(Poll) Should Sharedropping Projects have to Pay tx fees for the Sharedrop?

[Tuck Fheman]

I've been waiting to see when assets like this got created, and whether the forum would be against them and try to blacklist/censor them or what would happen, lolz.

I've come close several times, but backed off just before clicking the button. I ran 10 different ideas by someone else and decided to go with a more positive UIA since I'd basically be throwing $15 away and pissing off a lot of people by tipping something like "FU" constantly. Besides I can still get the point across for 1 BTS.

[phillyguy]

worthless sharebits fun tokens that I can pass around for shits and giggles.

 

I believe the fact that people have paid BTS for them makes them not exactly "worthless".

I could be wrong, unless you consider BTS worthless as well ... and if that's the case, then you're just wrong.

#sharebits "phillyguy" 1 FUCKYOU
 

LOL. Thanks for proving my point.

[hybridd]

worthless sharebits fun tokens that I can pass around for shits and giggles.

 

I believe the fact that people have paid BTS for them makes them not exactly "worthless".

I could be wrong, unless you consider BTS worthless as well ... and if that's the case, then you're just wrong.

#sharebits "phillyguy" 1 FUCKYOU
 

I've been waiting to see when assets like this got created, and whether the forum would be against them and try to blacklist/censor them or what would happen, lolz.

[btstip]

Hey Tuck Fheman, here are the results of your tips...

• phillyguy: has been credited 1 BTS

Curious about ShareBits? Visit us at http://sharebits.io and start tipping BTS on https://bitsharestalk.org/ today!

Source: https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,20401.msg263451/topicseen.html#msg263451

Created by hybridd

[Tuck Fheman]

worthless sharebits fun tokens that I can pass around for shits and giggles.

 

I believe the fact that people have paid BTS for them makes them not exactly "worthless".

I could be wrong, unless you consider BTS worthless as well ... and if that's the case, then you're just wrong.

#sharebits "phillyguy" 1 FUCKYOU
 

[phillyguy]

Has there ever been a share drop by an outside entity on the BTS community? Or just needless circle jerking?

by an outside entity?  as soon as they sharedrop they are no longer "outside entities"...

to name a few of these "outside entities":
1) PLAY
2) MUSE
3) IDENTABITS
4) LOTTOSHARES (PT 1 AND PT 2)
5) SHAREBITS

As for target audiences...we have a GREAT one: Brownies.  in fact, while sharedropping on bts mostly means sharedropping on a few whales and centralized exchanges these days...brownies have been very solid target. 

*p.s. brownies was likely just the very beginning.

Ok...so I have BTS and brownie.pts. How can I claim what's already been share dropped?

Are you seriously mentioning Identabit!

Fuzzy - I appreciate your passion but come on man, try not to be so full of bullshit.

thank you for appreciating my passion, but to be honest it is not bullshit.  All of these chains have different teams working on them...though they also consult with bm and their team if/when needed.  Sharedropping is multifaceted...and is the beginning of the sharing economy.  You don't have to believe me today...but someday you will.   

Who said anything about believing you? I asked two questions and you provided a bunch of white noise instead of answers.

Has any group from another coin or project that was previously unrelated to BTS come to our community and said "we want your support, here's a sharedrop" and then it actually happened? Answer: No

Ok, So I have BTS and brownie.pts, how can I claim what's already been dropped? No answer from you, just garbage "if you don't believe me, someday you will"

Tuck Fehman atleast answered and said I can register my forum name and claim some worthless sharebits fun tokens that I can pass around for shits and giggles.

So, the point I was trying to get across with my original post is: Why are you starting a discussion about sharedropping fees when we can't even get anyone from another REAL crypto project to look at BTS and this community as an option?

[fuzzy]

Has there ever been a share drop by an outside entity on the BTS community? Or just needless circle jerking?

by an outside entity?  as soon as they sharedrop they are no longer "outside entities"...

to name a few of these "outside entities":
1) PLAY
2) MUSE
3) IDENTABITS
4) LOTTOSHARES (PT 1 AND PT 2)
5) SHAREBITS

As for target audiences...we have a GREAT one: Brownies.  in fact, while sharedropping on bts mostly means sharedropping on a few whales and centralized exchanges these days...brownies have been very solid target. 

*p.s. brownies was likely just the very beginning.

Ok...so I have BTS and brownie.pts. How can I claim what's already been share dropped?

Are you seriously mentioning Identabit!

Fuzzy - I appreciate your passion but come on man, try not to be so full of bullshit.

thank you for appreciating my passion, but to be honest it is not bullshit.  All of these chains have different teams working on them...though they also consult with bm and their team if/when needed.  Sharedropping is multifaceted...and is the beginning of the sharing economy.  You don't have to believe me today...but someday you will.   

[Tuck Fheman]

I think you pretended to not get that he is not asking anything but a rhetorical question, and I did not care much to put a completely unrelated to this thread comment in response to your post.

No no, I only read the first line of his post and responded thinking it was legit. 

[tonyk]

I think you are now allowed to hold brownies in account that is not matching you forum name, to begin with.

[hint] how else will BM know from which account to confiscate them if he choses to do so?

Maybe I'm confused about the question. But my answer was dealing with how he can recover the tokens I sharedropped to all Brownie.PTS hodlers via Sharebits. If the receiver does not have the same account name on the forum they will need to register it here to claim ... because the sharedrop was to BTS account names and the bot is only tied to forum names (currently).

I think you pretended to not get that he is not asking anything but a rhetorical question, and I did not care much to put a completely unrelated to this thread comment in response to your post.

[Tuck Fheman]

I think you are now allowed to hold brownies in account that is not matching you forum name, to begin with.

[hint] how else will BM know from which account to confiscate them if he choses to do so?

Maybe I'm confused about the question. But my answer was dealing with how he can recover the tokens I sharedropped to all Brownie.PTS hodlers via Sharebits. If the receiver does not have the same account name on the forum they will need to register it here to claim ... because the sharedrop was to BTS account names and the bot is only tied to forum names (currently).

[tonyk]

Ok...so I have BTS and brownie.pts. How can I claim what's already been share dropped?

If your BTS account hodling Brownies is different from your forum name, you need to register that BTS account name on the forum, then head over to Sharebits.io to claim yer coinage.

I think you are now allowed to hold brownies in account that is not matching you forum name, to begin with.

[hint] how else will BM know from which account to confiscate them if he choses to do so?

[Tuck Fheman]

Ok...so I have BTS and brownie.pts. How can I claim what's already been share dropped?

If your BTS account hodling Brownies is different from your forum name, you need to register that BTS account name on the forum, then head over to Sharebits.io to claim yer coinage.

[phillyguy]

Has there ever been a share drop by an outside entity on the BTS community? Or just needless circle jerking?

by an outside entity?  as soon as they sharedrop they are no longer "outside entities"...

to name a few of these "outside entities":
1) PLAY
2) MUSE
3) IDENTABITS
4) LOTTOSHARES (PT 1 AND PT 2)
5) SHAREBITS

As for target audiences...we have a GREAT one: Brownies.  in fact, while sharedropping on bts mostly means sharedropping on a few whales and centralized exchanges these days...brownies have been very solid target. 

*p.s. brownies was likely just the very beginning.

Ok...so I have BTS and brownie.pts. How can I claim what's already been share dropped?

Are you seriously mentioning Identabit!

Fuzzy - I appreciate your passion but come on man, try not to be so full of bullshit.

[fuzzy]

Has there ever been a share drop by an outside entity on the BTS community? Or just needless circle jerking?

by an outside entity?  as soon as they sharedrop they are no longer "outside entities"...

to name a few of these "outside entities":
1) PLAY
2) MUSE
3) IDENTABITS
4) LOTTOSHARES (PT 1 AND PT 2)
5) SHAREBITS

As for target audiences...we have a GREAT one: Brownies.  in fact, while sharedropping on bts mostly means sharedropping on a few whales and centralized exchanges these days...brownies have been very solid target. 

*p.s. brownies was likely just the very beginning.

[hybridd]

I don't think non %-factored share drops are really "fair" and no serious business venture would ever do this. That's just my opinion though, others might feel different.

[fuzzy]

dont have time to make anything but a quick response atm, but sharedropping can be done in other ways beyond distributing via % of coins held.  it can be done based on account (betty lui sharedropped 20 tokens on each btstalk account...or betty lui sharedropped on her email list)...etc.

then we have the guest ool style sharedrop you helped enable yourself!

their are, im sure, many more use cases...in fact i know of some others but atm dont have enough time to explain.

[hybridd]

Sorry, I skimmed  this thread because I felt I should reply ASAP (will re-read in a bit, but I've gotta run an errand shortly so once I'm back)... let me try answering a few questions here:

What is share dropping?
The act of choosing a targeted asset like BROWNIE.PTS, determining who holds this asset and their %-holding, and then distributing them a quantity based on their %-holding of some other asset.

Where do the fees come from?
Right now to be safe we assume 45 BTS on every transfer transaction. Since a share drop sends the assets directly to the share-holders BTS2.0 accounts, this is a transfer transaction. Thus, fee = N-holders * 45

How could we reduce fees?
Modifying BTS 2.0 itself
BTS 2.0 lacks batch operations right now, for example if there was a multi-transfer that let issue a person execute one command that pays to several people for a reasonable fee, this would reduce the cost. For example, lets say multitransfer required you to send funds to at least 5 people and costed 10 BTS per person (min. 50 BTS fee).

via ShareBits
Some how implement logging in with a BTS 2.0 account? If ShareBits could perform the sharedrop without sending any real block chain transactions, no fees need to be incurred. This is what @Tuck Fheman  attempted to do with his first few share drops (but they assumed your BTS account was the same as your forum account).

I suppose another way if you could associate a BTS 2.0 account with your BTS talk account on ShareBits. Which could be done in two ways, either a different memo-code would be used for this... or we make the assumption that if a person funds an account that BTS account becomes auto-associated with the account they funded (not ideal, for a variety of reasons).

Edit:
Ok there's no way to word this without being confusing, so before I start when I say BTS 2.0 account on ShareBits basically what I mean is similar to when I say your BTS talk account on ShareBits or your Twitter account on ShareBits:
So, there would be no way to log into an authenticated session for a BTS 2.0 account on ShareBits (with Twitter there's open authentication, with BitsharesTalk there's the security code, etc. that's how you get into an authenticated session). However, what you would be able to do is merge your BTS 2.0 account on ShareBits with (for example) your BTS talk account on ShareBits thus giving you access to your BTS 2.0 account's balances (on ShareBits).

Merging would be done by first logging into an authenticated session (i.e. say your BitsharesTalk account) on ShareBits, then going under 'Accounts' and requesting a merge to a BTS 2.0 account. The requirement for this merge is that BTS 2.0 account must have been used within your last 5 deposits to your account you're trying to merge from.

[Tuck Fheman]

I think @Tuck Fheman has the right idea. Use tool we already have and be able to hit everyone you want to hit with some semblance of targeting effectively gets the job done.

I agree!

@hybridd how about you?

You're already pulling all of the BTS account hodlers names from each UIA for your current method using Cryptofresh.

If you modify your existing code a little (my assumption) so that the sharedropper can sharedrop for free (basically tipping like we already do), Sharebits will make more in fees (A LOT MORE) by collecting on the withdrawals instead of charging the sharedropper.

I have no idea how to accomplish the last part of keeping the sharedrop in your system and notifying the BTS account holder when we don't know their forum account but I assume you can figure it out.

A simple post saying, "Hey if you own XYX-UIA we are sharedropping to it on X day and you can withdraw (with your magic solution) when it's done!".  That's the best I've come up with in 5 minutes.

More fees for Sharebits, free sharedrops for the sharedropper and everyone's happy ... except fav. 

You guys are much smarter than me, so I'm sure you can come up with an elegant solution that will make you and your investors more profits by passing the fee to the withdrawer.

[phillyguy]

Has there ever been a share drop by an outside entity on the BTS community? Or just needless circle jerking?

[BunkerChainLabs-DataSecurityNode]

What we are talking about here is a Worker proposal to create a whole new function within bitshares.

Do we want to spend something like $4000 on something like this?

Before we get all crazy about it though, what is our target customer? When was the last time some other coin or organization came along wishing to sharedrop on all the BTS holders? Only ones I seem to recall recently choose to do it in such a way that they only got those that were interest or active in BTS.

By reducing the fee you are lowering the barrier to entry sure, but on the other side of it, the sharedroppers are still taking on a huge chunk of their value to distribute to many who may not respond, or just dump them into oblivion as has always happened in the past. It's not just the cost of doing a sharedrop that is prohibitive, it's the value return. Even at free it still would not solve the value issue.

I think @Tuck Fheman has the right idea. Use tool we already have and be able to hit everyone you want to hit with some semblance of targeting effectively gets the job done.

[Tuck Fheman]

- you won't get every bts id in a database like the forum.

Cryptofresh.com

- why would a sharedropper use a centralized method? remember: every sharedrop would go to sharebits, not the user. that's not what bitshares is about.

Because this way it's free, which was the issue being discussed. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I bet there are many more counter arguments

Come at me bro!

[fav]

-snip-

wishful thinking. we have to talk about real sharedropping here

It's already been done, four times, successfully. No wishing involved. All that needs to be done is for Sharebits to modify the code they implemented after I did my 4 sharedrops on their system, thereby increasing the amount of fees they make and making sharedropping free.

No clue what you're missing here, but it's quite simple actually.

- you won't get every bts id in a database like the forum.
- why would a sharedropper use a centralized method? remember: every sharedrop would go to sharebits, not the user. that's not what bitshares is about.

I bet there are many more counter arguments

[Tuck Fheman]

-snip-

wishful thinking. we have to talk about real sharedropping here

It's already been done, four times, successfully. No wishing involved. All that needs to be done is for Sharebits to modify the code they implemented after I did my 4 sharedrops on their system, thereby increasing the amount of fees they make and making sharedropping free.

No clue what you're missing here, but it's quite simple actually.

[fav]

-snip-

wishful thinking. we have to talk about real sharedropping here

[Tuck Fheman]

We should make it free to sharedrop if we want to get any sharedrops.

and how would you prevent spam?

You can sharedrop for free and you can ignore the bot.

Problem solved!

The only remaining issue is solved by each individual account holder by registering their BTS account name here on the forum.

It would probably then be best to verify they are the proper account holder.

Point being ... all of this can already be done with a little help from the account hodlers.

@hybridd this may also make Sharebits more in fees by each individual account holder having to pay the 45 BTS to withdraw vs the current one time fee to the sharedropper. (hint)

Example : The other day I ran the current sharedrop version you've implemented (up to the point of actually doing it) and it was going to charge me 890 BTS to sharedrop.  With just 100 people being sharedropped to the bot would make 4500 BTS in fees IF it was charging the fees to the withdrawers.

[fav]

We should make it free to sharedrop if we want to get any sharedrops.

and how would you prevent spam?

[Ander]

We should make it free to sharedrop if we want to get any sharedrops.

[Tuck Fheman]

If it's a UIA sharedropping on some other UIA or some part of the community (like the "top BTS holders"), then it should be full price.
If it's a sharedrop on the whole community (all BTS holders) then it should be much cheaper (just a spam prevention).

^ This

^ This

[EstefanTT]

If it's a UIA sharedropping on some other UIA or some part of the community (like the "top BTS holders"), then it should be full price.
If it's a sharedrop on the whole community (all BTS holders) then it should be much cheaper (just a spam prevention).

^ This

^ This

[DestBest]

If it's a UIA sharedropping on some other UIA or some part of the community (like the "top BTS holders"), then it should be full price.
If it's a sharedrop on the whole community (all BTS holders) then it should be much cheaper (just a spam prevention).

^ This

[triox]

If it's a UIA sharedropping on some other UIA or some part of the community (like the "top BTS holders"), then it should be full price.
If it's a sharedrop on the whole community (all BTS holders) then it should be much cheaper (just a spam prevention).

[fuzzy]

God productive discussion makes me smile...thank you so much for it. 

[xeroc]

We shouldn't make it "free" but cheap ..
Free would be bad as it allows to easily spam the network significantly ..
I'd rather say sharedropping costs you $100 per 1000 accounts or so ..

[Tuck Fheman]

Or is there a way we could make it free to sharedrop? 

It's already free. I did it last week at no cost to me.

The only issue is that each BTS account holder must register that same name here on the forum to collect, unless Sharebits were to create a workaround.

What they did was create a workaround that made them and their investors money and I don't blame them for that.

If you want to know how to do it for free, go here (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,19852.msg261094.html#msg261094) but keep the caveat mentioned in mind before sharedropping.

[fuzzy]

Or is there a way we could make it free to sharedrop?  I am interested in opinions here so please vote in the poll but also try to give constructive info. 

To me, we should make it as easy as possible for token creators and project teams to sharedrop on our community because the easier (and cheaper) it is to do so...the more it will happen, which just seems like a win-win to me.