Author Topic: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain  (Read 1227 times)

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Offline clayop

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BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« on: January 18, 2016, 05:29:05 am »
We soon have OPEN.EUR with 0% deposit fee via SEPA, which is very nice bank transfer system for Euro people.
I'm thinking that we can have BTC-EUR market on DEX using OPEN.EUR and OPENBTC.

Here's some marketing point.

1. It has an honest orderbook
2. The blockchain-based market system cannot be hacked
3. Users can control all of their fund (IOU)
4. With relatively secure system than centralized exchanges, it can have more secure wallet servers


I little researched Kraken, where $2 mil (BTCEUR) traded in last 24 hours, and found couple of points we have to consider to adjust.

1. Withdraw fee (deposit fees are both 0%)
- Kraken: 0.09 Euro
- OPEN.EUR: 3.0%

2. Trading fee
- Kraken: maker 0%~0.16% / taker 0.10~0.26% (Most of cases it maybe around 0.15% / 0.25%)
- OPEN.EUR: 0.3% / OPENBTC: 0.2%

3. Liquidity: we need a market making bot that copies orders from Kraken to DEX (with some aggregation and buffer) [member=11]dannotestein[/member]

If we can make it, we may get some traction from the world. Any suggestions and comments are more than welcome.
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krondix

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2016, 07:57:36 am »
I'm ready to help with liquidity

Offline karnal

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2016, 08:23:54 am »
What I don't get is how having the various XXXXX.YYY improves over centralized exchanges. If your company disappears, we're all left with useless tokens.

Wouldn't it make more sense to accept deposits in EUR and hand out BitEUR?

Offline Samupaha

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2016, 08:50:37 am »
What I don't get is how having the various XXXXX.YYY improves over centralized exchanges. If your company disappears, we're all left with useless tokens.

This is how exchanges work. When customers are trading, they are using IOUs, not real things.

Wouldn't it make more sense to accept deposits in EUR and hand out BitEUR?

This would be just selling and buying euros and biteuros. So it's more something that traders do, not exchanges.

Offline karnal

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2016, 09:01:27 am »
Why not just trade the real thing, though? Is the collateral required the main obstacle, or also perhaps desired control over the asset parameters?

p.s: Any up-to-date documentation regarding procedures to issue a UIA, best practices, etc?

Offline Akado

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2016, 09:41:16 am »
What I don't get is how having the various XXXXX.YYY improves over centralized exchanges. If your company disappears, we're all left with useless tokens.

Wouldn't it make more sense to accept deposits in EUR and hand out BitEUR?

How can exchanges keep up with the collateral? I deposit 100euros, exchange can only credit me 50bitEUR or something due to collateral being ~200%.

bitEUR is needed, however, there is no way for exchanges to do that unless they place a huge amount of money locked in collateral, which by itself means nothing because if there is a sudden surge on deposits, they might still not be able to keep up with them and be forced to say "sorry we dont accept deposits atm" which, if they do, they won't be used ever again.

I think exchanges should be an account type and allowed to have lower collateral maybe. Or have them share a multi signature account among themselves. That way they monitor each other. I've already suggested this. I believe it would be tough for them to agree with this but atm I have no other ideas.
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Offline karnal

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2016, 09:47:47 am »
It seems vaguely horrendous to have up to $exchangeNo SOMEEXCHANGE.CURRENCY "coins" which then must be sold back for the "real" BitCurrency.. correct me if I'm wrong, but there would be little incentive to ever use, say, BitEUR in this scenario ..

Offline cube

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2016, 11:15:22 am »
1. Withdraw fee (deposit fees are both 0%)
- Kraken: 0.09 Euro
- OPEN.EUR: 3.0%

2. Trading fee
- Kraken: maker 0%~0.16% / taker 0.10~0.26% (Most of cases it maybe around 0.15% / 0.25%)
- OPEN.EUR: 0.3% / OPENBTC: 0.2%

In summary, openledger is not competitive versus Kraken.  Any chance to improve on it? [member=23432]ccedk[/member]

It seems vaguely horrendous to have up to $exchangeNo SOMEEXCHANGE.CURRENCY "coins" which then must be sold back for the "real" BitCurrency.. correct me if I'm wrong, but there would be little incentive to ever use, say, BitEUR in this scenario ..

I think this is the '$$$$' question/puzzle that needs to be solved.  If we could not get BitXXX going yet, we could at least get SOMEEXCHANGE.YYYCURRENCY "coins" going.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2016, 11:17:23 am by cube »
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Offline Akado

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2016, 11:35:40 am »
It seems vaguely horrendous to have up to $exchangeNo SOMEEXCHANGE.CURRENCY "coins" which then must be sold back for the "real" BitCurrency.. correct me if I'm wrong, but there would be little incentive to ever use, say, BitEUR in this scenario ..

There is. bitEUR is a trustless asset while exchangeAsset.eur are not. but I agree we need to create more incentives. Say there would be market makers using MAKER on a exchange.eur/bitEUR market. That way people could almost instantaneously change between the two. Meaning as soon as you get exchange.eur you could trade it for bitEUR which is safer if you want to hold while the market makers get profit from taking the risk of holding exchange.iou

For that we would need MAKER though.
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Offline Samupaha

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2016, 11:52:33 am »
I'd guess that exchangeEUR/bitEUR peg will hold quite well. No need for bots or anything, just place orders with a profit margin you want. It's so easy that anybody can do that.

Offline Empirical1.2

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Re: BTC-EUR Market Based on Blockchain
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2016, 12:00:11 pm »
What I don't get is how having the various XXXXX.YYY improves over centralized exchanges. If your company disappears, we're all left with useless tokens.

Wouldn't it make more sense to accept deposits in EUR and hand out BitEUR?

How can exchanges keep up with the collateral? I deposit 100euros, exchange can only credit me 50bitEUR or something due to collateral being ~200%.


If the proceeds of the standard 0.2% trading fee was directed to BitAsset collateral, I wonder if that could over time supplement collateral to the point that 100% collateral from the short side would be adequate?
« Last Edit: January 18, 2016, 12:01:46 pm by Empirical1.2 »
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