffed.

[cgafeng]

bts just push all user away

[monsterer]

so that's 200 bts for lifetime member? doesn't sound crazy high to me

No, that's 30k BTS to become a lifetime member, then update your asset

That's the lifetime member fee

yes plus all the other benefits you get from the membership.

I am already a lifetime member

[Tuck Fheman]

That is crazy high. Especially since it costs 5000 just to create a cheap one.

Yeah, I brought that up earlier in another thread.

I'm waiting to see if this will be adjusted before I start making changes.

[fav]

so that's 200 bts for lifetime member? doesn't sound crazy high to me

No, that's 30k BTS to become a lifetime member, then update your asset

That's the lifetime member fee

yes plus all the other benefits you get from the membership.

[monsterer]

so that's 200 bts for lifetime member? doesn't sound crazy high to me

No, that's 30k BTS to become a lifetime member, then update your asset

1000 BTS is the lifetime member fee

[fav]

so that's 200 bts for lifetime member? doesn't sound crazy high to me

[monsterer]

That is crazy high. Especially since it costs 5000 just to create a cheap one.