Author Topic: 2016 Vision Blog Post  (Read 26749 times)

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jakub

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Depends upon how you define terms.  Remove force from government but retain the ability to have an ordered, peaceful society that appears to be "governed" from the outside and what do you have? 

So we can either attempt to scare people with new terms by "taking away the government they believe deep down they need" *OR* we can say "keep your government, I just want to take away its right to use violence".

The problem with government isn't that it uses violence, but that the people believe it has the right to.  Take away the belief of the people and it is little more than organized crime.  If we tell people we can achieve everything "good" the government does without using violence then they are receptive.

Those are very wise words.
However, there are many ways to dismantle this false belief in government having the right to use force.

One of them might be MAS. Another might be DEX.
So let the shareholders decide how to allocate our limited resources between MAS and DEX.

And for the shareholders to be able to choose we must have:
- a couple of worker proposals for building DEX
- a couple of worker proposals for building MAS

Instead of an abrupt announcement by BM that we need to pivot and from now on MAS is the way to go.

Offline CoinHoarder

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Communities that share a common philosophy are potential customers we can serve.  We have suggested two or three.

But how fast you can serve them? That's my biggest problem with MAS. I'm really skeptical that you could get thousands of paying members in 2016. You still have only a vision and (as far as I know) nothing concrete has been done.

The PR from a MAS could be huge... we'really talking mainstream media. I can read the headlines now...

"Non violent drug users can now buy insurance in case they get arrested..."

"Prostitutes can now buy insurance...."

"Your next speeding ticket is covered..."

Etc etc.

Everyone's complaining about finishing the DEX,  butironically an MAS feature will bootstrap the DEX more so than "finishing" the finished DEX.
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Offline xeroc

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Government IS force.

Bingo.

Depends upon how you define terms.  Remove force from government but retain the ability to have an ordered, peaceful society that appears to be "governed" from the outside and what do you have? 

So we can either attempt to scare people with new terms by "taking away the government they believe deep down they need" *OR* we can say "keep your government, I just want to take away its right to use violence".

The problem with government isn't that it uses violence, but that the people believe it has the right to.  Take away the belief of the people and it is little more than organized crime.  If we tell people we can achieve everything "good" the government does without using violence then they are receptive.
Very fascinating interpretation. Thx

Offline bytemaster

Government IS force.

Bingo.

Depends upon how you define terms.  Remove force from government but retain the ability to have an ordered, peaceful society that appears to be "governed" from the outside and what do you have? 

So we can either attempt to scare people with new terms by "taking away the government they believe deep down they need" *OR* we can say "keep your government, I just want to take away its right to use violence".

The problem with government isn't that it uses violence, but that the people believe it has the right to.  Take away the belief of the people and it is little more than organized crime.  If we tell people we can achieve everything "good" the government does without using violence then they are receptive. 
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Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract between myself and anyone else.   These are merely my opinions and I reserve the right to change them at any time.

Offline Samupaha

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Communities that share a common philosophy are potential customers we can serve.  We have suggested two or three.

But how fast you can serve them? That's my biggest problem with MAS. I'm really skeptical that you could get thousands of paying members in 2016. You still have only a vision and (as far as I know) nothing concrete has been done.

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Offline Ben Mason

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If one's mind is in a state of fear, I think we'd all agree that clear and critical thought becomes compromised. Bytemaster must be encouraged to share his thoughts and ideas, to chew them over with our community, other communities and other visionaries within the blockchain arena. Whatever he needs to continue to grow and inspire.

If everyone currently involved in BItShares disappeared....the code will remain and at some point, if it's as powerful as we think it is and still competitive, someone else will pick it up, rebrand and build a community around it. It is only our community's perception of value that gives BItShares any value at all.  If we want this/our iteration of BitShares to succeed, we all need to work out how to educate and reach people. Through the hard work, talent and dedication of many in this community, the technology is almost ready within the scope of existing features.

So we....
Continue to polish what we have.
Enhance our community based material.
Embrace innovative ways to fund further development (although remaining mindful of fairness, mitigating undue complexity and limiting regulatory risk.)
Develop a clear and powerful mission statement that will grab and hold the attention of people and communities within and beyond crypto.

BitShares. Helping people everywhere to secure a brighter future.

All the value is in our community at the moment, it's only through recognising this and expanding it that we'll reach our potential.

Offline merivercap

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I like the vision and focus on growing the community.   The DEX and Smartcoins can still be core features and businesses can focus on marketing it to certain demographics, but leading with the Bitshares community as the foundation for a new society with voluntary governance may bring a lot of people together.   Our community is a major strength.    We can continue to market Bitshares as a financial platform for businesses, but if there is a community with a larger purpose attached to the financial platform it can be an added benefit for businesses.  Most people building businesses on Bitshares probably agree with the NAP anyways.  A small number of businesses may not want to associate with the community, but the technology is behind the scenes so anyone can use it.   Also traditional banks and financial institutions really just want private permissioned blockchains..

DPOS is a natural fit for voluntary governance....we can use it for local communities, non-profits, businesses... the more organizations that use the blockchain to organize, have transparency and have accountability the better...  .. (BTW BitCash as a company will use the blockchain for transparency and acountability.)....anyways we'll see what the rest of the community thinks..

Lastly we should really reach out to the Bitcoin community more... our technology really complements Bitcoin and many of those in the Bitcoin community promote the same ideas about voluntaryism and governance...
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Offline Geneko

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For starters, my intent is to focus mostly on marketing, community building rather than technology. The technology can take care of itself if you have the right ideas and messages that resonate.

This is best thing that could happen!! If nobody I will follow this resolution.

I have made a conscious decision to not invest more of my own money in unproven ideas. This means that I will take steps to prove an idea has traction and figure out how to market the idea before building it out. It means that the MAS will have thousands of members on "day one" because I won't even build it out if I cannot attract thousands of people to a concept.

MAS is successful because it is simple idea easy to grasp and has strong underlying emotion. We are at best, elephant riders, where elephant is our emotional being.
But don't forget that debit and credit cards actually made that simple and convenient.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2015, 10:34:42 pm by Geneko »

Offline Geneko

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We need to give people more reasons to come use the platform.


You shuould not give people more reasons, what you should give them is something they can see, feel, touch, smell, taste, experience.

Nobody bothers with reasons. And you are very tallented with viral presentations, explanations, asociations, examples, use that
instead of reasoning. 

Offline lil_jay890

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I get the fact Dan wants to share his view and vision. Other people shouldn't pressure you not to think or share your thoughts or how you see the world, etc

I believe everything you ever did for BitShares was, is and will be with the best of intentions, I really believe that, however, from anyone else's point of view, whose money is into BitShares, will not see it the same way.

It's impossible to please anyone and you're just sharing thoughts, however you must know by now that these kind of posts, whatever they might be, being the topic itself controversial or not, will end up in polemic.

Why? Because from other people's point of view, they only want to see results. They want to see CNX being pragmatic and efficient. Most people will see this and think you're not focused, lost in philosophies, etc, I'm not saying you are and that you should ever let others condition how you express yourself, but unfortunately that will be like most people will see it, always.

People only care about results, not caring if you even had to be inhuman to achieve them. They want them, they demand them and that's it. Now obviously you aren't obliged to anything, but that's the kind of reaction you should expect from other people, from most people.

For them:
- BitShares relies completely on you and CNX (even if it can hire 10000 devs, because pratically that's how it is atm)
- Without you, project dies
- They want results
- They don't see results
- They see philosophical stuff which they don't care the slightest
- They don't see their money growing which is what they care the most
- They see multiple ideas everywhere
- They don't see a path, a clear objective on what will happen next

All of this causes people to be insecure, afraid, mad and all kind of different negative reactions, even if your intentions are the best. Of course most people's reaction if they were in your shoes would be something like "But all I did was a single post, trying to explain my vision, what's wrong with that? I can't say what I think? I can't share my opinion on the project I started?" and that might feel pretty unfair. However, once again, most people won't care about that because all they care about is their own money and well... I can't judge them because of that, that's how the world works, we are too dependent on money, no money, no funny, no food in the tummy.

So basically all I have to say trying not to be biased is to take that into consideration, because you know everything you say and everything you do will be watched and analysed very carefully. On one side because people see you as someone so intelligent and with great ideas, on the other because this entire project, still relies too much on you and CNX.

_____
My opinion on this.

No problem with you sharing your ideas other than that you should know everyone panics, whether you say "yes" or "no", wether you say "right" or "left".

Also I'm of the opinion before we can start any of this stuff we need money. It's better to have it to secure our future and guarantee that stuff can be done then start off with that immediately and jeopardizing the entire project.

Atm I must say - although I've been in BTS since the AGS donation period  and haven't sold a single one - I'm stuff like Bond Markets/Margin Trading, Prediction Markets, etc, won't be done.Imo that's imperative. But that's just my opinion. The shareholders choose,

Great post Akado +5%


Offline Akado

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We need to give people more reasons to come use the platform.

Exactly, it's better if you're the best at something that's needed than being average at multiple things not as needed.
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Offline cass

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My approach for 2016 and beyond is very different from my "build it and they will come" approach. 


 +5%
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Offline Stan

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Alright Stan, just answer this for me...

What is bitshares and in what direction does CNX want to see bitshares go?  What does CNX want to focus on?

-Are we an exchange?
-Are we a merchant tool?
-Are we a swiss bank?
-Are we a US style bank?
-Are we a anonymous money transmitter?
-Are we an Insurance company?
-Are we a social welfare group?
-Are we a prediction market / gambling company?
-Are we a token of exchange?
-Are we a company devoted to profit/shareholders?

Because right now it seems like we are trying to be all of those things.  What is the problem with just picking 1 or 2 to focus on right now?  Picking something to focus on will help "bootstrap" the community for finding partners in that particular area.  Right now our energy is dwindling and is being expelled in too many directions.



We want to see BitShares gain users.  Like a rolling stone.
Users are what makes everything else possible.

I view BitShares as a versatile real-time platform on which to build blockchain based businesses.
Having a built-in exchange is a great piece of infrastructure on which to build everything else.
Having on-and-off ramps such as provided by OpenLedger is another key piece of infrastructure.

But one of the biggest challenges to getting any exchange going is liquidity and market depth.
It's why the big exchanges keep getting bigger.  Nothing succeeds like success.

A quality interface is a necessary but not sufficient reason for people to use an exchange. 
And BitShares has funded guys working on that.
But the need for liquidity and market depth are even more important.

We need to give people more reasons to come use the platform.

One way is to offer assets and services you can't get anywhere else.
    Stable currencies are one thing, but they need their own liquidity to function.
    Fee backed assets are a great innovation, but they need businesses to generate the fees that back them.
    Communities that share a common philosophy are potential customers we can serve.  We have suggested two or three.

To do any of this needs funding, and that means pursuing what the providers of that funding believe in.
So our way forward depends on what Champions step up to lead and what business opportunities make sense to them.

At this point, what entrepreneurs build on the BitShares platform is a function of what they think they can promote successfully.  That will differ with the talents and passions of each individual entrepreneur.




Anything said on these forums does not constitute an intent to create a legal obligation or contract of any kind.   These are merely my opinions which I reserve the right to change at any time.

Offline Akado

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I get the fact Dan wants to share his view and vision. Other people shouldn't pressure you not to think or share your thoughts or how you see the world, etc

I believe everything you ever did for BitShares was, is and will be with the best of intentions, I really believe that, however, from anyone else's point of view, whose money is into BitShares, will not see it the same way.

It's impossible to please anyone and you're just sharing thoughts, however you must know by now that these kind of posts, whatever they might be, being the topic itself controversial or not, will end up in polemic.

Why? Because from other people's point of view, they only want to see results. They want to see CNX being pragmatic and efficient. Most people will see this and think you're not focused, lost in philosophies, etc, I'm not saying you are and that you should ever let others condition how you express yourself, but unfortunately that will be like most people will see it, always.

People only care about results, not caring if you even had to be inhuman to achieve them. They want them, they demand them and that's it. Now obviously you aren't obliged to anything, but that's the kind of reaction you should expect from other people, from most people.

For them:
- BitShares relies completely on you and CNX (even if it can hire 10000 devs, because pratically that's how it is atm)
- Without you, project dies
- They want results
- They don't see results
- They see philosophical stuff which they don't care the slightest
- They don't see their money growing which is what they care the most
- They see multiple ideas everywhere
- They don't see a path, a clear objective on what will happen next

All of this causes people to feel insecure, afraid, mad and all kind of different negative reactions, even if your intentions are the best. Of course most people's reaction if they were in your shoes would be something like "But all I did was a single post, trying to explain my vision, what's wrong with that? I can't say what I think? I can't share my opinion on the project I started?" and that might feel pretty unfair. However, once again, most people won't care about that because all they care about is their own money and well... I can't judge them because of that, that's how the world works, we are too dependent on money, no money, no funny, no food in the tummy.

So basically all I have to say trying not to be biased is to take that into consideration, because you know everything you say and everything you do will be watched and analysed very carefully. On one side because people see you as someone so intelligent and with great ideas, on the other because this entire project, still relies too much on you and CNX.

_____
My opinion on this.

No problem with you sharing your ideas other than that you should know everyone panics, whether you say "yes" or "no", wether you say "right" or "left".

Also I'm of the opinion before we can start any of this stuff we need money. It's better to have it to secure our future and guarantee that stuff can be done then start off with that immediately and jeopardizing the entire project.

Atm I must say - although I've been in BTS since the AGS donation period  and haven't sold a single one - I'm afraid stuff like Bond Markets/Margin Trading, Prediction Markets, etc, won't be done.Imo that's imperative. But that's just my opinion. The shareholders choose,

« Last Edit: December 29, 2015, 08:55:08 pm by Akado »
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