Author Topic: OPENPOS :: Smartcoins Point Of Sale (POS) & BitShares Wallet for Android/iPhone  (Read 60257 times)

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Offline 麥可貓

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I was re-directed here by bitacer (https://bitsharestalk.org/index.php/topic,20780.0.html). Sorry in advance that  don't have a lot casual time now, so I make my point as concise as possible:

1. cell phone wallet is definitely worth doing. I still remember there was a project called limewallet that claimed to do so, but I cannot find any progress now
2. Speaking of POS, lets make this clear logically: "a POS for bts" does not equal to "commercial adoption of bts", but what we actually want is the later one, isn't it?
3. Is a POS for bts the key for stores to accept bts? Not actually. The key is a good commercial team to persuade corporations to do so.
4. Is a POS for bts necessary for stores to accept bts? Not actually. Check this out if you have not seen it:
https://medium.com/@digital654321/familymart-now-accpets-bitoex-s-bitcoin-wallet-to-buy-goods-b85c9bac78f2#.djc1n1g0g
a bitcoin exchange BitoEX teamed up with familymart to aceept bitcoin to buy goods by using the small machine 'famiport'. They just added a button for this next to buttons for buying game points or other coupons. No complex software is involved, the key secret is how BitoEX persuade Famiymart to do so.

Once again, Itruely appreciate the effort to make a cell phone wallet for bts, but as to the other one,  it is actually a commercial problem, not a programming problem.
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Offline Akado

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Imo the Market fee of OPENPOS is a bit too high.
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Market fee   2%

Isn't the fee for payment terminals or whatever their called, like 3%? I understand you have a business but the difference might not be worth it for merchants.
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Offline yvv

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3. Is a POS for bts the key for stores to accept bts? Not actually. The key is a good commercial team to persuade corporations to do so.

This is not a POS for BTS. Merchants will never accept BTS. They will accept bitUSD, bitEUR etc, or issue their own tokens. Bitshares != BTS.

Offline kenCode

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No complex software is involved, the key secret is how BitoEX persuade Famiymart to do so.

Let the competition do the persuasion. Over 50K businesses use the Odoo software, businesses like Cox Communications for example (they have millions of customers). Instead of trying to convince 1 corporation, I would rather provide options for 50K hungry businesses all at once, some whom of which are competing with each other. Hence, we kill 50K birds with 1 stone (in a sense).
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Offline Chris4210

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Imo the Market fee of OPENPOS is a bit too high.
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Market fee   2%

Isn't the fee for payment terminals or whatever their called, like 3%? I understand you have a business but the difference might not be worth it for merchants.

The merchant fees depend on the payment processor. They can range from 1-2% for each debit card transaction and 2-4% and more  for credit cards .

Many small stores in Germany do not accept debit cards as payment due to the high fees. We plan offer lower fees for our services, especially since we use Smartcoins bitEUR, bitUSD, or bitCNY as core currencies.

Quote
3. Is a POS for bts the key for stores to accept bts? Not actually. The key is a good commercial team to persuade corporations to do so.

This is not a POS for BTS. Merchants will never accept BTS. They will accept bitUSD, bitEUR etc, or issue their own tokens. Bitshares != BTS.


Yes, the Smartcoin POS can handle regular debit and credit cards PLUS all major Smartcoins ranging from BitShares, Bitcoin to Doge and Litecoin. Most Bitcoins POS where not successful due to BTC price volatility. I am convinced we can change that with BitShares Smartcoins.
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Offline kenCode

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I'd like to give a special Thank You, a shoutout to [member=37209]bitacer[/member] for correcting our Turkish translation!
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bUN9N6uIBEloXtWZNXJQ-xG6NaT57FA4sHOvkqRyGE8/edit?usp=sharing
 
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Offline yvv

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Yes, the Smartcoin POS can handle regular debit and credit cards PLUS all major Smartcoins ranging from BitShares, Bitcoin to Doge and Litecoin. Most Bitcoins POS where not successful due to BTC price volatility. I am convinced we can change that with BitShares Smartcoins.

Merchants can also issue their own tokens, like giftcards, in few seconds. Think about it. A token fully baked by business. Customer preloads bitshares wallet with merchant's token, then go shop with discount. A win situation for both, merchant and customer.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2015, 04:32:26 pm by yvv »

Offline kenCode

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Merchants can also issue their own tokens, like a giftcards, in few seconds. Think about it. A token fully baked by business. Customer preloads bitshares wallet with merchant's token, then shop with discount. A win situation for both, merchant and customer.

Bingo +5% +5% and +5% 8)
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Offline 麥可貓

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No complex software is involved, the key secret is how BitoEX persuade Famiymart to do so.

Let the competition do the persuasion. Over 50K businesses use the Odoo software, businesses like Cox Communications for example (they have millions of customers). Instead of trying to convince 1 corporation, I would rather provide options for 50K hungry businesses all at once, some whom of which are competing with each other. Hence, we kill 50K birds with 1 stone (in a sense).

1. If blockchain technology, or at least bitcoin, has become a self-evident phenomena, then yes companies would be persuaded naturally. If it is still the frontier of innovation, then as I know a commercial expert is the key to bridge two worlds.
2. Convicing 1 corporation with 2986 branches (aka Familymart) is definitely better than convicing 50k corporations in many ways. You cannot have the man power to convince 50k corporations, hence it is not like kill 50k birds with one stone, it is actually sit and wait 50k birds die naturally.
3. A good example is the bts cart. As I can recall, it has been done for a long time. Look how many web shops are using it?
« Last Edit: December 27, 2015, 04:05:59 pm by 麥可貓 »
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Offline yvv

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You cannot have the man power to convince 50k corporations, hence it is not like kill 50k birds with one stone, it is actually sit and wait 50k birds die naturally.

It is actually like putting bird food into 50K bird feeders and waiting when 50M birds come to eat. They may come or may not. Good chance that they will.


Offline Pheonike


The more options bts/smartcoins have out in the wild, the better the odds of success. Its nearly impossible to predict which ave would lead to success thars why we should have many.

Offline btswolf

Hi,

Since I were not able to find BitShares-Munich as registered Company it seems like you are doing this fundraiser as private individuals?!
If you are doing it as private individual I wonder if the 19k EURO you want to raise are really reliable developer costs or if you just want to stay in the 20k EURO taxfree crowdfunding zone?
Or are you doing the fundraiser as Small Business? Then you would have to pay tax if you raise more than 17.500 EURO?!

If this is a private show how can Chris be the CEO/CMO/CFO of anything?
Why is CCEDK the issuer of the Token and you are "only" the seller?
* What is the difference between creating/issuing the token and just selling it?

I suggest you to create a legal business entity because you are:
* Doing a crowdfund of ~19.000 €
* You are offering a 50% rewarding program which is basically recurring buyback of OPENPOS that is very likely affected by the KWG
* You are offering a contract which is at least affected by $312b BGB

Wasn't there a call with Winheller from which you wanted to post the results here a while ago?
* I think the whole community would benefit from the knowledge you gained about bitassets and taxes.

Sorry for this littlebit pessimistic post but I fear I would not get back anything in return of my investment when you've found out how big the regulatory issues you'll face really are.

On the other hand you will become my personal heroes if this projects gets through all the regulatory instances successfully.

Offline eagleeye

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Hi,

Since I were not able to find BitShares-Munich as registered Company it seems like you are doing this fundraiser as private individuals?!
If you are doing it as private individual I wonder if the 19k EURO you want to raise are really reliable developer costs or if you just want to stay in the 20k EURO taxfree crowdfunding zone?
Or are you doing the fundraiser as Small Business? Then you would have to pay tax if you raise more than 17.500 EURO?!

If this is a private show how can Chris be the CEO/CMO/CFO of anything?
Why is CCEDK the issuer of the Token and you are "only" the seller?
* What is the difference between creating/issuing the token and just selling it?

I suggest you to create a legal business entity because you are:
* Doing a crowdfund of ~19.000 €
* You are offering a 50% rewarding program which is basically recurring buyback of OPENPOS that is very likely affected by the KWG
* You are offering a contract which is at least affected by $312b BGB

Wasn't there a call with Winheller from which you wanted to post the results here a while ago?
* I think the whole community would benefit from the knowledge you gained about bitassets and taxes.

Sorry for this littlebit pessimistic post but I fear I would not get back anything in return of my investment when you've found out how big the regulatory issues you'll face really are.

On the other hand you will become my personal heroes if this projects gets through all the regulatory instances successfully.

Have a google translate button on your website, I wouldn't mind reading your stuff.

I would have pmed you but not everyone looks at personal messages.

I also agree with you, if kenCode can pull this off, it will make bitshares huge.
« Last Edit: December 28, 2015, 07:27:37 am by eagleeye »

38PTSWarrior

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Hi,

Since I were not able to find BitShares-Munich as registered Company it seems like you are doing this fundraiser as private individuals?!
If you are doing it as private individual I wonder if the 19k EURO you want to raise are really reliable developer costs or if you just want to stay in the 20k EURO taxfree crowdfunding zone?
Or are you doing the fundraiser as Small Business? Then you would have to pay tax if you raise more than 17.500 EURO?!

If this is a private show how can Chris be the CEO/CMO/CFO of anything?
Why is CCEDK the issuer of the Token and you are "only" the seller?
* What is the difference between creating/issuing the token and just selling it?

I suggest you to create a legal business entity because you are:
* Doing a crowdfund of ~19.000 €
* You are offering a 50% rewarding program which is basically recurring buyback of OPENPOS that is very likely affected by the KWG
* You are offering a contract which is at least affected by $312b BGB

Wasn't there a call with Winheller from which you wanted to post the results here a while ago?
* I think the whole community would benefit from the knowledge you gained about bitassets and taxes.

Sorry for this littlebit pessimistic post but I fear I would not get back anything in return of my investment when you've found out how big the regulatory issues you'll face really are.

On the other hand you will become my personal heroes if this projects gets through all the regulatory instances successfully.

Have a google translate button on your website, I wouldn't mind reading your stuff.

I would have pmed you but not everyone looks at personal messages.

I also agree with you, if kenCode can pull this off, it will make bitshares huge.
Eagleeye, could you write me a worker proposal?

Offline kenCode

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[member=32866]btswolf[/member]
Our meeting with Winheller on Nov 23rd was very revealing. They handle all of the legal and tax reporting. I cannot give legal or financial advice, but I can tell you what they told us as they said that we *could* actually be an issuer of tokens but we chose not to since we want to raise funds from a global audience for this project. I'm more paranoid than most when it comes to regulations so conferring with Chris, we chose CCEDK as the perfect choice because of their status out of Denmark which is still very crypto friendly. All you guys issuing sharebot tips and brics and all that stuff be forewarned, what you are doing is very dangerous. Winheller also told us that if you (Americans, Germans, Europeans in general, whatever) DO want to be the issuer of a UIA that (in issuance context) you should never use the words "shares", "dividend", "money", "credit", "kickback" or "bank". Even "tips" are supposed to be taxed you guys. The word token however is apparently undefined in German law and since we live here we chose to go with Winheller's advice and only use that word. The words "reward" and "token" are used to indicate the long term benefits of holding a token (like baseball cards, they may, or may not be worth something some day). The 19K number has nothing to do with taxation, it is the exact number that must be raised to finish up these 2 projects. For everyone's security, the developers are always paid using multiple milestones and escrow. As for Titles, you can have whatever titles you want as it summarizes for people who to go to for what information. Generally speaking, Chris is the marketing and finances guy and I am the project manager and developer guy. Both of us are taxed privately without a company formed right now, but at some point when we can afford it and we actually have some assets to protect then we may set something up along those lines. I for one have no income at all, zero. I do get a government check every month for 180€ that helped me out personally a bit but that is about to end next month I think. My wife works full-time to support the family right now. Chris has a second part time job which helps, but I can tell you we are both just making ends meet so that we can get these projects off the ground. When BitShares grows, then we can grow.
 
We'll be having a mumble this friday (I think), [member=602]fuzzy[/member] so if you guys want to chat about Smartcoins POS or the BitShares Wallet please join in on the call!
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